# Bush and Romney not backing Trump **URL:** \ **Category:** Politics & Elections\ **Created:** [June 7, 2020, 12:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bush-and-romney-not-backing-trump/855199 "2020-06-07T12:37:04Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![QuickSilver](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/quicksilver/32/7832_2.png) [@QuickSilver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/QuickSilver)\ **Post date:** [June 8, 2020, 2:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bush-and-romney-not-backing-trump/855199/41 "2020-06-08T14:06:37Z")
> [@Bijou\_Drains](#): > > 94 crime bill is going to hurt Biden from the left , some may stay home. I think it’s more the fact that Biden’s last name isn’t Sanders is what’s going to make some of these people stay at home. ---
**Author:** ![asahi](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/asahi/32/8693_2.png) [@asahi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/asahi)\ **Post date:** [June 8, 2020, 4:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bush-and-romney-not-backing-trump/855199/42 "2020-06-08T16:26:35Z")
> [@Bijou\_Drains](#): > > 94 crime bill is going to hurt Biden from the left , some may stay home. Bernie Sanders also voted for that same Crime Bill? Were those same left voters going to hold that against him, too? This is a vote for or against Trump, and anyone who hates Trump is unlikely to use some vote from 15 or 30 years ago against Biden. ---
**Author:** ![asahi](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/asahi/32/8693_2.png) [@asahi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/asahi)\ **Post date:** [June 8, 2020, 4:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bush-and-romney-not-backing-trump/855199/43 "2020-06-08T16:27:46Z")
> [@QuickSilver](#): > > I think it’s more the fact that Biden’s last name isn’t Sanders is what’s going to make some of these people stay at home. Yeah, pretty much. And the longer Trump stays in office, I doubt even that will matter to anyone except the most masochistic of progressives. ---
**Author:** ![Little\_Nemo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/little_nemo/32/3120_2.png) [@Little\_Nemo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Little_Nemo)\ **Post date:** [June 8, 2020, 4:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bush-and-romney-not-backing-trump/855199/44 "2020-06-08T16:35:24Z")
> [@asahi](#): > > This is a vote for or against Trump, and anyone who hates Trump is unlikely to use some vote from 15 or 30 years ago against Biden. The problem is some people feel that Trump is a terrible President - and want him to get re-elected for that reason. Their theory is that America needs fundamental changes in the way things work. But people are resistant to making these changes. The only way they will agree to these necessary and beneficial changes is if things get really desperate and our current system collapses. And Trump will produce that desperation and collapse if he remains in office for another term. If Biden get elected, on the other hand, he will just slap a band-aid on our problems and restore the status quo. He will make it possible for us to avoid making the changes we should. ---
**Author:** ![QuickSilver](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/quicksilver/32/7832_2.png) [@QuickSilver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/QuickSilver)\ **Post date:** [June 8, 2020, 4:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bush-and-romney-not-backing-trump/855199/45 "2020-06-08T16:58:26Z")
> [@Little\_Nemo](#): > > The problem is some people feel that Trump is a terrible President - and want him to get re-elected for that reason. > > Their theory is that America needs fundamental changes in the way things work. But people are resistant to making these changes. The only way they will agree to these necessary and beneficial changes is if things get really desperate and our current system collapses. And Trump will produce that desperation and collapse if he remains in office for another term. > > If Biden get elected, on the other hand, he will just slap a band-aid on our problems and restore the status quo. He will make it possible for us to avoid making the changes we should. I take it this is not a position you hold. That said… This is an ignorant, arguably immoral and frankly vile philosophical mind set. ---
**Author:** ![madsircool](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/madsircool/32/3432_2.png) [@madsircool](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/madsircool)\ **Post date:** [June 8, 2020, 5:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bush-and-romney-not-backing-trump/855199/46 "2020-06-08T17:00:49Z")
> [@JRDelirious](#): > > Good for them but let me see some top R’s who \*\*\*are \*\*\*facing reelection _NOW_ or some RW media voices who are \*currently \*influential distance themselves and say “no, sorry, I stand for all Republican values but I’d rather wait 4 years for someone sane” and I’ll be impressed. I won’t be holding my breath. > > . George Will paywalled Washington Post oped piece > **[Opinion | Trump must be removed. So must his congressional enablers.](https://www.washingtonpost.com/opinions/no-one-should-want-four-more-years-of-this-taste-of-ashes/2020/06/01/1a80ecf4-a425-11ea-bb20-ebf0921f3bbd_story.html)** > > With Trump, there is no such thing as rock bottom. So, assume the worst is yet to come. Salon piece > **["The worst is yet to come": Leading conservative columnist predicts tough...](https://www.salon.com/2020/06/08/the-worst-is-yet-to-come-leading-conservative-columnist-predicts-tough-times-ahead-for-gop_partner/)** > > A leading conservative writer comes out with a scathing argument for defeating Trump and his enablers > [@](#): > > George F. Will, who turned 79 on May 4, is among the most prominent conservative journalists in the United States — although he has been a vehement critic of Donald Trump’s presidency and even left the Republican Party because of it. And Will’s most recent Washington Post column is especially scathing: the Never Trumper stresses that voting the “crybaby in chief” out of office in November is crucial in order to reverse the country’s “downward spiral.” > > “In 2016,” Will recalls, “voters were presented an unprecedentedly unpalatable choice: never had both major parties offered nominees with higher disapproval than approval numbers. Voters chose what they wagered would be the lesser blight. Now, however, they have watched him govern for 40 months and more than 40% — slightly less than the percentage that voted for him — approve of his sordid conduct.” > > But according to Will, voting Trump out of office this year is not enough to reverse the United States’ decline — all of his Republican “enablers” in Congress must be voted out of office as well for allying themselves with a “vulgarian.” ---
**Author:** ![Bijou\_Drains](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bijou_drains/32/2814_2.png) [@Bijou\_Drains](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bijou_Drains)\ **Post date:** [June 8, 2020, 6:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bush-and-romney-not-backing-trump/855199/47 "2020-06-08T18:08:17Z")
A lot of Trump voters really like that’s a jerk because he goes after “libtards” They like that he’s a real life Archie Bunker. They don’t care what Will, Powell, Romney and other “elitists” say or write. Those guys denouncing Trump makes them happy. They only listen to Hannity, Limbaugh, and the whole Fox news crowd. ---
**Author:** ![BigT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bigt/32/12044_2.png) [@BigT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BigT)\ **Post date:** [June 8, 2020, 8:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bush-and-romney-not-backing-trump/855199/48 "2020-06-08T20:25:56Z")
> [@Little\_Nemo](#): > > The problem is some people feel that Trump is a terrible President - and want him to get re-elected for that reason. > > Their theory is that America needs fundamental changes in the way things work. But people are resistant to making these changes. The only way they will agree to these necessary and beneficial changes is if things get really desperate and our current system collapses. And Trump will produce that desperation and collapse if he remains in office for another term. > > If Biden get elected, on the other hand, he will just slap a band-aid on our problems and restore the status quo. He will make it possible for us to avoid making the changes we should. And it’s a very privileged theory, ignoring the most vulnerable who get harmed by it, and assuming that there will be something left to pull back, and not just a failed country or actual nationalist state. Gradualism has been what has historically worked. The problem was just that people started backsliding. Holding people’s feet to the fire is what’s important, to prevent that. That said, it’s good for rhetorical purposes to act as if you are willing to let things get worse. That gives you more leverage to hold people’s feet to the fire. ---
**Author:** ![wolfpup](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/wolfpup/32/10618_2.png) [@wolfpup](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/wolfpup)\ **Post date:** [June 8, 2020, 9:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bush-and-romney-not-backing-trump/855199/49 "2020-06-08T21:02:32Z")
> [@enipla](#): > > Trumps only ‘political’ affiliation is to himself. But he has been a useful tool for many of the assholes (and hostile countrys) that are in the GOP. Perhaps a few are turning. Only those stupider than Trump are still behind him. Unless they still think they can gain something from this mess. The politicization of the Trump fiasco by America’s enemies should not be underestimated. Russia, China, and Iran are all on board. Putin worked long and hard to help get Trump elected and he’s been reaping the rewards. It must have been hard for him to keep a straight face at the Helsinki summit when Trump sucked up to him like a lost hungry puppy. Now he can condemn the US as a failed state and not be far wrong; Trump still thinks he can win in November and if voter turnout is low enough and voter suppression effective enough that may happen, too. For that matter, he has also said that [“[we may have to] go for a third term”](https://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/americas/us-politics/trump-2024-election-third-term-mike-huckabee-impeachment-inquiry-a9244761.html). > [@Little\_Nemo](#): > > It wouldn’t surprise me to see Bush run again in 2024 if Trump loses this year. GWB’s soaring popularity lately ought to help things along for Jeb. I greatly disliked GWB but at least he was a patriot – however much wrong-headed he may have been at times – who took the oath of office and meant it. It’s kind of the least you can expect of an American president. I would never have believed I’d have anything good to say about GWB but it’s all relative, isn’t it? Trump is like something out of a dystopian novel, the kind that no one would have published because it’s too fantastically unbelievable, and yet here we are. ---
**Author:** ![Little\_Nemo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/little_nemo/32/3120_2.png) [@Little\_Nemo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Little_Nemo)\ **Post date:** [June 8, 2020, 9:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bush-and-romney-not-backing-trump/855199/50 "2020-06-08T21:04:10Z")
> [@QuickSilver](#): > > I take it this is not a position you hold. No, I don’t. For several reasons. ---
**Author:** ![Little\_Nemo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/little_nemo/32/3120_2.png) [@Little\_Nemo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Little_Nemo)\ **Post date:** [June 8, 2020, 9:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bush-and-romney-not-backing-trump/855199/51 "2020-06-08T21:19:26Z")
> [@Bijou\_Drains](#): > > A lot of Trump voters really like that’s a jerk because he goes after “libtards” They like that he’s a real life Archie Bunker. They don’t care what Will, Powell, Romney and other “elitists” say or write. Those guys denouncing Trump makes them happy. They only listen to Hannity, Limbaugh, and the whole Fox news crowd. But there are diverging goals. Most conservatives, including the media pundit crowd, are looking at the long term. They’re not willing to sacrifice the conservative movement for Donald Trump. To them, Trump is just another Republican President passing through. They’re looking ahead to 2024, 2028, 2032 as well as all of the non-presidential elections out there. For Trump and his base, the Trump Presidency is the only important thing. They don’t care who wins after he’s gone. They’re not willing to sacrifice Donald Trump for the conservative movement. ---
**Author:** ![Little\_Nemo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/little_nemo/32/3120_2.png) [@Little\_Nemo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Little_Nemo)\ **Post date:** [June 8, 2020, 9:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bush-and-romney-not-backing-trump/855199/52 "2020-06-08T21:22:03Z")
> [@wolfpup](#): > > GWB’s soaring popularity lately ought to help things along for Jeb. I greatly disliked GWB but at least he was a patriot – however much wrong-headed he may have been at times – who took the oath of office and meant it. It’s kind of the least you can expect of an American president. I would never have believed I’d have anything good to say about GWB but it’s all relative, isn’t it? Trump is like something out of a dystopian novel, the kind that no one would have published because it’s too fantastically unbelievable, and yet here we are. I always said this about Bush; I never felt he was a racist. ---
**Author:** ![Hari\_Seldon](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/hari_seldon/32/5173_2.png) [@Hari\_Seldon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hari_Seldon)\ **Post date:** [June 9, 2020, 1:18am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bush-and-romney-not-backing-trump/855199/53 "2020-06-09T01:18:01Z")
Nothing anyone will do will move Trump’s base. But there are still a few independents and undecideds around. If only Romney and Bush and the others (Will, Frum,…) would actually say they are voting for Biden, it might make a difference. But Romney says he might write in a vote for his wife and the others–notably except Powell–aren’t saying. So they really don’t want to help defeat Trump; they just want to avoid the opprobrium of have supported him. ---
**Author:** ![Bijou\_Drains](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bijou_drains/32/2814_2.png) [@Bijou\_Drains](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bijou_Drains)\ **Post date:** [June 9, 2020, 11:49am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bush-and-romney-not-backing-trump/855199/54 "2020-06-09T11:49:23Z")
Romney said he’s not going to say who he’s voting for. ---
**Author:** ![RitterSport](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/rittersport/32/6326_2.png) [@RitterSport](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RitterSport)\ **Post date:** [June 9, 2020, 11:50am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bush-and-romney-not-backing-trump/855199/55 "2020-06-09T11:50:07Z")
> [@Hari\_Seldon](#): > > Nothing anyone will do will move Trump’s base. But there are still a few independents and undecideds around. If only Romney and Bush and the others (Will, Frum,…) would actually say they are voting for Biden, it might make a difference. But Romney says he might write in a vote for his wife and the others–notably except Powell–aren’t saying. So they really don’t want to help defeat Trump; they just want to avoid the opprobrium of have supported him. Yes, exactly. During the previous election, some NYT op-ed guy was railing against Trump (Peter Wehner?) and what a disaster he will be, but in the same piece, said that, of course, he can’t vote for Clinton. Dude, there are two choices, just the two. Writing in your wife or Donald Duck or whatever will not maximize the chance that Trump is defeated. If these never-Trumpers were serious, they’d be coming out strongly for Biden, rather than just against Trump. The Lincoln Project folks seem pretty serious, though. They’re producing anti-Trump ads. ---
**Author:** ![Akaj](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/akaj/32/145_2.png) [@Akaj](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Akaj)\ **Post date:** [June 9, 2020, 2:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bush-and-romney-not-backing-trump/855199/56 "2020-06-09T14:47:33Z")
> [@Lantern](#): > > I can think of only two endorsements that could move the needle: George W Bush or Jim Mattis endorsing Biden. I’ll happily write Mattis’ speech for him: My name is General Jim Mattis. I served in the United States Marine Corps for 44 years, commanding forces in the Gulf War, Afghanistan and Iraq. I am a lifelong Republican, and was proud to serve as United States Secretary of Defense for more than two years under President Trump. However, while serving under this president I became increasingly aware that he does not truly understand the nature of military strength or the importance of our allies, and I resigned when he betrayed our friends the Kurds in Syria. In recent months it has become clear to me that he is the first president in my lifetime who does not try to unite the American people. He does not even pretend to try. Instead, he tries to divide us. He consistently places his own interests and personal image ahead of the needs of the American people. I love my country, and right now we need leadership more than we ever have. Donald Trump is not and cannot be that leader, and that’s why I am publicly stating my support for Senator Joe Biden in this year’s election. If you love the United States, please vote for Joe Biden. Thank you. ---
**Author:** ![Bijou\_Drains](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bijou_drains/32/2814_2.png) [@Bijou\_Drains](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bijou_Drains)\ **Post date:** [June 9, 2020, 4:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bush-and-romney-not-backing-trump/855199/57 "2020-06-09T16:20:35Z")
Retired 4 star military people endorsing Biden is better than Bush , at least to me. A lot of people are still not happy with Bush’s 8 years. ---
**Author:** ![Dark\_Sponge](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dark_sponge/32/121_2.png) [@Dark\_Sponge](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dark_Sponge)\ **Post date:** [June 9, 2020, 5:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bush-and-romney-not-backing-trump/855199/58 "2020-06-09T17:25:35Z")
> [@enipla](#): > > Former candidate for VP. And people say Democrats have made bad choices. I don’t think it hurt Palin. She was completely forgotten before. If nothing else, it was memorable. ---
**Author:** ![Little\_Nemo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/little_nemo/32/3120_2.png) [@Little\_Nemo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Little_Nemo)\ **Post date:** [June 9, 2020, 5:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bush-and-romney-not-backing-trump/855199/59 "2020-06-09T17:54:26Z")
> [@RitterSport](#): > > Yes, exactly. During the previous election, some NYT op-ed guy was railing against Trump (Peter Wehner?) and what a disaster he will be, but in the same piece, said that, of course, he can’t vote for Clinton. > > Dude, there are two choices, just the two. Writing in your wife or Donald Duck or whatever will not maximize the chance that Trump is defeated. If these never-Trumpers were serious, they’d be coming out strongly for Biden, rather than just against Trump. > > The Lincoln Project folks seem pretty serious, though. They’re producing anti-Trump ads. I remember P.J. O’Rourke said that as much as he hated Hillary Clinton he was going to vote for her. ---
**Author:** ![Little\_Nemo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/little_nemo/32/3120_2.png) [@Little\_Nemo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Little_Nemo)\ **Post date:** [June 9, 2020, 5:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bush-and-romney-not-backing-trump/855199/60 "2020-06-09T17:55:28Z")
> [@Lantern](#): > > I can think of only two endorsements that could move the needle: George W Bush or Jim Mattis endorsing Biden. I think it would hurt Trump’s chances if Mike Pence endorsed Biden. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bush-and-romney-not-backing-trump/855199.md?page=2) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bush-and-romney-not-backing-trump/855199.md?page=4)