# Bush Knew bin Laden was in Tora Bora **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [August 7, 2005, 11:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bush-knew-bin-laden-was-in-tora-bora/316046 "2005-08-07T23:52:47Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![EddyTeddyFreddy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/eddyteddyfreddy/32/18796_2.png) [@EddyTeddyFreddy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/EddyTeddyFreddy)\ **Post date:** [August 8, 2005, 3:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bush-knew-bin-laden-was-in-tora-bora/316046/21 "2005-08-08T15:26:10Z")
Yep, just as bullshit as all the other allegations that Clinton ignored terrorists, as [Snopes, for one, points out.](http://www.snopes.com/rumors/clinton.htm) ---
**Author:** ![Revtim](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/revtim/32/1042_2.png) [@Revtim](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Revtim)\ **Post date:** [August 8, 2005, 3:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bush-knew-bin-laden-was-in-tora-bora/316046/22 "2005-08-08T15:39:54Z")
> [@Clothahump](#): > > You’re quoting a story from Newsweek, which we all know is a bastion of journalistic integrity. Why am I not surprised by that? > > If you’re that upset about bin Laden getting away, how about Clinton’s being handed bin Laden on a silver platter and refusing to do anything about him because he couldn’t be “disturbed” at the time? If he had acted, we wouldn’t have had 9/11 and we wouldn’t be in Iraq today? Why aren’t you bitching about that instead? So can we assume your source for Clinton “being handed bin Laden on a silver platter” is more trustworthy than Newsweek? ---
**Author:** ![Liberal](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/848f3c/32.png) [@Liberal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Liberal)\ **Post date:** [August 8, 2005, 4:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bush-knew-bin-laden-was-in-tora-bora/316046/23 "2005-08-08T16:01:10Z")
As far as I’m concerned, it is inconceivable that the Bush administration lacks the intelligence (in the other sense of the term) to find Bin Laden. No bribery, deceit, or violence against al-Qaeda should be spared. Maybe it would help for Bush to think of Bin Laden as a US citizen. An atheist one. A gay atheist. A gay atheist Democrat. A gay atheist Democrat who reads forbidden books in the library. Then by god, they’d nab his ass. ---
**Author:** ![Lemur866](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lemur866/32/434_2.png) [@Lemur866](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lemur866)\ **Post date:** [August 8, 2005, 4:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bush-knew-bin-laden-was-in-tora-bora/316046/24 "2005-08-08T16:02:19Z")
Anyway, even if Clinton let Bin Ladin get away, what relevance does that have to whether Bush let Bin Ladin get away? None as far as I can see. Clinton’s alleged failures don’t excuse Bush’s alleged failures, nor do Bush’s alleged failures excuse Clinton’s alleged failures. I’m sick of this Tu Quoque bullshit. We didn’t send 100,000 troops to Afghanistan because there was no way to supply that number of troops. Yes, we could drop soldiers and tanks there, but they’d be out of ammunition, food, fuel, medical supplies, and spare parts within a week. An armored division cut off from supply lines is just a very expensive junkyard guarded by light infantry. We could invade Iraq with 100,000 men because we could build up vast supply depots in Kuwait and Saudi Arabia then drive across the border essentially unopposed. Where exactly were we going to do that in Afghanistan? No roads, no airfields, no friendly neighboring countries, no flat desert. The invasion of Iraq was easy. A comparable invasion of Afghanistan would be much much more difficult, just ask the Soviet Union. They failed even though they were literally next door. ---
**Author:** ![EddyTeddyFreddy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/eddyteddyfreddy/32/18796_2.png) [@EddyTeddyFreddy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/EddyTeddyFreddy)\ **Post date:** [August 8, 2005, 4:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bush-knew-bin-laden-was-in-tora-bora/316046/25 "2005-08-08T16:02:29Z")
> [@Revtim](#): > > So can we assume your source for Clinton “being handed bin Laden on a silver platter” is more trustworthy than Newsweek? That would depend on how much you trust a multi-forwarded glurge email, wouldn’t it? :dubious: ---
**Author:** ![Ponder\_Stibbons](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ponder_stibbons/32/343_2.png) [@Ponder\_Stibbons](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ponder_Stibbons)\ **Post date:** [August 8, 2005, 4:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bush-knew-bin-laden-was-in-tora-bora/316046/26 "2005-08-08T16:06:43Z")
Well … maybe if he was a gay atheist Democrat who reads forbidden books in the library and supports stem cell research and women’s rights. But, AFAIK, IRL, OBL actually opposes all of those things. Just like GWB. Coincidence? Well, yes, actually. But it makes for a fun conspiracy theory. 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![Clothahump](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/51bf81/32.png) [@Clothahump](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Clothahump)\ **Post date:** [August 8, 2005, 4:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bush-knew-bin-laden-was-in-tora-bora/316046/27 "2005-08-08T16:11:23Z")
> [@Revtim](#): > > So can we assume your source for Clinton “being handed bin Laden on a silver platter” is more trustworthy than Newsweek? Yep. [Dereliction of Duty](http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/tg/detail/-/0895260603/qid=1123517688/sr=8-3/ref=pd_bbs_sbs_3/102-9015075-9041742?v=glance&s=books&n=507846) , by Robert Patterson. ---
**Author:** ![Clothahump](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/51bf81/32.png) [@Clothahump](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Clothahump)\ **Post date:** [August 8, 2005, 4:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bush-knew-bin-laden-was-in-tora-bora/316046/28 "2005-08-08T16:13:25Z")
> [@EddyTeddyFreddy](#): > > That would depend on how much you trust a multi-forwarded glurge email, wouldn’t it? :dubious: If that’s what _you_ choose to trust as a source, then have at it. I prefer the eyewitness account of someone who was there and saw it happen. ---
**Author:** ![Hentor\_the\_Barbarian](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/8edcca/32.png) [@Hentor\_the\_Barbarian](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hentor_the_Barbarian)\ **Post date:** [August 8, 2005, 4:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bush-knew-bin-laden-was-in-tora-bora/316046/29 "2005-08-08T16:16:21Z")
> [@Liberal](#): > > Maybe it would help for Bush to think of Bin Laden as a US citizen. An atheist one. A gay atheist. A gay atheist Democrat. A gay atheist Democrat who reads forbidden books in the library. Then by god, they’d nab his ass. 😃 Now there’s a question for Ann Coulter (or Karl Rove): is bin Laden worse than a Democrat? ---
**Author:** ![Fear\_Itself](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/fear_itself/32/19637_2.png) [@Fear\_Itself](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fear_Itself)\ **Post date:** [August 8, 2005, 4:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bush-knew-bin-laden-was-in-tora-bora/316046/30 "2005-08-08T16:17:37Z")
> [@Clothahump](#): > > If you’re that upset about bin Laden getting away, how about Clinton’s being handed bin Laden on a silver platter… You know, we have _Gaudere’s Law_ of spelling and grammar karma, and we have _Godwin’s Law_ of Nazi comparisons. I propose that any knee-jerk Clinton reference in response to any criticism of Bush be from now on called _“Clothahump’s Law of Clinton Irrelevancy”_. This thread’s been **Clothahumped** by the **Clothahumper!** ---
**Author:** ![Revtim](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/revtim/32/1042_2.png) [@Revtim](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Revtim)\ **Post date:** [August 8, 2005, 4:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bush-knew-bin-laden-was-in-tora-bora/316046/31 "2005-08-08T16:18:02Z")
I guess I shouldn’t be surprised that **Clothahump** finds an obvious partisan hack-job trustworthy, and Newsweek not. ---
**Author:** ![elucidator](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/8edcca/32.png) [@elucidator](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elucidator)\ **Post date:** [August 8, 2005, 4:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bush-knew-bin-laden-was-in-tora-bora/316046/32 "2005-08-08T16:41:57Z")
Mr. **Clothahump** Most esteemed sir! I am to be writing you to offer a most excellent investment opportunity! My late father was Banking and Financial Minister here in Nigeria. As you may be knowing, he was assassinated on the orders of Mr. President Clinton to prevent the revealing of a scandal about illegal rhinoceros horn to be imported to bolster his flagging _boogabooga_. At the time of his death, he had been placed 30 billion Nigerian _dorku_ in the most scenic and illustrious Cayman Islands bank accounts, but did neglect to name an executor for this accounting. As his son, I cannot approach these accountings for fear of raising suspicousness. There is where your most excellent financial opportunity arises!.. ---
**Author:** ![XT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/xt/32/456_2.png) [@XT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/XT)\ **Post date:** [August 8, 2005, 5:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bush-knew-bin-laden-was-in-tora-bora/316046/33 "2005-08-08T17:34:56Z")
Wow, you guys are sure easily sidetracked. Clothahump comes in, writes paragraphs and drops the dreaded ‘C’ word and off you go. 😛 -XT ---
**Author:** ![Clothahump](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/51bf81/32.png) [@Clothahump](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Clothahump)\ **Post date:** [August 8, 2005, 7:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bush-knew-bin-laden-was-in-tora-bora/316046/34 "2005-08-08T19:48:39Z")
> [@Fear Itself](#): > > You know, we have _Gaudere’s Law_ of spelling and grammar karma, and we have _Godwin’s Law_ of Nazi comparisons. I propose that any knee-jerk Clinton reference in response to any criticism of Bush be from now on called _“Clothahump’s Law of Clinton Irrelevancy”_. > > This thread’s been **Clothahumped** by the **Clothahumper!** I suggest you not ignore your scheduled meds. That was really lame, even for a lib. ---
**Author:** ![Clothahump](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/51bf81/32.png) [@Clothahump](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Clothahump)\ **Post date:** [August 8, 2005, 7:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bush-knew-bin-laden-was-in-tora-bora/316046/35 "2005-08-08T19:51:39Z")
> [@elucidator](#): > > Mr. **Clothahump** > > Most esteemed sir! I am to be writing you to offer a most excellent investment opportunity! My late father was Banking and Financial Minister here in Nigeria. As you may be knowing, he was assassinated on the orders of Mr. President Clinton to prevent the revealing of a scandal about illegal rhinoceros horn to be imported to bolster his flagging _boogabooga_. > > At the time of his death, he had been placed 30 billion Nigerian _dorku_ in the most scenic and illustrious Cayman Islands bank accounts, but did neglect to name an executor for this accounting. As his son, I cannot approach these accountings for fear of raising suspicousness. > > There is where your most excellent financial opportunity arises!.. ROTFLMAO!! At least yours was funny. It was a better effort than the drivel that **Fear Itself** posted. Still lame, though. You both ignore the source and concentrate on the messenger, a common problem with libs when confronted with facts they can’t refute. Have you bothered to read the book I referenced? You should. It’s an eye-opener. ---
**Author:** ![Revtim](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/revtim/32/1042_2.png) [@Revtim](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Revtim)\ **Post date:** [August 8, 2005, 8:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bush-knew-bin-laden-was-in-tora-bora/316046/36 "2005-08-08T20:07:30Z")
OK, I’ll give you the benefit of the doubt **Clothahump** , let’s assume the book you linked to is 100 percent blessed-by-God true. It’s still a _tu quoque_ fallacy to bring it up as if it means something to the discussion at hand, and does nothing to excuse Bush’s failures, which is what this thread is about. ---
**Author:** ![Fear\_Itself](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/fear_itself/32/19637_2.png) [@Fear\_Itself](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fear_Itself)\ **Post date:** [August 8, 2005, 8:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bush-knew-bin-laden-was-in-tora-bora/316046/37 "2005-08-08T20:20:54Z")
> [@Clothahump](#): > > At least yours was funny. It was a better effort than the drivel that **Fear Itself** posted. I shall endeavor to raise the level of my drivel. Still, to be considered in the same class of “lame” with **luci** is high praise indeed. ---
**Author:** ![NurseCarmen](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/5daacb/32.png) [@NurseCarmen](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/NurseCarmen)\ **Post date:** [August 8, 2005, 8:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bush-knew-bin-laden-was-in-tora-bora/316046/38 "2005-08-08T20:28:25Z")
Gee, with book titles under his belt like Reckless Disregard : How Liberal Democrats Undercut Our Military, Endanger Our Soldiers, and Jeopardize Our Security , How could we _not_ assume he’s a partisan hack? ---
**Author:** ![Maeglin](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/8baadc/32.png) [@Maeglin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Maeglin)\ **Post date:** [August 8, 2005, 8:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bush-knew-bin-laden-was-in-tora-bora/316046/39 "2005-08-08T20:50:23Z")
> [@](#): > > both ignore the source and concentrate on the messenger, a common problem with libs when confronted with facts they can’t refute. Perhaps you would care to remind the peanut gallery who began this strain of the conversation by dismissing Newsweek as an unacceptable source? ---
**Author:** ![Contrapuntal](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/e274bd/32.png) [@Contrapuntal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Contrapuntal)\ **Post date:** [August 8, 2005, 9:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bush-knew-bin-laden-was-in-tora-bora/316046/40 "2005-08-08T21:03:29Z")
> [@Clothahump](#): > > I prefer the eyewitness account of someone who was there and saw it happen. That’s the bestest kind! [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bush-knew-bin-laden-was-in-tora-bora/316046.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bush-knew-bin-laden-was-in-tora-bora/316046.md?page=3)