# Bush must GO! (Government Investigates Teachers Union) **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [March 5, 2004, 4:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bush-must-go-government-investigates-teachers-union/232718 "2004-03-05T16:34:58Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![acaveman](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/8e8cbc/32.png) [@acaveman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/acaveman)\ **Post date:** [March 5, 2004, 4:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bush-must-go-government-investigates-teachers-union/232718/1 "2004-03-05T16:34:58Z")
Bush is going after anyone that is against him including the Teachers Union… Labor Dept. Probes Teachers Union Reports Email this Story > [@](#): > > Mar 4, 4:49 PM (ET) > > By LARRY MARGASAK > > WASHINGTON (AP) - A teachers union that spends heavily to support political candidates is acknowledging for the first time that the government is investigating whether all its expenditures have been reported. > > National Education Association general counsel Bob Chanin confirmed the Labor Department investigation began in April 2002, the same month a conservative law firm complained to the Bush administration that millions of dollars in political spending went unreported. > > “We believe we reported all political expenditures properly,” Chanin told The Associated Press. “We concealed nothing. I am confident we’ll get a clean bill of health and be able to move on.” […] > > **[Edited down due to copyright concerns. Post links or _short_ excerpts only, please. --Gaudere]** and to add to this… I hear from a Howard Stern listner that he may be taken off the air as well. By me posting this, does that mean that I don’t get to attend this year’s celabratory book/art burning after the election? ---
**Author:** ![In\_Conceivable](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/4bbf92/32.png) [@In\_Conceivable](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/In_Conceivable)\ **Post date:** [March 5, 2004, 4:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bush-must-go-government-investigates-teachers-union/232718/2 "2004-03-05T16:44:56Z")
And what is your proof that Bush is behind this? ---
**Author:** ![John\_Mace](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_mace/32/185_2.png) [@John\_Mace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Mace)\ **Post date:** [March 5, 2004, 4:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bush-must-go-government-investigates-teachers-union/232718/3 "2004-03-05T16:50:12Z")
If the Teachers’ Union wants to play the political game, they should expect an audit from time to time. The question might more apropriately be: why did it take so long? At any rate, what’s the debate here other than another rant against Bush? You might find more interest in the BBQ Pit for this kind of thread. ---
**Author:** ![Gaudere](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/e495f1/32.png) [@Gaudere](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gaudere)\ **Post date:** [March 5, 2004, 4:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bush-must-go-government-investigates-teachers-union/232718/4 "2004-03-05T16:53:27Z")
[Moderator Hat ON] Thread title edited for clarity. You might do better if you can explain your debate topic more; or, if you just want to rant about Bush, I can move the thread to the BBQ Pit. [Moderator Hat OFF] ---
**Author:** ![DMC](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dmc/32/18049_2.png) [@DMC](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DMC)\ **Post date:** [March 5, 2004, 5:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bush-must-go-government-investigates-teachers-union/232718/5 "2004-03-05T17:50:23Z")
> [@In Conceivable](#): > > And what is your proof that Bush is behind this? I don’t think there is any proof Bush is behind it. There is, on the other hand, lots of evidence that his good buddies, Scaife and friends, are behind it. ---
**Author:** ![Jinx](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/c6cbf5/32.png) [@Jinx](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jinx)\ **Post date:** [March 5, 2004, 6:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bush-must-go-government-investigates-teachers-union/232718/6 "2004-03-05T18:05:20Z")
For clarity and insight, may I suggestion that…: The OP’s mindset, when posting this thread, may be going back to recent news regarding the recent comment from the Secretary of the US Dept of Ed…calling the NEA a “terrorist organization”. I think the OP _might_ simply wish to say that it is hoped the audit is on the up-and-up especially in an election year. - Jinx ---
**Author:** ![Renob](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/8c91f0/32.png) [@Renob](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Renob)\ **Post date:** [March 5, 2004, 6:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bush-must-go-government-investigates-teachers-union/232718/7 "2004-03-05T18:16:18Z")
Yet another unfounded attack on Bush. If there were indeed complaints about this union’s expenditures, then the government would be remiss is they _didn’t_ investigate. Should the NEA get a free pass on alleged unlawful activity just because they are liberal? And since the investigation has been ongoing since 2002, I somehow doubt this is an election year ploy. As for the Howard Stern comment, are you trying to imply that Bush is conpsiring to shut him down? That’s just silly. Howard is in no danger of going off the air. He makes too much money for Infinity Broadcasting (they are the ones who distribute his show, right?). Also, since Howard usually endorses Republicans (Whitman, D’Amato, et al.) it’s not likely that Bush would want him gone (of course, this is making the ridiculous assumption that the president can simply force anyone he dislikes off the air). You should really check your facts before making such random comments. ---
**Author:** ![Munch](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/munch/32/5281_2.png) [@Munch](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Munch)\ **Post date:** [March 5, 2004, 6:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bush-must-go-government-investigates-teachers-union/232718/8 "2004-03-05T18:41:38Z")
> [@](#): > > I hear from a Howard Stern listner that he may be taken off the air as well. Research, Google, and tinfoil are your friends. ---
**Author:** ![rjung](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/45deac/32.png) [@rjung](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/rjung)\ **Post date:** [March 5, 2004, 9:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bush-must-go-government-investigates-teachers-union/232718/9 "2004-03-05T21:08:16Z")
> [@Renob](#): > > As for the Howard Stern comment, are you trying to imply that Bush is conpsiring to shut him down? That’s just silly. Howard is in no danger of going off the air. He makes too much money for Infinity Broadcasting (they are the ones who distribute his show, right?). Also, since Howard usually endorses Republicans (Whitman, D’Amato, et al.) it’s not likely that Bush would want him gone (of course, this is making the ridiculous assumption that the president can simply force anyone he dislikes off the air). (1) I believe Howard Stern endorsed John Kerry a few days ago. (2) Howard apparently believes he will be thrown off the air, since he made that comment on his show to his audience this morning. No idea whether or not Bush is behind it (I think it’s more of an overzealous FCC, myself), but don’t throw too many assumptions around. ---
**Author:** ![rjciii](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/ecae2f/32.png) [@rjciii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/rjciii)\ **Post date:** [March 5, 2004, 11:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bush-must-go-government-investigates-teachers-union/232718/10 "2004-03-05T23:05:32Z")
> [@rjung](#): > > (2) Howard apparently believes he will be thrown off the air, since he made that comment on his show to his audience this morning. You aren’t suggesting that Stern believes everything he says, are you? The guy has done everything known to man for ratings, so it wouldn’t surprise me a bit if he had absolutely no fear of being shut down. ---
**Author:** ![rjung](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/45deac/32.png) [@rjung](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/rjung)\ **Post date:** [March 5, 2004, 11:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bush-must-go-government-investigates-teachers-union/232718/11 "2004-03-05T23:31:54Z")
**Shrug** Apparently, Stern told his viewers with absolutely no humor whatsoever that he was “not joking,” that the FCC is looking to slap an unprecedented fine against him for indecent broadcasting, and that Infinity might drop him inside of a week. Dunno about the inner politiks of Infinity, but the FCC’s unprecedented fines is apparently making [mainstream news outlets.](http://money.cnn.com/2004/03/05/news/companies/fcc_rules/) I guess we’ll find out by next Friday, eh? ---
**Author:** ![TeaElle](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/8491ac/32.png) [@TeaElle](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TeaElle)\ **Post date:** [March 6, 2004, 2:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bush-must-go-government-investigates-teachers-union/232718/12 "2004-03-06T02:09:42Z")
The FCC _may_ slap an unprecedented fine on Infinity for “indecency” aired as part of the Stern program. That remains to be seen. It is presumptuous to believe that if they do so it will be on the orders of anyone beyond Michael Powell, who heads the agency and holds to a very conservative POV regarding broadcast standards. Even if you presume that Powell is a Bush appointee and therefore takes his cues from the man who gave him his job, there’s still a faulty presumption at work, namely that an FCC chief appointed by a different president (Kerry) would view the Stern situation differently. But there is absolutely no evidence that a new FCC chief wouldn’t slap a massive fine on Infinity for the specific incident that has Stern in the center of a maelstrom and off the air on some Clear Channel stations. (You can search for the specifics, it regards the broadcast of a telephone call which included racial slurs and graphic references to oral sex.) The sheer volume of complaints received over the incident would have necessitated an inquiry, at the very least, regardless of Stern’s (or Infinity’s) political leanings. ---
**Author:** ![Magiver](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/4491bb/32.png) [@Magiver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Magiver)\ **Post date:** [March 6, 2004, 2:57am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bush-must-go-government-investigates-teachers-union/232718/13 "2004-03-06T02:57:20Z")
[QUOTE=TeaElle] The FCC _may_ slap an unprecedented fine on Infinity for “indecency” aired as part of the Stern program. That remains to be seen. It is presumptuous to believe that if they do so it will be on the orders of anyone beyond Michael Powell, who heads the agency and holds to a very conservative POV regarding broadcast standards. If Powell has conservative standards (or any standards) he’s damn slow about enforcing them. ---
**Author:** ![flickster](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/7bcc69/32.png) [@flickster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/flickster)\ **Post date:** [March 6, 2004, 3:10am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bush-must-go-government-investigates-teachers-union/232718/14 "2004-03-06T03:10:46Z")
> [@rjung](#): > > Howard apparently believes he will be thrown off the air, since he made that comment on his show to his audience this morning. Not crying any crocodile tears here, but that’s JMHO. The show is tired and old, but I would rather the free market decide it’s fate than making him a martyr. ---
**Author:** ![Zoe](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/a4c791/32.png) [@Zoe](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Zoe)\ **Post date:** [March 6, 2004, 4:00am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bush-must-go-government-investigates-teachers-union/232718/15 "2004-03-06T04:00:49Z")
> [@](#): > > **John Mace** : If the Teachers’ Union wants to play the political game, they should expect an audit from time to time. Are you serious? In the first place, the National Education Association is not a union. Their dues are not used for political purposes. There is a separate PAC which teachers can choose to support if they wish. If there has been a complaint from a reliable source, an investigation _may_ be in order. But no organization should have to expect to be harrassed simply because their political arm supports candidates other than the current administration. That is known as having an “enemies list” and it served Nixon poorly. The investigative powers of government are not to be used casually or as punishment. It’s a waste of money and resources. So, that was almost two years ago. The law firm that complained must surely have had some “leads.” What has the Labor Department found after two years of investigation? And how much has this cost the taxpayer? ---
**Author:** ![Quint\_Essence](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/q/54ee81/32.png) [@Quint\_Essence](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Quint_Essence)\ **Post date:** [March 6, 2004, 7:05am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bush-must-go-government-investigates-teachers-union/232718/16 "2004-03-06T07:05:53Z")
Bush is a criminally stupid, morally inept shit for brains ass. I think we should all send him some pretzels. ---
**Author:** ![DMC](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dmc/32/18049_2.png) [@DMC](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DMC)\ **Post date:** [March 6, 2004, 7:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bush-must-go-government-investigates-teachers-union/232718/17 "2004-03-06T07:09:46Z")
For those who still think this was simply a lawfirm crying foul out of concern, [here](http://www.mediatransparency.org/search_results/info_on_any_recipient.php?recipientID=747) is the breakdown of the money behind the Landmark Legal Foundation, who filed the complaints. For those who might be curious, the Sarah Scaife Foundation, the Scaife Family Foundation, the Alleghany Foundation and the Carthage Foundation are all part of the Scaife empire. Yes, Scaife is also the name of the man who hired a reporter to write a book about the Vince Foster “murder”, and had his fingers in just about every accusation ever laid at the feet of the Clintons. While Scaife is a buddy of Bush, Sr., is he a friend of Bush, Jr? Who knows, but I bet there’s not six degrees of separation between the two. ---
**Author:** ![Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e99b99/32.png) [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Diogenes_the_Cynic)\ **Post date:** [March 6, 2004, 7:25am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bush-must-go-government-investigates-teachers-union/232718/18 "2004-03-06T07:25:21Z")
Stern has been saying on his show that Clear Channel turned on him when he began to publicly blast Bush on the air and call for his ouster. He contends that Clear Channel is in the GOPs pocket and has habitually fired those who are critical of Bush or the war in Iraq. Stern cited examples like a woman who was canned for refusing to attend a pro-war rally. Whatever you think of Stern’s credibility, he has been loudly screaming that the Bushies are spearheading a coup to get him off the air and he really seems to believe it. He did endorse Kerry, btw, not because he loves Kerry but because he’s been going nuts saying we need to get Bush out of the White House. ---
**Author:** ![TBG](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/c89c15/32.png) [@TBG](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TBG)\ **Post date:** [March 6, 2004, 8:38am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bush-must-go-government-investigates-teachers-union/232718/19 "2004-03-06T08:38:00Z")
> [@Zoe](#): > > Are you serious? In the first place, the National Education Association is not a union. Their dues are not used for political purposes. My parents are both teachers, and I can tell you, the NEA is about anything but actual education. ---
**Author:** ![Zoe](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/a4c791/32.png) [@Zoe](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Zoe)\ **Post date:** [March 6, 2004, 8:40am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bush-must-go-government-investigates-teachers-union/232718/20 "2004-03-06T08:40:19Z")
The IRS is auditing the NEA which has tax exempt status. This is crazy. Clear channel shuts down Stern. The Reagan movie isn’t shown. Bill Maher was fired from PI for saying the terrorists weren’t cowards. Don’t even want to think about the Patriot Act or the proposed Amendment. Aren’t you glad we’re “more free” now? [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bush-must-go-government-investigates-teachers-union/232718.md?page=2)