Forgive me. I’m rarely an overt patriot. 
(But ya gotta admit, the whole “It’s just colors on paper!!!” schtick is such an easy setup it’s hard not to jizz red, white and blue all over it…)
And yes, they are all wonderful gestures too. But the lowering of the flag to half-mast is powerfully symbolic of the sympathy that you, as an entire nation, have for the victims of this diabolical event. Nothing else quite conveys the sombreness and gravity of the situation, not money, not orchestrated visits by pompous heads oif state or trite ‘statements of support’. I truly hope that our PM follows suit and drops our flags too.
BTW, I am irreverently anti-establishment and convention under normal circumstances, and think of flags as basically silly bits of cloth that should mostly be disregarded. Not today though. Today your flag (and mine too hopefully) will be flying at half mast.
After 9/11, other countries lowered their flags to half-mast to honor our dead… why should we not do the same?
This is NOT a normal tragedy or disaster (as if such a thing could ever be ordinary) - the scope and numbers are unusual. It crossed multiple national borders, killed (at present count) 150,000 in mere minutes, completely devasted the lives of millions and, given that the area is heavily visited by tourists and it was a holiday time period, many thousands visting from outside the region were killed so countries literally halfway around the world have also lost citizens.
I’d much rather start a new tradition of half-mast flags for tragedies of international scope than do what some have done in the past - dancing in the streets and celebrating at the misfortunes of others.
Someone mentioned Arlington National Cemetary… did they also remember that the first soliders buried there were not generals and admirals but lowly privates, some of them unknowns, who had fallen during the Civil War? Part of what has made the United States admirable in the past has been our willingness to acknowledge and honor the common man as well as the rich and powerful. Surely, if we can lower the flag for the death of one man we can lower it for a day for 150,000 dead.
Not really. Taking something inside when the weather is foul is a symbol of respect towards it. I don’t think it’s nearly as arbitrary as “only look at the flag with both eyes!”
Well, yeah. Of course.
That’s why we’ve spent WAY, WAY, WAY more money arming our soldiers, funding our law enforcement agencies, and educating our children then we’ve spent coming up with guidelines on how our flag should be treated.
I’m no fan of President Bush, but I think he was clearly right in directing flags to be lowered to half mast. The death of 100,000 people is no trivial matter and certainly qualifies for any memorial actions.
Bush’s lowering of the flag is a pathetic attempt to make people think he actually cares.
Aid for tsunami victims: $35 million
Bush inauguration celebration: $45 million
Cost for one day of Iraq war: $270 million
The sad part is how quickly people will forgot about this. Right-wing talking heads constantly remind us of 3000 dead Americans on 9/11 to justify the murder of 100,000 Iraqis by the US invasion. You never hear them shed a single tear for the 100,000 dead Iraqis or the 50,000 dead Iranians, and I guarantee they aren’t losing any sleep over the disaster area that is Asia.
Somehow 3000 Americans are muuuuuuch more important - they are imperial citizens after all. Those other dead people don’t count. They’re just subhuman savages. They might be briefly exploited for headline news (disaster means high ratings) but the story gets old soon and we’re right back to 9/11 and how 9/11 somehow justifies our Iraq invasion even though Iraq had absolutely nothing to do with 9/11.
I hate Bush and the vast majority of his policies and actions with the passion of a thousand white hot suns, but I can’t really get worked up about this.
Even if Bush the man is just doing it for show, I think it’s an adequate expression of the real grief and concern felt by millions of everyday Americans over this tragedy. The amount of money and donations pouring into countless charities and aid organizations of all stripes should be indicative of that, regardless of whatever amount of government money Bush has or has not pledged. The flag as a symbol belongs to everyone, not just the government.
If you can’t abide by the flag being lowered for thousands dead of non-Americans, then at least for the Americans that were overseas and who died there because they were in the wrong place at the wrong time. :rolleyes:
Of course, flag-worship tends to annoy/disturb me in general, so I have a hard time getting worked up at all when people talk about what’s “wrong” and “right” to do with a flag. Man.
Did I miss a left-turn at Alberquerque or summat? 
I thought this thread was about shows of respect for those who died in the tsunami. Does every-fucking-thing have to end up being a ragging on Bush and Co’s warmongering? It’s really bloody boring after a while you know.
Hey, jinwicked is back! Good to hear from you!
The US aid pledge is up to $350 million now.
So, while I could care less about the lowering of the flag, since it’s the money that matters, I think the Bush admin is doing its part.
You have to ask? Haven’t you been here long enough to know that any thread can be hijacked into an argument about Iraq?
(FWIW, I agree.)
You ignorant cooze, as has been pointed out, US aid is at $350,000,000.00 to date, not $35 million. And that isn’t counting the considerable military resources we have sent to the region to aid relief efforts. That number is going to rise, as has been stated umpteen times, and ignored by you little shrieking buttgoblins umpteen times.
Yeah, I guess I did have an inkling, but all the same it never ceases to amaze me just how rabid some posters can be. :rolleyes:
I see such actions as lowering the flag to be fundamentally apolitical by their very nature. It’s a symbol of the nation coming together in some sort of non-partisan communion to mourn the tragedy that has occurred, whether it’s a statesman/woman who has died, or 3000 people in 9/11, or 150,000 in the tsunami.
It’s about sharing grief, not about political pointscoring.
I don’t think the thread was hijacked. It was kind of about Bush from the… ah, beginning.
Of course its possible that what seems like a maudlin and manipulative display might be an entirely sincere, heartfelt gesture. Gotta admit that, its possible.
From here, looks kinda like this. The Bushiviks very much hoped to see headlines :“America Outraged by Slander from Corrupt, Ineffectual UN”. Which they got. Then they got “Maybe The Corrupt Little Wimp Has A Point?” So they are scrambling to get ahead of this one. Want to keep the attention in correct focus, not digress to distractions, do not, do NOT want to see “We’re Spending $275 Million Every Day for Nothing”.
Still, maybe not. Walks like a duck, quacks, swims…still, could be an eagle.
About Bush, yes.
About the Iraq war? Not that I can see.
:rolleyes:
Elucidator, do you truly believe that President Bush is so cold and heartless that he feels nothing for the 150,000 dead, and that scoring political points–with an electorate that puts foreign aid somewhere WAY below abortion, social issues, TWAT, the economy, tax reform, etc.–was his primary motivation for this? It boggles my mind that people can read that into this. Disagreeing with someones politics doesn’t give you license to characterize him as a sociopath.
I can’t believe this is a Pit thread. Or that there are people agreeing with the OP. Jesus, even as a commie pinko tree hugger, I see nothing wrong with what the fuck he did and can’t imagine what is going on in the minds of people that do. Insane.
Proving that the ‘Hand in warm water’ trick actually works, at least on Donald Rumsfeld: Priceless!
A President of the United States orders flags to be flown at half-mast in honour of those who died in the Indian Ocean tsunami tragedy. This is a touching and good thing, and shouldn’t be seen as dishonouring anybody or anything.
The President is G W Bush. Same applies. And no, I’m not a fan.