# Bush Says: "The Iraqis Owe Us a Debt of Gratitude" **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [January 15, 2007, 1:37am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bush-says-the-iraqis-owe-us-a-debt-of-gratitude/388013 "2007-01-15T01:37:06Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![Princhester](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/3e96dc/32.png) [@Princhester](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Princhester)\ **Post date:** [January 15, 2007, 9:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bush-says-the-iraqis-owe-us-a-debt-of-gratitude/388013/41 "2007-01-15T21:40:20Z")
[QUOTE=Scylla] I mentioned that he had been blown up in rebuttal to the point that he would only get positive responses from Iraqis since he had the gun. Having had one try to blow him up would show this to be incorrect, as would the fact that our troops get shot at quite a bit. [/QUOTE] You really think this makes a skerrick of sense? ---
**Author:** ![DrDeth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/b487fb/32.png) [@DrDeth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DrDeth)\ **Post date:** [January 16, 2007, 12:00am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bush-says-the-iraqis-owe-us-a-debt-of-gratitude/388013/42 "2007-01-16T00:00:31Z")
[QUOTE=GLWasteful] As opposed to what, the ersatz torture that US citizens inflicted? Kinda wish I could share your delusion that the average Iraqi is going to wind up anything but dead or maimed at the end of this exercise in nation building, but I don’t. And the Kurds were doing just great when Saddam was in power. As it stands now, they’ll have to fight off the Shiites and Sunnis when someone in the US finally pulls the plug. And considering the track record that the US has with the Kurds, they know that full well. [/QUOTE] The "torture"at Abu Ghraib was about as bad as Frat hazing. Certainly I wouldn’t volunteer for it, but compared to the horrors that SH and his sons did, it can barely qulify as torture. You really think that _half_ or so of the population of Iraq is going to be blown up? And, the Kurds were victims of SH attempt at genocide, where he tried to kill them off with fucking nerve gas for gods sake. How is that “doing just great”? :rolleyes: You are simply uninformed. You don’t know shit about the situation there. ---
**Author:** ![Liberal](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/848f3c/32.png) [@Liberal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Liberal)\ **Post date:** [January 16, 2007, 12:10am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bush-says-the-iraqis-owe-us-a-debt-of-gratitude/388013/43 "2007-01-16T00:10:50Z")
[QUOTE=Der Trihs] People died from our torture at Abu Ghraib. What did Saddam and friends do, raise them as zombies and torture the animated corpses ? [/QUOTE] Compare the numbers and the span of time, not to mention the school girls. Your sort of deliberate myopia is the reason you haven’t been able to grab more than a small, tenuous majority despite that this administration has fucked things up more than any in history. You keep screaming what a partisan idiot you are and thereby scaring off voters. ---
**Author:** ![elucidator](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/8edcca/32.png) [@elucidator](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elucidator)\ **Post date:** [January 16, 2007, 12:19am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bush-says-the-iraqis-owe-us-a-debt-of-gratitude/388013/44 "2007-01-16T00:19:27Z")
[QUOTE=DrDeth] The "torture"at Abu Ghraib was about as bad as Frat hazing… [/quote] Something about that phrase “frat hazing” rings a bell. Something about a fat, drug-addled blowhard. Not a clear memory, just a vague sense of mental nausea from exposure to the toxic wasted. > [@](#): > > …You really think that _half_ or so of the population of Iraq is going to be blown up?.. Probably not, probably an exaggeration. Precisely what percentage would you define as “acceptable”? > [@](#): > > …And, the Kurds were victims of SH attempt at genocide, where he tried to kill them off with fucking nerve gas for gods sake. How is that “doing just great”? :rolleyes:… Oh, come now. You knew perfectly well that the reference was to the Kurdish situation after the enforcement of the “No Fly” zone. > [@](#): > > …You are simply uninformed. You don’t know shit about the situation there. Stunning. Simply stunning. ---
**Author:** ![GIGObuster](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gigobuster/32/421_2.png) [@GIGObuster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GIGObuster)\ **Post date:** [January 16, 2007, 12:30am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bush-says-the-iraqis-owe-us-a-debt-of-gratitude/388013/45 "2007-01-16T00:30:36Z")
[QUOTE=DrDeth] The "torture"at Abu Ghraib was about as bad as Frat hazing. Certainly I wouldn’t volunteer for it, but compared to the horrors that SH and his sons did, it can barely qulify as torture. [/quote] I see that Rush [del]Limpbough[/del] Limbaugh has pulled one on you. [http://www.editorandpublisher.com/eandp/news/article\_display.jsp?vnu\_content\_id=1001218842](http://www.editorandpublisher.com/eandp/news/article_display.jsp?vnu_content_id=1001218842) > [@](#): > > NEW YORK A federal judge ruled today that graphic pictures of detainee abuse at Iraq’s Abu Ghraib prison must be released over government claims that they could damage America’s image. Last year a Republican senator conceded that they contained scenes of “rape and murder” and Secretary of Defense Donald Rumsfeld said they included acts that were “blatantly sadistic.” > [@](#): > > You really think that _half_ or so of the population of Iraq is going to be blown up? Indeed, hard to do that when many are becoming refugees (2 million and counting) > [@](#): > > And, the Kurds were victims of SH attempt at genocide, where he tried to kill them off with fucking nerve gas for gods sake. How is that “doing just great”? :rolleyes: Timeline problem again, that is ok, it is a typical sindrome of the extreme right. No one denied that, but the time to act for that was during the Reagan administration, that was the time that Saddam developed and used those weapons. > [@](#): > > You are simply uninformed. You don’t know shit about the situation there. Your post was one of the most ignorant I have ever seen in the history of the SDMB, even the grapist was better informed. ---
**Author:** ![DrDeth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/b487fb/32.png) [@DrDeth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DrDeth)\ **Post date:** [January 16, 2007, 12:31am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bush-says-the-iraqis-owe-us-a-debt-of-gratitude/388013/46 "2007-01-16T00:31:54Z")
[QUOTE=elucidator] Oh, come now. You knew perfectly well that the reference was to the Kurdish situation after the enforcement of the “No Fly” zone. . [/QUOTE] No, I do not “know” that, nor was it indicated. But even so, the “no fly zone” wasn;t something SH wanted, it was forced on him by American Military might. Thus “And the Kurds were doing just great when Saddam was in power.” is juat barely valid if you add “but only while the American Military was protecting them on a daily basis from acts of genocide.” ---
**Author:** ![Miller](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/miller/32/481_2.png) [@Miller](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Miller)\ **Post date:** [January 16, 2007, 12:36am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bush-says-the-iraqis-owe-us-a-debt-of-gratitude/388013/47 "2007-01-16T00:36:37Z")
[QUOTE=DrDeth] The "torture"at Abu Ghraib was about as bad as Frat hazing. Certainly I wouldn’t volunteer for it, but compared to the horrors that SH and his sons did, it can barely qulify as torture’. [/QUOTE] Does frat hazing encompass rape and murder now? Glad I stayed out of the Greek system when I was in school. ---
**Author:** ![GIGObuster](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gigobuster/32/421_2.png) [@GIGObuster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GIGObuster)\ **Post date:** [January 16, 2007, 12:45am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bush-says-the-iraqis-owe-us-a-debt-of-gratitude/388013/48 "2007-01-16T00:45:34Z")
[QUOTE=Liberal] Compare the numbers and the span of time, not to mention the school girls. Your sort of deliberate myopia is the reason you haven’t been able to grab more than a small, tenuous majority [/quote] Hold it, hold it.. The myopia here is that you are saying the democrats are as left as **Der Trihs** , no wonder many here are not taking you seriously. > [@](#): > > despite that this administration has fucked things up more than any in history. You keep screaming what a partisan idiot you are and thereby scaring off voters. And to think that even in the pit the party was pitted for not doing the promised bipartisanship they ran with. 🙂 On the whole the democrats ran with a “we are better than the republicans” and “we will check what is the President doing” platform. Telling us \*\*Der Trihs \*\* represents a Democratic partisan is a straw man, you are better than that. ---
**Author:** ![Der\_Trihs](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/der_trihs/32/233_2.png) [@Der\_Trihs](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Der_Trihs)\ **Post date:** [January 16, 2007, 1:41am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bush-says-the-iraqis-owe-us-a-debt-of-gratitude/388013/49 "2007-01-16T01:41:46Z")
[QUOTE=DrDeth] The "torture"at Abu Ghraib was about as bad as Frat hazing. [/quote] Tell it to the raped, and the dead, and the insane. If that’s what fraternitites do, then they should be broken up and their leaders tossed in prison. _Without_ using cluster bombs and napalm on the universities, to continue my analogy. [QUOTE=Liberal] Compare the numbers and the span of time, not to mention the school girls. [/quote] We haven’t been there as long, so we are morally superior ? :rolleyes: And which girls are you talking about ? The ones we raped in front of their parents to terrorize them ? [QUOTE=Liberal] Your sort of deliberate myopia is the reason you haven’t been able to grab more than a small, tenuous majority despite that this administration has fucked things up more than any in history. You keep screaming what a partisan idiot you are and thereby scaring off voters. [/QUOTE] When have I ever claimed to be a Democrat ? When have I even shown respect for them ? They are _barely_ better than the Republicans; that’s all. ---
**Author:** ![GLWasteful](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/f05b48/32.png) [@GLWasteful](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GLWasteful)\ **Post date:** [January 16, 2007, 2:13am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bush-says-the-iraqis-owe-us-a-debt-of-gratitude/388013/50 "2007-01-16T02:13:26Z")
[QUOTE=DrDeth] The "torture"at Abu Ghraib was about as bad as Frat hazing. [/quote] I’ll be goddamned. I didn’t think there was anybody ignorant enough to trot this horseshit out again. It appears that through living, I have learned. > [@](#): > > Certainly I wouldn’t volunteer for it. . . Can’t imagine for a moment why in hell not. After all, you maintain that it was analagous to frat hazing. And surely that can’t be too bad. > [@](#): > > You really think that _half_ or so of the population of Iraq is going to be blown up? Not only do I not, I also never said any such thing. Mayhap you could point out to me where you got such an asinine and harebrained idea? > [@](#): > > And, the Kurds were victims of SH attempt at genocide, where he tried to kill them off with fucking nerve gas for gods sake. How is that “doing just great”? Sweet merciful mother of fuck. . .are you really **that** willfully obtuse? A primer, and I promise to type slowly: The Kurds were doing great when Saddam was in power and the no-fly zone kept him from his baser instincts. Hell, they all but had the Kurdistan that they’ve been angling for. But then, I imagine that you knew full well what was meant by that statement. Of course, you also believe (or claim to believe) that Abu Ghraib was the work of pranksters and suchlike. So maybe you needed that little bit of knowledge that I’ve imparted. You’re certainly welcome. > [@](#): > > You are simply uninformed. You don’t know shit about the situation there. Clearly. If only I were an apologist for Abu Ghraib and someone who can’t read, such as yourself, then I would know shit. Jack shit, to be precise. So, you got anything else in your colon you wanna fling? Or are you too busy talking out of it? ---
**Author:** ![RedFury](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/ec9cab/32.png) [@RedFury](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RedFury)\ **Post date:** [January 16, 2007, 3:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bush-says-the-iraqis-owe-us-a-debt-of-gratitude/388013/51 "2007-01-16T03:09:41Z")
[QUOTE=DrDeth] The "torture"at Abu Ghraib was about as bad as Frat hazing. Certainly I wouldn’t volunteer for it, but compared to the horrors that SH and his sons did, it can barely qulify as torture. \ You are simply uninformed. You don’t know shit about the situation there. [/QUOTE] And you obviously have a loose sphincter as everyone can see you simply ooze shit out of it. “Fraz haze” your ass, worthless motherfucker. ---
**Author:** ![ElvisL1ves](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/5daacb/32.png) [@ElvisL1ves](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ElvisL1ves)\ **Post date:** [January 16, 2007, 3:12am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bush-says-the-iraqis-owe-us-a-debt-of-gratitude/388013/52 "2007-01-16T03:12:25Z")
[61% of Iraqis \*approve \* of attacks on US occupation forces.](http://www.worldpublicopinion.org/pipa/articles/home_page/250.php?nid=&id=&pnt=250&lb=hmpg2) So, **Scylla** , you never did tell us why \*you \* haven’t enlisted, did you? Care to let us in on your thinking? ---
**Author:** ![RedFury](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/ec9cab/32.png) [@RedFury](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RedFury)\ **Post date:** [January 16, 2007, 3:19am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bush-says-the-iraqis-owe-us-a-debt-of-gratitude/388013/53 "2007-01-16T03:19:27Z")
BTW, shit-for-brains, and others like him/her, why don’t you fuckin’ pay attention to what **madmonk28** has to say? He’s had his ass on the line there practically since day one of this American-provoked genocide. What? Don’t tell me. He doesn’t fit in the world of those “who create their own reality.” A used tampon is worth three of every one of your ilk. ---
**Author:** ![RedFury](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/ec9cab/32.png) [@RedFury](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RedFury)\ **Post date:** [January 16, 2007, 3:22am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bush-says-the-iraqis-owe-us-a-debt-of-gratitude/388013/54 "2007-01-16T03:22:47Z")
[QUOTE=ElvisL1ves] [61% of Iraqis \*approve \* of attacks on US occupation forces.](http://www.worldpublicopinion.org/pipa/articles/home_page/250.php?nid=&id=&pnt=250&lb=hmpg2) So, **Scylla** , you never did tell us why \*you \* haven’t enlisted, did you? Care to let us in on your thinking? [/QUOTE] Come on, **Elvis** , you’re a smart guy. Do you really think that query needs an answer? I’ll give you a clue: said of women and kittens. ---
**Author:** ![Scylla](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/a5b964/32.png) [@Scylla](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Scylla)\ **Post date:** [January 16, 2007, 3:42am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bush-says-the-iraqis-owe-us-a-debt-of-gratitude/388013/55 "2007-01-16T03:42:43Z")
[QUOTE=ElvisL1ves] [61% of Iraqis \*approve \* of attacks on US occupation forces.](http://www.worldpublicopinion.org/pipa/articles/home_page/250.php?nid=&id=&pnt=250&lb=hmpg2) So, **Scylla** , you never did tell us why \*you \* haven’t enlisted, did you? Care to let us in on your thinking? [/QUOTE] I did, responding to the chickenhawk argument. I think it’s on the 2nd or 3rd page of the “volunteers needed” thread in this forum. I invited **Redfury** to respond, and I’d be happy to hear your response. ---
**Author:** ![elucidator](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/8edcca/32.png) [@elucidator](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elucidator)\ **Post date:** [January 16, 2007, 4:24am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bush-says-the-iraqis-owe-us-a-debt-of-gratitude/388013/56 "2007-01-16T04:24:58Z")
Coolness, **Red** , center your _chakras_. Visualize: you’re seated by a cool running creek, bass and trout splashing, a six pack cooling in the water, all your exes are dead, Emma Goldman is reading from her essays, her pert bosom heaving with longing… ---
**Author:** ![Liberal](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/848f3c/32.png) [@Liberal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Liberal)\ **Post date:** [January 16, 2007, 10:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bush-says-the-iraqis-owe-us-a-debt-of-gratitude/388013/57 "2007-01-16T10:09:04Z")
[QUOTE=ElvisL1ves] So, **Scylla** , you never did tell us why \*you \* haven’t enlisted, did you? Care to let us in on your thinking? [/QUOTE] Why haven’t you run for president so you can change the policy you hate so much? ---
**Author:** ![Der\_Trihs](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/der_trihs/32/233_2.png) [@Der\_Trihs](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Der_Trihs)\ **Post date:** [January 16, 2007, 10:30am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bush-says-the-iraqis-owe-us-a-debt-of-gratitude/388013/58 "2007-01-16T10:30:11Z")
[QUOTE=Liberal] Why haven’t you run for president so you can change the policy you hate so much? [/QUOTE] Because he’d almost certainly lose, and lacks the money/connections to seriously try ? There are just a _few_ more spots open in the military than in the Presidency, you know. ---
**Author:** ![don\_t\_ask](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e68b1a/32.png) [@don\_t\_ask](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/don_t_ask)\ **Post date:** [January 16, 2007, 10:31am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bush-says-the-iraqis-owe-us-a-debt-of-gratitude/388013/59 "2007-01-16T10:31:57Z")
That’s funny. I heard someone conducting a quiz on the radio tonight. One of the questions was “In George Orwell’s _1984_ which ministry was responsible for conducting the wars?” He ended up having to give clues to people and said that the name of the ministry was “…quite Orwellian. You know a thing is named but it means the opposite. George Bush does it really well.” I couldn’t think what he meant but that is a great example. Ministry of Peace indeed. ---
**Author:** ![RTFirefly](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/c77e96/32.png) [@RTFirefly](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RTFirefly)\ **Post date:** [January 16, 2007, 10:32am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bush-says-the-iraqis-owe-us-a-debt-of-gratitude/388013/60 "2007-01-16T10:32:51Z")
[Gratitude, May 2003 version](http://www.nybooks.com/articles/18771): > [@](#): > > In Bremer’s account, the President was seriously interested in one issue: whether the leaders of the government that followed the CPA would publicly thank the United States. But there is no evidence that he cared about the specific questions that counted: Would the new prime minister have a broad base of support? Would he be able to bridge Iraq’s ethnic divisions? What political values should he have? Instead, Bush had only one demand: “It’s important to have someone who’s willing to stand up and thank the American people for their sacrifice in liberating Iraq.” According to Bremer, he came back to this single point three times in the same meeting. Similarly, Ghazi al-Yawar, an obscure Sunni Arab businessman, became Bush’s candidate for president of Iraq’s interim government because, as Bremer reports, Bush had “been favorably impressed with his open thanks to the Coalition.” That’s our Bush. Always with his priorities straight. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bush-says-the-iraqis-owe-us-a-debt-of-gratitude/388013.md?page=2) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bush-says-the-iraqis-owe-us-a-debt-of-gratitude/388013.md?page=4)