What “ingredient” would that be?
I already quoted it. If you do not feel inclined to read the actual threads you comment on, I do not feel inclined to repeat myself.
As noted above, Bush Sr. was referring to 9/11.
If the elder Bush had been less worried about fracturing his coalition the U.S. could have taken out Saddam then and not had today’s crisis.
Of course there could have been new and different crises in the interim had Bush Sr. acted unilaterally in '91.
What, exactly, did Iraq have to do with 9/11?
Oh, yeah…nothing.
Good old red herring, the favorite Bush ingredient.
LoL, would you at least read the quote? Instead of the knee-jerk rhetoric?
:dubious: Indeed.
I still think that Sr. had a much better grasp of foreign policy than Jr. and I still think that Sr. is subtly warning his idiot son not piss off the world with an illegal invasion. I don’t think that Sr. is against the invasion, per se, but I think he wants UN approval for it. Sr. did not exactly say that 9/11 was an ipso facto causus belli, but just implied (wrongly) that it was something to be considered.
The fact that Sr. is smarter than Jr. does not mean that Sr. isn’t just as capable as being cynical and manipulative. He can lie through hsi teeth and spout propaganda just as well as GeeDub, but he’s not dumb enough to shoot off his mouth about how America can do whatever it wants and the rest of the world can kiss his ass. It’s a difference of method, not policy…and certainly not morality.
** Saen, ** thank you for the link. I have now read the whole thing, stem to stern, and here’s my take on it:
Bush Sr. was sending messages to both sides. He was, with extreme tact and subtlety, saying to his son that he felt his son should work hard to bring togther the UN (which his son is absolutely trying to do. I don’t believe the Resident * wants * to go it alone at all. Everything would be * way *easier and simpler if he had stong UN support. He’s an idiot, but he’s not that much of an idiot.), and he was sending a message to the rest of the world that they should come together and support what Jr. is trying to do.
After reading it, I would characterize his position as supportive, yet certainly cautious, not at all thrilled with the idea of going forward without the UN.
And I would have to characterize the piece I linked to in my op as seriously overstating the case. Although if you stop to consider Sr’s position, it isn’t that difficult to extrapolate from what he said to what the author claimed he meant. After all, it’s not as though he’d ever really come out and say “My son is an insane cowboy madman, somebody stop him!”…even if he felt it were true. It’s just not done.
Well, don’t expect me to hang around too much, Boris. As I think you know, I remain completely aghast that there is any debate at all about this, that it is even a topic of discussion. I am so alarmed and horrified by the success of the Resident’s manipulations, that every time I consider wading into the fray I have to stop. Because in the end all I really want to do is scream at the top of my lungs:
WHY THE FUCK ARE WE EVEN HAVING THIS CONVERSATION? ARE YOU ALL AS FUCKING INSANE AS THAT MANIAC IN THE WHITE HOUSE? DIDN’T ANYONE READ * 1984? * HELLO?
And I realize how unsatisfying that, and the ensuing responses would ultimately be, so I go back to fussing over the details of moving into my new house and having my gall bladder removed.
"It’s clear when he says that he could have accomplished nothing in the 1st Gulf war without the UN. "
Yeah, if not for the Australians those Iraqis would have pushed Stormin Norman right back into the Persian Gulf. Geez…
The UN is useless, much like your pedantic rantings.
Well, let’s pretend that Bush Sr. said what the horribly slanted article claims he said. Heck, I’ll give you one further - let’s pretend that Jimmy Carter is GWB’s father, Jimmy Carter who has been terrifically (and I use the term with great irony) outspoken in his opposition to the current administration’s policies.
So, in this hypothetical situation, with the Wise and Noble Jimmy Bush Carter Sr. telling his son to back the hell off, do I balk in my assertion that war is a proper and just response to Iraq’s behavior? Not in the slightest. My opinions are based on the facts of the situation, not on what an ex-president thinks. Frankly, I would be skeptical of the intellectual resolve of anyone who based their feelings on this matter on what Bush Sr, or any other prior president thought, considering that the current administration is privvy to a helluva lot more information than any ex-president.
Jeff
Strawman. It’s not about military assistance, it’s about maintaining stability in the middle east.