# Bush v. Kerry, Round Three **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [October 13, 2004, 1:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bush-v-kerry-round-three/268997 "2004-10-13T13:53:30Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 28
**Author:** ![Mehitabel](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/8797f3/32.png) [@Mehitabel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mehitabel)\ **Post date:** [October 14, 2004, 3:36am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bush-v-kerry-round-three/268997/541 "2004-10-14T03:36:19Z")
Nightline just said 42% Kerry, 41% Bush, 14% a tie. No idea what the other 2% thought, probably Nader-ites a’stirring up trouble as they are wont to do. 😃 ---
**Author:** ![Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/left_hand_of_dorkness/32/7156_2.png) [@Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Left_Hand_of_Dorkness)\ **Post date:** [October 14, 2004, 3:37am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bush-v-kerry-round-three/268997/542 "2004-10-14T03:37:28Z")
> [@Diogenes the Cynic](#): > > Who here said they were convinced Kerry would win? We only said he won the debate. We also said it wouldn’t affect the polls much, so who are you talking about? I believe if he names names, he’ll be breaking the forum’s rules. Seems to me that these debate threads get **Bricker** more worked up than we otherwise see him :). I have a hard time choosing a winner in the debate. Obviously Bush said more crap that I disagreed with, but Kerry’s no angel in my eyes, either; I would love to have an anti-death-penalty, pro-gay-rights, anti-war candidate for whom i could realistically cast my ballot. Daniel ---
**Author:** ![Guinastasia](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/guinastasia/32/5751_2.png) [@Guinastasia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Guinastasia)\ **Post date:** [October 14, 2004, 3:39am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bush-v-kerry-round-three/268997/543 "2004-10-14T03:39:40Z")
> [@Captain Lance Murdoch](#): > > Did anyone hear the shit George Will was spewing about immigrants on ABC? No, what did he say? ---
**Author:** ![KidCharlemagne](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/ed8c4c/32.png) [@KidCharlemagne](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/KidCharlemagne)\ **Post date:** [October 14, 2004, 3:40am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bush-v-kerry-round-three/268997/544 "2004-10-14T03:40:56Z")
> [@Bricker](#): > > An excellent point. I offered only even money. Those people convinced Kerry will win should be placing their money now. I suspect most of these blowhards will not, however, just as the blowhards did not take my wager; only two reasonable people did that. Guess they aren’t too reasonable if they took 1:1 on Kerry. Go lock it in at Tradesports and put it in your private savings retirement account! ---
**Author:** ![Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/left_hand_of_dorkness/32/7156_2.png) [@Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Left_Hand_of_Dorkness)\ **Post date:** [October 14, 2004, 3:41am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bush-v-kerry-round-three/268997/545 "2004-10-14T03:41:40Z")
> [@5que](#): > > We must preserve the sanctity of the hard drive. Partitioning is a horrible procedure and should be banned by constitutional amendment. I disagree. We have 22 hard drives that have already been partitioned, and I fully support performing further partitions on them. We have hundreds of partitions that can be performed without having to partition the drives of any more computers. And can we please, for the love of God, stop quoting Internet polls? I mean, if you want to ask your Magic 8 ball whether Kerry won the debate, I’d love to hear what response you get–at least there’s **some** chance that your Magic 8 ball is really magic. Daniel ---
**Author:** ![Bricker](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/977dab/32.png) [@Bricker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bricker)\ **Post date:** [October 14, 2004, 3:44am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bush-v-kerry-round-three/268997/546 "2004-10-14T03:44:32Z")
> [@Left Hand of Dorkness](#): > > I believe if he names names, he’ll be breaking the forum’s rules. Seems to me that these debate threads get **Bricker** more worked up than we otherwise see him :). True. Because these threads, more than anything else, exemplify the SDMB-Lefty-Groupthink Phenom. Page after page of posters smugly assuring each other that their worldview is correct, and that any other view is unthinkable. ---
**Author:** ![Sam\_Stone](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ecccb3/32.png) [@Sam\_Stone](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sam_Stone)\ **Post date:** [October 14, 2004, 3:45am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bush-v-kerry-round-three/268997/547 "2004-10-14T03:45:04Z")
**RTFirefly** said: > [@](#): > > BUSH: I think it’s important, since he talked about the Medicare plan, has he been in the United States Senate for 20 years? He has no record on reforming of health care. No record at all. > > He introduced some 300 bills and he’s passed five. > > No record of leadership. > > I came to Washington to solve problems. I was deeply concerned about seniors having to choose between prescription drugs and food. And so I led. And in 2006, our seniors will get a prescription drug coverage in Medicare. > > SCHIEFFER: Senator Kerry? Thirty seconds. > > KERRY: Once again, the president is misleading America. I’ve actually passed 56 individual bills that I’ve personally written and, in addition to that, and not always under my name, there is amendments on certain bills. > > But more importantly, with respect to the question of no record, I helped write – I did write, I was one of the original authors of the early childhood health care and the expansion of health care that we did in the middle of the 1990s. And I’m very proud of that. > > So the president’s wrong. And you take Kerry’s word for that? > [@](#): > > Since Joining The U.S. Senate In 1985, Kerry Has Been The Lead Sponsor On 316 Bills, Only 5 (1.6%) Of Which Became Law.(Thomas Website, [http://thomas.loc.gov](http://thomas.loc.gov), Accessed 10/3/04) From [This cite](http://www.noticias.info/Asp/aspComunicados.asp?nid=36053&src=0). Methinks Kerry came up with his 56 number by including any bill in which he offered a modification or amendment or otherwise had some role in. The key is whether he was the lead sponsor on them (whether he introduced them). Bush was right, and Kerry was spinning. ---
**Author:** ![Early\_Out](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/6f9a4e/32.png) [@Early\_Out](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Early_Out)\ **Post date:** [October 14, 2004, 3:46am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bush-v-kerry-round-three/268997/548 "2004-10-14T03:46:28Z")
> [@Mehitabel](#): > > Nightline just said 42% Kerry, 41% Bush, 14% a tie. > > No idea what the other 2% thought, probably Nader-ites a’stirring up trouble as they are wont to do. 😃 Well, at least the Naderites are going to have a bit more trouble mucking about in Pennsylvania. Nader has been [tossed off the ballot](http://www.cnn.com/2004/ALLPOLITICS/10/13/nader.pennsylvania.ap/index.html). The judge who made the decision had some rather unflattering things to say about the signature-collection effort (what’s the opposite of “hyperbole?” “Hypobole?” OK, I’ll just stick with “understatement”). ---
**Author:** ![Bricker](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/977dab/32.png) [@Bricker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bricker)\ **Post date:** [October 14, 2004, 3:48am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bush-v-kerry-round-three/268997/549 "2004-10-14T03:48:21Z")
> [@KidCharlemagne](#): > > Guess they aren’t too reasonable if they took 1:1 on Kerry. Go lock it in at Tradesports and put it in your private savings retirement account! Well, technically, they took the bet when it was “Bush v. Anybody” at 1:1. No one knew it would shake out to be Kerry. ---
**Author:** ![Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/left_hand_of_dorkness/32/7156_2.png) [@Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Left_Hand_of_Dorkness)\ **Post date:** [October 14, 2004, 3:50am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bush-v-kerry-round-three/268997/550 "2004-10-14T03:50:44Z")
> [@Bricker](#): > > True. Because these threads, more than anything else, exemplify the SDMB-Lefty-Groupthink Phenom. Page after page of posters smugly assuring each other that their worldview is correct, and that any other view is unthinkable. There’s a thread in the pit, by **duffer** , in which he claims Edwards is comparing Kerry to Jesus. If I read it, based on similar threads by him, I know it’d piss me off with its absurd inaccuracies. I’ve therefore not read it. If these threads are no more than lefty groupthink, why do you trouble yourself with them? Daniel ---
**Author:** ![Gaudere](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/e495f1/32.png) [@Gaudere](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gaudere)\ **Post date:** [October 14, 2004, 3:54am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bush-v-kerry-round-three/268997/551 "2004-10-14T03:54:58Z")
**Hentor the Barbarian** > [@](#): > > You can take your pretentious bigotry and stuff it. [Moderator Hat ON] We ARE still in Great Debates. Hentor, cool it. That goes for the rest of you too; things have been a bit heated in this thread. Ease off. [Moderator Hat OFF] ---
**Author:** ![Mehitabel](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/8797f3/32.png) [@Mehitabel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mehitabel)\ **Post date:** [October 14, 2004, 3:56am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bush-v-kerry-round-three/268997/552 "2004-10-14T03:56:53Z")
Well, I’m off to bed, visions of George Stephanopoulos dancing in my head. And I finally finished ‘This House’, the last song of I DO! I DO!, on the soundtrack of my mind. It’s been real. Let’s do this again in four years!! ---
**Author:** ![Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e99b99/32.png) [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Diogenes_the_Cynic)\ **Post date:** [October 14, 2004, 3:58am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bush-v-kerry-round-three/268997/553 "2004-10-14T03:58:55Z")
> [@Sam Stone](#): > > **RTFirefly** said: > And you take Kerry’s word for that? > > From [This cite](http://www.noticias.info/Asp/aspComunicados.asp?nid=36053&src=0). > > Methinks Kerry came up with his 56 number by including any bill in which he offered a modification or amendment or otherwise had some role in. The key is whether he was the lead sponsor on them (whether he introduced them). > > Bush was right, and Kerry was spinning. Why is that "key?’ Who gives a crap? This election is about Bush, not Kerry. Kerry has only one requirement he must fulfill and that is to not be Bush. He has succeeded at that and thus has earned my vote. I would literally vote for an egg salad sandwich over Bush, so attacking Kerry is a waste of time as far as I’m concerned. ---
**Author:** ![Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/left_hand_of_dorkness/32/7156_2.png) [@Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Left_Hand_of_Dorkness)\ **Post date:** [October 14, 2004, 4:00am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bush-v-kerry-round-three/268997/554 "2004-10-14T04:00:52Z")
> [@Diogenes the Cynic](#): > > I would literally vote for an egg salad sandwich over Bush I just want to point out that a 35-year-old egg salad sandwich is gonna be awfully stinky. That said, there’s plenty of voters who AREN’T willing to vote for chicken butt protein over the current POTUS; for them, they need to understand the critiques of Kerry. Daniel ---
**Author:** ![PatriotX](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/c4cdca/32.png) [@PatriotX](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/PatriotX)\ **Post date:** [October 14, 2004, 4:02am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bush-v-kerry-round-three/268997/555 "2004-10-14T04:02:42Z")
> [@Starving Artist](#): > > Tavis Smiley is a hothead. He used to host a talk show on BET and eventually became so snide, angry and belligerent with his guests that BET fired him. I wouldn’t give his take on things any credence whatsoever. I think that this was an attempt at humor on Mr. Smiley’s part. ---
**Author:** ![Hentor\_the\_Barbarian](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/8edcca/32.png) [@Hentor\_the\_Barbarian](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hentor_the_Barbarian)\ **Post date:** [October 14, 2004, 4:04am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bush-v-kerry-round-three/268997/556 "2004-10-14T04:04:06Z")
> [@chula](#): > > Hey, slow down there. I hate that William F. Buckley accent he had when he was young. I’m just pointing out that it’s a big shift to talking like a hick. (My mom talks like a hick too, though I different kind of hick.) I apologize - I took your slight of the northeastern accent personally. I am also not sure now if you are saying that Kerry has gone to talking like a hick, which I don’t think anyone would claim. You should realize, however, that Southies in Boston, people from the Northeast Kingdom in Vermont, those east of the river in Connecticut, all have some degree or another of the “idear” in their speech, but are not pretentious Yalies. My mom has a very nice “sofer” in the living room. She’s never been to “Palmer,” Italy. On the other hand, some people born in New Haven, who ended up going to Yale, say “ve-HIC-les” and “nukyuler.” Perhaps that was what you meant by a long way to talking like a hick. 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![Spree](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/919ad9/32.png) [@Spree](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Spree)\ **Post date:** [October 14, 2004, 4:07am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bush-v-kerry-round-three/268997/557 "2004-10-14T04:07:05Z")
> [@Sam Stone](#): > > From [This cite](http://www.noticias.info/Asp/aspComunicados.asp?nid=36053&src=0). > > Methinks Kerry came up with his 56 number by including any bill in which he offered a modification or amendment or otherwise had some role in. The key is whether he was the lead sponsor on them (whether he introduced them). > > Bush was right, and Kerry was spinning. **Sam** , do you have a cite that doesn’t come _directly_ from the RNC, as noted on the Noticias [site](http://www.noticias.info/Asp/aspComunicados.asp?nid=36053&src=0) ? > [@](#): > > US ELECTION: DO-NOTHING SENATOR - Kerry Offered Small Bills, But Little Change > Republican National Committee (RNC) , Washington (Estados Unidos) jue 14 Oct 2004 > Política \> Elecciones :rolleyes: They might even be correct but I’m sure as heck not willing to take the RNC’s word for it, ya know? ---
**Author:** ![Hentor\_the\_Barbarian](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/8edcca/32.png) [@Hentor\_the\_Barbarian](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hentor_the_Barbarian)\ **Post date:** [October 14, 2004, 4:10am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bush-v-kerry-round-three/268997/558 "2004-10-14T04:10:10Z")
> [@Sam Stone](#): > > Bush was right, and Kerry was spinning. Bush was wrong, but Kerry was spinning. He has put forth that many bills of his own - not amendments to others that you speculate (if those were counted, there would be many more) but a number of the bills (I don’t recall exactly how many) were resolutions for things like the Senate to recognize certain individuals or express opposition to other things. That said, I find those who minimize his work in the Senate to be vastly understating the importance of the work he did, which has oft been cited here, on things like Iran-Contra, BCCI, Viet Nam MIA and reconcilliation issues. ---
**Author:** ![PatriotX](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/c4cdca/32.png) [@PatriotX](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/PatriotX)\ **Post date:** [October 14, 2004, 4:10am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bush-v-kerry-round-three/268997/559 "2004-10-14T04:10:13Z")
> [@KidCharlemagne](#): > > Guess they aren’t too reasonable if they took 1:1 on Kerry. Go lock it in at Tradesports and put it in your private savings retirement account! You’ve turned me on to the place. ---
**Author:** ![PatriotX](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/c4cdca/32.png) [@PatriotX](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/PatriotX)\ **Post date:** [October 14, 2004, 4:15am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bush-v-kerry-round-three/268997/560 "2004-10-14T04:15:32Z")
> [@Sam Stone](#): > > Methinks Kerry came up with his 56 number by including any bill in which he offered a modification or amendment or otherwise had some role in. Isn’t that what Kerry said? [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bush-v-kerry-round-three/268997.md?page=27) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bush-v-kerry-round-three/268997.md?page=29)