# Bushbots, since I can't ask for your brains, get yer asses in here... **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [January 14, 2005, 5:24am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bushbots-since-i-cant-ask-for-your-brains-get-yer-asses-in-here/284669 "2005-01-14T05:24:23Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 5
**Author:** ![davenportavenger](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/5f8ce5/32.png) [@davenportavenger](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/davenportavenger)\ **Post date:** [January 14, 2005, 11:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bushbots-since-i-cant-ask-for-your-brains-get-yer-asses-in-here/284669/81 "2005-01-14T23:30:09Z")
> [@annaplurabelle](#): > > He’s _not_ a true Conservative. He’s not even a true Republican. He’s a radical extremist. If you consider yourself a Conservative or Republican, and yet agree with the Bush admin. on most issues, then I suggest you re-think your own self-identification. Totally. And that’s why I have so little faith in conservatives today. Whatever happened to policing your own damn party? Keeping it in line with the values with which it was founded? Remember when people used to care about things like that? Never before in history have Americans lock-stepped with a politician or a political party the way the Pubs are now. Abraham Lincoln and Teddy Roosevelt would spit on you people. Maybe if thinking conservatives don’t want to be labeled Bushbots they should take a hard look at their party and its shining son, and figure out if they really want the Republican Party to take a radical shift toward interventionist foreign policy, higher taxes, and a larger budget–all things that the Pubs are supposed to be diametrically opposed to. Because party loyalty in the face of all outside data is not American. If you’re just supporting Republicans because that’s what you’ve always done, try taking a look at what they’re standing for today. Don’t just pull the lever. Research the candidate. Learn. Then again, if you really are buying what Dubya’s selling and view this war optimistically, what kind of happy pills are you taking and where can I buy some? ---
**Author:** ![TastesLikeBurning](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/839c29/32.png) [@TastesLikeBurning](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TastesLikeBurning)\ **Post date:** [January 15, 2005, 12:29am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bushbots-since-i-cant-ask-for-your-brains-get-yer-asses-in-here/284669/82 "2005-01-15T00:29:56Z")
> [@gobear](#): > > If a rollyeyes smiley is the best you have to offer, you might as well cede the argument right now. **You’re not even American; you don’t know or care about the political differences dividing us here in the States. so why should I or any American, Dem or Pub, listen to some foreigner tell us how to run our country?** Bolding mine. You stupid, blind, and arrogant fuck. Your argument that those of us who aren’t American have no right to input regarding the running of your country may have some credence, IF America were only minding their own business. But the fact remains that increasingly over the years, America has run roughshod over the rights of other countries to run their own internal affairs, so until that changes, suck it up dumbfuck. ---
**Author:** ![GaWd](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/f08c70/32.png) [@GaWd](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GaWd)\ **Post date:** [January 15, 2005, 12:33am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bushbots-since-i-cant-ask-for-your-brains-get-yer-asses-in-here/284669/83 "2005-01-15T00:33:19Z")
> [@continuity eror](#): > > Then again, if you really are buying what Dubya’s selling and view this war optimistically, what kind of happy pills are you taking and where can I buy some? Hard to say. Those who see sunshine and roses in the war have disappeared, apparently… ---
**Author:** ![gobear](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/8dc957/32.png) [@gobear](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gobear)\ **Post date:** [January 15, 2005, 12:49am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bushbots-since-i-cant-ask-for-your-brains-get-yer-asses-in-here/284669/84 "2005-01-15T00:49:14Z")
> [@TastesLikeBurning](#): > > Bolding mine. > > You stupid, blind, and arrogant fuck. > > Your argument that those of us who aren’t American have no right to input regarding the running of your country may have some credence, IF America were only minding their own business. > > But the fact remains that increasingly over the years, America has run roughshod over the rights of other countries to run their own internal affairs, so until that changes, suck it up dumbfuck. Dumbfuck I may be, but I get to vote (not that it counted this time) and you don’t. You don’t live here, you don’t pay taxes, your opinion doesn’t count. ---
**Author:** ![Scylla](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/a5b964/32.png) [@Scylla](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Scylla)\ **Post date:** [January 15, 2005, 12:52am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bushbots-since-i-cant-ask-for-your-brains-get-yer-asses-in-here/284669/85 "2005-01-15T00:52:05Z")
1. I look at the OP, the title of this thread, and, some of the posts within, and I think my earlier thesis concerning aggressive insults without substance being proof of stupidity and cowardice is looking pretty good. 2. Concerning the “Bush is a lunkhead” for saying “Bring it on” when it is now being used against our troops… I have to agree. It seems like a very ill-advised thing to say. It goes to prove that there **is** no such thing as free speech. You pay for **everything** you say. I think Bush deserves some scorn heaped on him for this. If you agree with this so far, there is an unfortunate consequence. For a long time the most extreme criticism of the war, and Bush has been justified under “free speech.” Clearly that speech had, and continues to have consequences for our troops as well. You can’t have it both ways. ---
**Author:** ![annaplurabelle](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/919ad9/32.png) [@annaplurabelle](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/annaplurabelle)\ **Post date:** [January 15, 2005, 1:05am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bushbots-since-i-cant-ask-for-your-brains-get-yer-asses-in-here/284669/86 "2005-01-15T01:05:50Z")
> [@Scylla](#): > > For a long time the most extreme criticism of the war, and Bush has been justified under “free speech.” Clearly that speech had, and continues to have consequences for our troops as well. You can’t have it both ways. What are you suggesting? ---
**Author:** ![Starving\_Artist](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/aeb1de/32.png) [@Starving\_Artist](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Starving_Artist)\ **Post date:** [January 15, 2005, 1:23am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bushbots-since-i-cant-ask-for-your-brains-get-yer-asses-in-here/284669/87 "2005-01-15T01:23:14Z")
> [@Clothahump](#): > > \ > > Very well stated, amigo. Thank you. 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![davenportavenger](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/5f8ce5/32.png) [@davenportavenger](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/davenportavenger)\ **Post date:** [January 15, 2005, 1:29am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bushbots-since-i-cant-ask-for-your-brains-get-yer-asses-in-here/284669/88 "2005-01-15T01:29:32Z")
> [@gobear](#): > > You don’t live here, you don’t pay taxes, your opinion doesn’t count. This comment is really xenophobic. America’s actions affect the rest of the world in a way that, say, Italy’s doesn’t. There isn’t a corner of the world that isn’t touched by our government. So I think foreigners have every right to talk about our government–it affects them, even if only indirectly in some cases. ---
**Author:** ![Kimstu](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/ecd19e/32.png) [@Kimstu](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kimstu)\ **Post date:** [January 15, 2005, 1:38am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bushbots-since-i-cant-ask-for-your-brains-get-yer-asses-in-here/284669/89 "2005-01-15T01:38:56Z")
And heaven knows, if **Sam Stone** can run around these boards focusing so passionately on US political issues that many other posters don’t even realize he isn’t American, other non-Americans should be able to do the same. **Scylla:** _For a long time the most extreme criticism of the war, and Bush has been justified under “free speech.” Clearly that speech had, and continues to have consequences for our troops as well._ Well, you’re definitely wrong about the “clearly” part, for starters. Exactly what “consequences for our troops” are you claiming have been produced by anti-war and anti-Bush criticism, and what are your grounds for claiming it? ---
**Author:** ![World\_Eater](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/f04885/32.png) [@World\_Eater](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/World_Eater)\ **Post date:** [January 15, 2005, 1:43am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bushbots-since-i-cant-ask-for-your-brains-get-yer-asses-in-here/284669/90 "2005-01-15T01:43:49Z")
> [@gobear](#): > > Dumbfuck I may be, but I get to vote (not that it counted this time) and you don’t. You don’t live here, you don’t pay taxes, your opinion doesn’t count. I disagree. Bush has plenty of influence outside our borders, hence people beyond them have a right to their opinions of him. ---
**Author:** ![gobear](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/8dc957/32.png) [@gobear](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gobear)\ **Post date:** [January 15, 2005, 1:48am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bushbots-since-i-cant-ask-for-your-brains-get-yer-asses-in-here/284669/91 "2005-01-15T01:48:22Z")
> [@World Eater](#): > > I disagree. Bush has plenty of influence outside our borders, hence people beyond them have a right to their opinions of him. Of course, they can have an opinion, and they can voice their opinion, but they do not vote, they do not have representation in Congress, they don’t pay taxes, therefore their opinions don’t matter. It’s be like me bitching about Australia’s governmen–I’ve not been there, don’t know the people or the domestic issues, but I expect the Australians to value my opinions over their own and for their government to heed what I say. ---
**Author:** ![Starving\_Artist](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/aeb1de/32.png) [@Starving\_Artist](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Starving_Artist)\ **Post date:** [January 15, 2005, 1:53am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bushbots-since-i-cant-ask-for-your-brains-get-yer-asses-in-here/284669/92 "2005-01-15T01:53:54Z")
> [@ivylass](#): > > As God said on _Joan of Arcadia_… > > "There’s no answer I can give that would make any sense to you. How apropos! This is exactly why I haven’t bother to explain, _yet again_, what good I think is being accomplished in Iraq. It accomplishes nothing but to provide fodder for more argument. Those who are asking what good is being accomplished in Iraq aren’t really interested in knowing…they just want to attack whatever is said. ---
**Author:** ![Starving\_Artist](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/aeb1de/32.png) [@Starving\_Artist](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Starving_Artist)\ **Post date:** [January 15, 2005, 2:15am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bushbots-since-i-cant-ask-for-your-brains-get-yer-asses-in-here/284669/93 "2005-01-15T02:15:44Z")
> [@gobear](#): > > **Starving Artist’s** post about “optimism vs. pessimism” is key; to him beleiving in America and being a patriot means supporting the president; people who don’t support the president are therefore not patriotic. He forgets that sometimes the highest degree of patriotism is speaking truth to power, in this case exposing the lies and chicanery of a corrupt regime. Well, first of all I’d like to thank you for the positive things you’ve said regarding those of us on the other side of this issue. Secondly, though, I have to quibble with your analysis of my position here. I don’t necessarily believe that in order to be a good American one has to support the president, and I don’t necessarily view criticism of the government to be non-patriotic. If you’ll pardon my saying so, it seems that you are thinking in much the same way as those who accuse me of mindlessly swallowing “Bushco propaganda.” It seems to be difficult for those on the other side to believe that one could agree with the administration’s stances on these issues without having been “conned” into it. Your post seems to indicate that you believe I advocate mindless loyalty to the party, rather than being cognizant of the fact that perhaps the administration is following a course of action that is in line with what I belive to be correct to begin with. In other words, I’m not following the Bush party line and I haven’t swallowed any “Bushco propaganda”; I’m simply in tune philosophically with the administration’s stances on many of these issues. ---
**Author:** ![annaplurabelle](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/919ad9/32.png) [@annaplurabelle](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/annaplurabelle)\ **Post date:** [January 15, 2005, 2:29am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bushbots-since-i-cant-ask-for-your-brains-get-yer-asses-in-here/284669/94 "2005-01-15T02:29:56Z")
> [@Starving Artist](#): > > In other words, I’m not following the Bush party line and I haven’t swallowed any “Bushco propaganda”; I’m simply in tune philosophically with the administration’s stances on many of these issues. Could you expand on what those stances are? > [@](#): > > This is exactly why I haven’t bother to explain, yet again, what good I think is being accomplished in Iraq. It accomplishes nothing but to provide fodder for more argument. Those who are asking what good is being accomplished in Iraq aren’t really interested in knowing…they just want to attack whatever is said. That’s an avoidance technique. Unless you are taking the stance that you are a Supreme Being, and therefore above the need for explanation to mere mortals. You should be able to explain why you feel so wholeheartedly that your principles (stances) are worthy of embracing. If not, how did you justify them to yourself? ---
**Author:** ![Polycarp](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/82dd89/32.png) [@Polycarp](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Polycarp)\ **Post date:** [January 15, 2005, 2:42am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bushbots-since-i-cant-ask-for-your-brains-get-yer-asses-in-here/284669/95 "2005-01-15T02:42:26Z")
> [@Starving Artist](#): > > How apropos! > > This is exactly why I haven’t bother to explain, _yet again_, what good I think is being accomplished in Iraq. It accomplishes nothing but to provide fodder for more argument. Those who are asking what good is being accomplished in Iraq aren’t really interested in knowing…they just want to attack whatever is said. In view of what you said in your next post, answering **gobear** , I would like to make a request. not to be acted on until both your response and that of one of the GD moderators has been posted to the affirmative in this thread. That request would be for a GD thread that would calmly analyze the benefits and liabilities of the present situation there, perhaps with **Tamerlane** or another expert on the area commenting on the ethnopolitical realities we should be aware of regarding Iraq in a manner that is not (or minimally) judgmental of American policies. The request would be for you to start an OP outlining what good you think is being done there. The reason for the moderator request is that, as I request it, courtesy would be **mandated** in that thread – absolutely no hot tempers or accusations of toeing a party line (pro or anti Bush) allowed. I frankly think that we’re up to our ass in alligators, and are making no progress toward draining the swamp. You clearly feel otherwise to some degree, based on that statement. I’d like opportunity to quietly review your arguments, question them politely, and perhaps build some common ground on this most volatile of subjects. I realize I’m asking a lot of the moderators in suggesting a thread of this sort, and I would not be surprised to hear a “no, we cannot enforce that rule for that thread” from one of them. But I for one welcome… 😉 No, I for one would like to hear your perspective on the positives of the Iraq situation and why you hold that view. ---
**Author:** ![GaWd](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/f08c70/32.png) [@GaWd](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GaWd)\ **Post date:** [January 15, 2005, 3:33am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bushbots-since-i-cant-ask-for-your-brains-get-yer-asses-in-here/284669/96 "2005-01-15T03:33:16Z")
SA- I’m not asking for your opinions on the war. THis is the second time I have re-iterated my request to you. I’m asking you to detail for me, the differences between your optimism and our “pessimism”. No, I want to see evidence of a situation that you see as rosy and I see gloom and doom. After all, if the difference was mere perspective, it should be simple to show me where you and yours cheered whilst me and mine booed. If not evidence, then at least a hypothetical? Something? You’re letting me down… > [@](#): > > That’s an avoidance technique. Unless you are taking the stance that you are a Supreme Being, and therefore above the need for explanation to mere mortals. Well, duh. Sam ---
**Author:** ![RedFury](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/ec9cab/32.png) [@RedFury](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RedFury)\ **Post date:** [January 15, 2005, 4:21am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bushbots-since-i-cant-ask-for-your-brains-get-yer-asses-in-here/284669/97 "2005-01-15T04:21:25Z")
Oh, don’t you worry, **Sam** , surely you know by now that they have a soothing explanation for _everything_ – otherwise known as spinning like tops. Problem lies when people start to consume their own fabrications. Something this particular Administration are experts at. For instance, no doubt many of you remember the numerous threads – both pre and post invasion – in which many of us were warning about the potential blowback of this 21st century Crusade. No doubt you also remember the spin put forth by the Bushbots at the time: “Iraq’s the flypaper” “We’d rather fight them there than here” etc. etc. Well, this is the situational anylisis _today_: [Iraq New Terror Breeding Ground](http://www.washingtonpost.com/ac2/wp-dyn/A7460-2005Jan13?language=printer) > [@](#): > > \*\*raq has replaced Afghanistan as the training ground for the next generation of “professionalized” terrorists, according to a report released yesterday by the National Intelligence Council, the CIA director’s think tank. > > Iraq provides terrorists with “a training ground, a recruitment ground, the opportunity for enhancing technical skills,” said David B. Low, the national intelligence officer for transnational threats. “There is even, under the best scenario, over time, the likelihood that some of the jihadists who are not killed there will, in a sense, go home, wherever home is, and will therefore disperse to various other countries.” > > \ > > Bush described the war in Iraq as a means to promote democracy in the Middle East. “A free Iraq can be a source of hope for all the Middle East,” he said one month before the invasion. “Instead of threatening its neighbors and harboring terrorists, Iraq can be an example of progress and prosperity in a region that needs both.” > > But as instability in Iraq grew after the toppling of Hussein, and resentment toward the United States intensified in the Muslim world, hundreds of foreign terrorists flooded into Iraq across its unguarded borders. They found tons of unprotected weapons caches that, military officials say, they are now using against U.S. troops. Foreign terrorists are believed to make up a large portion of today’s suicide bombers, and U.S. intelligence officials say these foreigners are forming tactical, ever-changing alliances with former Baathist fighters and other insurgents. > > \ > > According to the NIC report, Iraq has joined the list of conflicts – including the Israeli-Palestinian stalemate, and independence movements in Chechnya, Kashmir, Mindanao in the Philippines, and southern Thailand – that have deepened solidarity among Muslims and helped spread radical Islamic ideology. (my highlight) Solution? Kill them all and let Allah sort them out. Yep, no doubt the glass’ half full…of shit. ---
**Author:** ![RedFury](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/ec9cab/32.png) [@RedFury](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RedFury)\ **Post date:** [January 15, 2005, 4:32am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bushbots-since-i-cant-ask-for-your-brains-get-yer-asses-in-here/284669/98 "2005-01-15T04:32:40Z")
> [@Scylla](#): > > I look at the OP, the title of this thread, and, some of the posts within, and I think my earlier thesis concerning aggressive insults without substance being proof of stupidity and cowardice is looking pretty good. I read the above quote and can’t help but notice what a brave, brave man, **Scylla** is. Cheering others to their deaths from behind the comfort of his own keyboard. Tell you what, why don’t you go join Overcompensators Anonymous and shove your testosterone-laden Internet persona up your rectum. ---
**Author:** ![RedFury](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/ec9cab/32.png) [@RedFury](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RedFury)\ **Post date:** [January 15, 2005, 4:47am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bushbots-since-i-cant-ask-for-your-brains-get-yer-asses-in-here/284669/99 "2005-01-15T04:47:32Z")
[**Hentor The Barbarian**](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=5718232&postcount=27) > [@](#): > > Getting to do what they want is the bottom line, not what actually happens as a result. (Look at the fact that, with all the things that have gone wrong or been done wrong, nobody has suffered any consequences. The only people who have been dismissed have been those who are not team players – those who do not put their party before their country. Others are given medals of freedom!) I used to be unable to comprehend German citizens in the 1930’s. Indeed. Watching this whole thing unfold has been a real eye-opening experience for me as well. Well put. ---
**Author:** ![Squink](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/b5e925/32.png) [@Squink](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Squink)\ **Post date:** [January 15, 2005, 5:14am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bushbots-since-i-cant-ask-for-your-brains-get-yer-asses-in-here/284669/100 "2005-01-15T05:14:34Z")
> [@Scylla](#): > > 1. I look at the OP, the title of this thread, and, some of the posts within, and I think my earlier thesis concerning aggressive insults without substance being proof of stupidity and cowardice is looking pretty good. Yup. It sure is. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bushbots-since-i-cant-ask-for-your-brains-get-yer-asses-in-here/284669.md?page=4) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bushbots-since-i-cant-ask-for-your-brains-get-yer-asses-in-here/284669.md?page=6)