# Bush's plan to rebuild: Whats this puppy gona cost us? **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [September 16, 2005, 1:22am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bushs-plan-to-rebuild-whats-this-puppy-gona-cost-us/321896 "2005-09-16T01:22:13Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![rjung](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/45deac/32.png) [@rjung](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/rjung)\ **Post date:** [September 16, 2005, 6:35am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bushs-plan-to-rebuild-whats-this-puppy-gona-cost-us/321896/21 "2005-09-16T06:35:24Z")
> [@xtisme](#): > > whats this going to cost us? As much as it takes to erase the stigma of “incompetence” that Katrina sandbagged him with: > [@](#): > > By late last week, Administration aides were describing a three-part comeback plan. The first: **Spend freely, and worry about the tab and the consequences later.** “Nothing can salve the wounds like money,” said an official who helped develop the strategy. > –[“Living Too Much in the Bubble?”,](http://www.time.com/time/magazine/article/0,9171,1103581-3,00.html) _Time_ magazine, 9/19/2005 (And for whoever cares, the other steps of Bush’s spin-control plan are (2) blame everyone else, and (3) find another issue to distract the populace with) ---
**Author:** ![Zoe](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/a4c791/32.png) [@Zoe](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Zoe)\ **Post date:** [September 16, 2005, 7:10am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bushs-plan-to-rebuild-whats-this-puppy-gona-cost-us/321896/22 "2005-09-16T07:10:58Z")
> [@](#): > > **uglybeech** : It’s insane to rebuild the whole thing when there’s every reason to believe that it’ll happen again. I mean even if they managed to protect the levees against a cat 5 hurricane - for however many billions of dollars that alone will cost - what’s to protect them from a terrorist attack? Why bother building more highways in Boston? Terrorists gonna get 'em. ---
**Author:** ![uglybeech](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/82dd89/32.png) [@uglybeech](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/uglybeech)\ **Post date:** [September 16, 2005, 7:29am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bushs-plan-to-rebuild-whats-this-puppy-gona-cost-us/321896/23 "2005-09-16T07:29:14Z")
> [@Zoe](#): > > Why bother building more highways in Boston? Terrorists gonna get 'em. First of all the Big Dig was a terrible idea. If I could go back in time and spend that $15 billion on something more useful I would. But even still it’s a bad analogy. If a terrorist bombed the big dig (and I’m not sure we’d notice the difference) you’d get a big hole in it whose repair cost would be proportional to the size of the bomb. If a terrorist bombed a levee in New Orleans after the whold city had been rebuilt you could lose the entire city again. It’s a crazy risk if you don’t need to take it. ---
**Author:** ![Metacom](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/ecae2f/32.png) [@Metacom](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Metacom)\ **Post date:** [September 16, 2005, 1:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bushs-plan-to-rebuild-whats-this-puppy-gona-cost-us/321896/24 "2005-09-16T13:21:13Z")
> [@rjung](#): > > (And for whoever cares, the other steps of Bush’s spin-control plan are (2) blame everyone else, and (3) find another issue to distract the populace with) Actually, I think the [plan](http://www.heritage.org/Research/GovernmentReform/sr05.cfm) will be something like this: [ol] [li]Spend a lot of money.[/li][li]Roll back environmental regulations.[/li][li]Roll back labor regulations.[/li][li]Repeal capital gains and estate tax.[/li][/ol] Trickle-down reconstruction! ---
**Author:** ![LouisB](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/dfb087/32.png) [@LouisB](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/LouisB)\ **Post date:** [September 16, 2005, 1:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bushs-plan-to-rebuild-whats-this-puppy-gona-cost-us/321896/25 "2005-09-16T13:32:58Z")
I personally don’t believe any church at all should receive one thin dime of our money to rebuild—or for any other purpose, actually. I think most churches are basicaly tax-emempt, are they not? Congregations fund the original construction; let them fund the rebuilding. ---
**Author:** ![CalMeacham](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/calmeacham/32/35_2.png) [@CalMeacham](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CalMeacham)\ **Post date:** [September 16, 2005, 1:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bushs-plan-to-rebuild-whats-this-puppy-gona-cost-us/321896/26 "2005-09-16T13:35:18Z")
> [@](#): > > The Exxon Valdez spill was cleaned up way, way ahead of initial estimates. That will come as news to the people there. I recall the howlsd of indignation at the time that Exxon claimed the job was done. The Boston Museum of Science has had a mini-exshibit on how the area still isn’t clean. And there’s this: > [@](#): > > Today, ten years after the oil washed over the Chugach beaches, you can kick over a rock and it will smell like an old gas station. [http://www.gregpalast.com/detail.cfm?artid=17&row=2](http://www.gregpalast.com/detail.cfm?artid=17&row=2) [http://www.gregpalast.com/detail.cfm?artid=269&row=2](http://www.gregpalast.com/detail.cfm?artid=269&row=2) ---
**Author:** ![CalMeacham](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/calmeacham/32/35_2.png) [@CalMeacham](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CalMeacham)\ **Post date:** [September 16, 2005, 1:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bushs-plan-to-rebuild-whats-this-puppy-gona-cost-us/321896/27 "2005-09-16T13:40:12Z")
It’s not just liberal reporters, either. NOAA claims the pollution’s still there: [http://www.osti.gov/energycitations/product.biblio.jsp?osti\_id=6165979](http://www.osti.gov/energycitations/product.biblio.jsp?osti_id=6165979) ---
**Author:** ![Metacom](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/ecae2f/32.png) [@Metacom](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Metacom)\ **Post date:** [September 16, 2005, 1:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bushs-plan-to-rebuild-whats-this-puppy-gona-cost-us/321896/28 "2005-09-16T13:50:27Z")
> [@LouisB](#): > > I personally don’t believe any church at all should receive one thin dime of our money to rebuild—or for any other purpose, actually. I’m glad the rest of the country is more tolerant then you are. ---
**Author:** ![Merijeek](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/f05b48/32.png) [@Merijeek](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Merijeek)\ **Post date:** [September 16, 2005, 2:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bushs-plan-to-rebuild-whats-this-puppy-gona-cost-us/321896/29 "2005-09-16T14:05:31Z")
> [@uglybeech](#): > > If a terrorist bombed a levee in New Orleans after the whold city had been rebuilt you could lose the entire city again. It’s a crazy risk if you don’t need to take it. Hijack question here - I’ve been to New Orleans many times, but it’s not like the levees were top of my list. And I’m not much of an expert on boating. Still, I have to wonder, how difficult would it be to drive a boat with a ton of TNT in it right next to a levee? Is there anything to stop it, or is it more homeland security stuff that nobody has ever conceived of before? -Joe ---
**Author:** ![Steve\_MB](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/steve_mb/32/5339_2.png) [@Steve\_MB](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Steve_MB)\ **Post date:** [September 16, 2005, 2:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bushs-plan-to-rebuild-whats-this-puppy-gona-cost-us/321896/30 "2005-09-16T14:11:27Z")
> [@SteveG1](#): > > Part of the reason is simple CYA. If you estimate a task will take 3 weeks and $50K, and it only takes 2 weeks and $25K, you are “golden” because you came in ahead of schedule and under budget. However if you understimate you are in deep shit. You’ve gone overdue and overbudget, and people were depending on you doing what you claimed you could. It’s just safer to be pessimistic. “How else to maintain my reputation as a miracle worker?” --Scotty ---
**Author:** ![E-Sabbath](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/e19adc/32.png) [@E-Sabbath](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/E-Sabbath)\ **Post date:** [September 16, 2005, 2:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bushs-plan-to-rebuild-whats-this-puppy-gona-cost-us/321896/31 "2005-09-16T14:38:28Z")
Not going to say it wouldn’t do damage, but it wouldn’t do huge amounts of damage. It’d mostly be channeled up and away from the levee. Water’s less compressable than air, so the force of the explosion would be mostly up and out. If you were to somehow plant a shaped charge, you could put a hole in it, but that’s nothing that couldn’t be patched… reasonably quickly. Not that big a hole, either. This is _huge_ amounts of mass here, you’d need serious explosives to move much of it. Why the failure was so serious was the combination of the hurricane _and_ the failure. Nobody could get to the levees to repair them. At least, that’s my rule of thumb answer. I may be wrong. ---
**Author:** ![Mtgman](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/b5a626/32.png) [@Mtgman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mtgman)\ **Post date:** [September 16, 2005, 2:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bushs-plan-to-rebuild-whats-this-puppy-gona-cost-us/321896/32 "2005-09-16T14:39:19Z")
I’ll make one prediction. A very cynical one. More money will be spent on rebuilding New Orleans, one city with a population of half a million or so, than on rebuilding all of Iraq(~26 million) and Afghanistan(~29 million). Much, much more. Enjoy, Steven ---
**Author:** ![MacTech](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/c0e974/32.png) [@MacTech](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MacTech)\ **Post date:** [September 16, 2005, 2:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bushs-plan-to-rebuild-whats-this-puppy-gona-cost-us/321896/33 "2005-09-16T14:49:45Z")
> [@Metacom](#): > > Actually, I think the [plan](http://www.heritage.org/Research/GovernmentReform/sr05.cfm) will be something like this: > [ol] > [li]Spend a lot of money.[/li][li]Roll back environmental regulations.[/li][li]Roll back labor regulations.[/li][li]Repeal capital gains and estate tax.[/li][/ol] > Trickle-down reconstruction! actually, wasn’t it… 1; rebuild New Orleans 2; ??? 3; Profit! ---
**Author:** ![squeegee](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/squeegee/32/14537_2.png) [@squeegee](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/squeegee)\ **Post date:** [September 16, 2005, 4:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bushs-plan-to-rebuild-whats-this-puppy-gona-cost-us/321896/34 "2005-09-16T16:04:49Z")
What bothers me most here is that we’re apparently back to the [trifecta](http://www.washingtonpost.com/ac2/wp-dyn?pagename=article&contentId=A11253-2002Jul1¬Found=true) mindset prevalent in late 2001 and after – these are extraordinary times, so fiscal constraints go _must_ out the window. The absense of any spending sanity – spending on Iraq, on questionable tax cuts, on anything at all – will be explained away with the excuse of Katrina. Someone questioning unsustainable deficit spending will be painted as lacking compassion for the hurricane victims. :dubious: . ---
**Author:** ![John\_Mace](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_mace/32/185_2.png) [@John\_Mace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Mace)\ **Post date:** [September 16, 2005, 4:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bushs-plan-to-rebuild-whats-this-puppy-gona-cost-us/321896/35 "2005-09-16T16:10:23Z")
I think the men of this country would willingly chip in to rebuild NOLA if Congress passed the “NOLE Reconstruction and Tits Flash Act”: For every $10 you contribute, you get one string of beads to be used anytime the man chooses. A woman, upon being presented with the beads, must flash her tits for a full 10 seconds. Problem solved! ---
**Author:** ![Wartime\_Consigliori](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/9d8465/32.png) [@Wartime\_Consigliori](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Wartime_Consigliori)\ **Post date:** [September 16, 2005, 4:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bushs-plan-to-rebuild-whats-this-puppy-gona-cost-us/321896/36 "2005-09-16T16:22:52Z")
> [@John Mace](#): > > I think the men of this country would willingly chip in to rebuild NOLA if Congress passed the “NOLE Reconstruction and Tits Flash Act” I would like to offer my full-throated support of this initiative. ---
**Author:** ![Little\_Bird](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/3ec8ea/32.png) [@Little\_Bird](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Little_Bird)\ **Post date:** [September 16, 2005, 4:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bushs-plan-to-rebuild-whats-this-puppy-gona-cost-us/321896/37 "2005-09-16T16:32:09Z")
> [@LouisB](#): > > I personally don’t believe any church at all should receive one thin dime of our money to rebuild—or for any other purpose, actually. I think most churches are basicaly tax-emempt, are they not? Congregations fund the original construction; let them fund the rebuilding. > [@Metacom](#): > > I’m glad the rest of the country is more tolerant then you are. I agree with **LouisB**. Churches don’t pay taxes, so they shouldn’t get federal aid. Can’t have it both ways, folks. ---
**Author:** ![carnivorousplant](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/carnivorousplant/32/3563_2.png) [@carnivorousplant](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/carnivorousplant)\ **Post date:** [September 16, 2005, 4:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bushs-plan-to-rebuild-whats-this-puppy-gona-cost-us/321896/38 "2005-09-16T16:47:39Z")
> [@Little Bird](#): > > I agree with **LouisB**. Churches don’t pay taxes, so they shouldn’t get federal aid. Can’t have it both ways, folks. I have to agree with that, although I’d like not to. 🙂 I will make two predictions: Halliburton will get some bids. NASA’s Moon/Mars plans are going down the tubes. ---
**Author:** ![John\_Mace](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_mace/32/185_2.png) [@John\_Mace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Mace)\ **Post date:** [September 16, 2005, 4:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bushs-plan-to-rebuild-whats-this-puppy-gona-cost-us/321896/39 "2005-09-16T16:56:27Z")
> [@Little Bird](#): > > I agree with **LouisB**. Churches don’t pay taxes, so they shouldn’t get federal aid. Can’t have it both ways, folks. Neither do charitable organizations. Are you saying that the feds should not rebuild a Red Cross building or a Slavation Army building? The “don’t pay taxes” argument isn’t a very good one. An establishment clause argument is better, although it’s easily defeated by having the feds treat all denominations equally-- rebuild the churches, temples, mosques, etc. ---
**Author:** ![Metacom](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/ecae2f/32.png) [@Metacom](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Metacom)\ **Post date:** [September 16, 2005, 5:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bushs-plan-to-rebuild-whats-this-puppy-gona-cost-us/321896/40 "2005-09-16T17:44:46Z")
> [@Little Bird](#): > > Churches don’t pay taxes, so they shouldn’t get federal aid. Can’t have it both ways, folks. And people who itemize mortgage interest? [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bushs-plan-to-rebuild-whats-this-puppy-gona-cost-us/321896.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bushs-plan-to-rebuild-whats-this-puppy-gona-cost-us/321896.md?page=3)