# Bush's poll numbers dropping: can't fool all of the people all the time **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [July 21, 2003, 5:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bushs-poll-numbers-dropping-cant-fool-all-of-the-people-all-the-time/189951 "2003-07-21T17:01:02Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![elf6c](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/c57346/32.png) [@elf6c](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elf6c)\ **Post date:** [July 21, 2003, 5:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bushs-poll-numbers-dropping-cant-fool-all-of-the-people-all-the-time/189951/1 "2003-07-21T17:01:02Z")
From a story about the hapless Dems finally catching on and running ads featuring Bush’s false Iraq nuke claim (and Pubbies attempts to pressure stations into not running them): [http://story.news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story&u=/ap/20030721/ap\_on\_el\_pr/democrats\_bush\_4](http://story.news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story&u=/ap/20030721/ap_on_el_pr/democrats_bush_4) > [@](#): > > The ad squabble comes at a time when public trust in the president has been eroding, according to results released Sunday from a CNN-Time poll. > The poll found that 47 percent view Bush as a leader they can trust, while 51 percent said they have doubts and reservations. That’s down from 56 percent who saw him as a leader they could trust in late March, with 41 percent having doubts. > The poll of 1,004 people taken Wednesday and Thursday had an error margin of plus or minus 3 percentage points. Just like your Dad, we can read your lips just fine. But I am sure that those tons of WMD’s will be found any day now. Chuck Hagel continues to show independance from the approved spin control- how naughty: > [@](#): > > “To just throw George Tenet’s body from the train and say, ‘That takes care of the problem,’ I don’t think is the way to do this,” Hagel said. > > Hagel pointed to National Security Adviser Condoleezza Rice, Defense Secretary Donald Rumsfeld, Secretary of State Colin Powell and Vice President Dick Cheney as part of the process that led to Bush including the report in the annual presidential address. [http://www.cnn.com/2003/US/07/20/sprj.irq.wmd.investigation/](http://www.cnn.com/2003/US/07/20/sprj.irq.wmd.investigation/) And look out Apologistas- [Constanza] Bob Graham is getting angry! [/Constanza]: > [@](#): > > But Sen. Bob Graham of Florida, a Democratic presidential candidate, said intelligence was available that should have made Bush realize the information in the uranium report was suspect. One source was Vice President Dick Cheney, he told CBS’ “Face the Nation.” > > “The vice president is the one who went to the CIA on several occasions. He asked specifically for additional information on the Niger-Iraq connection. The United States sent an experienced ambassador, who came back after a full review with a report that these were fabricated documents,” Graham said. > > “You cannot tell me that the vice president didn’t receive the same report that the CIA received, and that the vice president didn’t communicate that report to the president or national security advisers to the president.” [http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?f=/news/archive/2003/07/20/national0229EDT0428.DTL](http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?f=/news/archive/2003/07/20/national0229EDT0428.DTL) ---
**Author:** ![ElvisL1ves](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/5daacb/32.png) [@ElvisL1ves](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ElvisL1ves)\ **Post date:** [July 21, 2003, 5:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bushs-poll-numbers-dropping-cant-fool-all-of-the-people-all-the-time/189951/2 "2003-07-21T17:37:56Z")
Lest we forget, Graham is not just “a Democratic presidential candidate”. He’s the ranking Democrat on the Senate Intelligence Committee, and was its chairman at the time this was being discussed. If anyone outside the Administration would know, it’s him. ---
**Author:** ![Gatopescado](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gatopescado/32/5711_2.png) [@Gatopescado](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gatopescado)\ **Post date:** [July 21, 2003, 6:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bushs-poll-numbers-dropping-cant-fool-all-of-the-people-all-the-time/189951/3 "2003-07-21T18:00:06Z")
But you can fool some of the people all the time. ---
**Author:** ![elf6c](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/c57346/32.png) [@elf6c](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elf6c)\ **Post date:** [July 21, 2003, 6:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bushs-poll-numbers-dropping-cant-fool-all-of-the-people-all-the-time/189951/4 "2003-07-21T18:09:44Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by gatopescado \* > \*\*But you can fool some of the people all the time. \*\* And I expect 2 of them to drop by at any moment. [pulls out his Apologista Buzz Word Bingo card and marker and awaits expectantly. . .] ---
**Author:** ![Xploder](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/x/a183cd/32.png) [@Xploder](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Xploder)\ **Post date:** [July 21, 2003, 6:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bushs-poll-numbers-dropping-cant-fool-all-of-the-people-all-the-time/189951/5 "2003-07-21T18:12:16Z")
So there was a poll of 1004 people. 47% for and 51% against, with an error margin of 3-6%. So? How is that you KNOW that the error go’s against the 47% faction? I’m just curious as I don’t have a bone to pick in the pro vs anti bush fight that seems to be nonstop around here. Seems to me that with that margin of error it could be 50-50. ---
**Author:** ![rjung](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/45deac/32.png) [@rjung](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/rjung)\ **Post date:** [July 21, 2003, 6:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bushs-poll-numbers-dropping-cant-fool-all-of-the-people-all-the-time/189951/6 "2003-07-21T18:27:28Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by elf6c \* > And I expect 2 of them to drop by at any moment. Only two? I can name a dozen SDMBBushApologistas off the top of my head. > [@](#): > > [pulls out his Apologista Buzz Word Bingo card and marker and awaits expectantly. . .] Hey, I didn’t get a bingo card! Where are they? ---
**Author:** ![Sterra](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/8c91f0/32.png) [@Sterra](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sterra)\ **Post date:** [July 21, 2003, 6:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bushs-poll-numbers-dropping-cant-fool-all-of-the-people-all-the-time/189951/7 "2003-07-21T18:32:05Z")
It could be 50-50, but the main news is the drop. And it probably wont stop dropping for a while. [http://www.cnn.com/2003/ALLPOLITICS/07/20/graham.report/](http://www.cnn.com/2003/ALLPOLITICS/07/20/graham.report/) ---
**Author:** ![Evil\_One](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/45deac/32.png) [@Evil\_One](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Evil_One)\ **Post date:** [July 21, 2003, 6:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bushs-poll-numbers-dropping-cant-fool-all-of-the-people-all-the-time/189951/8 "2003-07-21T18:32:33Z")
Settle down. I thought the same thing in 1994 after the Republican sweep. You are as doomed now as I was in the 90’s. ---
**Author:** ![elf6c](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/c57346/32.png) [@elf6c](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elf6c)\ **Post date:** [July 21, 2003, 6:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bushs-poll-numbers-dropping-cant-fool-all-of-the-people-all-the-time/189951/9 "2003-07-21T18:32:38Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Xploder \* > \*\*So there was a poll of 1004 people. 47% for and 51% against, with an error margin of 3-6%. > > So? How is that you KNOW that the error go’s against the 47% faction? > > I’m just curious as I don’t have a bone to pick in the pro vs anti bush fight that seems to be nonstop around here. > > Seems to me that with that margin of error it could be 50-50. \*\* Hmm, so the margin of error goes all to one side? Seems more likely that it will match the overall results, statistically speaking. Heck, it could be 3-6% **worse** for Bush too. But I would have a hard time making that argument with a straight face. Given the declining trend over the last couple of weeks (it was at 56%) the number seems right, and if anything I would wager the error rate may slightly favor Bush (i.e. too high). But, it is best to stick with the actual numbers the poll provides. Besides, I can just wait 2 weeks and the number will be around 40% anyway. 😉 ---
**Author:** ![World\_Eater](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/f04885/32.png) [@World\_Eater](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/World_Eater)\ **Post date:** [July 21, 2003, 6:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bushs-poll-numbers-dropping-cant-fool-all-of-the-people-all-the-time/189951/10 "2003-07-21T18:40:05Z")
I hope it drops through the floor. ---
**Author:** ![Largo62](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/45deac/32.png) [@Largo62](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Largo62)\ **Post date:** [July 21, 2003, 6:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bushs-poll-numbers-dropping-cant-fool-all-of-the-people-all-the-time/189951/11 "2003-07-21T18:49:42Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by World Eater \* > \*\*I hope it drops through the floor. \*\* Ditto that. Ohmygawd! Did I say “ditto”? :eek: ---
**Author:** ![Misery\_Loves\_Co](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/7cd45c/32.png) [@Misery\_Loves\_Co](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Misery_Loves_Co)\ **Post date:** [July 21, 2003, 7:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bushs-poll-numbers-dropping-cant-fool-all-of-the-people-all-the-time/189951/12 "2003-07-21T19:05:14Z")
I was listening to a report on these sorts of figures on some Public Radio show or other while I was driving home yesterday afternoon. What almost caused me to crash into a building though, was when someone made the statement that (paraphrased): “this sort of issue is likely to undermine the president’s chief strengths, which have been his credibility and his \*\* _skills at foreign policy_\*\*. . .” What The Fuck??? Did I just get pulled into an alternate dimension? Am I somehow living 1984 - has the Ministry of Love has just made a revision to reality? Though I don’t for a minute see it myself, I can. . . accept . . . that Bush has an aura of “credibility” with a fair number of people. But since when was Foreign Policy ever considered his strong suit? I seem to remember that at least one bone of contention between the runners in the last election was that Gore had many, many times Bush’s experience in foreign policy - that Bush could only hope to rely on his cabinet and Dad’s experience. Beyond that, the total shambles that he’s made of America’s reputation in the international community with his war would have destroyed any misconceptions. But somehow, it’s only _now_ that he’s being brought low from a throne of foreign-policy mastery? Someone pinch me - this can’t be real! ---
**Author:** ![TWDuke](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/e495f1/32.png) [@TWDuke](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TWDuke)\ **Post date:** [July 21, 2003, 7:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bushs-poll-numbers-dropping-cant-fool-all-of-the-people-all-the-time/189951/13 "2003-07-21T19:31:48Z")
OT nitpick: > [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Misery Loves Co. \* > … **Did I just get pulled into an alternate dimension? Am I somehow living 1984 - has the Ministry of Love has just made a revision to reality?** … I think that would be the Ministry of Truth. The Ministry of Love would help you out if you had trouble understanding the revision. The Ministry of Peace would be planning the next distraction. ---
**Author:** ![Dissonance](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/85f322/32.png) [@Dissonance](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dissonance)\ **Post date:** [July 21, 2003, 7:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bushs-poll-numbers-dropping-cant-fool-all-of-the-people-all-the-time/189951/14 "2003-07-21T19:32:53Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Misery Loves Co. \* > **Though I don’t for a minute see it myself, I can. . . accept . . . that Bush has an aura of “credibility” with a fair number of people. But since when was Foreign Policy ever considered his strong suit?** Bush is a Republican, Republicans are of course better at Foreign Policy than Democrats, ergo one of Bush’s strengths is in Foreign Policy. Please ignore any evidence to the contrary. ---
**Author:** ![Sterra](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/8c91f0/32.png) [@Sterra](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sterra)\ **Post date:** [July 21, 2003, 7:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bushs-poll-numbers-dropping-cant-fool-all-of-the-people-all-the-time/189951/15 "2003-07-21T19:34:13Z")
> [@](#): > > “this sort of issue is likely to undermine the president’s chief strengths, which have been his credibility and his skills at foreign policy. . .” No, those are Bush’s chief strengths. If you think otherwise try to name where he is stronger than those two things. Bush’s new chief strength is comedy [http://story.news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story&u=/nm/iraq\_wolfowitz\_dc](http://story.news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story&u=/nm/iraq_wolfowitz_dc) > [@](#): > > “I think all foreigners should stop interfering in the internal affairs of Iraq,” said Wolfowitz, who is touring the country to meet U.S. troops and Iraqi officials. > > “Those who want to come and help are welcome,” he said. “Those who come to interfere and destroy are not.” ---
**Author:** ![Airman\_Doors\_USAF](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/e36b37/32.png) [@Airman\_Doors\_USAF](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Airman_Doors_USAF)\ **Post date:** [July 21, 2003, 7:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bushs-poll-numbers-dropping-cant-fool-all-of-the-people-all-the-time/189951/16 "2003-07-21T19:41:42Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by rjung \* > \*\*Only two? I can name a dozen SDMBBushApologistas off the top of my head. \*\* I’d like to see that list, the “Usual Suspects” as coined by **elucidator**. Following that, I’ll retort with the liberal list and we can get this all out of the way. ---
**Author:** ![Shade](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/2bfe46/32.png) [@Shade](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Shade)\ **Post date:** [July 21, 2003, 8:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bushs-poll-numbers-dropping-cant-fool-all-of-the-people-all-the-time/189951/17 "2003-07-21T20:03:24Z")
You can fool all of the people some of the time and some of the people all of the time, but you can’t fool all of the people all of the time. **Fortunately a simple majority is not required.** Sorry, some jokes have to be made, whatever your politics ---
**Author:** ![Guinastasia](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/guinastasia/32/5751_2.png) [@Guinastasia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Guinastasia)\ **Post date:** [July 21, 2003, 8:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bushs-poll-numbers-dropping-cant-fool-all-of-the-people-all-the-time/189951/18 "2003-07-21T20:39:37Z")
Say it with me now, folks: How LOW can you GO! How LOW can you GO! All right, I wanna see his numbers playing the LIMBO, babeee!!! ---
**Author:** ![Misery\_Loves\_Co](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/7cd45c/32.png) [@Misery\_Loves\_Co](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Misery_Loves_Co)\ **Post date:** [July 21, 2003, 8:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bushs-poll-numbers-dropping-cant-fool-all-of-the-people-all-the-time/189951/19 "2003-07-21T20:53:38Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Sterra \* > \*\*No, those are Bush’s chief strengths. If you think otherwise try to name where he is stronger than those two things. > \*\* :smack: DOH!!! Of course - now it makes sense - I shoulda thought of that. And thanks to **TWDuke** for the nitpick - I was sure I picked the wrong Ministry, but it was the first one that popped to mind. I’ve been wanting to reread that book for some time, but am too afraid that it’ll just freak me out. I remember a time when it was a scary hypothetical. I’m not sure that it’s so hypothetical anymore - thanks not to conspiracy so much as the abundance of sheeple. In short, **Dissonance** ’ post rings a little too true. ---
**Author:** ![rjung](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/45deac/32.png) [@rjung](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/rjung)\ **Post date:** [July 21, 2003, 11:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bushs-poll-numbers-dropping-cant-fool-all-of-the-people-all-the-time/189951/20 "2003-07-21T23:09:04Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Airman Doors, USAF \* > I’d like to see that list, the “Usual Suspects” as coined by **elucidator**. What, and spoil the surprise? :eek: 😉 > [@](#): > > Following that, I’ll retort with the liberal list **pfffffffffffffft** … everyone knows who’s on _that_ list already. 😃 [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bushs-poll-numbers-dropping-cant-fool-all-of-the-people-all-the-time/189951.md?page=2)