# Business in Ferguson destroyed. Do you rebuild or take insurance money and go elsewhere? **URL:** \ **Category:** In My Humble Opinion\ **Created:** [November 27, 2014, 12:29am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/business-in-ferguson-destroyed-do-you-rebuild-or-take-insurance-money-and-go-elsewhere/705728 "2014-11-27T00:29:12Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![tomndebb](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/b9e5f3/32.png) [@tomndebb](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tomndebb)\ **Post date:** [November 27, 2014, 3:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/business-in-ferguson-destroyed-do-you-rebuild-or-take-insurance-money-and-go-elsewhere/705728/21 "2014-11-27T15:32:29Z")
> [@Grumman](#): > > It’s not just the looters and arsonists. Even the ones that aren’t attacking your store are still siding with an asshole who commits strong-arm robberies and attacks cops. I wouldn’t trust any of those protestors not to come after me if I was the one who had to shoot a robber. Oh, bullshit. The police have had a decades-long conflict with the black citizens of Ferguson to which the shooting provided a flash point. And there is no evidence that a majority of those people are “siding” with anyone. We could equally conclude from the tone of your rant that the people of Ferguson would be better served by someone less prone to hasty judgments. ---
**Author:** ![John\_Mace](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_mace/32/185_2.png) [@John\_Mace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Mace)\ **Post date:** [November 27, 2014, 4:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/business-in-ferguson-destroyed-do-you-rebuild-or-take-insurance-money-and-go-elsewhere/705728/22 "2014-11-27T16:01:33Z")
> [@smiling\_bandit](#): > > Also, to be blunt about **John Mace** ’s flippant comment, small business owners are flocking o get out of California. Not really sure about that, but you should understand that “California” has about as many different economies as the rest of the US does, altogether. Where I live, business is booming, and you may need to go upscale with your bakery or whatever small business you own, but there is so much money floating thru the economy in Silicon Valley it would make your head spin. ---
**Author:** ![GythaOgg](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/49beb7/32.png) [@GythaOgg](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GythaOgg)\ **Post date:** [November 27, 2014, 4:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/business-in-ferguson-destroyed-do-you-rebuild-or-take-insurance-money-and-go-elsewhere/705728/23 "2014-11-27T16:03:19Z")
> [@aceplace57](#): > > It depends on the type of business. The looted convenience store and McDonalds will probably reopen. They had a stream of customers from the near by apartment complexes. > > The burned out Title Company will probably relocate. Theres really no need for them to stay in such a run down part of town. > > I’m not sure about the pizza places. Little Caesars burned and the franchise may decide its not worth reopening. I guess it depends on how successful the location had been. If they were selling a lot of pizza then maybe its worth reopening in that location. What a lot of people don’t realize is the Ferguson businesses also get a steady stream of business from Express Scripts (Corporate headquarters just the other side of I 70) and the University of Missouri at St. Louis (which runs a shuttle for the students to a part of Ferguson with restaurants and shops). The Whistle Stop frozen custard place is a big favorite with the UMSL students. I would guess the pizza place got plenty enough business from the campus, Express Scripts, and the neighborhood to justify reopening. Centene has also recently announced they’re opening a call center in Ferguson next year. I vote for rebuilding and staying open. Given the locale, it makes sense for the businesses to stay. ---
**Author:** ![kopek](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kopek/32/337_2.png) [@kopek](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kopek)\ **Post date:** [November 28, 2014, 2:22am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/business-in-ferguson-destroyed-do-you-rebuild-or-take-insurance-money-and-go-elsewhere/705728/24 "2014-11-28T02:22:16Z")
> [@kayaker](#): > > Yes. I have a friend who stuck it out in Lawrenceville through the bad times and the area is having a resurgence. Then again, I knew someone with a home in the North Side’s Mexican War Streets area who stuck it out only to have gentrification force him to sell. I’m sort of on the hill behind there and Manchester by all the graveyards. We’re today more what Mexican War/Manchester was in the 70s/80s. But we’re coming back too. Parts of Manchester can be odd; you have two identical houses side by side. The one is owned by 3rd generation Yinzer, and needs some work but nothing serious, and its worth maybe 15K. His neighbor is from AGH and remuddled his place and it sells for 145K. And around me either place would be like $35,000. Has to drive real estate agents nuts! ---
**Author:** ![aceplace57](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/aceplace57/32/3500_2.png) [@aceplace57](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/aceplace57)\ **Post date:** [November 28, 2014, 3:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/business-in-ferguson-destroyed-do-you-rebuild-or-take-insurance-money-and-go-elsewhere/705728/25 "2014-11-28T15:12:33Z")
NBC has interviews with the business owners. > **['I'm Lost Now': Can Ferguson's Businesses Ever Rise From Rubble?](https://www.nbcnews.com/storyline/michael-brown-shooting/im-lost-now-can-fergusons-businesses-ever-rise-rubble-n256341)** > > Many Ferguson merchants wonder whether their businesses can survive the toll of riots to date – and potential uprisings to come. > [@](#): > > “To be honest with you, I’m lost now,” Yaacoub told NBC News after touring the charred shell that once was Sam’s. The exterior brick walls are the only salvageable chunks. The roof is gone. "I’m not sure money-wise. Money-wise, it’s just too hard. > > “I had to borrow $700 to buy some wood, just to put the boards together to close up where (the rioters) came in from, to close the building. It’s just too much, you know,” added Yaacoub, who carries insurance coverage for fire damage but isn’t certain when or how much he might be paid to begin a rebuild. > [@](#): > > At a strip mall two doors down from the remnants of Sam’s, looters smashed the glass at the Clip Appeal salon then hurled a Molotov cocktail inside. Two local men grabbed plastic water bottles and dashed inside the shop to try to douse the flames, said Leeanna Moore, a 22-year employee. > > While Moore cheered those heroics, she admitted she hasn’t decided if she will ever return to work at the salon, which also carries insurance. > > “The fear bothers me right now, just the fact that we have to go back down in the area. We never felt that way before,” Moore said. "That’s why I think a lot of businesses won’t return. They’ll have the fear of: What if something else happens? The same thing could happen. ---
**Author:** ![aceplace57](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/aceplace57/32/3500_2.png) [@aceplace57](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/aceplace57)\ **Post date:** [November 28, 2014, 3:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/business-in-ferguson-destroyed-do-you-rebuild-or-take-insurance-money-and-go-elsewhere/705728/26 "2014-11-28T15:26:48Z")
I admire this guy. Sams Market is an important part of that community. > [@](#): > > For some Ferguson business owners, like Yaacoub, the decision to try again is not personal. It’s about a larger obligation they feel to their neighborhoods. > > “All of my (six) workers have families and they want to live. But also, without me, this community will have no grocery store. They come to me for their eggs, milk, cereal, everything. A lot of old people walk to the store. A lot of people count on me,” Yaacoub said. > > "Everybody came into the store today and tell me, ‘What we can do?’ Even some customers tell me, ‘Please don’t take (the arson) like that. Just come back in business.’ So I’ll come back in business. But I need time to fix it. ---
**Author:** ![Stringbean](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/d6d6ee/32.png) [@Stringbean](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Stringbean)\ **Post date:** [November 28, 2014, 6:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/business-in-ferguson-destroyed-do-you-rebuild-or-take-insurance-money-and-go-elsewhere/705728/27 "2014-11-28T18:38:48Z")
> [@tomndebb](#): > > Oh, bullshit. > > The police have had a decades-long conflict with the black citizens of Ferguson to which the shooting provided a flash point. And there is no evidence that a majority of those people are “siding” with anyone. This is nonsensical. The rallying cry is “no justice, no peace.” That they are protesting in the immediate aftermath of the grand jury announcement on Michael Brown’s case is an obvious indication that they have “sided” with Brown. If not, what injustice are they protesting against? Brown, who robbed a store and assaulted a police officer. They have sided with a young man who committed two crimes, and proclaimed him a victim. ---
**Author:** ![BigT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bigt/32/12044_2.png) [@BigT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BigT)\ **Post date:** [November 30, 2014, 7:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/business-in-ferguson-destroyed-do-you-rebuild-or-take-insurance-money-and-go-elsewhere/705728/28 "2014-11-30T19:32:05Z")
> [@Grumman](#): > > It’s not just the looters and arsonists. Even the ones that aren’t attacking your store are still siding with an asshole who commits strong-arm robberies and attacks cops. I wouldn’t trust any of those protestors not to come after me if I was the one who had to shoot a robber. People stood by the guy because he was unarmed and they believe he was retreating. Nothing that happened before that point matters. His being “an asshole who commits strong-arm robberies and attacks cops” doesn’t matter. They believe the shooting was not justified by the actions that happened at that very moment. If you shoot a robber because he’s a robber in the process of robbing you, and not because you’re in fear for your life, you’d deserve to be pilloried and hopefully put in jail. Most of the time, a robber doesn’t put you in fear for your life, as killing or harming you is not their goal. Don’t get me wrong. I’d stay way because all the tensions between the citizens and the police are still a powder keg waiting to go off, which neither side has actually tried to defuse. But to be worried because I might shoot a robber instead of calling the police like any other store? That’s dumb. ---
**Author:** ![Tim\_T-Bonham.net](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/46a35a/32.png) [@Tim\_T-Bonham.net](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tim_T-Bonham.net)\ **Post date:** [December 1, 2014, 4:25am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/business-in-ferguson-destroyed-do-you-rebuild-or-take-insurance-money-and-go-elsewhere/705728/29 "2014-12-01T04:25:02Z")
> [@BigT](#): > > Most of the time, a robber doesn’t put you in fear for your life, as killing or harming you is not their goal. You think i am not ‘harmed’ by a robbery? I wish I had the excess cash you must have! ---
**Author:** ![Astral\_Rejection](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/258eb7/32.png) [@Astral\_Rejection](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Astral_Rejection)\ **Post date:** [December 1, 2014, 7:01am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/business-in-ferguson-destroyed-do-you-rebuild-or-take-insurance-money-and-go-elsewhere/705728/30 "2014-12-01T07:01:01Z")
> [@t-bonham@scc.net](#): > > You think i am not ‘harmed’ by a robbery? > I wish I had the excess cash you must have! A “gotcha” like this does a disservice to actual conversation, as BigT’s comment clearly implied _physical_ harm. ---
**Author:** ![astorian](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/ad7895/32.png) [@astorian](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/astorian)\ **Post date:** [December 1, 2014, 8:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/business-in-ferguson-destroyed-do-you-rebuild-or-take-insurance-money-and-go-elsewhere/705728/31 "2014-12-01T20:51:38Z")
I’m reminded of Ben Stein’s observation that white people don’t “riot” by smashing windows, looting, or burning buildings. White people have their own way of rioting: by moving farther into the suburbs and voting Republican. The next Michael Brown will have a harder time finding stores to rob or clerks to slap around. Because the shopkeepers who can afford to leave Ferguson will. ---
**Author:** ![48Willys](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/4/db5fbb/32.png) [@48Willys](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/48Willys)\ **Post date:** [December 1, 2014, 8:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/business-in-ferguson-destroyed-do-you-rebuild-or-take-insurance-money-and-go-elsewhere/705728/32 "2014-12-01T20:54:09Z")
If the robber was not threatening bodily harm or even death, why would anyone give them the “loot”? If the robber is armed, then a death threat is in effect. Like someone once said, when seconds count, the police are only minutes away! As I do not like living in areas where I might get robbed at anytime, I chose to live far away from such areas. For me, cops are only hours away. As far the OPs Question as to whether to rebuild in the original neighborhood, or to relocate somewhere else, It depends. If I provide a service or product that my neighbors need, I would most likely stay. For the reasons given above. If my business did not directly help the local folks, I might leave if I thought that a repeat riot was likely. I do not enjoy being attacked by insane mobs. Even though the rioters were NOT local, they may return for an encore performance. No thank you! ---
**Author:** ![48Willys](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/4/db5fbb/32.png) [@48Willys](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/48Willys)\ **Post date:** [December 1, 2014, 10:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/business-in-ferguson-destroyed-do-you-rebuild-or-take-insurance-money-and-go-elsewhere/705728/33 "2014-12-01T22:17:42Z")
> [@BigT](#): > > People stood by the guy because he was unarmed and they believe he was retreating. Nothing that happened before that point matters. His being “an asshole who commits strong-arm robberies and attacks cops” doesn’t matter. They believe the shooting was not justified by the actions that happened at that very moment. > > If you shoot a robber because he’s a robber in the process of robbing you, and not because you’re in fear for your life, you’d deserve to be pilloried and hopefully put in jail. Most of the time, a robber doesn’t put you in fear for your life, as killing or harming you is not their goal. > > Don’t get me wrong. I’d stay way because all the tensions between the citizens and the police are still a powder keg waiting to go off, which neither side has actually tried to defuse. But to be worried because I might shoot a robber instead of calling the police like any other store? That’s dumb. It may not matter to you, but as a local business owner, It matters a lot to me! If the locals see a strong arm thief as a hero, I want out NOW! I do not believe that many of the locals see this thief as a hero. As I said in a post above, if a robber enters my store to rob me, he is threatening me, why else would I give in to him? In other words, for the robber to be effective, he must put you in fear for your life. Otherwise you would just laugh at him and tell him “No, go away” & he will. Do NOT try this anywhere! He will NOT just go away. Also your assertion that the robber does not want to harm the clerk may not be true in all cases. I have seen many cases where the robber got what he wanted, and beat or shot the store clerk anyway. I am not willing to bet MY life on your say so that the robber does not want to harm me. Hell, you do not even know him! At least, I hope that you are not fraternizing with robbers?🙂 I’ll tell you what, the next time someone robs you, you wait until he is done with the robbery, and then call the cops, if you can. See how long it takes for them to show up, also see if you get any assurance that it will not happen again. Good luck on that! I will handle the robbery as I see fit. I think that you are right on when you say “all the tensions between the citizens and the police are still a powder keg waiting to go off,” I am not so sure that “which neither side has actually tried to defuse.” is accurate. IIRC, the local neighborhood leaders are trying to reach out to the police. There was a story about this happening earlier last month. I do not recall where I read it though. It was NOT the MSM, I can assure you. Of course the police say that they are trying to work with these neighborhood leaders, I take this statement with a grain of salt, considering their history with the neighborhood. I hope that my skepticism is unfounded, for everyones sake. ---
**Author:** ![Eonwe](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/eonwe/32/240_2.png) [@Eonwe](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Eonwe)\ **Post date:** [December 1, 2014, 10:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/business-in-ferguson-destroyed-do-you-rebuild-or-take-insurance-money-and-go-elsewhere/705728/34 "2014-12-01T22:39:56Z")
Nevermind . . . misread/misunderstood something. ---
**Author:** ![control-z](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/eada6e/32.png) [@control-z](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/control-z)\ **Post date:** [December 2, 2014, 9:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/business-in-ferguson-destroyed-do-you-rebuild-or-take-insurance-money-and-go-elsewhere/705728/35 "2014-12-02T21:48:46Z")
Police can work with neighborhood leaders all they want, but presumably the neighborhood leaders are not the ones robbing stores and assaulting police officers. If the neighborhood leaders can stop crime they should do so. As for the OP, stores will be where there is profit to be made, but the store owner has to balance that with the drawbacks, including crime and violence. I’ve never been to that area but if my store had been robbed many times already this year I’d seriously think about moving. ---
**Author:** ![Orwell](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/dfb087/32.png) [@Orwell](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Orwell)\ **Post date:** [December 2, 2014, 10:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/business-in-ferguson-destroyed-do-you-rebuild-or-take-insurance-money-and-go-elsewhere/705728/36 "2014-12-02T22:16:21Z")
I wouldn’t rebuild there. No way. And I get so pissed reading comments about race relations, black frustration, police over-reaction, etc., as an explanation for the looting and rioting. Even if some of it is true, it’s entirely beside the point. Burning buildings and stealing other people’s property should not be excused nor tolerated. ---
**Author:** ![fachverwirrt](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/94ad74/32.png) [@fachverwirrt](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/fachverwirrt)\ **Post date:** [December 2, 2014, 10:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/business-in-ferguson-destroyed-do-you-rebuild-or-take-insurance-money-and-go-elsewhere/705728/37 "2014-12-02T22:19:40Z")
> [@astorian](#): > > I’m reminded of Ben Stein’s observation that white people don’t “riot” by smashing windows, looting, or burning buildings. Sure they do. They just do it because someone won a World Series, or because pumpkins. ---
**Author:** ![Tim\_T-Bonham.net](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/46a35a/32.png) [@Tim\_T-Bonham.net](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tim_T-Bonham.net)\ **Post date:** [December 2, 2014, 10:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/business-in-ferguson-destroyed-do-you-rebuild-or-take-insurance-money-and-go-elsewhere/705728/38 "2014-12-02T22:43:29Z")
> [@control-z](#): > > As for the OP, stores will be where there is profit to be made, but the store owner has to balance that with the drawbacks, including crime and violence. I’ve never been to that area but if my store had been robbed many times already this year I’d seriously think about moving. No, not if there is still profit to be made. You just raise the prices to cover the costs of the goods stolen during robberies, and pay for more insurance. Violence? That affects your minimum-wage employees, not you. In such locations, there is little competition, so you don’t have to worry about losing business to competitors. And if your employees are hurt, there are always more people willing to take those jobs regardless of the risks. Downward spiral here, but if it eventually gets too bad, you take your insurance money and start up again elsewhere. It’s been happening all thru history. ---
**Author:** ![doorhinge](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/a5b964/32.png) [@doorhinge](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/doorhinge)\ **Post date:** [December 2, 2014, 11:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/business-in-ferguson-destroyed-do-you-rebuild-or-take-insurance-money-and-go-elsewhere/705728/39 "2014-12-02T23:44:04Z")
> [@BigT](#): > > …If you shoot a robber because he’s a robber in the process of robbing you, and not because you’re in fear for your life, you’d deserve to be pilloried and hopefully put in jail. Most of the time, a robber doesn’t put you in fear for your life, as killing or harming you is not their goal. (post shortened) What a bizarre view of criminal activity you have. It’s the robber who deserves to be pilloried and definitely put in jail. The threat of actually doing physical harm to their victims is why a robbery is successful. Robbers aren’t asking for voluntary donations. :smack: ---
**Author:** ![Spectre\_of\_Pithecanthropus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/spectre_of_pithecanthropus/32/12343_2.png) [@Spectre\_of\_Pithecanthropus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Spectre_of_Pithecanthropus)\ **Post date:** [December 3, 2014, 10:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/business-in-ferguson-destroyed-do-you-rebuild-or-take-insurance-money-and-go-elsewhere/705728/40 "2014-12-03T22:05:30Z")
> [@DinoR](#): > > Triggered a memory from my childhood. My neighbors were the classic immigrant stereotype in some ways. Eldest son came over, raised some money and opened a convenience store. To not compete with chains like 7-11 or face high real estate costs it was in a poor neighborhood with high crime. Over time he used profits to bring the rest of the family and open another convenience store. Same type of location. Those stores were the family business. From what I’ve seen 7-11s have this weird propensity to attract shady-looking characters. I’ve noticed this even in upscale districts like Brentwood in L.A. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/business-in-ferguson-destroyed-do-you-rebuild-or-take-insurance-money-and-go-elsewhere/705728.md?page=1)