Well no – if the car doesn’t have a key, a start button is sort of a necessity. But the push button was coming back before smartfobs were invented. Aside from the S2000, many high end european sports cars were getting them. I have no doubt that they’d have trickled down to more normal cars by this point if they hadn’t become necessary for other reasons.
The genesis of the feature wasn’t sports cars, though. And, yes, they of course trickled down from more expensive cars - like most car gadgetry.
The 7 series had an electronic starter back in the 90s where you didn’t have to (trying to describe this) keep the key held in the ignition/cranking position while the car started up. You just stuck it in, turned it to on, turned it to ignition, let it go, and it would do the rest.
It takes a bit of time to propagate features to cars, and especially seeing as you’re not using a key anymore, I can see them using the hybrid key/push button implementation for a while to acclimatize consumers to the trend.
The push-button start on some modern cars is a fatal design flaw, as last year’s Toyota Hysteria demonstrated. At least with a key-start (even via solenoid) there was a direct mechanical linkage- turn it off and it kills the motor (unless it is dieseling). Modern buttons appear to be a software signal - the computer running the show checks the button every so often for status. If the software task that’s supposed to check that messes up, the vehicle can keep running even if you hammer the button through the dashboard.
I saw the results once of a “stop” button on a metal-smelting factory. As the molten metal began to pour, the guy hit the stop button. The PLC running the smelter unit had a bug that kept it to busy to change the motor setting, it just kept rotating the vat full of molten metal until all 60 tons poured all over the floor of the shop. Expensive clean up… The bug had been mention - slow and occasionally unresponsive equipment. They then did take the bug seriously and fix the problem, half a million dollars later.
An “off” button should be a command, not a suggestion.
Bring back crank starters!
:rolleyes:
So, you are allowed to call one button a lazy feature, but claim to miss something else (a button), yet not offer a reason why.
Here’s a hunch: For some reason – GASP – you like floor mounted switches (a.k.a. buttons) for controlling the bright/dim function of the headlights. It would be a novelty now, because there are various other lever-controlled methods for this now.
I know this must be all about laziness, but people like to push buttons, especially when pushing a button makes something happen. It really seems to be consistent with many things.
So, you like pushing a button to control the lights. Whatsamatterforyou? You no like to pull/push a lever to make that happen?
YOU LOVE BUTTONS, TOO! And, based on your comments in this thread, you like pushin’ em.
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Yeah, then maybe we’ll bring back steamers …
(One factor sometimes cited in the demise of the steam auto was the invention of the electric starter - when you had to crank your gas car and risk breaking your arm if you did it wrong, waiting for a boiler to warm up didn’t seem that bad.)
I have a friend (who’s not that old) who occasionally goes on a rant on how the new-fangled electric stuff isn’t as safe or reliable as the old way of doing things. He has said more than once that there should be a law requiring all electric windows to also have a mechanical crank. (I try to tell him that the only window that ever stopped working for me was a hand crank but he doesn’t listen…)
not only that, most new cars have “Tip-start” anyway, where the ignition lock cylinder doesn’t actually close the contacts to the relay that energizes the starter solenoid. Instead, when you twist the key to “START,” it signals the PCM to energize the starter solenoid and it will crank only as long as needed for the engine to start.
So in this case, whether you use a key or button or some other thing is largely immaterial.
I haven’t been exposed to one of these setups yet. What locks the steering column - is that electronically disengaged with the door locks, as well? Sure hate to have that backfire due to a software or wiring anomaly. Intermittent steering - what a concept…
I’m not sure if this answers your question, but in our car you must press the brake before the car will start and the fob must be close by.
I’ve got an Altima Coupe with keyless entry/ignition, and, in the parlance of my 4-year-old son, it’s super-cool. Push the button on the handle while opening the door, sit, push button, vrooom!
See, I don’t like push button start myself. I’d love a toggle switch, though.
Well, up here in New England I can state that a keyed entry could be a real nuisance in the winter. The keyhole being crusted over with ice, or even filled with ice, could be a real problem. I’ve had my keyless entry for a couple years now and haven’t seen that happen. And we’re having a peachy winter this year.
Also it seems it would be a lot harder to lock your key/fob in the car with the Start button approach.
Actually, all the responses to ‘why’ so far, mine included, are from the consumer viewpoint. A more likely answer might be that keyless entrrys and/or pushbutton start are better for the car manufacturers in one or more ways.
When I was in high school a friend had a 1950’s Chrysler with a push-button transmission. Bring that back.
WAG: The technology got better. Back in the day, it was probably mechanical, not electronic, and probably undependable, and thus it didn’t survive in the marketplace. Today, it’s probably much more dependable. Instead of something old becoming new, it’s probably more similar to technology catching up over time, like how GPS replaced maps. Maybe in another 30 years, automatic seatbelts will return, but they’ll be far superior to the ones that everybody hated in the 90’s.
Speaking of car technology, why haven’t sun visors gotten better in the past 30 years? It’s essentially the same design today as my first car, a 1981 Datsun.
After the pushbutton starters went away, in the late 60s, the ignition key moved from the dashboard to the steering column, so that the steering wheel could be automatically locked when the car was turned off.
About 10 years ago, GM started putting the ignition key back on the dashboard of some of their cars. This was before the pushbutton start became common again.
Personally, I think the ignition switch should be on the dashboard, the headlights should be turned on by pulling a knob out from the dashboard, the high beam switch should be a button on the floor and if the car is an automatic, the shifter should be on the steering column – automatic transmission should only be in large sedans and station wagons – everything else should have a clutch.
The reason for push buttons to start… New cars have RFID chips in the key for security. It negates the need for a mechanical key start mechanism. The button is cheaper.
And then it became cheaper for car manufacturers to use the key to start the car.
The older system required running a large cable from the battery up to a hefty floor switch, and then back to the starter. With the key switch, the large (expensive) cable ran only from the battery, to the solenoid to the starter motor, with only a small wire from the key switch to the solenoid. So it eliminated several feet or large wire and a hefty floor switch, for the addition of a starter solenoid and a small wire from the key switch to the solenoid. Net reduction in parts, weight, and cost.
But DTMF (touchtone) phones DO have an advantage for the phone system, beyond just the convenience of the user: the connections are made faster. Specifically, all numbers take the same amount of time (50-70 milliseconds) to transmit an acceptable signal. But a dial (pulse) system is 3 to 20 times slower: 161 milliseconds for a “1”, 1061 milliseconds for a “0”.
And this is not even considering the additional functions possible with DTMF dialing – phone menus, automated balance checking, etc.
I have heard one reason for the automatic starters (button or key) that hasn’t been mentioned yet. On the old-style, turn-and-hold-the-key starters, the solenoid would be engaged until you released the key back to the ‘on’ position. With the software-controlled starters, it can detect that the engine has fired and release the solenoid faster, which saves wear on the starter motor.
Mostly true, but not entirely. I’ve heard that the Porsche 956/962 (a race car if ever there was one) actually had an ignition key to start it.