# C.K. Dexter Haven, what is "this"? **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [January 3, 2006, 2:16am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/c-k-dexter-haven-what-is-this/338172 "2006-01-03T02:16:26Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![lissener](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lissener/32/6139_2.png) [@lissener](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/lissener)\ **Post date:** [January 3, 2006, 3:11am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/c-k-dexter-haven-what-is-this/338172/21 "2006-01-03T03:11:56Z")
> [@Evil Captor](#): > > **lissener, turek** did you read the whole OP? Did it REALLY strike you as fwap-fwap-fwap material? Yes (thanks for presuming otherwise), and yes. ---
**Author:** ![Harborwolf](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/c89c15/32.png) [@Harborwolf](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Harborwolf)\ **Post date:** [January 3, 2006, 3:12am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/c-k-dexter-haven-what-is-this/338172/22 "2006-01-03T03:12:02Z")
> [@lissener](#): > > This is such a lame given in any such argument, I always wonder who will be shameless enough to trot it out. > > Let’s see, has been sharing the contents of his mind for 7,679 posts now. No, this doesn’t give anyone the unequivocal ability to “read his mind” (I can’t believe I’m actually wasting the pixels to address this), but it gives us all a certain familiarity that informs the kind of interpretations and judgments that we ALL make of each others’ communications on these boards. Speculation as to another person’s motivation is something we ALL do, all the time, usually without the vast amounts of personal data that EC has supplied to us here. Who doesn’t have a theory as to why Cruise and Holmes are engaged? or what Scooter Libby’s reasons were? Spare me. > > “You can’t read minds” is not an automatic get-out-of-jail-free card. It amounts to about the same thing as “reasonable doubt,” and might constitute a loophole for EC if this were a murder trial, but “prepoderance of the evidence” is adequate for me, and the preponderance of the evidence that EC has been sharing here–for 7,679 posts–is pretty clear. My apologies. I thought the comment would sound snarky, but I went and posted it anyways. Sorry if I offended. Still, your argument isn’t any stronger than my “lame given” of an argument. You’re basically taking a wild ass guess based upon your idea of Evil Captors mindset. It doesn’t matter if we all do it (which is another lame argument). It’s not a good process by which to come to a conclusion. ---
**Author:** ![Metacom](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/ecae2f/32.png) [@Metacom](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Metacom)\ **Post date:** [January 3, 2006, 3:13am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/c-k-dexter-haven-what-is-this/338172/23 "2006-01-03T03:13:09Z")
> [@Evil Captor](#): > > **Metacom** apparently you DID read the OP, but I don’t think you’ve made your point. I write bondage erotica and sell it online. If I WANNA write fwap-fwap-fwap stuff, I can DO that. This smacks of obtuseness on your part, deliberate or otherwise. It’s not the bondage that I think you’re masturbating to in this case, it’s the act of bringing it up to this particular audience, which has already discussed the topic with you plenty and could use a break. That’s an itch you can’t scratch by writing erotica. ---
**Author:** ![lissener](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lissener/32/6139_2.png) [@lissener](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/lissener)\ **Post date:** [January 3, 2006, 3:16am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/c-k-dexter-haven-what-is-this/338172/24 "2006-01-03T03:16:38Z")
> [@Harborwolf](#): > > You’re basically taking a wild ass guess based upon your idea of Evil Captors mindset. It doesn’t matter if we all do it (which is another lame argument). It’s not a good process by which to come to a conclusion. Dude, I am not taking a wild assed guess. EC’s posting history has prompted a certain amount of ponderation on my part, and I’ve reached my conclusions about his reasons for posting this shit after devoting way too much energy to considering it. I find it hilarious that your dismissal of my conclusion as a “wild ass guess” is based entirely on a wild ass guess as to how I reached that conclusion. As you have illustrated yourself, this is indeed NOT a good process by which to come to a conclusion. Thanks for reading MY mind. ---
**Author:** ![Evil\_Captor](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/f17d59/32.png) [@Evil\_Captor](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Evil_Captor)\ **Post date:** [January 3, 2006, 3:17am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/c-k-dexter-haven-what-is-this/338172/25 "2006-01-03T03:17:34Z")
> [@lissener](#): > > This is such a lame given in any such argument, I always wonder who will be shameless enough to trot it out. > > Let’s see, has been sharing the contents of his mind for 7,679 posts now. No, this doesn’t give anyone the unequivocal ability to “read his mind” (I can’t believe I’m actually wasting the pixels to address this), but it gives us all a certain familiarity that informs the kind of interpretations and judgments that we ALL make of each others’ communications on these boards. Speculation as to another person’s motivation is something we ALL do, all the time, usually without the vast amounts of personal data that EC has supplied to us here. Who doesn’t have a theory as to why Cruise and Holmes are engaged? or what Scooter Libby’s reasons were? Spare me. > > “You can’t read minds” is not an automatic get-out-of-jail-free card. It amounts to about the same thing as “reasonable doubt,” and might constitute a loophole for EC if this were a murder trial, but “prepoderance of the evidence” is adequate for me, and the preponderance of the evidence that EC has been sharing here–for 7,679 posts–is pretty clear. **lissener** we mostly cross swords in the politics section of Great Debates and this section, where my posts relating to bondage are few and far between. Are you talking about my political opinions here, or what? ---
**Author:** ![Wolfian](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/7ea924/32.png) [@Wolfian](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Wolfian)\ **Post date:** [January 3, 2006, 3:17am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/c-k-dexter-haven-what-is-this/338172/26 "2006-01-03T03:17:59Z")
> [@lissener](#): > > That’s my “in the first place,” that CS is not here for EC’s private little wankfests. > … > EC, do your wanking in private. Odd. I have the same reaction reading your posts in CS. I thought **Dex** was a bit quick on the trigger on this one. **Captor** clearly stated what the purpose of the thread was. If people didn’t want to talk about it they could have let the fucker sink like a stone. ---
**Author:** ![Interrobang](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/interrobang/32/17463_2.png) [@Interrobang](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Interrobang)\ **Post date:** [January 3, 2006, 3:20am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/c-k-dexter-haven-what-is-this/338172/27 "2006-01-03T03:20:33Z")
> [@lissener](#): > > He gets a chub off of surprising people with sexual-bondage imagery when they’re not expecting it. Anyone surprised by sexual-bondage imagery in a thread called “The Principles of Bondage Scenes in Mainstream Movies and TV Shows” has a reading comprehension problem. ---
**Author:** ![lissener](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lissener/32/6139_2.png) [@lissener](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/lissener)\ **Post date:** [January 3, 2006, 3:20am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/c-k-dexter-haven-what-is-this/338172/28 "2006-01-03T03:20:42Z")
> [@Evil Captor](#): > > **Metacom** apparently you DID read the OP, but I don’t think you’ve made your point. I write bondage erotica and sell it online. If I WANNA write fwap-fwap-fwap stuff, I can DO that. I have several friends who make their living with online erotica. One of the phenomena that I have observed with a couple of them–and now with EC–is that an immersion in that mindset can sometimes, unintentionally, affect your interactions with the “real” world. Your porn is leaking out into the other parts of your life, EC. Get a grip. ---
**Author:** ![Mr.Blue\_Sky](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/d26b3c/32.png) [@Mr.Blue\_Sky](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mr.Blue_Sky)\ **Post date:** [January 3, 2006, 3:21am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/c-k-dexter-haven-what-is-this/338172/29 "2006-01-03T03:21:33Z")
> [@lissener](#): > > Get a grip. Man, the jokes just write themselves. ---
**Author:** ![Harborwolf](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/c89c15/32.png) [@Harborwolf](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Harborwolf)\ **Post date:** [January 3, 2006, 3:22am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/c-k-dexter-haven-what-is-this/338172/30 "2006-01-03T03:22:20Z")
> [@lissener](#): > > Dude, I am not taking a wild assed guess. EC’s posting history has prompted a certain amount of ponderation on my part, and I’ve reached my conclusions about his reasons for posting this shit after devoting way too much energy to considering it. I find it hilarious that your dismissal of my conclusion as a “wild ass guess” is based entirely on a wild ass guess as to how I reached that conclusion. As you have illustrated yourself, this is indeed NOT a good process by which to come to a conclusion. Thanks for reading MY mind. Since you’ve posted nothing that shows how you reached your conclusion about Evil Captor, the only assumption was that you were taking a wild ass guess. Feel free to show me what lead you to your conclusion. You seem to be much more knowledgeable about his posting history than I am. ---
**Author:** ![lissener](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lissener/32/6139_2.png) [@lissener](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/lissener)\ **Post date:** [January 3, 2006, 3:22am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/c-k-dexter-haven-what-is-this/338172/31 "2006-01-03T03:22:30Z")
> [@Evil Captor](#): > > **lissener** we mostly cross swords in the politics section of Great Debates and this section, where my posts relating to bondage are few and far between. Are you talking about my political opinions here, or what? Your political opinions have never approached my radar. I don’t tend to demonize a person on one front simply because I disagree with them on another. ---
**Author:** ![lissener](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lissener/32/6139_2.png) [@lissener](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/lissener)\ **Post date:** [January 3, 2006, 3:24am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/c-k-dexter-haven-what-is-this/338172/32 "2006-01-03T03:24:27Z")
> [@Harborwolf](#): > > Since you’ve posted nothing that shows how you reached your conclusion about Evil Captor, the only assumption was that you were taking a wild ass guess. Feel free to show me what lead you to your conclusion. You seem to be much more knowledgeable about his posting history than I am. Sorry, I’m not gonna construct a monograph on EC’s psychology from hours of searches. It’s been done before, and I’m not all that concerned with convincing you. ---
**Author:** ![Evil\_Captor](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/f17d59/32.png) [@Evil\_Captor](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Evil_Captor)\ **Post date:** [January 3, 2006, 3:27am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/c-k-dexter-haven-what-is-this/338172/33 "2006-01-03T03:27:20Z")
> [@Metacom](#): > > It’s not the bondage that I think you’re masturbating to in this case, it’s the act of bringing it up to this particular audience, which has already discussed the topic with you plenty and could use a break. That’s an itch you can’t scratch by writing erotica. Actually, I DO find it useful to talk about bondage imagery with people who aren’t all that interested in bondage. Ya’ll keep me honest, in a sense. In the case of the particular thread I started, I havw posted the principles I listed on a bondage-related discussion board, and mostly I got, “Yay! More bondage! 'Cuz we like bondage!” OK, I got some responses that were much more sensible than that, but most of the responses I got were suspect because they were from people who like bondage scenes, just as I do. I figure posting the ideas on a board where people aren’t into bondage imagery, but are at least willing to discuss them as adults, I’m more likely to get, “Dude, this is bullshit. Nobody thinks like that.” The basic thing is, I dont feel that discussion of bondage and bondage-related stuff necessarily belongs only on bondage-related boards. Is the possibility of that kind of thought on my part what’s bothering you? ---
**Author:** ![lissener](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lissener/32/6139_2.png) [@lissener](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/lissener)\ **Post date:** [January 3, 2006, 3:28am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/c-k-dexter-haven-what-is-this/338172/34 "2006-01-03T03:28:54Z")
> [@Interrobang!?](#): > > Anyone surprised by sexual-bondage imagery in a thread called “The Principles of Bondage Scenes in Mainstream Movies and TV Shows” has a reading comprehension problem. Sigh. I know you know that’s a disingenuous oversimplification of what I meant, if I did say it less clearly than I might have wished. Perhaps “surprise” in its “boo!” sense is not the perfect word. I feel certain that you know pretty much what I meant to convey. In any case, Dex can defend his actions without me; this thread is not about me, despite the attempts to deflect it in that manner. I’ve said my piece, moving on. ---
**Author:** ![Harborwolf](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/c89c15/32.png) [@Harborwolf](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Harborwolf)\ **Post date:** [January 3, 2006, 3:29am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/c-k-dexter-haven-what-is-this/338172/35 "2006-01-03T03:29:19Z")
> [@lissener](#): > > Sorry, I’m not gonna construct a monograph on EC’s psychology from hours of searches. It’s been done before, and I’m not all that concerned with convincing you. Fair enough. W.A.G. it is then. ---
**Author:** ![Revtim](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/revtim/32/1042_2.png) [@Revtim](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Revtim)\ **Post date:** [January 3, 2006, 3:30am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/c-k-dexter-haven-what-is-this/338172/36 "2006-01-03T03:30:39Z")
So, exactly what board rule was broken by the thread in question? Is this another case of people just failing to ignore what they don’t like for some reason? The thread was clearly titled. ---
**Author:** ![Polycarp](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/82dd89/32.png) [@Polycarp](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Polycarp)\ **Post date:** [January 3, 2006, 3:33am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/c-k-dexter-haven-what-is-this/338172/37 "2006-01-03T03:33:26Z")
I’d recommend that EC read a good book instead. I have a title by Maugham in mind for him. 😉 ---
**Author:** ![Metacom](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/ecae2f/32.png) [@Metacom](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Metacom)\ **Post date:** [January 3, 2006, 3:36am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/c-k-dexter-haven-what-is-this/338172/38 "2006-01-03T03:36:44Z")
> [@Evil Captor](#): > > Is the possibility of that kind of thought on my part what’s bothering you? No. In general, I don’t have a problem with discussions of deviant sexuality, provided it doesn’t lapse into advocacy of non-consensual acts. What bothers me, in this particular case, is that you’re obsessed with it to the point that you won’t stop talking about it here. Take the studded black-leather halter of the pony and let the tired old nag graze for a while. ---
**Author:** ![Evil\_Captor](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/f17d59/32.png) [@Evil\_Captor](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Evil_Captor)\ **Post date:** [January 3, 2006, 3:54am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/c-k-dexter-haven-what-is-this/338172/39 "2006-01-03T03:54:55Z")
> [@Metacom](#): > > No. In general, I don’t have a problem with discussions of deviant sexuality, provided it doesn’t lapse into advocacy of non-consensual acts. > > What bothers me, in this particular case, is that you’re obsessed with it to the point that you won’t stop talking about it here. Take the studded black-leather halter of the pony and let the tired old nag graze for a while. Y’know, in the Pit thread I counted all the posts I made and and then calculated the number about bondage as a percentage of them. It came out to less than eight percent, IIRC … definitely somewhere in there. And that included posts where the references to bondage were extremely circuitous and mild, the sort anyone might make. So I really think you are mischaracterizing my posting history in a major way, Metacom. ---
**Author:** ![Larry\_Mudd](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/f14d63/32.png) [@Larry\_Mudd](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Larry_Mudd)\ **Post date:** [January 3, 2006, 3:57am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/c-k-dexter-haven-what-is-this/338172/40 "2006-01-03T03:57:16Z")
My personal limit was reached a couple of days ago, in the “Best part of the movie is totally unlike the rest of the movie” thread. OMG! An otherwise unremarkable scifi movie featured chrome chastity belts and bridles on slave workers! Give it a fucking rest. I have no problem with bondage. It’s just fucking _tedious_ when one person brings it up incessantly. It’s not shocking, offensive, or repellent. It’s just boring. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/c-k-dexter-haven-what-is-this/338172.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/c-k-dexter-haven-what-is-this/338172.md?page=3)