# Cafe Society **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [July 27, 2007, 8:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cafe-society/413426 "2007-07-27T20:54:59Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 8
**Author:** ![Muffin](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/muffin/32/4341_2.png) [@Muffin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Muffin)\ **Post date:** [July 28, 2007, 11:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cafe-society/413426/141 "2007-07-28T23:09:56Z")
[QUOTE=Small British Shop Owner] I never said I wanted it to be raised. [/QUOTE] Actually, what you said in your OP was: [QUOTE=Small British Shop Owner] Cafe Society is pretty… low brow? Isn’t it? I just think it’s a bit disappointing. I’m not being dispariging, just critical here. [/QUOTE] If you find it disappointing, but don’t wish to raise it through your contributions, then why do you waste your time reading it and commenting upon it? Just to snark? ---
**Author:** ![Zabali\_Clawbane](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/ecd19e/32.png) [@Zabali\_Clawbane](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Zabali_Clawbane)\ **Post date:** [July 28, 2007, 11:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cafe-society/413426/142 "2007-07-28T23:12:30Z")
I would say it was not so much bitching to bitch, as sneering myself. ---
**Author:** ![Muffin](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/muffin/32/4341_2.png) [@Muffin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Muffin)\ **Post date:** [July 28, 2007, 11:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cafe-society/413426/143 "2007-07-28T23:12:38Z")
[QUOTE=Small British Shop Owner] Sorry, I just realised you were Swedish (or a truck driver), so doesn’t apply - I was working on the assumption that you were American, and probably having on your body a monocole, tweed jacket, and pocket watch. [/QUOTE] Why did you make that assumption? ---
**Author:** ![Contrapuntal](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/e274bd/32.png) [@Contrapuntal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Contrapuntal)\ **Post date:** [July 28, 2007, 11:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cafe-society/413426/144 "2007-07-28T23:12:52Z")
[QUOTE=Small British Shop Owner] I think we’ve all resolved our differences, so I’ll bow out from this thread(I’d love to say gracefully, but it would be a lie) at this point… [/QUOTE] As well as the part about bowing out, apparently. ---
**Author:** ![Small\_British\_Shop\_Owner](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/e56c9b/32.png) [@Small\_British\_Shop\_Owner](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Small_British_Shop_Owner)\ **Post date:** [July 28, 2007, 11:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cafe-society/413426/145 "2007-07-28T23:16:41Z")
[QUOTE=Contrapuntal] As well as the part about bowing out, apparently. [/QUOTE] Oooooh, get you! @Miller: No. ---
**Author:** ![Muffin](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/muffin/32/4341_2.png) [@Muffin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Muffin)\ **Post date:** [July 28, 2007, 11:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cafe-society/413426/146 "2007-07-28T23:24:02Z")
[QUOTE=Small British Shop Owner] Oooooh, get you! @Miller: No. [/QUOTE] _“Curiouser and curiouser!” Cried Alice (she was so much surprised, that for the moment she quite forgot how to speak good English). . . . . Oh, dear! What nonsense I’m talking!_ ---
**Author:** ![Muffin](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/muffin/32/4341_2.png) [@Muffin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Muffin)\ **Post date:** [July 28, 2007, 11:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cafe-society/413426/147 "2007-07-28T23:51:06Z")
[QUOTE=Miss Purl McKnittington] Part of the reason that low-brow (for lack of a better word) topics are more popular is that it takes a hell of a lot more of an intellectual and emotional investment to debate fine art or literature. Even incredibly intelligent folks need to turn their brains off every once and a while and read a murder mystery or watch “The Simpsons.” Since the board is predominantly used for recreation, it’s not really fair to fault the participants who use it to discuss entertainment rather than . . . whatever “high-brow” is. It’s not like the SDMB is a peer-reviewed journal or a symposium on postmodern thought. [/QUOTE] That’s why I seldom post to CS. It’s not for lack of interest – it’s for lack of recreational time. ---
**Author:** ![Humble\_Servant](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/47e85d/32.png) [@Humble\_Servant](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Humble_Servant)\ **Post date:** [July 29, 2007, 12:38am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cafe-society/413426/148 "2007-07-29T00:38:56Z")
[QUOTE=C K Dexter Haven] I can express my insights about a contemporary movie. But if I venture an insight about _Hamlet_, I know that there are almost five centuries of commentary and scholarly thoughts, by those who have spent a lifetime immersed in study of Shakespeare: what more can I add? What can I say beyond very simplistic statements? Hence, there is a natural tendency to the modern and new, which is exciting, rather than the ancient and well-worn. [/QUOTE] I come here for entertainment and to shoot the shit (or listen to other people shoot the shit) with a bunch of cranky opinionated funny characters I’ve grown to recognize over time. I don’t want snooty humorless oneupsmanship or deference, I want it all mixed up and free-wheeling. What entertains me are threads about stuff I like, and I like “higher-brow” stuff disproportionately. CS for me is often a vast wasteland and I am sad when there is nothing there for me to read. **Dex** , you’re wrong that you would have nothing to add to a Shakespeare discussion. I want to shoot the shit about Shakespeare here and now with this particular group of wits and dipshits and I don’t mind a bit if someone in the past said what you think and I don’t mind high school level readings–I just want it in play. ---
**Author:** ![Humble\_Servant](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/47e85d/32.png) [@Humble\_Servant](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Humble_Servant)\ **Post date:** [July 29, 2007, 12:48am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cafe-society/413426/149 "2007-07-29T00:48:15Z")
Oops–that’s not supposed to sound like I’m saying Dex has high school level readings–I was trying to encourage people to post–it’s not like you need an education this high to ride or anything. ---
**Author:** ![Frank](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/3d9bf3/32.png) [@Frank](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Frank)\ **Post date:** [July 29, 2007, 12:53am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cafe-society/413426/150 "2007-07-29T00:53:38Z")
I am, frankly, bewildered as to why those of you who want to discuss “high-brow” topics in CS simply don’t start some threads about what you are interested in discussing. If you’d like to talk about the reverse image of The Last Supper, debate whether **NAF1138** ’s real cousin was the Earl of Oxford, or accuse Homer of plagiarism, well shit, feel free. There’s no rule that say it has to have been on TV last night. ---
**Author:** ![denquixote](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/b9bd4f/32.png) [@denquixote](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/denquixote)\ **Post date:** [July 29, 2007, 1:43am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cafe-society/413426/151 "2007-07-29T01:43:50Z")
[QUOTE=Small British Shop Owner] Fuck off [/QUOTE] I was going to warn you not to spend the $14.95 but I was too late. Live and learn. Your posts may be a little strange but your biggest problem is you are tooo nice to be here. ---
**Author:** ![Procyon](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/ac91a4/32.png) [@Procyon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Procyon)\ **Post date:** [July 29, 2007, 2:29am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cafe-society/413426/152 "2007-07-29T02:29:31Z")
Thank you for your response, **C K Dexter Haven**. One of the things I love about Cafe Society is its breadth. Anything from the lowest brow to the loftiest (whatever that means) is welcome for discussion and nothing is strictly out-of-place. [QUOTE=C K Dexter Haven] I don’t find it surprising that people posting on a Message Board are more interested in discussing entertainment than arts. I think if we surveyed all Message Boards (not just Straight Dope), we’d find far more discussion of Harry Potter than of James Joyce. [/QUOTE] I am not surprised by this either. Though under a possible formulation, popularity is inversely proportional to the brow height. That is, once something becomes accessible to many it ceases to be highbrow. A possibility, merely. I would be interested in starting a thread on the subject–though I fear I would be a poor tender of any ensuing discussion for lack of time–because I am interested in the distinction and its prevalence in discussion about art. Though, like you, I do not think it possesses much analytical merit. > [@](#): > > I think also that the focus on more recent entertainment arises precisely because we are an intelligent and reasonably well-educated group. I can express my insights about a contemporary movie. But if I venture an insight about _Hamlet_, I know that there are almost five centuries of commentary and scholarly thoughts, by those who have spent a lifetime immersed in study of Shakespeare: what more can I add? What can I say beyond very simplistic statements? Hence, there is a natural tendency to the modern and new, which is exciting, rather than the ancient and well-worn. I like this idea because it does help explain the disparity and because I didn’t think of it at all. Still, I think there’s more to be said about art than deep insights. Certainly not everything in the entertainment threads is scholarly analysis. ---
**Author:** ![Muffin](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/muffin/32/4341_2.png) [@Muffin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Muffin)\ **Post date:** [July 29, 2007, 9:40am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cafe-society/413426/153 "2007-07-29T09:40:00Z")
That, and artistic endeavour is not static. It is live and out there as we speak. ---
**Author:** ![C\_K\_Dexter\_Haven](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/b2d939/32.png) [@C\_K\_Dexter\_Haven](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/C_K_Dexter_Haven)\ **Post date:** [July 29, 2007, 2:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cafe-society/413426/154 "2007-07-29T14:54:58Z")
I didn’t mean to imply that there was nothing more to be said about great or classic art. To the contrary, my feeling is that one of the things that distinguishes great art is that one is constantly able to go back to it for new insights. I meant to say that posting about a classic (hence, “high brow”) work requires a great deal more courage, thought, and effort – and thus, it’s somewhat intimidating. I would hesitate to post, “My more recent encouner with Aristotelean logic”, for example, and I suspect that if I did post, there would be few posters who would respond. It’s much easier – less courage, less thought, less effort – to post about yesterday’s TV show. Thus, again, because we’re on a Message Board rather than in a class room, we get what we get. ---
**Author:** ![susan\_foster](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/d9b06d/32.png) [@susan\_foster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/susan_foster)\ **Post date:** [July 29, 2007, 8:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cafe-society/413426/155 "2007-07-29T20:01:08Z")
At the end of the day, isn’t the point of any message board to be a gathering of people, discussing topics of interest to them? People post things that they want to talk about; if there is something that you want to talk about, and there is no thread about it - start one. What can you lose? Susan ---
**Author:** ![Muffin](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/muffin/32/4341_2.png) [@Muffin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Muffin)\ **Post date:** [July 29, 2007, 8:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cafe-society/413426/156 "2007-07-29T20:26:34Z")
[QUOTE=susan\_foster] if there is something that you want to talk about, and there is no thread about it - start one. What can you lose? [/QUOTE] All dignity and the risk of an eye infection. Oops, wrong thread. ---
**Author:** ![Tool\_of\_the\_Conspiracy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/bc79bd/32.png) [@Tool\_of\_the\_Conspiracy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tool_of_the_Conspiracy)\ **Post date:** [July 30, 2007, 4:27am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cafe-society/413426/157 "2007-07-30T04:27:27Z")
[QUOTE=Idle Thoughts] You know what? I had a sudden change of heart. That’s it! You go at it. Boy has the dope needed someone like you for a long time. 🙂 Never let them tell you you’re doing wrong! Don’t go down without a fight! Come on, mods, just one “pulls up a lawn chair” here? [/QUOTE] Ah, using this strategy? > **[Wikipedia:Please be a giant dick, so we can ban you](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:GIANTDICK)** > > Lately, it has come to our attention that some people are being only slightly dickish, rather than either not being dicks at all, or being giant dicks (who can be banned). > This is a request for members of the Wikipedia community to cease mild dickery: either desist with being a dick altogether, or become a gigantic dick so that immediate banning becomes justified. > Each example states a form of mild dickery along with suggestions as to what to do if you choose the "become a giant dick" (BGD) o... ---
**Author:** ![Windwalker](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/5e9695/32.png) [@Windwalker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Windwalker)\ **Post date:** [July 30, 2007, 6:28am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cafe-society/413426/158 "2007-07-30T06:28:37Z")
I’m surprised that no one has mentioned this, but I would divide “high-brow” and “low-brow” not by what is being discussed, but by _how_ it is being discussed. If you’re discussing how The Simpsons is a melting pot of cultural references that helps set the stage for modern discourse, that feels just as high-brow to me as a discussion about Lady McBeth’s state of mind. It’s certainly much more high-brow to me than a thread about who’s hotter, Mona Lisa or Venus di Milo? ---
**Author:** ![Dervorin](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/eb8c5e/32.png) [@Dervorin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dervorin)\ **Post date:** [July 30, 2007, 10:43am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cafe-society/413426/159 "2007-07-30T10:43:48Z")
[QUOTE=Windwalker] It’s certainly much more high-brow to me than a thread about who’s hotter, Mona Lisa or Venus di Milo? [/QUOTE] Venus ftw! She’s hotter by far! She roxx0rs my soxx0rs! Ooga ooga! Nekkid boobies! I think you have a good point, though. High-brow (which to my mind is just another word for intellectually snobbish) discussion can be had on nearly any subject. I think what matter for me is that people are discussing things intelligently and with some non-trivial insights into the subject matter. And this being a message board with many intelligent people, I find plenty of that. Anyone who wants to appoint themselves Grand High Poobah of all matters cultural and be the sole arbiter of what constitutes worthwhile discussion can take a hike. ---
**Author:** ![Little\_Plastic\_Ninja](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/f07891/32.png) [@Little\_Plastic\_Ninja](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Little_Plastic_Ninja)\ **Post date:** [July 30, 2007, 2:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cafe-society/413426/160 "2007-07-30T14:04:04Z")
[QUOTE=Tool of the Conspiracy] Ah, using this strategy? > **[Wikipedia:Please be a giant dick, so we can ban you](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:GIANTDICK)** > > Lately, it has come to our attention that some people are being only slightly dickish, rather than either not being dicks at all, or being giant dicks (who can be banned). > This is a request for members of the Wikipedia community to cease mild dickery: either desist with being a dick altogether, or become a gigantic dick so that immediate banning becomes justified. > Each example states a form of mild dickery along with suggestions as to what to do if you choose the "become a giant dick" (BGD) o... [/QUOTE] It’s like Goofus and Gallant meet the Wiki! Too awesome! > [@Muffin](#): > > Add another “u”. You’re going to get him spelling it noveauu riche, you do know that… Okay. I’m going to try turning over that new leaf I was considering. I’m going to attempt to be both friendly and considerate. _cracks knuckles_ Here goes. **SBSO** , regarding your continued presence here: you may want to consider looking to your behavior. Insulting the entire population of the boards is a bit like wandering into a new pub and shouting about how much you hate the music, the decor, and the shoes of that large fellow with LOVE and HAT (he’s missing one finger on that hand) tattooed on his knuckles. Certainly the internet is a good place to chat anonymously about controversial topics, but keep in mind that nobody is going to take your opinions seriously if that’s all you do. You’re pissing in the pool you’re swimming in, so don’t be shocked if you start to smell like wee before long. Gosh, I guess that wasn’t very nice. I’d better start practicing my pleasantness again. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cafe-society/413426.md?page=7) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cafe-society/413426.md?page=9)