# Caleb Williams and the 2024 Bears: a poll **URL:** \ **Category:** The Game Room\ **Tags:** football-nfl\ **Created:** [August 2, 2024, 2:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/caleb-williams-and-the-2024-bears-a-poll/1005154 "2024-08-02T14:48:36Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 4
**Author:** ![DCnDC](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dcndc/32/2842_2.png) [@DCnDC](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DCnDC)\ **Post date:** [October 28, 2024, 3:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/caleb-williams-and-the-2024-bears-a-poll/1005154/61 "2024-10-28T15:40:44Z")
There was some head-scratching playcalling in that game. The bubble screen on 4th-and-1 from their own 40? What the hell was that? That’s an OC way overthinking the problem. ---
**Author:** ![Akaj](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/akaj/32/145_2.png) [@Akaj](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Akaj)\ **Post date:** [October 28, 2024, 3:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/caleb-williams-and-the-2024-bears-a-poll/1005154/62 "2024-10-28T15:45:27Z")
> [@Omniscient](#): > > Bears have a terrible OL and OC. Let’s hope that this is what’s holding Caleb back. My thought after the game was that the Bears drafted the right QB but hired the wrong OC. It’s pretty clear that Kingsbury (whom the Bears also interviewed) is helping Daniels far more than Waldron is helping Williams. And any OC who OKs handing the ball off to a backup center in a game-critical goal-line situation deserves to be fired on the spot. The OL was bad to start the season and got worse when Jones was replaced by Amegadjie. I blame Waldron once again for calling plays that depended on a rookie OT from Yale playing his first offensive snaps being able to block pass rushers one-on-one. > [@DCnDC](#): > > The bubble screen on 4th-and-1 from their own 40? What the hell was that? That’s an OC way overthinking the problem. Yeah, that too. ---
**Author:** ![Atamasama](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/atamasama/32/12961_2.png) [@Atamasama](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Atamasama)\ **Post date:** [October 28, 2024, 10:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/caleb-williams-and-the-2024-bears-a-poll/1005154/63 "2024-10-28T22:53:51Z")
> [@Akaj](#): > > My thought after the game was that the Bears drafted the right QB but hired the wrong OC. I wasn’t extremely impressed by Waldron when he was in Seattle either. He was a protege of Sean McVay, and I think people expect him to be his clone or something, but that clearly isn’t the case. On a positive note, it’s a lot easier to find a good OC than a good QB. ---
**Author:** ![Omniscient](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/omniscient/32/3290_2.png) [@Omniscient](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Omniscient)\ **Post date:** [October 29, 2024, 7:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/caleb-williams-and-the-2024-bears-a-poll/1005154/64 "2024-10-29T19:10:42Z")
Part of me feels like hiring the disciple of an offensive genius HC is a poor strategy. More often than not, it seems like these guys are more propped up by that HC instead of absorbing some the genius. There are obvious exceptions, but maybe finding a successful OC thriving under a defensive HC is a better strategy. ---
**Author:** ![Akaj](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/akaj/32/145_2.png) [@Akaj](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Akaj)\ **Post date:** [October 29, 2024, 8:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/caleb-williams-and-the-2024-bears-a-poll/1005154/65 "2024-10-29T20:13:32Z")
> [@Omniscient](#): > > Part of me feels like hiring the disciple of an offensive genius HC is a poor strategy. More often than not, it seems like these guys are more propped up by that HC instead of absorbing some the genius. Cough cough Matt Nagy cough cough. ---
**Author:** ![Atamasama](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/atamasama/32/12961_2.png) [@Atamasama](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Atamasama)\ **Post date:** [October 29, 2024, 9:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/caleb-williams-and-the-2024-bears-a-poll/1005154/66 "2024-10-29T21:20:27Z")
I mean, look at the Bill Belichick “Coaching Tree”; it’s absolutely massive, and while you have a few that have done well, for the most part you see a lot of failures. ---
**Author:** ![Omniscient](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/omniscient/32/3290_2.png) [@Omniscient](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Omniscient)\ **Post date:** [October 30, 2024, 8:26am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/caleb-williams-and-the-2024-bears-a-poll/1005154/67 "2024-10-30T08:26:22Z")
Of course the 2 successful McVay spin offs are in our fucking division. ---
**Author:** ![garygnu](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/garygnu/32/2924_2.png) [@garygnu](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/garygnu)\ **Post date:** [October 30, 2024, 10:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/caleb-williams-and-the-2024-bears-a-poll/1005154/68 "2024-10-30T22:45:50Z")
I was thrown off by a Florida Man story today. A teen also named Caleb Williams was arrested for brandishing a machete at polling location near Jacksonville. ---
**Author:** ![pulykamell](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pulykamell/32/3166_2.png) [@pulykamell](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pulykamell)\ **Post date:** [October 31, 2024, 12:17am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/caleb-williams-and-the-2024-bears-a-poll/1005154/69 "2024-10-31T00:17:07Z")
I saw that story in the other thread here and thought the same. ---
**Author:** ![DCnDC](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dcndc/32/2842_2.png) [@DCnDC](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DCnDC)\ **Post date:** [November 12, 2024, 2:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/caleb-williams-and-the-2024-bears-a-poll/1005154/70 "2024-11-12T14:52:14Z")
Shane Waldron is out. Deservedly so. His scheme makes no sense. Caleb is getting worse, not better. Something needed to be done. Probably more than this, but it’s a start I guess. > **[Bears fire embattled OC Waldron amid struggles](https://www.espn.com/nfl/story/_/id/42345908/shane-waldron-fired-bears-offensive-coordinator-sources-say)** > > Shane Waldron has been fired as the Bears' offensive coordinator less than 10 months after being hired for the job. ---
**Author:** ![EllisDee](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ellisdee/32/4531_2.png) [@EllisDee](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/EllisDee)\ **Post date:** [November 12, 2024, 5:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/caleb-williams-and-the-2024-bears-a-poll/1005154/71 "2024-11-12T17:20:34Z")
Well one thing we know for sure is that the best way to develop a rookie quarterback is to keep changing his OC and head coach as frequently as possible. ---
**Author:** ![DCnDC](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dcndc/32/2842_2.png) [@DCnDC](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DCnDC)\ **Post date:** [November 12, 2024, 5:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/caleb-williams-and-the-2024-bears-a-poll/1005154/72 "2024-11-12T17:36:59Z")
I get that he has all this creative athleticism and you can’t ever coach that, while you can absolutely coach a guy to play on-script within a system, and that’s why you draft Caleb Williams or Anthony Richardson, but you have to have someone who _can_ teach him (and enough organizational patience to let him learn). You can mostly get away with playing playground hero ball all the time at Oklahoma and USC, but in the NFL suddenly he’s not the best athlete on the field. Until he gets that, he’s not going to succeed. If he does get it, sky’s the limit. ---
**Author:** ![Loach](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/loach/32/350_2.png) [@Loach](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Loach)\ **Post date:** [November 12, 2024, 6:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/caleb-williams-and-the-2024-bears-a-poll/1005154/73 "2024-11-12T18:11:12Z")
> [@DCnDC](#): > > Shane Waldron is out. Deservedly so. His scheme makes no sense. Caleb is getting worse, not better. Something needed to be done. Probably more than this, but it’s a start I guess. > > [Shane Waldron fired as Bears' offensive coordinator - ESPN](https://www.espn.com/nfl/story/_/id/42345908/shane-waldron-fired-bears-offensive-coordinator-sources-say) I can’t remember which one but one of the pundits was saying if a player regresses like this it’s always the coaches fault. I don’t know if it’s absolute, but I do tend to agree with that. ---
**Author:** ![kenobi\_65](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kenobi_65/32/13178_2.png) [@kenobi\_65](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kenobi_65)\ **Post date:** [November 12, 2024, 6:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/caleb-williams-and-the-2024-bears-a-poll/1005154/74 "2024-11-12T18:12:45Z")
It does seem like coaching and game planning are part of the problem. I also suspect that management spent so much effort surrounding Williams with talented receivers (as well as RB D’Andre Swift) that they neglected investing in the offensive line, which was weak to start with, and is now completely injury-riddled. ---
**Author:** ![DCnDC](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dcndc/32/2842_2.png) [@DCnDC](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DCnDC)\ **Post date:** [November 12, 2024, 6:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/caleb-williams-and-the-2024-bears-a-poll/1005154/75 "2024-11-12T18:28:13Z")
> [@Loach](#): > > I don’t know if it’s absolute, but I do tend to agree with that. In this particular case, I’d totally agree with that. > [@kenobi\_65](#): > > they neglected investing in the offensive line, which was weak to start with, and is now completely injury-riddled. While many of the sacks are on the O-line, and at least as many on the receivers not getting any separation, Caleb is not entirely without blame, either. He absolutely holds the ball too long, is not throwing receivers open, is overthrowing wide open receivers, and is pulling down the ball and running too early. The scheme and plays under Waldron were often badly timed. So many plays I’m looking at receivers standing stationary at the end of their routes, staring back at Caleb, who’s not doing anything, or conversely Caleb hits the end of his X-step drop, and the receivers haven’t even made their first break yet, it’s insane, the play concept doesn’t even make any sense. It looks like very poor Madden playcalling, just picking something off a menu, mostly at random. Even on bog-standard plays everyone has in their playbooks, the timing is off. The receivers are running their routes too slowly or poorly, and/or Caleb’s footwork is off and he’s hitting the last step too early, forcing him to throw off-platform. Watch for the little baby step he often takes before throwing, that’s really bad, it means his timing is completely off. ---
**Author:** ![jnglmassiv](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/f07891/32.png) [@jnglmassiv](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jnglmassiv)\ **Post date:** [November 12, 2024, 8:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/caleb-williams-and-the-2024-bears-a-poll/1005154/76 "2024-11-12T20:54:52Z")
> [@DCnDC](#): > > and running too early Backwards . Running backwards. Or toward the sideline. ---
**Author:** ![Omniscient](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/omniscient/32/3290_2.png) [@Omniscient](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Omniscient)\ **Post date:** [November 14, 2024, 3:26am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/caleb-williams-and-the-2024-bears-a-poll/1005154/77 "2024-11-14T03:26:02Z")
> [@DCnDC](#): > > Until he gets that, he’s not going to succeed. If he does get it, sky’s the limit. I hate to say it, but I’m no longer convinced. Literally everything is broken with this offense. Bad line, bad script, bad timing, bad situational play calling, poor effort, dropped balls…the list goes on. But the shocking thing is Caleb’s _awful_ accuracy, especially on deep balls. I don’t remember anyone in the pre-draft process calling him out for having poor ball placement and uncatchable deep balls. I watched a ton of this film and never saw any indications that he couldn’t drive the ball downfield. So him being this bad, like atrociously bad, is a terrifying signal. I’m hoping that this is all a byproduct of a bad offensive line and bad play design. But his rep in college was making plays off schedule in a terrible offense with terrible protection. I don’t know what’s different. The NFL ball is a little bigger. The players on the line are bigger. Whatever it is, I really hope these are just growing pains. ---
**Author:** ![Atamasama](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/atamasama/32/12961_2.png) [@Atamasama](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Atamasama)\ **Post date:** [November 14, 2024, 8:23am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/caleb-williams-and-the-2024-bears-a-poll/1005154/78 "2024-11-14T08:23:21Z")
> [@Loach](#): > > I can’t remember which one but one of the pundits was saying if a player regresses like this it’s always the coaches fault. Waldron did not do so well as OC in Seattle either. ---
**Author:** ![DCnDC](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dcndc/32/2842_2.png) [@DCnDC](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DCnDC)\ **Post date:** [November 14, 2024, 1:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/caleb-williams-and-the-2024-bears-a-poll/1005154/79 "2024-11-14T13:05:04Z")
> [@Omniscient](#): > > But his rep in college was making plays off schedule in a terrible offense with terrible protection. I don’t know what’s different. He’s suddenly not the best athlete on the field. He got away with that stuff at USC because he wasn’t playing NFL-caliber defenses. “Just run around and make a play” is not a viable NFL game plan. ---
**Author:** ![Hamlet](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/hamlet/32/2818_2.png) [@Hamlet](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hamlet)\ **Post date:** [November 14, 2024, 2:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/caleb-williams-and-the-2024-bears-a-poll/1005154/80 "2024-11-14T14:26:22Z")
> [@Omniscient](#): > > I don’t remember anyone in the pre-draft process calling him out for having poor ball placement and uncatchable deep balls. “Disconcerting deep-ball accuracy in QB-friendly offense.” From [NFL.com](https://www.nfl.com/prospects/caleb-williams/32005749-4c17-6897-a516-9754023602e6) [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/caleb-williams-and-the-2024-bears-a-poll/1005154.md?page=3) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/caleb-williams-and-the-2024-bears-a-poll/1005154.md?page=5)