# California - legal weed going on the ballot baby! **URL:** \ **Category:** Miscellaneous and Personal Stuff I Must Share\ **Created:** [March 26, 2010, 7:51am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/california-legal-weed-going-on-the-ballot-baby/533852 "2010-03-26T07:51:36Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 4
**Author:** ![FoieGrasIsEvil](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/foiegrasisevil/32/16638_2.png) [@FoieGrasIsEvil](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/FoieGrasIsEvil)\ **Post date:** [March 28, 2010, 5:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/california-legal-weed-going-on-the-ballot-baby/533852/61 "2010-03-28T17:47:16Z")
> [@heraldgwena](#): > > Personally, I find the smell of marijuana to be much more potent and hard to hide then the smell of alcohol. Alcohol, at least to a point, can be covered with a breath mint and/or certainly kinds of food just as easily as marijuana can be covered with body spray. I find that some people are very adept at hiding the fact that they have been drinking. I think it all depends. Alcohol on your breath is something you’re going to carry around with you pretty much no matter what you do. If you don’t smoke pot in an enclosed area and take a couple precautions, you really can’t smell it on someone. Anyway, I suppose its a tangent. ---
**Author:** ![HMS\_Irruncible](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/hms_irruncible/32/7394_2.png) [@HMS\_Irruncible](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/HMS_Irruncible)\ **Post date:** [March 28, 2010, 5:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/california-legal-weed-going-on-the-ballot-baby/533852/62 "2010-03-28T17:56:23Z")
> [@Una\_Persson](#): > > …and as I’ve posted before, something the potheads don’t understand is that the steady Societal move towards a prohibition of cigarettes and smoking is going to converge hard on any pot legalization which might occur. my prediction is that about the time pot becomes as legal as cigarettes pot smokers will be relegated to smoking **only** in their homes, with all doors and windows shut, and with no children under 21, pets, or sensitive plants in the house. My fear is that government healthcare pokes a big gaping hole in the historic anti-prohibition logic that people should make their own choices as long as they’re harming only themselves. If the government takes over healthcare, self-harm is now everyone’s business, and gives the government more incentive than ever to escalate the drug war to previously unimagined levels. ---
**Author:** ![Spectre\_of\_Pithecanthropus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/spectre_of_pithecanthropus/32/12343_2.png) [@Spectre\_of\_Pithecanthropus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Spectre_of_Pithecanthropus)\ **Post date:** [March 28, 2010, 7:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/california-legal-weed-going-on-the-ballot-baby/533852/63 "2010-03-28T19:50:02Z")
> [@Una\_Persson](#): > > …and as I’ve posted before, something the potheads don’t understand is that the steady Societal move towards a prohibition of cigarettes and smoking is going to converge hard on any pot legalization which might occur. my prediction is that about the time pot becomes as legal as cigarettes pot smokers will be relegated to smoking **only** in their homes, with all doors and windows shut, and with no children under 21, pets, or sensitive plants in the house.. In California, particularly L.A. and San Francisco and their environs, we already have a situation where nobody smokes tobacco in public. The proposed legalization statute still prohibits smoking marijuana in public. As for the tax evasion issue, I think the revenue to be generated is probably a lot less than people think, to begin with. Unlike tobacco and booze, pot is reasonably easy to “manufacture” – as it were – at home. Many users are just going to opt for that, instead of paying money to someone else for it. (I, too, support legalization, but not because I think it will solve California’s budget woes.) As an example of something which is already highly taxed, the bootlegging of tobacco may be a minor element in the grand scheme of criminal enterprises. But it can’t possibly be a major part of it. When’s the last time you heard about two gangs battling it out over the bootleg cigarette trade? Not that it doesn’t happen somewhere, sometime. But there’s no way you can compare the amount of criminality surrounding a prohibited product with one that is merely taxed. ---
**Author:** ![Spectre\_of\_Pithecanthropus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/spectre_of_pithecanthropus/32/12343_2.png) [@Spectre\_of\_Pithecanthropus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Spectre_of_Pithecanthropus)\ **Post date:** [March 28, 2010, 7:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/california-legal-weed-going-on-the-ballot-baby/533852/64 "2010-03-28T19:59:50Z")
> [@Cosmic Relief](#): > > My fear is that government healthcare pokes a big gaping hole in the historic anti-prohibition logic that people should make their own choices as long as they’re harming only themselves. If the government takes over healthcare, self-harm is now everyone’s business, and gives the government more incentive than ever to escalate the drug war to previously unimagined levels. Except I don’t know how much more they could escalate it. The only way to effectively interdict such behavior would be to mount security cameras in people’s houses, and conscript half the population to monitor and report on the other half.i Self harm is already the business of everyone in the insurance pool, but so far nobody (to my knowledge) has tried to prohibit and punish every type of behavior that is potentially risky. ---
**Author:** ![Chimera](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/8e8cbc/32.png) [@Chimera](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chimera)\ **Post date:** [March 28, 2010, 8:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/california-legal-weed-going-on-the-ballot-baby/533852/65 "2010-03-28T20:17:31Z")
I think if they were to try to do such a thing under the concept of Socialized Medicine, they would have already tried it in The Nanny State (Britain). Just not going to fly in the US. ---
**Author:** ![tr0psn4j](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/958977/32.png) [@tr0psn4j](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tr0psn4j)\ **Post date:** [March 28, 2010, 9:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/california-legal-weed-going-on-the-ballot-baby/533852/66 "2010-03-28T21:04:06Z")
I doubt this will pass but I’ll go and vote for it anyway. (not much of a post, just wanted to subscribe to the thread) ---
**Author:** ![Covered\_In\_Bees](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/7ab992/32.png) [@Covered\_In\_Bees](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Covered_In_Bees)\ **Post date:** [March 28, 2010, 10:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/california-legal-weed-going-on-the-ballot-baby/533852/67 "2010-03-28T22:39:54Z")
> [@tr0psn4j](#): > > I doubt this will pass but I’ll go and vote for it anyway. > > (not much of a post, just wanted to subscribe to the thread) Jesus christ, you don’t have to post to subscribe. You click on “thread tools” then on “subscribe” then on “add subscription”. ---
**Author:** ![tr0psn4j](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/958977/32.png) [@tr0psn4j](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tr0psn4j)\ **Post date:** [March 28, 2010, 11:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/california-legal-weed-going-on-the-ballot-baby/533852/68 "2010-03-28T23:48:12Z")
> [@Covered\_In\_Bees](#): > > Jesus christ, you don’t have to post to subscribe. You click on “thread tools” then on “subscribe” then on “add subscription”. Well that’s no fun. 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![Covered\_In\_Bees](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/7ab992/32.png) [@Covered\_In\_Bees](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Covered_In_Bees)\ **Post date:** [March 28, 2010, 11:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/california-legal-weed-going-on-the-ballot-baby/533852/69 "2010-03-28T23:51:27Z")
> [@tr0psn4j](#): > > Well that’s no fun. 🙂 Sure it is. It’s just a different _kind_ of fun. 🙂 Expand your horizons, man. ---
**Author:** ![Yookeroo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/yookeroo/32/323_2.png) [@Yookeroo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Yookeroo)\ **Post date:** [March 29, 2010, 2:25am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/california-legal-weed-going-on-the-ballot-baby/533852/70 "2010-03-29T02:25:57Z")
> [@Spectre\_of\_Pithecanthropus](#): > > As for the tax evasion issue, I think the revenue to be generated is probably a lot less than people think, to begin with. Unlike tobacco and booze, pot is reasonably easy to “manufacture” – as it were – at home. Many users are just going to opt for that, instead of paying money to someone else for it. I bet most users will not be growing their own. No matter how easy it is. ---
**Author:** ![Captain\_Lance\_Murdoch](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/47e85d/32.png) [@Captain\_Lance\_Murdoch](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Captain_Lance_Murdoch)\ **Post date:** [March 29, 2010, 6:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/california-legal-weed-going-on-the-ballot-baby/533852/71 "2010-03-29T18:02:40Z")
I bet a lot of people who normally don’t vote will be motivated to support this measure. It could make polling the issue dificult. ---
**Author:** ![DiosaBellissima](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/a8b319/32.png) [@DiosaBellissima](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DiosaBellissima)\ **Post date:** [March 29, 2010, 6:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/california-legal-weed-going-on-the-ballot-baby/533852/72 "2010-03-29T18:57:54Z")
> [@Una\_Persson](#): > > …and as I’ve posted before, something the potheads don’t understand is that the steady Societal move towards a prohibition of cigarettes and smoking is going to converge hard on any pot legalization which might occur. my prediction is that about the time pot becomes as legal as cigarettes pot smokers will be relegated to smoking **only** in their homes, with all doors and windows shut, and with no children under 21, pets, or sensitive plants in the house. I don’t understand what the problem is here? Maybe it’s because I live here in California where no one smokes anywhere (basically). ---
**Author:** ![ComeToTheDarkSideWeHaveCookies](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/e9bcb4/32.png) [@ComeToTheDarkSideWeHaveCookies](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ComeToTheDarkSideWeHaveCookies)\ **Post date:** [March 29, 2010, 7:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/california-legal-weed-going-on-the-ballot-baby/533852/73 "2010-03-29T19:32:54Z")
And smoking is not the only way to partake, of course. ---
**Author:** ![tr0psn4j](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/958977/32.png) [@tr0psn4j](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tr0psn4j)\ **Post date:** [March 29, 2010, 7:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/california-legal-weed-going-on-the-ballot-baby/533852/74 "2010-03-29T19:47:41Z")
> [@ComeToTheDarkSideWeHaveCookies](#): > > And smoking is not the only way to partake, of course. I was just thinking about this last night. If it gets legalized, will smoking be the default method of marijuana use? ---
**Author:** ![garygnu](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/garygnu/32/2924_2.png) [@garygnu](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/garygnu)\ **Post date:** [March 29, 2010, 7:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/california-legal-weed-going-on-the-ballot-baby/533852/75 "2010-03-29T19:51:54Z")
I dunno. I read about one guy who diffuses it into olive oil and drizzles it on spaghetti and whatnot. I’d love to try legal pot cooking. ---
**Author:** ![levdrakon](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/49beb7/32.png) [@levdrakon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/levdrakon)\ **Post date:** [March 29, 2010, 7:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/california-legal-weed-going-on-the-ballot-baby/533852/76 "2010-03-29T19:52:55Z")
> [@DiosaBellissima](#): > > I don’t understand what the problem is here? Maybe it’s because I live here in California where no one smokes anywhere (basically). Yeah, smoking in most places in California is about as commonplace as it is on Star Trek. I think 1964 was about the last time a Californian just walked into someone’s house and lit up. Most smokers don’t even smoke inside their own homes. ---
**Author:** ![lezlers](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/258eb7/32.png) [@lezlers](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/lezlers)\ **Post date:** [March 29, 2010, 8:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/california-legal-weed-going-on-the-ballot-baby/533852/77 "2010-03-29T20:09:31Z")
> [@Rigamarole](#): > > To expand on that, the really stupid thing about decriminalization is that it makes punishments for minor possession minimal to the point of it being a joke while keeping the penalties for possession/distribution of large quantities fairly stiff. > > Even now in California, possession of under 1 ounce (and an ounce is quite a lot for personal consumption) is only a citable offense like a traffic ticket, less serious than a misdemeanor. But if you’re caught with several pounds of the stuff and you’re not an authorized medicinal supplier than you could be going away for quite a few years. This is untrue. Possession of under an ounce of marijuana _is_ a misdemeanor, under Health and Safety Code section 11357(b). Maximum penalty, however, is a $100 fine. ---
**Author:** ![Stan\_Shmenge](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/94ad74/32.png) [@Stan\_Shmenge](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Stan_Shmenge)\ **Post date:** [March 30, 2010, 10:45am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/california-legal-weed-going-on-the-ballot-baby/533852/78 "2010-03-30T10:45:34Z")
I have a feeling it is going to be defeated. All the law enforcement types, and their families will be voting against, because it cuts into their business model, and they are already gearing up the scare campaign. The soccer moms will be up in arms, even though many of them toked up before popping out the snowflakes and maybe still do but can’t bear the thought of little Tyler or Brianna getting their hands on some, and the husbands will be henpecked into going along, so basically anyone with kids will be against it, then there is the old fogey contingent who thinks it is the tool of the devil, and the Bible thumpers… All these folks are going to turn out heavy and vote against. This against the stoners? Duuude! Election day was YESTERDAY!?! Bummer! ---
**Author:** ![vinniepaz](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/v/b4bc9f/32.png) [@vinniepaz](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/vinniepaz)\ **Post date:** [March 30, 2010, 5:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/california-legal-weed-going-on-the-ballot-baby/533852/79 "2010-03-30T17:32:25Z")
> [@Una\_Persson](#): > > And anyone who thinks legalization will end drug running of pot hasn’t thought the process through. Instead of police resources to catch and convict drug dealers and smugglers for the legality of the drugs, it will be the same damn thing on the basis of tax evasion. So we’ll have the same tunnels under the border, the same stabbings and shootings, the same people sitting in jail pissing away the tax dollars and laughing in our faces. > > There may not even be less on an overall basis, only a proportional basis - more people who don’t smoke or don’t smoke much will probably get their pot from official, safe, tax-paid sources, but there will always be a significant group of people who want the cheapest pot possible and don’t want to grow it. And of course there will be the “joints laced with X, Y, or Z” sales as well. I can still remember three boys in 9th grade biology who stole formaldehyde from the class to dip their joints in it, claiming that it was “supercharging” the pot (I have no idea what this does, and don’t care enough to Google, the point is, people are always going to fuck with the system). I’m in college and went to a high school in the city and consider myself pretty knowledgeable about the economics of the drug trade. Obviously this is anecdotal, but I don’t really think this is true. Weed is pretty cheap as far as drugs go. You can smoke a bowl for a couple bucks and a blunt for five. Considering that generally accepted weed prices (~10 dollars/gram at small quantities) are more a result of the risks involved in dealing and the lack of a true marketplace than cost of production, I imagine that even with taxation, prices would remain about the same. This is supported by existing prices for medicinal and in Holland (I think it costs a little bit more than 10/gram, but the quality is better). If legal weed was approx. the same price as illegal weed is now (which I think is a fair assumption), everyone I know would switch. No one enjoys the criminal aspect of marijuana, or dealing with the shady people that sell it, or not knowing what you’re getting when you buy it. Basically, this was a long way of making this point: People will pay a premium for legal weed. Legalization would marginalize the illegal marijuana trade, just like repealing prohibition marginalized bootlegging. ---
**Author:** ![Algher](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/3d9bf3/32.png) [@Algher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Algher)\ **Post date:** [March 30, 2010, 5:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/california-legal-weed-going-on-the-ballot-baby/533852/80 "2010-03-30T17:40:25Z")
I wonder if this will help or hurt the other statewide elections. Who will this bring to the polls more - social conservatives who will also make Meg the governor, and Carly the Senator? Alternatively, will we get a huge youth turnout and a stronger left-wing vibe to the election? I will vote for it, but won’t smoke personally. I cough up a lung every time I try to smoke. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/california-legal-weed-going-on-the-ballot-baby/533852.md?page=3) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/california-legal-weed-going-on-the-ballot-baby/533852.md?page=5)