# Can a six year old commit murder? **URL:** \ **Category:** In My Humble Opinion\ **Created:** [January 7, 2023, 8:24am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-a-six-year-old-commit-murder/977825 "2023-01-07T08:24:40Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 16\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![TriPolar](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/tripolar/32/3008_2.png) [@TriPolar](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TriPolar)\ **Post date:** [March 22, 2023, 2:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-a-six-year-old-commit-murder/977825/41 "2023-03-22T14:33:59Z")
I can’t place the date, 80s or 90s maybe, heard of a case where one young child apparently pushed another one down a stairway killing them. The surviving child says they did it because the other child expressed a desire to die. Both children were aged 5 or under as I recall. There was mention that no prosecution was possible, and of course there was an investigation into why a child would express a desire to die, if that is what happened at all. ---
**Author:** ![elfkin477](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/a9a28c/32.png) [@elfkin477](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elfkin477)\ **Post date:** [March 26, 2023, 5:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-a-six-year-old-commit-murder/977825/42 "2023-03-26T17:23:18Z")
> [@Procrustus](#): > > Children under the age of eight years are incapable of committing crime. Children of eight and under twelve years of age are presumed to be incapable of committing crime, **but this presumption may be removed by proof that they have sufficient capacity to understand the act or neglect, and to know that it was wrong** Wait. Does this mean that at seven I might have been held to a different standard than a classmate if we committed the same crime against our teacher because I was gifted (and had been given a standardized IQ test) and he or she wasn’t? ---
**Author:** ![PastTense](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pasttense/32/14550_2.png) [@PastTense](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/PastTense)\ **Post date:** [March 26, 2023, 5:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-a-six-year-old-commit-murder/977825/43 "2023-03-26T17:35:44Z")
No. At age 7 you are always presumed to be incapable of committing the crime. It is between the age of 8 and under 12 you might be held to a different standard. ---
**Author:** ![TriPolar](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/tripolar/32/3008_2.png) [@TriPolar](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TriPolar)\ **Post date:** [March 26, 2023, 6:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-a-six-year-old-commit-murder/977825/44 "2023-03-26T18:28:09Z")
But if @elfkin477 were 8 years old and gifted she could have been tried for the crime as someone age 12 and older would be, while a 7 year old classmate would be considered incapable of committing the crime. gifted or not. It is absurd but could happen. “The other kid did it too” is not much of defense, may not be allowed at all in court. If someone were actually harmed by you and your classmate the call to prosecute one of you would intensify if the other could not be prosecuted. ---
**Author:** ![doreen](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/858c86/32.png) [@doreen](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/doreen)\ **Post date:** [March 26, 2023, 11:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-a-six-year-old-commit-murder/977825/45 "2023-03-26T23:00:13Z")
It’s really not a matter of an IQ test and whether or not someone is “gifted” - the fact that one eight year old has a higher IQ than another , high enough to be considered gifted does not necessarily mean that the eight year old with the higher IQ is able to appreciate the nature of their act and know that it was wrong. An IQ test doesn’t measure that. ---
**Author:** ![nearwildheaven](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/90db22/32.png) [@nearwildheaven](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/nearwildheaven)\ **Post date:** [April 3, 2023, 10:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-a-six-year-old-commit-murder/977825/46 "2023-04-03T22:53:12Z")
Update: The teacher this child (allegedly) shot is suing the school district, among others, for $140 million. There are a gazillion links out there, so pick your favorite news source if you wish to dive further down this rabbit hole. Other disturbing behaviors he engaged in have come to light; among other things, last year, they sexually molested a fellow kindergartner on the playground and the reason they had to have a parent accompany them to school was because they were refusing to have the child evaluated regarding their behavioral issues. My own guess is that the parents are refusing to do this for at least one of two reasons: they are from a culture where having a child with a diagnosed difference is considered more stigmatized than the behavior that indicates the difference, and/or they don’t want the child to tell doctors things about them (the parents) that they don’t want outsiders to know. I had long speculated that the cap on their identity was due to the child being in foster care, but I’m starting to think this isn’t the case. ---
**Author:** ![Eyebrows\_0f\_Doom](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/eyebrows_0f_doom/32/3119_2.png) [@Eyebrows\_0f\_Doom](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Eyebrows_0f_Doom)\ **Post date:** [April 4, 2023, 12:12am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-a-six-year-old-commit-murder/977825/47 "2023-04-04T00:12:06Z")
> [@nearwildheaven](#): > > among other things, last year, they sexually molested a fellow kindergartner on the playground and the reason they had to have a parent accompany them to school was because they were refusing to have the child evaluated regarding their behavioral issues Who are you referring to here by saying “they molested a kindergartener”? The boy who shot his teacher or his parents? ---
**Author:** ![nearwildheaven](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/90db22/32.png) [@nearwildheaven](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/nearwildheaven)\ **Post date:** [April 4, 2023, 1:22am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-a-six-year-old-commit-murder/977825/48 "2023-04-04T01:22:52Z")
The boy who shot his teacher. He tackled a girl who was wearing a dress on the playground, and did it in front of a teacher. I used they-them pronouns because even though I’m assuming this is a boy, I don’t know for sure. ---
**Author:** ![PastTense](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pasttense/32/14550_2.png) [@PastTense](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/PastTense)\ **Post date:** [August 15, 2023, 6:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-a-six-year-old-commit-murder/977825/49 "2023-08-15T18:21:26Z")
> **[Mother of 6-year-old who shot his teacher pleads guilty to state charge of...](https://www.cnn.com/2023/08/15/us/virginia-teacher-shooting-mother-guilty/index.html)** > > Deja Taylor, the mother of the Virginia 6-year-old who shot his first-grade teacher in January, pleaded guilty to a charge of felony child neglect Tuesday. ---
**Author:** ![Whack-a-Mole](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/whack-a-mole/32/141_2.png) [@Whack-a-Mole](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Whack-a-Mole)\ **Post date:** [August 15, 2023, 6:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-a-six-year-old-commit-murder/977825/50 "2023-08-15T18:32:37Z")
Tl;Dr: > The boy, who is now in the custody of his great-grandfather, will not be criminally charged, Newport News Commonwealth’s Attorney Howard Gwynn has said. > > The child has “extreme emotional issues” and is in therapy and showing improvement Interesting case for a different thread on nature vs. nurture. ---
**Author:** ![fedman1](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/e495f1/32.png) [@fedman1](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/fedman1)\ **Post date:** [August 17, 2023, 7:45am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-a-six-year-old-commit-murder/977825/51 "2023-08-17T07:45:15Z")
from CNN “My mom had that gun. I stole it because I needed to shoot my teacher,” the 6-year-old said after the shooting, authorities claimed during a statement of facts in court Tuesday. ---
**Author:** ![PastTense](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pasttense/32/14550_2.png) [@PastTense](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/PastTense)\ **Post date:** [December 16, 2023, 4:00am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-a-six-year-old-commit-murder/977825/52 "2023-12-16T04:00:24Z")
> The [mother of a 6-year-old](https://www.cbsnews.com/news/mother-deja-taylor-of-virginia-child-who-shot-teacher-abby-zwerner-sentenced/) who shot his teacher in Virginia was [sentenced](https://www.wtkr.com/news/in-the-community/newport-news/mother-of-boy-who-shot-abby-zwerner-at-richneck-elem-to-be-sentenced-for-felony-child-neglect)Friday to two years in prison for felony child neglect, nearly a year after her son used her gun to critically wound the educator… > > Taylor was [sentenced](https://www.cbsnews.com/news/mother-deja-taylor-of-virginia-child-who-shot-teacher-abby-zwerner-sentenced/) in November to 21 months in federal prison for using marijuana while owning a gun, which is illegal under U.S. law. The combination of her state and federal sentences amounts to a total punishment of nearly four years behind bars. > **[Deja Taylor, mother of 6-year-old who shot Virginia teacher Abby Zwerner, gets...](https://www.cbsnews.com/news/deja-taylor-sentenced-mother-6-year-old-shot-virginia-teacher-abby-zwerner-child-neglect/)** > > Deja Taylor has now been sentenced twice for the classroom shooting, which stunned the nation and shook the city of Newport News. ---
**Author:** ![EnolaStraight](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/41988e/32.png) [@EnolaStraight](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/EnolaStraight)\ **Post date:** [December 18, 2023, 3:11am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-a-six-year-old-commit-murder/977825/53 "2023-12-18T03:11:55Z")
An earlier thread on the subject: [When should kids be charged as adults? - In My Humble Opinion - Straight Dope Message Board](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-should-kids-be-charged-as-adults/665106/25) ---
**Author:** ![PastTense](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pasttense/32/14550_2.png) [@PastTense](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/PastTense)\ **Post date:** [November 6, 2025, 10:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-a-six-year-old-commit-murder/977825/54 "2025-11-06T22:18:29Z")
> **[A former teacher shot by student, 6, wins $10M jury verdict against...](https://apnews.com/article/newport-news-virginia-teacher-shot-68865dde6f4953ef8a9dbda30e957ddb)** > > A Virginia jury has awarded $10 million to a former teacher in a lawsuit that accused an administrator of ignoring warnings that a 6-year-old student had a gun before the teacher was shot. While apparently it is common in that state to have some liability insurance coverage I expect the vast majority of the verdict will not be paid. ---
**Author:** ![Ancient\_Nerd](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/ed655f/32.png) [@Ancient\_Nerd](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ancient_Nerd)\ **Post date:** [November 6, 2025, 10:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-a-six-year-old-commit-murder/977825/55 "2025-11-06T22:37:38Z")
There was a case, somewhere in the Pacific Northwest, a few years ago, where a young mother was given a gun as a Christmas present. In the checkout line at a supermarket, her baby, sitting in the seat of the shopping cart, found the gun in his mother’s purse and shot her with it, killing her. ---
**Author:** ![Thing.Fish](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/thing.fish/32/9168_2.png) [@Thing.Fish](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Thing.Fish)\ **Post date:** [November 6, 2025, 10:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-a-six-year-old-commit-murder/977825/56 "2025-11-06T22:54:06Z")
The administrator who had the judgment against her (for ignoring multiple reports from other children that the kid was armed) also is awaiting trial on numerous criminal charges for her failure to protect her students. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-a-six-year-old-commit-murder/977825.md?page=2)