# Can child rape victims be forced to mother their children? **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [August 26, 2018, 1:18am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-child-rape-victims-be-forced-to-mother-their-children/820283 "2018-08-26T01:18:30Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![Broomstick](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/broomstick/32/246_2.png) [@Broomstick](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Broomstick)\ **Post date:** [August 26, 2018, 10:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-child-rape-victims-be-forced-to-mother-their-children/820283/41 "2018-08-26T22:13:24Z")
> [@nearwildheaven](#): > > One thing that’s always confused me about judicial bypass is how these young girls, even with one, can undergo a surgical procedure without their parents knowing something is going on. That’s on top of the court appearance in the first place. That’s why a judge is necessary - to determine if it is a case where the best interests of the child over-ride the wishes/beliefs of her parents. ---
**Author:** ![Bryan\_Ekers](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bryan_ekers/32/183_2.png) [@Bryan\_Ekers](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bryan_Ekers)\ **Post date:** [August 26, 2018, 10:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-child-rape-victims-be-forced-to-mother-their-children/820283/42 "2018-08-26T22:31:51Z")
> [@j666](#): > > I assumed the OP meant too young to decided for herself legally? It certainly struck me as odd factoid to drop in the middle of a hypothetical, since I was not aware of any medical issue that would render someone “too young” for abortion and indeed I thought it was clearly established it was possible to be “too young” for a safe pregnancy. But the OP clearly has an agenda based on how he perceives the legal and ethical issues, not on anything related to science or medicine, and that’s fine but it would have been nice to establish that up front. ---
**Author:** ![Contemplation](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/6de8d8/32.png) [@Contemplation](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Contemplation)\ **Post date:** [August 26, 2018, 10:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-child-rape-victims-be-forced-to-mother-their-children/820283/43 "2018-08-26T22:47:27Z")
> [@Bryan\_Ekers](#): > > It certainly struck me as odd factoid to drop in the middle of a hypothetical, since I was not aware of any medical issue that would render someone “too young” for abortion and indeed I thought it was clearly established it was possible to be “too young” for a safe pregnancy. > > But the OP clearly has an agenda based on how he perceives the legal and ethical issues, not on anything related to science or medicine, and that’s fine but it would have been nice to establish that up front. No agenda here. I was trying to remain neutral by preventing both sides of the issue. SD seems to be very staunchly pro-choice. People ITT got very emotional over a hypothetical scenario that has probably happened a lot throughout human history. ---
**Author:** ![nelliebly](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/nelliebly/32/5422_2.png) [@nelliebly](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/nelliebly)\ **Post date:** [August 26, 2018, 11:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-child-rape-victims-be-forced-to-mother-their-children/820283/44 "2018-08-26T23:06:58Z")
> [@Contemplation](#): > > No agenda here. I was trying to remain neutral by preventing both sides of the issue. SD seems to be very staunchly pro-choice. People ITT got very emotional over a hypothetical scenario that has probably happened a lot throughout human history. **I was trying to remain neutral by preventing both sides of the issue**. Interesting typo. 🙂 Of course it’s happened many times. That’s well-documented. If it’s historical, it’s not merely hypothetical. But why would you think people _wouldn’t_ get passionate about the issues behind a “hypothetical” scenario that involves child rape, pregnancy, and abortion? ---
**Author:** ![Voyager](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/voyager/32/133_2.png) [@Voyager](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Voyager)\ **Post date:** [August 26, 2018, 11:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-child-rape-victims-be-forced-to-mother-their-children/820283/45 "2018-08-26T23:22:36Z")
> [@Contemplation](#): > > No agenda here. I was trying to remain neutral by preventing both sides of the issue. SD seems to be very staunchly pro-choice. People ITT got very emotional over a hypothetical scenario that has probably happened a lot throughout human history. I hope you understand what pro-choice means. It does not mean someone is for abortion in all circumstances. It is possible for a person to be personally opposed to abortion and yet feel that others with different views should have free access to it. John Kerry was like that, I believe. If someone has religious objections fine for them, but unless you can present your god as evidence, stay the fuck away from those of different or no religion. ---
**Author:** ![Voyager](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/voyager/32/133_2.png) [@Voyager](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Voyager)\ **Post date:** [August 26, 2018, 11:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-child-rape-victims-be-forced-to-mother-their-children/820283/46 "2018-08-26T23:29:01Z")
> [@Flyer](#): > > Serious question– > Why do you want to traumatize such a girl even further, by forcing her to go the rest of her life knowing that (A) her unborn child was murdered, and (B) her family was complicit in that evil? In any decent family the child would be told that a surgical procedure, having nothing to do with murder, was done to protect her life and health. Andy any God-botherer assaulting a child with accusations of murder would suffer serious repercussions. Because that would be the real evil here. ---
**Author:** ![j666](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/9de0a6/32.png) [@j666](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/j666)\ **Post date:** [August 26, 2018, 11:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-child-rape-victims-be-forced-to-mother-their-children/820283/47 "2018-08-26T23:39:53Z")
> [@Contemplation](#): > > No agenda here. I was trying to remain neutral by preventing both sides of the issue. SD seems to be very staunchly pro-choice. People ITT got very emotional over a hypothetical scenario that has probably happened a lot throughout human history. Women and girls have died from pregnancy and giving birth throughout human history. I’m still think it’s a bad thing. ---
**Author:** ![Bryan\_Ekers](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bryan_ekers/32/183_2.png) [@Bryan\_Ekers](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bryan_Ekers)\ **Post date:** [August 27, 2018, 1:35am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-child-rape-victims-be-forced-to-mother-their-children/820283/48 "2018-08-27T01:35:24Z")
> [@Contemplation](#): > > No agenda here. I was trying to remain neutral by preventing both sides of the issue. SD seems to be very staunchly pro-choice. People ITT got very emotional over a hypothetical scenario that has probably happened a lot throughout human history. Well, the rather glaring factual error in the hypothetical prevents me from investing too heavily in it. The realistic (and more common than it should be) scenario of a raped and impregnated preteen certainly can and should generate concern, though I don’t think “very emotional” is an accurate descriptor of the reaction to the scenario, but rather your artificial and unnecessary limitation on the scenario. As for human history, childbirth was pretty commonly fatal for both mother and newborn so dismissing the options offered by modern medicine is especially misplaced. ---
**Author:** ![kanicbird](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/5f8ce5/32.png) [@kanicbird](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kanicbird)\ **Post date:** [August 27, 2018, 2:26am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-child-rape-victims-be-forced-to-mother-their-children/820283/49 "2018-08-27T02:26:22Z")
> [@Qadgop\_the\_Mercotan](#): > > Speaking as an MD who used to deliver babies, no. Abortion is safer than childbirth at any age. Safer for who, abortion generally has about a 50% mortality rate. ---
**Author:** ![kanicbird](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/5f8ce5/32.png) [@kanicbird](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kanicbird)\ **Post date:** [August 27, 2018, 2:29am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-child-rape-victims-be-forced-to-mother-their-children/820283/50 "2018-08-27T02:29:44Z")
> [@Thudlow\_Boink](#): > > Where in the Bible does it say that our DNA is what makes us human beings? > > And since identical twins have the same DNA, does that mean they’re the same person? The Bible does say that the life is in the breath and also in the blood. The ‘life’ is the accountable part. ---
**Author:** ![thirdname](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/d07c76/32.png) [@thirdname](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/thirdname)\ **Post date:** [August 27, 2018, 2:34am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-child-rape-victims-be-forced-to-mother-their-children/820283/51 "2018-08-27T02:34:16Z")
I don’t know about girls being forced to keep their babies, but male victims of statutory rape are routinely forced to pay child support to their rapists. (I’m not sure whether this applies to forcible rape as well.) I’m not sure if they start collecting it when the victim turns 18, or when they first start earning money or what, but in the Olivas case below he was held liable for accumulated support going back to the child’s birth. > **[Arizona Is Requiring A Male Statutory Rape Victim To Pay Child Support](https://www.businessinsider.com/male-statutory-rape-victim-nick-olivas-must-pay-child-support-2014-9)** > > Past court cases have established precedents for states requiring male statutory rape victims to pay child support. > **[Hermesmann v. Seyer](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hermesmann_v._Seyer)** > > Hermesmann v. Seyer (State of Kansas ex rel. Hermesmann v. Seyer, 847 P.2d 1273 (Kan. 1993)), was a precedent-setting Kansas, United States, case in which Colleen Hermesmann successfully argued that a woman is entitled to sue the father of her child for child support even if conception occurred as a result of a criminal act committed by the woman. The case was brought in her name by the then Kansas Department of Social and Rehabilitation Services. > Hermesmann was a babysitter for Shane Seyer du... [https://lawpublications.barry.edu/cgi/viewcontent.cgi?article=1017&context=cflj](https://lawpublications.barry.edu/cgi/viewcontent.cgi?article=1017&context=cflj) [PDF] ---
**Author:** ![nelliebly](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/nelliebly/32/5422_2.png) [@nelliebly](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/nelliebly)\ **Post date:** [August 27, 2018, 3:16am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-child-rape-victims-be-forced-to-mother-their-children/820283/52 "2018-08-27T03:16:13Z")
> [@kanicbird](#): > > Safer for who, abortion generally has about a 50% mortality rate. You’re saying HALF of all women who have abortions die?! Nope. Please show a cite. According to a 2012 study published by the [NCIB PubMed](https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/22270271), > [@](#): > > The pregnancy-associated mortality rate among women who delivered live neonates was 8.8 deaths per 100,000 live births. The mortality rate related to induced abortion was 0.6 deaths per 100,000 abortions…The risk of death associated with childbirth is approximately 14 times higher than that with abortion. Unless, of course, you were referring to the mortality rate for the embryo, in which case, it’s about 100%. But I’d like to ask you when one child’s life becomes less worthy than another child’s life. Pregnancy at age 12 is very dangerous. If the child-mother’s life is in danger, does that of the the embryo/fetus/baby always come first? ---
**Author:** ![Guinastasia](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/guinastasia/32/5751_2.png) [@Guinastasia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Guinastasia)\ **Post date:** [August 27, 2018, 4:13am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-child-rape-victims-be-forced-to-mother-their-children/820283/53 "2018-08-27T04:13:28Z")
> [@kanicbird](#): > > Safer for who, abortion generally has about a 50% mortality rate. Let’s see a cite for that. (Unless you’re talking about the fetus/embryo, and in which case, just come right out and say it instead of playing games.) ---
**Author:** ![Contemplation](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/6de8d8/32.png) [@Contemplation](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Contemplation)\ **Post date:** [August 27, 2018, 4:26am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-child-rape-victims-be-forced-to-mother-their-children/820283/54 "2018-08-27T04:26:57Z")
What defines who/what is a human being? ---
**Author:** ![kambuckta](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/53a042/32.png) [@kambuckta](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kambuckta)\ **Post date:** [August 27, 2018, 4:53am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-child-rape-victims-be-forced-to-mother-their-children/820283/55 "2018-08-27T04:53:12Z")
> [@Contemplation](#): > > What defines who/what is a human being? That might be discussion for another thread, don’tcha think? If all you wanted to really talk about was arguments for/against abortion, why didn’t you just come out and say that in your OP? :dubious: ---
**Author:** ![Voyager](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/voyager/32/133_2.png) [@Voyager](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Voyager)\ **Post date:** [August 27, 2018, 4:59am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-child-rape-victims-be-forced-to-mother-their-children/820283/56 "2018-08-27T04:59:54Z")
> [@Contemplation](#): > > What defines who/what is a human being? We all agree that birth does - though in past years, children weren’t really considered to be human beings until they could be shown to survive outside the womb, which is why babies weren’t named immediately. Before birth, it is a matter of definition and debate. So let’s not through women and doctors in jail for disagreeing with some religion or other. That sound reasonable? ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [August 27, 2018, 5:05am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-child-rape-victims-be-forced-to-mother-their-children/820283/57 "2018-08-27T05:05:16Z")
> [@Contemplation](#): > > What defines who/what is a human being? Would you happen to have an opinion on the OP and/or the question you just raised? ---
**Author:** ![j666](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/9de0a6/32.png) [@j666](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/j666)\ **Post date:** [August 27, 2018, 5:06am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-child-rape-victims-be-forced-to-mother-their-children/820283/58 "2018-08-27T05:06:34Z")
> [@nelliebly](#): > > But I’d like to ask you when one child’s life becomes less worthy than another child’s life. Pregnancy at age 12 is very dangerous. If the child-mother’s life is in danger, does that of the the embryo/fetus/baby always come first? Embryos and fetuses are not children. They are potential children. > [@Contemplation](#): > > What defines who/what is a human being? In this particular circumstance, that of a pregnant woman? The pregnant woman. ---
**Author:** ![kambuckta](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/53a042/32.png) [@kambuckta](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kambuckta)\ **Post date:** [August 27, 2018, 5:10am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-child-rape-victims-be-forced-to-mother-their-children/820283/59 "2018-08-27T05:10:08Z")
> [@Czarcasm](#): > > Would you happen to have an opinion on the OP and/or the question you just raised? He IS the OP of this thread. ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [August 27, 2018, 5:11am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-child-rape-victims-be-forced-to-mother-their-children/820283/60 "2018-08-27T05:11:45Z")
> [@kambuckta](#): > > He IS the OP of this thread. And I’m asking if the Original Poster has an opinion about his Original Post. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-child-rape-victims-be-forced-to-mother-their-children/820283.md?page=2) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-child-rape-victims-be-forced-to-mother-their-children/820283.md?page=4)