# Can Democrats actually stop the nomination of Brett Kavanaugh? **URL:** \ **Category:** Politics & Elections\ **Created:** [September 4, 2018, 12:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-democrats-actually-stop-the-nomination-of-brett-kavanaugh/820733 "2018-09-04T12:49:41Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 248
**Author:** ![John\_Mace](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_mace/32/185_2.png) [@John\_Mace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Mace)\ **Post date:** [September 28, 2018, 7:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-democrats-actually-stop-the-nomination-of-brett-kavanaugh/820733/4941 "2018-09-28T19:06:29Z")
> [@AK84](#): > > So Trump is acting out of character? > You do realise that this could well mean the “offer” is a trap? Order the FBI to a short investigation, give them very narrow terms of references. And they report something like “The balance of probabilities supports Judge Kavanuaghs claims over Professor Fords”. I don’t believe the FBI would offer a judgment of that sort. They will offer a set of facts, not a judgement about those facts. By “they” did you mean the Senate Republicans? “We were able to determine that the alleged gathering took place sometime between Jun 1, 1981 and August 31 1983” “We were unable to verify from store records if Mark Judge was working at the Safeway Store during that time period”. Stuff like that. ---
**Author:** ![Crafter\_Man](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/crafter_man/32/458_2.png) [@Crafter\_Man](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Crafter_Man)\ **Post date:** [September 28, 2018, 7:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-democrats-actually-stop-the-nomination-of-brett-kavanaugh/820733/4942 "2018-09-28T19:06:57Z")
If the FBI doesn’t find evidence a crime was committed by Kavanaugh, will dopers rally behind Kavanaugh? ---
**Author:** ![KidCharlemagne](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/ed8c4c/32.png) [@KidCharlemagne](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/KidCharlemagne)\ **Post date:** [September 28, 2018, 7:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-democrats-actually-stop-the-nomination-of-brett-kavanaugh/820733/4943 "2018-09-28T19:07:53Z")
> [@Dinsdale](#): > > Are you saying victims of sexual violation are exceptionally reliable witnesses? With respect to what in particular? > > I’m not saying this isn’t so, but I’m curious as to the scientific basis for this contention. Is there general consensus on this? As long as those memories haven’t been manipulated later by an incompetent or ill-intentioned therapist, then yes. The memories encoded and modulated with high levels of stress hormones are generally more vivid and more snapshot-like than ordinary memories. Since during extreme duress there is often a tunnel vision effect, it’s not surprising that memories are, in total, less complete, but more accurate for what is remembered. ---
**Author:** ![AlsoNamedBort](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/alsonamedbort/32/3213_2.png) [@AlsoNamedBort](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AlsoNamedBort)\ **Post date:** [September 28, 2018, 7:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-democrats-actually-stop-the-nomination-of-brett-kavanaugh/820733/4944 "2018-09-28T19:08:56Z")
> [@Crafter\_Man](#): > > If the FBI doesn’t find evidence a crime was committed by Kavanaugh, will dopers rally behind Kavanaugh? I was already opposed to him before all this. Why would I or anyone else previously opposed to him change their mind? ---
**Author:** ![Evil\_Economist](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/c89c15/32.png) [@Evil\_Economist](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Evil_Economist)\ **Post date:** [September 28, 2018, 7:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-democrats-actually-stop-the-nomination-of-brett-kavanaugh/820733/4945 "2018-09-28T19:08:57Z")
> [@Crafter\_Man](#): > > If the FBI doesn’t find evidence a crime was committed by Kavanaugh, will dopers rally behind Kavanaugh? Rally? Why on earth would they do that? He’s still a creepy, angry, extreme right-wing douche bag. That won’t change. ---
**Author:** ![Lance\_Turbo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lance_turbo/32/6156_2.png) [@Lance\_Turbo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lance_Turbo)\ **Post date:** [September 28, 2018, 7:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-democrats-actually-stop-the-nomination-of-brett-kavanaugh/820733/4946 "2018-09-28T19:09:45Z")
> [@Crafter\_Man](#): > > If the FBI doesn’t find evidence a crime was committed by Kavanaugh, will dopers rally behind Kavanaugh? Prediction: No. Why would they? Was that a real question? ---
**Author:** ![Richard\_Parker](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/35a633/32.png) [@Richard\_Parker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Richard_Parker)\ **Post date:** [September 28, 2018, 7:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-democrats-actually-stop-the-nomination-of-brett-kavanaugh/820733/4947 "2018-09-28T19:10:30Z")
> [@Crafter\_Man](#): > > If the FBI doesn’t find evidence a crime was committed by Kavanaugh, will dopers rally behind Kavanaugh? There is already ample evidence that Kavanaugh committed a crime. The question is whether they will find more evidence to help people decide whether he committed a crime or not. I think he disqualified himself with his talk of Clinton conspiracies, if nothing else. So my view won’t change. If they find more evidence that he tried to rape Dr. Ford, will you oppose him? ---
**Author:** ![Beckdawrek](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/beckdawrek/32/3647_2.png) [@Beckdawrek](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Beckdawrek)\ **Post date:** [September 28, 2018, 7:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-democrats-actually-stop-the-nomination-of-brett-kavanaugh/820733/4948 "2018-09-28T19:11:01Z")
Kav doesn’t want the FBI investigating because they will find out exactly how much he was drinking as a teenager. You can’t be Sober as a judge if you’re imbibing that much. I know drinkers, my whole family are at many levels of alcoholism and heavy drinking. As the sober one in the room I see the stupidity and craziness that goes on. I really have no moral problem with basic drinking. But, and this is the thing, I want my SC justices to be ‘Sober’, thoughtful, and even handed. I could care less about his politics. Along as he can be impartial. I don’t think Kav can do that. He’s lost his judicial demeanor and flew off the rails yesterday. ---
**Author:** ![AK84](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/85e7bf/32.png) [@AK84](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AK84)\ **Post date:** [September 28, 2018, 7:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-democrats-actually-stop-the-nomination-of-brett-kavanaugh/820733/4949 "2018-09-28T19:11:03Z")
> [@John\_Mace](#): > > I don’t believe the FBI would offer a judgment of that sort. They will offer a set of facts, not a judgement about those facts. By “they” did you mean the Senate Republicans? > > “We were able to determine that the alleged gathering took place sometime between Jun 1, 1981 and August 31 1983” > > “We were unable to verify from store records if Mark Judge was working at the Safeway Store during that time period”. > > Stuff like that. Apparently the President can set the Terms of Reference under the statute. If he tells them something like “are the claims prima facie sufficient to lead to criminal conviction or a civil finding”: then they might have to. An extremely narrow and short inquiry which does not even delay the vote\*, will not be what the Democrats want. \*They were planning to work over the weekend and confirm on Tuesday or Wednesday. All this means is they start on Monday and finish Thursday or Friday. ---
**Author:** ![AK84](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/85e7bf/32.png) [@AK84](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AK84)\ **Post date:** [September 28, 2018, 7:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-democrats-actually-stop-the-nomination-of-brett-kavanaugh/820733/4950 "2018-09-28T19:14:23Z")
> [@Beckdawrek](#): > > Kav doesn’t want the FBI investigating because they will find out exactly how much he was drinking as a teenager. You can’t be Sober as a judge if you’re imbibing that much. I know drinkers, my whole family are at many levels of alcoholism and heavy drinking. As the sober one in the room I see the stupidity and craziness that goes on. I really have no moral problem with basic drinking. But, and this is the thing, I want my SC justices to be ‘Sober’, thoughtful, and even handed. I could care less about his politics. Along as he can be impartial. I don’t think Kav can do that. He’s lost his judicial demeanor and flew off the rails yesterday. I fear you will be disappointed. Maximum they’ll get comflicting stories, most of those subjective assessments anyway. ---
**Author:** ![Ravenman](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ravenman/32/2929_2.png) [@Ravenman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ravenman)\ **Post date:** [September 28, 2018, 7:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-democrats-actually-stop-the-nomination-of-brett-kavanaugh/820733/4951 "2018-09-28T19:15:48Z")
> [@Crafter\_Man](#): > > If the FBI doesn’t find evidence a crime was committed by Kavanaugh, will dopers rally behind Kavanaugh? Like how you voted for Hillary Clinton after she was cleared of charges stemming from emailbenghazipizzagate? ---
**Author:** ![Dinsdale](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/97f17d/32.png) [@Dinsdale](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dinsdale)\ **Post date:** [September 28, 2018, 7:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-democrats-actually-stop-the-nomination-of-brett-kavanaugh/820733/4952 "2018-09-28T19:18:40Z")
> [@KidCharlemagne](#): > > As long as those memories haven’t been manipulated later by an incompetent or ill-intentioned therapist, then yes. The memories encoded and modulated with high levels of stress hormones are generally more vivid and more snapshot-like than ordinary memories. Since during extreme duress there is often a tunnel vision effect, it’s not surprising that memories are, in total, less complete, but more accurate for what is remembered. Ahh - I see. The pot I linked said “witness to armed robbery” - I read it as victim of armed robbery. I thought the poster was suggesting the stress of sexual assault was somehow qualitatively different than all other stressful memories. My error. I’d still like to see the research behind what you cite. My layman’s impression is that folks’ memories are pretty plastic… And I could imagine that stress might “color” one’s immediate perceptions in a way that might lead to unreliability later. But I’m anything but an expert. ---
**Author:** ![Grrr](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/grrr/32/146_2.png) [@Grrr](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Grrr)\ **Post date:** [September 28, 2018, 7:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-democrats-actually-stop-the-nomination-of-brett-kavanaugh/820733/4953 "2018-09-28T19:19:33Z")
> [@Crafter\_Man](#): > > If the FBI doesn’t find evidence a crime was committed by Kavanaugh, will dopers rally behind Kavanaugh? The fact that he lied so much during his testimony is disqualifying. So no. ---
**Author:** ![DSeid](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dseid/32/20194_2.png) [@DSeid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DSeid)\ **Post date:** [September 28, 2018, 7:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-democrats-actually-stop-the-nomination-of-brett-kavanaugh/820733/4954 "2018-09-28T19:19:38Z")
> [@Crafter\_Man](#): > > If the FBI doesn’t find evidence a crime was committed by Kavanaugh, will dopers rally behind Kavanaugh? Speaking for myself … I thought he was a poor choice before any of this sexual assault stuff. His not being a proven criminal would not change that belief and both his having lied as a knee jerk response and his behavior in the hearing yesterday only cement that assessment of him. I would never rally behind him. But I would more willingly accept that he has passed a minimal bar, that the process has passed a minimal bar, and not find his being on the court as horrific. ---
**Author:** ![Fiveyearlurker](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/da6949/32.png) [@Fiveyearlurker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fiveyearlurker)\ **Post date:** [September 28, 2018, 7:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-democrats-actually-stop-the-nomination-of-brett-kavanaugh/820733/4955 "2018-09-28T19:21:17Z")
I think the GOP wants out of this nominee and is trying to engineer the softest possible landing to blame Democrats. ---
**Author:** ![Beckdawrek](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/beckdawrek/32/3647_2.png) [@Beckdawrek](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Beckdawrek)\ **Post date:** [September 28, 2018, 7:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-democrats-actually-stop-the-nomination-of-brett-kavanaugh/820733/4956 "2018-09-28T19:22:32Z")
> [@AK84](#): > > Apparently the President can set the Terms of Reference under the statute. If he tells them something like “are the claims prima facie sufficient to lead to criminal conviction or a civil finding”: then they might have to. > > An extremely narrow and short inquiry which does not even delay the vote\*, will not be what the Democrats want. > > \*They were planning to work over the weekend and confirm on Tuesday or Wednesday. All this means is they start on Monday and finish Thursday or Friday. Who is gonna explain that to Trump? Graham? ---
**Author:** ![Fiddle\_Peghead](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/fiddle_peghead/32/3506_2.png) [@Fiddle\_Peghead](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fiddle_Peghead)\ **Post date:** [September 28, 2018, 7:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-democrats-actually-stop-the-nomination-of-brett-kavanaugh/820733/4957 "2018-09-28T19:25:36Z")
As it seems to me from yesterday’s testimony, the last thing Kavanaugh wants is an FBI investigation. I suppose we will shortly find out if this is the case. If the nomination is withdrawn, it would seem highly likely that it was done at his request, even if that is never actually shown to be the case. ---
**Author:** ![Dinsdale](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/97f17d/32.png) [@Dinsdale](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dinsdale)\ **Post date:** [September 28, 2018, 7:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-democrats-actually-stop-the-nomination-of-brett-kavanaugh/820733/4958 "2018-09-28T19:26:22Z")
> [@Dinsdale](#): > > … > I’d still like to see the research behind what you cite. Just one [article](https://blogs.scientificamerican.com/observations/how-reliable-are-the-memories-of-sexual-assault-victims/) I readily googled. ---
**Author:** ![Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/left_hand_of_dorkness/32/7156_2.png) [@Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Left_Hand_of_Dorkness)\ **Post date:** [September 28, 2018, 7:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-democrats-actually-stop-the-nomination-of-brett-kavanaugh/820733/4959 "2018-09-28T19:29:13Z")
Yeah, the “you can’t remember stuff from long ago” people have a different life experience from me. I certainly don’t remember what I was doing on, say, August 4, 1988 (date chosen randomly). But significant events in my adolescence, including things like significant sexual events, or even things like the first time I held hands with a girl as an awkward teenager? I can remember a lot about those occasions–and they are a helluva lot less significant than the memory Ford is describing. The “remembering it wrong” narrative just doesn’t hold. We’re left with some other possibilities: 1. She’s mentally ill and is remembering something false. Over and over, folks with these made-up memories include bizarre Grand Guignol memories, not the sort of not-quite-completed-rape-because-of-a-pratfall stuff that Ford described. 2. She’s lying. Again, what a master-stroke of lying this would be, to tell a lie in which there was no completed rape. Most false accusations are horrorshows; I’m unaware of accusations proven false that involve an uncompleted rape. In either of those cases, there’s also the question of precedence. Would a middle-aged woman prone to lying or imagining rape get through her first several decades without lying or imagining previous rapes? If an FBI investigation finds that twice before she accused someone of rape, and if an investigation finds no evidence to support those accusations, then my belief in her claims will crumble. But the apparent absence of any previous accusations of sexual assault from a woman who’s had decades to make them can only bolster this charge. ---
**Author:** ![Fiveyearlurker](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/da6949/32.png) [@Fiveyearlurker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fiveyearlurker)\ **Post date:** [September 28, 2018, 7:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-democrats-actually-stop-the-nomination-of-brett-kavanaugh/820733/4960 "2018-09-28T19:35:18Z")
Will Judge refuse to testify? Would he be subpoenaed? Would he plead the fifth? [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-democrats-actually-stop-the-nomination-of-brett-kavanaugh/820733.md?page=247) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-democrats-actually-stop-the-nomination-of-brett-kavanaugh/820733.md?page=249)