By the same token, the implicit argument of airplane advocates is that people should not live anywhere but near airports, with vast unpopulated areas between that the planes fly over. Trains would mostly fit into the niche currently occupied by planes, not that occupied by cars.
If my truck was a plug in hybrid, it could go weeks at a time with never using the gasoline engine. It only gets driven very far when my wife and I have to go separate places at the same time. I think it has only been 100 miles from home once in the last 5 years.
I think those buying plug in hybrids or even pure electrics will be younger, more affluent and early adopters. Just the demographic stores and employers want. Outlets, metered or not, will be provided. Also, a perk for public employees.
I’ll be all over a fully-electric when my Camry hits 120K. It’s a ways off, I don’t drive that much, and 120K would leave plenty of room for longer trips that any plug-in couldn’t handle. Or hell, I drive so little maybe plug-ins COULD go that far by then.
Well, considering that the Leaf usually does between 60 and 110 miles per charge, apparently that is the case now. The average driver would only have to recharge every two days at the most.
Within the broad category of electric vehicles there are cars that can meet virtually most consumers’ needs, except cost. And the lines between decreasing cost for EVs and the increasing cost of fueling an ICE are rapidly approaching.
Pure battery electrics come in shapes from small city cars to large delivery trucks and buses. From pokey things to cars with performance numbers that in many ways but the best sports cars to shame. Recharge is possible in 10 to 20 minutes and battery swap stations can do it even faster. No the infrastructure for those options are not widely available but do make sense for fleet owners and in some areas that function like islands.
Plug-in hybrids and so-called extended range electric vehicles like the Volt provide all the utility of an ICE vehicle while allowing a small fraction of typical ICE gas use to hardly any at all depending on the particular vehicle and the individual driver’s needs.
So can they replace gasoline powered cars? Yes. However as a matter of practical choice they are not ready to replace them for one car families that need to be able to distance travel with any regularity or who need towing capacity, and it is unclear if they ever will be. They are ready to serve the commuter vehicle of choice for most urban and suburban dwellers. And that is a large number of vehicles, and especially of new car sales.
Many experts expect that the future mix will contain a greater diversity than in times past, electric vehicles of various sorts, cars running off of synthetic diesel made from biomass, hybrids, natural gas vehicles for fleet use, and even some old fashioned ICE vehicles, all finding their niches of various sizes. Not a single sort of vehicle for all consumers.
I’ve seen teens put an old electric motor and some regular car batteries in an old heap and drive around with out gas. They only get 20 or 30 miles on a charge but they don’t seem to care.
They are driving with out paying for gas.
And? unlike the automakers, they don’t have to worry about it lasting for at least 150,000 miles, nor a bunch of people suing them if something is overtaxed and catches fire, and so on.
Yep. But it’s not hard to put an electric motor and some batteries in a car and run it with out gas.
I won’t be going electric any time soon. My normal commute is 60 miles… one way.
If only there was something that could move large amounts of people at high speed.
bonus points if that “something” happens to run from where he is to where he wants to go.
That is a real problem.
Building a car that can run around in batteries isn’t rocket science.
Building a car that is all electric that can match current ones (with cheap gas available everywhere), that isn’t happening.
The Telsa Model S comes out next summer, and the base model will have a ~160 mile range, enough to cover your commute with a fair bit of miles to spare. They also plan on 230 and 300 mile range versions as well. Granted, they will cost $60k-$80k before tax incentives, but a comparable ICE car -like a BMW 5-series or a Lexus LS (in terms of size, power, cabin quality, and so on) will cost about that anyways. Another 5 years or so, and those sorts of batteries will be cheap enough to go into everyday cars.
I’m not optimistic that they’ll get it down that cheap, but I’m willing to be surprised.
It’s a shame we can’t use batteries like the ISS uses.
First off, jz - that’s at least what Tesla says they’ll sell it for. The 160 mile range vehicle for $49,000 after the tax credit, and $10K each for step ups of additional 70 miles range up to 300 miles range. ) 0-60 in 5.6 seconds.
Random - The base pack is 42kWh. For comparison the Leaf’s is 24kWh and the Volt is 16kWh. The target for pricing “these sorts of batteries” is to get them down to $250/kWh. At that target price point the Volts pack would be $4000, the Leaf’s $6000 and the Tesla’s base pack $10,500. The likely 80 to 90 kWh pack needed for the 300 mile range model? $20,000. Not quite for every day cars.
Getting a 300 mile range EV at a price point for everyday cars will require some disruptive battery technology - a cheap metal air battery or some new ultracap. Until then long distance traveling needs will an option other than an EV for most consumers. That might happen in 5 or so years - Chu thinks it will - but it won’t be batteries like these.
I know that’s what they’re targeting, but the car’s still a ways away from mass-production and I’m just hoping they’re not counting on cost projections that may not work in their favor. I’m not saying they can’t do it, after all their fixed costs are probably massively lower than a large full-line automaker. It’s just that looking at everything going into the Model S- aluminum monocoque, enough battery for 300 miles of range, etc.- It’s hard to grasp how they’ll make their targeted price point and still make money on the car.
If they do, I’ll obviously give them all the credit in the world.
The electric range on the Volt is 25-50 miles, (40-80 km). Then you can drive another 344 miles on gas if you need to take a trip.
He’s not worried about moving large amounts of people, he’s worried about moving himself from where he is to where he wants to be.