# Can I be the only person stunned at just how badly President Joe Biden is doing? **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [August 31, 2021, 7:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-i-be-the-only-person-stunned-at-just-how-badly-president-joe-biden-is-doing/949851 "2021-08-31T19:33:27Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 31
**Author:** ![Sam\_Stone](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ecccb3/32.png) [@Sam\_Stone](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sam_Stone)\ **Post date:** [December 22, 2021, 8:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-i-be-the-only-person-stunned-at-just-how-badly-president-joe-biden-is-doing/949851/615 "2021-12-22T20:21:20Z")
Well, that’s certainly a way of looking at it. He’s been so successful he’s clawed his approval rating all the way from 65% to…41%. He’s so successful that over 70% of the country thinks it is on the wrong track. Independents think he’s so successful they give him a whopping 29% approval rating. > **[Biden’s approval dips to new low as independents sour on his leadership](https://www.pbs.org/newshour/politics/bidens-approval-dips-to-new-low-as-independents-sour-on-his-leadership)** > > Just 41 percent of Americans approve of the job he has been doing as president, according to a new PBS NewsHour/NPR/Marist poll. To answer the OP… Biden is meeting my expectations. ---
**Author:** ![Kimstu](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/ecd19e/32.png) [@Kimstu](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kimstu)\ **Post date:** [December 22, 2021, 8:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-i-be-the-only-person-stunned-at-just-how-badly-president-joe-biden-is-doing/949851/616 "2021-12-22T20:42:59Z")
> [@Sam\_Stone](#): > > He’s been so successful he’s clawed his approval rating all the way from 65% to…41%. But we basically expected that, as you noted. There’s about a third of the country that is committed to irrationally hating “the libs” for various partisan conspiracy-theory reasons completely irrespective of reality, and they have a very large conservative propaganda machine industriously amplifying their message. Then there’s about a third of the country that reflexively attributes whatever’s bothering them to Presidential incompetence. Most of those people were cheered by the vaccine rollout and lifted COVID restrictions, return to more normal governance, etc., and that was reflected in Biden’s approval ratings. Now that they’ve got used to having some stuff they like and they’re having to put up with some other stuff they don’t like, their superficial content with Biden has turned to superficial discontent, encouraged by the conservative propaganda machine. After all, Obama’s approval rating went down to 41% in 2013, also mostly due to partisan resentment and propaganda. I don’t think in this current climate of cultivated ignorance and malignity you can necessarily interpret Presidential approval ratings as an indicator of successful achievement. ---
**Author:** ![Sam\_Stone](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ecccb3/32.png) [@Sam\_Stone](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sam_Stone)\ **Post date:** [December 22, 2021, 9:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-i-be-the-only-person-stunned-at-just-how-badly-president-joe-biden-is-doing/949851/617 "2021-12-22T21:08:37Z")
The biggest drop in his approval came after the Afghanistan pullout. And that, and the way it was handled, was all on him. He did it against the advice of his military leadership. He has never really recovered from that massive screw up. I don’t blame him for anything Covid-related, but he made his own bed by blaming Trump in the most vicious ways, then claiming that instead of locking down the country he was going to destroy the virus. He took that issue and made it about him, then failed to do what he claimed he’d be able to do. So if people are now blaming him for the pandemic, well, he teed it up for them. > **[Biden: Anyone Responsible For So Many Covid Deaths 'Should Not' Be President](https://www.barrons.com/news/biden-anyone-responsible-for-so-many-covid-deaths-should-not-be-president-01603416304)** > > Democratic White House hopeful Joe Biden said Thursday during his final debate with President Donald Trump that presiding over the nation as 220,000 Americans died from the coronavirus should disqualify Trump from reelection. > [@](#): > > Democratic White House hopeful Joe Biden said Thursday during his final debate with President Donald Trump that presiding over the nation as 220,000 Americans died from the coronavirus should disqualify Trump from reelection. > > “ **Anyone who’s responsible for that many deaths should not remain as president of the United States of America** ,” Biden said in the opening remarks of the showdown that comes just 12 days before the election. [bolding mine] Of course, that was before 600,000 more died under his watch. ---
**Author:** ![Procrustus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/procrustus/32/2994_2.png) [@Procrustus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Procrustus)\ **Post date:** [December 22, 2021, 9:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-i-be-the-only-person-stunned-at-just-how-badly-president-joe-biden-is-doing/949851/618 "2021-12-22T21:48:17Z")
> [@Sam\_Stone](#): > > I don’t blame him for anything Covid-related, but he made his own bed by blaming Trump in the most vicious ways, then claiming that instead of locking down the country he was going to destroy the virus. He took that issue and made it about him, then failed to do what he claimed he’d be able to do. So if people are now blaming him for the pandemic, well, he teed it up for them. There are reasons (easily identified) to blame Trump. What would you say Biden did wrong? ---
**Author:** ![Snowboarder\_Bo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/snowboarder_bo/32/229_2.png) [@Snowboarder\_Bo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Snowboarder_Bo)\ **Post date:** [December 22, 2021, 10:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-i-be-the-only-person-stunned-at-just-how-badly-president-joe-biden-is-doing/949851/619 "2021-12-22T22:14:04Z")
> [@Sam\_Stone](#): > > **I don’t blame him for anything Covid-related** , but he made his own bed by blaming Trump in the most vicious ways, then claiming that instead of locking down the country he was going to destroy the virus. He took that issue and made it about him, then failed to do what he claimed he’d be able to do. So if people are now blaming him for the pandemic, well, he teed it up for them. > > **Of course, that was before 600,000 more died under his watch.** (Helpful holding mine) You’re just full of shit. ---
**Author:** ![crowmanyclouds](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/crowmanyclouds/32/19884_2.png) [@crowmanyclouds](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/crowmanyclouds)\ **Post date:** [December 22, 2021, 10:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-i-be-the-only-person-stunned-at-just-how-badly-president-joe-biden-is-doing/949851/620 "2021-12-22T22:21:02Z")
And of course we won’t notice all the folks in his approval ratings that are, as we’ve seen in this very thread, pissed that Biden isn’t Santa Clause and didn’t give them the pony they wanted, will we Sam? ---
**Author:** ![running\_coach](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/running_coach/32/15836_2.png) [@running\_coach](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/running_coach)\ **Post date:** [December 22, 2021, 10:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-i-be-the-only-person-stunned-at-just-how-badly-president-joe-biden-is-doing/949851/621 "2021-12-22T22:31:05Z")
> [@Sam\_Stone](#): > > Of course, that was before 600,000 more died under his watch. - Is it possible to be any more of a disingenuous sack of shit? I’d swear you’d be happy for many more to die if it serves your political goals. ---
**Author:** ![Sam\_Stone](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ecccb3/32.png) [@Sam\_Stone](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sam_Stone)\ **Post date:** [December 22, 2021, 10:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-i-be-the-only-person-stunned-at-just-how-badly-president-joe-biden-is-doing/949851/622 "2021-12-22T22:39:27Z")
What the hell are you talking about? I’m not blaming Biden. I’m pointing out the unforced error of claiming that a President who presides over 220,000 deaths should resign. Now 600,000 more people are dead (again, NOT his fault), but if people are blaming him for it he need only look in the mirror for what he said about Trump for understanding. ---
**Author:** ![Procrustus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/procrustus/32/2994_2.png) [@Procrustus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Procrustus)\ **Post date:** [December 22, 2021, 10:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-i-be-the-only-person-stunned-at-just-how-badly-president-joe-biden-is-doing/949851/623 "2021-12-22T22:40:56Z")
> [@Sam\_Stone](#): > > I’m pointing out the unforced error of claiming that a President who presides over 220,000 deaths should resign. Now 600,000 more people are dead (again, NOT his fault), but if people are blaming him for it he need only look in the mirror for what he said about Trump for understanding. There is a difference between unnecessary deaths during Trump’s time (partially his fault) and those who died during Biden’s (not his fault). ---
**Author:** ![running\_coach](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/running_coach/32/15836_2.png) [@running\_coach](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/running_coach)\ **Post date:** [December 22, 2021, 10:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-i-be-the-only-person-stunned-at-just-how-badly-president-joe-biden-is-doing/949851/624 "2021-12-22T22:45:57Z")
> [@Sam\_Stone](#): > > What the hell are you talking about? **I’m not blaming Biden.** I’m pointing out the unforced error of claiming that a President who presides over 220,000 deaths should resign. Now 600,000 more people are dead (again, NOT his fault), but if people are blaming him for it he need only look in the mirror for what he said about Trump for understanding. BULL. SHIT. Trump and his handling and politicizing of the pandemic is directly responsible for those deaths. The continuing deaths are directly the fault of the atmosphere Trump created and the Republican Party is perpetuating. ---
**Author:** ![Thing.Fish](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/thing.fish/32/9168_2.png) [@Thing.Fish](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Thing.Fish)\ **Post date:** [December 22, 2021, 10:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-i-be-the-only-person-stunned-at-just-how-badly-president-joe-biden-is-doing/949851/625 "2021-12-22T22:46:30Z")
Besides which, the only things Biden could plausibly have done to reduce the number of deaths are things like strict vaccine mandates and enforced lockdowns. I’m going to guess Sam wouldn’t have approved if he’d done those things, either. ---
**Author:** ![Snowboarder\_Bo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/snowboarder_bo/32/229_2.png) [@Snowboarder\_Bo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Snowboarder_Bo)\ **Post date:** [December 22, 2021, 10:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-i-be-the-only-person-stunned-at-just-how-badly-president-joe-biden-is-doing/949851/626 "2021-12-22T22:47:51Z")
He doesn’t live here; those aren’t _political_ goals. He just likes fucking with things and he’d rather fuck with the neighbor than with his own. ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [December 22, 2021, 10:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-i-be-the-only-person-stunned-at-just-how-badly-president-joe-biden-is-doing/949851/627 "2021-12-22T22:49:16Z")
> [@Sam\_Stone](#): > > I don’t blame him for anything Covid-related, but he made his own bed by blaming Trump in the most vicious ways, then claiming that instead of locking down the country he was going to destroy the virus. He took that issue and made it about him, then failed to do what he claimed he’d be able to do. So if people are now blaming him for the pandemic, well, he teed it up for them. Yeah, if only Biden had the unquestioned power you would gladly give to Trump on a silver platter, right? ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [December 22, 2021, 10:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-i-be-the-only-person-stunned-at-just-how-badly-president-joe-biden-is-doing/949851/628 "2021-12-22T22:51:17Z")
> [@Sam\_Stone](#): > > What the hell are you talking about? I’m not blaming Biden. I’m pointing out the unforced error of claiming that a President who presides over 220,000 deaths should resign “Presiding over” and “directly causing” are two different things, weasel. ---
**Author:** ![Moriarty](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/moriarty/32/49_2.png) [@Moriarty](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Moriarty)\ **Post date:** [December 22, 2021, 10:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-i-be-the-only-person-stunned-at-just-how-badly-president-joe-biden-is-doing/949851/629 "2021-12-22T22:57:01Z")
It’s confusing that a politician can be accused of “buying votes” by pandering to voters’ wants but then a low approval rating is cited as proof he’s not doing a good job. What is it? Is he supposed to be responsive to the people or not? I always heard that one of the things that right wingers abhor is political correctness, but then it comes to pass that they measure a person‘s success by whether they are getting approval for the things they are doing. I thought it was better to do what’s right rather than what’s popular. > [@Sam\_Stone](#): > > The biggest drop in his approval came after the Afghanistan pullout. And that, and the way it was handled, was all on him. He did it against the advice of his military leadership. He has never really recovered from that massive screw up. I disagree that it was a screwup. To the contrary, it’s one of things I point to as an accomplishment. Biden knew that there would be political fallout based on the fact that there it would inevitably be messy (I have to think this is why Obama didn’t do it), but he did the right thing - end this perpetual waste of blood and treasure - even if it cost him in the polls. That’s statesmanship. ---
**Author:** ![Sam\_Stone](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ecccb3/32.png) [@Sam\_Stone](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sam_Stone)\ **Post date:** [December 22, 2021, 11:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-i-be-the-only-person-stunned-at-just-how-badly-president-joe-biden-is-doing/949851/630 "2021-12-22T23:08:08Z")
And the thousands of people, including Americans and green card holders who were left to the Taliban - was that good statesmanship too? Was abandoning Bagram airbase against the advice of his military commanders also good statesmanship? How about leaving behind billions of dollars in weaponry for the Taliban? Good statesmanship? The majority of people supported getting out of Afghanistan HOW it was done is disapproved of by an even larger majority. And that’s 100% on Biden. It didn’t have to be that way. > **[Biden's Approval Rating Hits A New Low After The Afghanistan Withdrawal](https://www.npr.org/2021/09/02/1033433959/biden-approval-rating-afghanistan-withdrawal)** > > President Biden's approval rating slid to just 43%, according to a new NPR/PBS NewsHour/Marist poll. The decline is principally due to independents, a key swing group. > [@](#): > > Amid the chaos of the U.S. withdrawal from Afghanistan, President Biden’s approval rating slid to just 43% in the latest [NPR/PBS NewsHour/Marist poll](https://maristpoll.marist.edu/polls/npr-pbs-newshour-marist-national-poll-afghanistan-september-2-2021). > > That is down 6 percentage points from [a survey conducted in July](https://maristpoll.marist.edu/wp-content/uploads/2021/08/Marist-Poll-USA-NOS-and-Tables_202108020951.pdf) and is the lowest mark for Biden in the poll since taking office. The decline is principally due to independents — just 36% of them approve of the job he’s doing, a 10-point drop. > > That a majority of independents now disapprove of his performance is bad news for Biden and Democrats. They’re a key swing group, one Biden won in 2020 but who now think he’s off track. You may think it was a great victory for Biden, but you’d be in a small minority. Biden took a ten point hit in his approval among independents after the withdrawal. And he’s never recovered them - he’s lost another 7 points among independents since then. ---
**Author:** ![crowmanyclouds](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/crowmanyclouds/32/19884_2.png) [@crowmanyclouds](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/crowmanyclouds)\ **Post date:** [December 22, 2021, 11:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-i-be-the-only-person-stunned-at-just-how-badly-president-joe-biden-is-doing/949851/631 "2021-12-22T23:24:35Z")
> [@Sam\_Stone](#): > > And the thousands of people, including Americans and green card holders who were left to the Taliban - was that good statesmanship too? Was abandoning Bagram airbase against the advice of his military commanders also good statesmanship? How about leaving behind billions of dollars in weaponry for the Taliban? Good statesmanship? {…} Ask Trump, it was his idea. ---
**Author:** ![Snowboarder\_Bo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/snowboarder_bo/32/229_2.png) [@Snowboarder\_Bo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Snowboarder_Bo)\ **Post date:** [December 22, 2021, 11:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-i-be-the-only-person-stunned-at-just-how-badly-president-joe-biden-is-doing/949851/632 "2021-12-22T23:25:54Z")
> [@Sam\_Stone](#): > > And the thousands of people, including Americans and green card holders who were left to the Taliban - was that good statesmanship too? Was abandoning Bagram airbase against the advice of his military commanders also good statesmanship? How about leaving behind billions of dollars in weaponry for the Taliban? Good statesmanship? Why stop at “thousands”? Surely it was millions, or even tens of millions, of people who were left behind to suffer under the Taliban, wasn’t it? Without planes or equipment, Bagram isn’t an Air Force base; it’s a strip of pavement. And billions of dollars of weapons were not left behind for the Taliban. You are full of shit. ---
**Author:** ![Moriarty](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/moriarty/32/49_2.png) [@Moriarty](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Moriarty)\ **Post date:** [December 22, 2021, 11:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-i-be-the-only-person-stunned-at-just-how-badly-president-joe-biden-is-doing/949851/633 "2021-12-22T23:39:41Z")
> [@Sam\_Stone](#): > > And the thousands of people, including Americans and green card holders who were left to the Taliban - was that good statesmanship too? Was abandoning Bagram airbase against the advice of his military commanders also good statesmanship? How about leaving behind billions of dollars in weaponry for the Taliban? Good statesmanship? Trump is to blame for slow walking visas out of Afghanistan, and set the timetable and conditions of withdrawal. I applaud Biden for following through on something Obama wouldn’t do and Trump didn’t want to take responsibility for (even as he recognized America’s involvement for the waste it was). There was no clean exit, a reflection of how ridiculous this Republican exercise in nation building has been from the beginning. As to Bagram: > [@](#): > > Marine Corps Gen. Kenneth McKenzie said, “the Bagram option [for use later in a large-scale evacuation of civilians] went away” without an order to send in up to 5,000 more American troops to back up the 650 left behind to defend the embassy in Kabul and retake the airbase. > > “I did not see any tactical utility” to holding Bagram, [he said before the House Armed Services Committee](https://armedservices.house.gov/hearings?ID=EFD55E56-DF6E-4F1A-983F-76192E43A01C). > “We did this in close coordination with our allies and partners. Every departure of every element was carefully synchronized across the coalition and with our Afghan partners. On no occasion were they caught unaware by our movements; every base was handed off to Afghan forces according to a mutually understood plan.”… > > Defense Secretary Lloyd Austin said remaining at Bagram “meant staying at war in Afghanistan.” He added, “there was no risk-free status quo option” of staying in the country after the announced withdrawal date. And as to the equipment, I’ll reiterate that it is non functional if not maintained, and the reference to “billions of dollars” is laughably immaterial considering that the U.S. spends about a trillion a year on military and security. Billions isn’t all that much. > **[CENTCOM: Keeping Bagram Airbase Was ‘Untenable’ Under White House Rules for...](https://news.usni.org/2021/09/29/centcom-keeping-bagram-airbase-was-untenable-under-white-house-rules-for-afghanistan-withdrawal)** > > The sprawling size of the U.S. airbase at Bagram and its isolation from Kabul meant that keeping it under American control was “untenable under the situation” once President Joe Biden ordered all U.S. forces out of Afghanistan, U.S. Central Command’s... ---
**Author:** ![Sam\_Stone](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ecccb3/32.png) [@Sam\_Stone](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sam_Stone)\ **Post date:** [December 22, 2021, 11:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-i-be-the-only-person-stunned-at-just-how-badly-president-joe-biden-is-doing/949851/634 "2021-12-22T23:48:28Z")
[https://www.reuters.com/business/aerospace-defense/planes-guns-night-vision-goggles-talibans-new-us-made-war-chest-2021-08-19/](https://www.reuters.com/business/aerospace-defense/planes-guns-night-vision-goggles-talibans-new-us-made-war-chest-2021-08-19/) > [@](#): > > Another official said that while there are no definitive numbers yet, the current intelligence assessment was that the Taliban are believed to control more than 2,000 armored vehicles, including U.S. Humvees, and up to 40 aircraft potentially including UH-60 Black Hawks, scout attack helicopters, and ScanEagle military drones. Also 70 MRAPS, worth a million each. $10 million each missile systems. A bunch of $30 million blackhawks, some disabled. The initial number of $85 billion was bullshit, but real estimates range up to $10 billion. From Snopes: > **[Did US Leave More Than $80B Worth of Equipment to the Taliban?](https://www.snopes.com/fact-check/us-taliban-arsenal-military-equipment/)** > > The "Taliban's New Arsenal" does not include 22,000 Humvees or 33 Black Hawk helicopters. > [@](#): > > An exact accounting of the military equipment currently in the Taliban’s hands is not available, though one expert estimated that the total value was closer to $10 billion. Before you tee off on someone, you should make sure you know what you are talking about. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-i-be-the-only-person-stunned-at-just-how-badly-president-joe-biden-is-doing/949851.md?page=30) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-i-be-the-only-person-stunned-at-just-how-badly-president-joe-biden-is-doing/949851.md?page=32)