# Can I buy a new PC with no hard drive? Where? **URL:** \ **Category:** In My Humble Opinion\ **Created:** [November 5, 2014, 6:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-i-buy-a-new-pc-with-no-hard-drive-where/703783 "2014-11-05T18:06:16Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![TimeWinder](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/bcef8e/32.png) [@TimeWinder](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TimeWinder)\ **Post date:** [November 5, 2014, 11:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-i-buy-a-new-pc-with-no-hard-drive-where/703783/21 "2014-11-05T23:28:42Z")
> [@JKilez](#): > > The proper way to do it is to use [Microsoft sysprep](http://www.sevenforums.com/tutorials/135077-windows-7-installation-transfer-new-computer.html) for the changeover. Yeah, I always forget about that tool. Beware the caveats, though: it doesn’t work if the system has ever been upgraded from a previous OS, for example. ---
**Author:** ![BigT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bigt/32/12044_2.png) [@BigT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BigT)\ **Post date:** [November 6, 2014, 8:28am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-i-buy-a-new-pc-with-no-hard-drive-where/703783/22 "2014-11-06T08:28:20Z")
With Adobe’s CS2, the hassle is going to their website and downloading the version that doesn’t need activation, and putting in the key once. It’s really not that big a deal. Now, keeping Windows 7, that’s a bigger deal. But a reinstall will probably do you some good. I had planned on sysprepping, too, when I upgraded, but just having a clean OS again was worth it. I did just directly move Firefox over, and I’m paying for it. But I still can’t be assed to do a proper reset/reinstall. ---
**Author:** ![Duke\_of\_York](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/f6c823/32.png) [@Duke\_of\_York](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Duke_of_York)\ **Post date:** [November 6, 2014, 11:31am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-i-buy-a-new-pc-with-no-hard-drive-where/703783/23 "2014-11-06T11:31:49Z")
NM ---
**Author:** ![BaldDudePeekskill](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/b5e925/32.png) [@BaldDudePeekskill](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BaldDudePeekskill)\ **Post date:** [November 6, 2014, 12:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-i-buy-a-new-pc-with-no-hard-drive-where/703783/24 "2014-11-06T12:19:58Z")
I bought a hard drive enclosure that connects to my new PC with a USB cable. I did that to avoid reinstalling I tunes and the gazillion songs I downloaded over the last ten years since I had an I pod ---
**Author:** ![Dewey\_Finn](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dewey_finn/32/4222_2.png) [@Dewey\_Finn](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dewey_Finn)\ **Post date:** [November 6, 2014, 12:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-i-buy-a-new-pc-with-no-hard-drive-where/703783/25 "2014-11-06T12:43:34Z")
> [@BigT](#): > > I did just directly move Firefox over, and I’m paying for it. But I still can’t be assed to do a proper reset/reinstall. For Firefox, the MozBackup utility makes it easy to back up and restore your profile. (Of course you still need to download the program, but that’s easy.) ---
**Author:** ![bump](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/7c8e57/32.png) [@bump](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bump)\ **Post date:** [November 6, 2014, 2:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-i-buy-a-new-pc-with-no-hard-drive-where/703783/26 "2014-11-06T14:51:10Z")
> [@Zebra](#): > > SSD? Solid State Drive? Yep. They’re very fast for reads and writes, but apparently have a limited number of cycles that a given memory cell can be written to, so they don’t last like a regular HDD does. I realized there’s a caveat for the page file not being on the SSD; that’s probably true if you have a lot of RAM like most machines come with these days. The page file won’t get used too much, and takes up valuable SSD real estate without giving you much of a performance boost, and will add some unnecessary writes to your SSD with no point. However, if you’re short on RAM and your page file sees a lot of use, the performance tradeoff may well be worth the extra writes it puts on your SSD. ---
**Author:** ![TimeWinder](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/bcef8e/32.png) [@TimeWinder](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TimeWinder)\ **Post date:** [November 6, 2014, 2:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-i-buy-a-new-pc-with-no-hard-drive-where/703783/27 "2014-11-06T14:58:56Z")
> [@bump](#): > > Yep. They’re very fast for reads and writes, but apparently have a limited number of cycles that a given memory cell can be written to, so they don’t last like a regular HDD does. > > I realized there’s a caveat for the page file not being on the SSD; that’s probably true if you have a lot of RAM like most machines come with these days. The page file won’t get used too much, and takes up valuable SSD real estate without giving you much of a performance boost, and will add some unnecessary writes to your SSD with no point. > > However, if you’re short on RAM and your page file sees a lot of use, the performance tradeoff may well be worth the extra writes it puts on your SSD. Note that this advice is fairly dated. Modern SSD’s have write cycle numbers so high that you can write data to them continuously for years. A couple of years ago, yeah, it might have been worth it to off-load high-write loads (and pay the corresponding speed cost), but these days, just slap the SSD in there and treat it like a magnetic drive. Paging is exactly the kind of situation where high-speed transfers pay off in user-perceptible speed gains. ---
**Author:** ![Zebra](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/c0e974/32.png) [@Zebra](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Zebra)\ **Post date:** [November 6, 2014, 6:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-i-buy-a-new-pc-with-no-hard-drive-where/703783/28 "2014-11-06T18:47:18Z")
You know I’m not trying to find the building blocks of the Higgs-Bossen. I just want to play some good games on Steam with all the graphics turned up to full. You guys sound like Geordie and Data talking about stuff just before Picard, who clearly didn’t understand of word of it, says “Make it so.” ---
**Author:** ![Dewey\_Finn](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dewey_finn/32/4222_2.png) [@Dewey\_Finn](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dewey_Finn)\ **Post date:** [November 6, 2014, 7:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-i-buy-a-new-pc-with-no-hard-drive-where/703783/29 "2014-11-06T19:08:40Z")
If you want to be simple, buy a new computer with Windows 7 already installed. You’re the one who proposed moving the hard drive to a new computer. ---
**Author:** ![bump](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/7c8e57/32.png) [@bump](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bump)\ **Post date:** [November 6, 2014, 7:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-i-buy-a-new-pc-with-no-hard-drive-where/703783/30 "2014-11-06T19:17:35Z")
> [@TimeWinder](#): > > Note that this advice is fairly dated. Modern SSD’s have write cycle numbers so high that you can write data to them continuously for years. A couple of years ago, yeah, it might have been worth it to off-load high-write loads (and pay the corresponding speed cost), but these days, just slap the SSD in there and treat it like a magnetic drive. Paging is exactly the kind of situation where high-speed transfers pay off in user-perceptible speed gains. I haven’t really looked at SSDs since early 2013, so you’re about right in the timing. What I was trying to say is that if you have enough RAM, your page file won’t see much action anyway, so you may as well move it to another disk and use that SSD space for something more useful, since SSDs are both smaller and more expensive than regular hard drives. But if your page file gets used a lot, it can be worth having on the SSD. ---
**Author:** ![ftg](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ftg/32/2801_2.png) [@ftg](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ftg)\ **Post date:** [November 6, 2014, 10:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-i-buy-a-new-pc-with-no-hard-drive-where/703783/31 "2014-11-06T22:25:05Z")
**Quartz** gave the magic term: Barebones PC. Lots of tech stores sell them. E.g., MicroCenter, various [Amazon](http://www.amazon.com/s/ref=sr_nr_n_1?rh=n%3A3015426011%2Ck%3Abarebones+pc&keywords=barebones+pc&ie=UTF8&qid=1415312552&rnid=2941120011) and its affiliates, etc. You don’t have to go to one of the storefront places. Installing your HD into a new barebones PC is quite doable if you have the knowledge. But with each generation of MS-Windows, that knowledge becomes more arcane. If you don’t know the term “barebones”, this isn’t probably for you. (E.g., do you know how to build a Windows PE disc and what to do with it?) ---
**Author:** ![GusNSpot](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gusnspot/32/436_2.png) [@GusNSpot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GusNSpot)\ **Post date:** [November 6, 2014, 11:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-i-buy-a-new-pc-with-no-hard-drive-where/703783/32 "2014-11-06T23:57:58Z")
It all goes back to the most common mistake first time buyers of a computer make. They believe it when the ‘know nothings’ tell them that this hard drive & RAM combo is all they will ever need. #2) A second or a better set of hard drives ( what… you only got one? :::: sheesh :::: ) is worth 10 X the cost of a pretty tower. If you do not clone your drives on a scheduled, you deserve the resultant problems. Kind of like building a house, going for max square footage and skimping on framing & insulation… Get an old IDE 5400 RPM HD and clone your “C” drive. You can then put it on any new hard drive you want or get everything off when going to a better or newer OS. May have to download a few drivers for older apps but you are not at risk for getting totally boned with an oops. ---
**Author:** ![Melbourne](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/b5e925/32.png) [@Melbourne](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Melbourne)\ **Post date:** [November 7, 2014, 7:53am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-i-buy-a-new-pc-with-no-hard-drive-where/703783/33 "2014-11-07T07:53:30Z")
> [@bump](#): > > Just make sure you put your page file on another drive; that constant read/write action will mess up your SSD faster than anything else. A Windows page file is possibly the **best possible use** you can make of your SSD – assuming that you actually use your page file. Which isn’t very common, but may actually be true if you are using Photoshop. Windows is designed to NOT do constant read/write actions with the pagefile. And the blazing fast large-block-read and small-random-write speed of SSDs make them an almost perfect match for the windows pagefile system. ---
**Author:** ![bump](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/7c8e57/32.png) [@bump](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bump)\ **Post date:** [November 7, 2014, 5:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-i-buy-a-new-pc-with-no-hard-drive-where/703783/34 "2014-11-07T17:21:43Z")
> [@Melbourne](#): > > A Windows page file is possibly the **best possible use** you can make of your SSD – assuming that you actually use your page file. Which isn’t very common, but may actually be true if you are using Photoshop. > > Windows is designed to NOT do constant read/write actions with the pagefile. And the blazing fast large-block-read and small-random-write speed of SSDs make them an almost perfect match for the windows pagefile system. Well, sure- ideally you don’t need a page file very often because you have enough RAM and don’t have to resort to virtual memory. In which case, there’s no real upside to keeping it on the SSD, and no real downside to moving it to cheaper storage. If you do use it often, then yeah, the SSD is the place to put it- it makes virtual memory act a lot more like regular memory because the access speeds, etc… are a lot closer to those of RAM than your regular hard drive’s are. ---
**Author:** ![Zebra](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/c0e974/32.png) [@Zebra](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Zebra)\ **Post date:** [November 7, 2014, 6:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-i-buy-a-new-pc-with-no-hard-drive-where/703783/35 "2014-11-07T18:06:06Z")
Well I found out that the Photoshop subscription fee is only 9.99 a month. (it used to be a lot more) So I’m not so worried about carrying over PS. (which has been a major hassle) I will keep my old HDs moving important docs to the my external hd and then add my current prime HD as a backup the one that will come with the new pc. I’m looking at Dell. The last PC I bought was an XPS series and I was really happy with that. About 750 for one with windows 7.1 and a year of Office. On the down side it comes with a year of MacAfee preinstalled. I’m going to ask if that can be avoided. ---
**Author:** ![Quartz](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/quartz/32/267_2.png) [@Quartz](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Quartz)\ **Post date:** [November 7, 2014, 7:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-i-buy-a-new-pc-with-no-hard-drive-where/703783/36 "2014-11-07T19:34:44Z")
If at all possible don’t go for Office 365 - it’s more expensive in the long term. ---
**Author:** ![Zebra](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/c0e974/32.png) [@Zebra](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Zebra)\ **Post date:** [November 7, 2014, 7:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-i-buy-a-new-pc-with-no-hard-drive-where/703783/37 "2014-11-07T19:38:39Z")
> [@Quartz](#): > > If at all possible don’t go for Office 365 - it’s more expensive in the long term. What would be a better option? ---
**Author:** ![ftg](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ftg/32/2801_2.png) [@ftg](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ftg)\ **Post date:** [November 7, 2014, 9:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-i-buy-a-new-pc-with-no-hard-drive-where/703783/38 "2014-11-07T21:30:42Z")
> [@Zebra](#): > > What would be a better option? [LibreOffice](http://www.libreoffice.org/). ---
**Author:** ![TimeWinder](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/bcef8e/32.png) [@TimeWinder](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TimeWinder)\ **Post date:** [November 13, 2014, 6:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-i-buy-a-new-pc-with-no-hard-drive-where/703783/39 "2014-11-13T18:31:55Z")
Bumping this slightly old thread because I found a link that speaks to “swap file on the SSD” issue we were discussing here. For over a year, the folks at techreport have been beating the living daylights out of some consumer SSD’s: they’ve got them on what amounts to _continuous_ uncompressible write cycles 24/7/365 minus some shutdowns for data gathering. They’ve done a series of reports as they failed, the latest of which is here: [http://techreport.com/review/27062/the-ssd-endurance-experiment-only-two-remain-after-1-5pb](http://techreport.com/review/27062/the-ssd-endurance-experiment-only-two-remain-after-1-5pb) The gist of the experiments is what’s implied above: modern SSD’s, even consumer ones, have a write cycle count so high in practice that you’ll never hit it during a reasonable lifetime for the drives. Use 'em for anything you want, just don’t ignore SMART failure indications on them, because when they _do_ finally go, they can do it suddenly. There’s a lot more information in the four or five reports to date about specific brands, but since their sample size was so small, I wouldn’t read much into it. ---
**Author:** ![Quartz](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/quartz/32/267_2.png) [@Quartz](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Quartz)\ **Post date:** [November 13, 2014, 7:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-i-buy-a-new-pc-with-no-hard-drive-where/703783/40 "2014-11-13T19:56:44Z")
> [@Zebra](#): > > What would be a better option? Just buy it outright. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-i-buy-a-new-pc-with-no-hard-drive-where/703783.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-i-buy-a-new-pc-with-no-hard-drive-where/703783.md?page=3)