# Can I lease an office space and live there? **URL:** \ **Category:** Factual Questions\ **Created:** [February 24, 2011, 9:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-i-lease-an-office-space-and-live-there/572505 "2011-02-24T21:32:35Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![grude](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/e47774/32.png) [@grude](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/grude)\ **Post date:** [April 2, 2012, 8:04am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-i-lease-an-office-space-and-live-there/572505/21 "2012-04-02T08:04:21Z")
Its not a shower in an officer per say BUT… Two one story industrial buildings I’ve worked at did have a shower inside the building in the toilets. Also two industrial buildings my father worked in also had a shower, it may have been intended as a emergency chemical shower but the employess used it all the same. And a high rise office suite building I’ve been in(that housed the regional offices of Social Security at the time) had a shower in the men’s room at least(dunno about the women’s 😉 ) So its not that rare. ---
**Author:** ![Annie-Xmas](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/ecc23a/32.png) [@Annie-Xmas](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Annie-Xmas)\ **Post date:** [April 2, 2012, 1:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-i-lease-an-office-space-and-live-there/572505/22 "2012-04-02T13:34:51Z")
If the City’s Code Enforcement Office does catch up with you, expect a buttload of fines. ---
**Author:** ![Pixel\_Dent](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/bc8723/32.png) [@Pixel\_Dent](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Pixel_Dent)\ **Post date:** [April 2, 2012, 2:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-i-lease-an-office-space-and-live-there/572505/23 "2012-04-02T14:57:46Z")
> [@gazpacho](#): > > In twenty years of working for 4 different companies in about 15 different buildings I have never been in an office building that did not have showers in at least one men’s room. In a couple areas I’ve lived the local building code actually said that all office buildings of more than mumble mumble had to have a shower. The law was passed specifically to encourage commuting via bike. A quick google shows NY City has similar laws which give the building owners some sort of credit if they have showers for bikers. ---
**Author:** ![The\_Other\_Waldo\_Pepper](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/the_other_waldo_pepper/32/12370_2.png) [@The\_Other\_Waldo\_Pepper](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Other_Waldo_Pepper)\ **Post date:** [April 2, 2012, 4:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-i-lease-an-office-space-and-live-there/572505/24 "2012-04-02T16:02:57Z")
> [@Rumor\_Watkins](#): > > To that end, if you are not actually using the office as an office, and don’t invite anyone onto your premises, Yeah, but what if you _ **do** _ invite folks onto your premises while using the office as an office? Say you hang out your shingle as an attorney – or, if you don’t have a license to practice law, as a wedding planner, or a language tutor, or a website designer, or something, anything. Sure, as it happens you don’t get a lot of walk-in business – but your front office is ready just in case anyone ever shows up looking to pay for your services as a travel agent or a yoga instructor or a private eye or whatever. You also happen to have a back room with a shower (and a little fridge, and a PC with an internet connection, and half-a-dozen other nifty little things), but that’s not illegal, right? ---
**Author:** ![TruCelt](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/trucelt/32/523_2.png) [@TruCelt](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TruCelt)\ **Post date:** [April 2, 2012, 4:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-i-lease-an-office-space-and-live-there/572505/25 "2012-04-02T16:05:34Z")
This is the first building I’ve worked in that doesn’t have shower facilities. (20+ years in work force - probably 8-9 buildings?) Only once did I have a privte bathroom with shower, but there’s usually some sort of gym and a shower in the basement. even my daughter’s school has that for the teachers. That said, I’m sure if I’d ever tried it I’d have been snagged by the parking attendants. They get very interested anytime a car stays overnight. Mixed-use areas do exist though. A dream of mine has always been to own a bookstore/cafe and live over top of it. :: sigh :: ---
**Author:** ![TriPolar](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/tripolar/32/3008_2.png) [@TriPolar](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TriPolar)\ **Post date:** [April 2, 2012, 4:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-i-lease-an-office-space-and-live-there/572505/26 "2012-04-02T16:17:59Z")
I know someone who did this. The problem was that he couldn’t overtly say the office was his residence. He claimed he lived at his brother’s house, and that was his official residence. The landlord didn’t care as long as he had some other place that was his official residence. He put a free standing shower in the bathroom, put in a little kitchenette out in the big common area, and slept on the couch in his office. But he rarely cooked anything there, and washed his clothes at the coin-op. He did it for about 2 years, then moved in with his GF. His employees thought he was an oddball at first, but he was successful and they all did well in the end. I think it would be a good idea for a young, single entrepreneur during a start up operation. ---
**Author:** ![Corcaigh](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/eb8c5e/32.png) [@Corcaigh](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Corcaigh)\ **Post date:** [April 2, 2012, 4:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-i-lease-an-office-space-and-live-there/572505/27 "2012-04-02T16:33:51Z")
> [@phreesh](#): > > Sounds like a summer movie. > > When DC’s girlfriend kicks him out of the apartment, he’s gotta find somewhere to stay - fast. Using his office as an apartment seemed like a great idea at first, but can he keep it a secret from his boss until the big promotion is decided?! > > I’d watch. **is standing outside the cinema checking the start times** Not quite the same thing as the OP, but I knew a guy who rented a flat in town, and opened a shop elsewhere in the town. The shop had an upstairs that wasn’t being used for anything, so he thought he’d do himself a favour, and pay the rent for the shop, and live in the space above it. The shop landlord quickly found out what he was doing, and although they didn’t have a leg to stand on, as there was nothing in the lease forbidding him doing this, they waited till he’d gone out one day, came in, and dumped a load of furniture and other household stuff upstairs so that he couldn’t use the space to live in. ---
**Author:** ![indigo1955](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/e56c9b/32.png) [@indigo1955](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/indigo1955)\ **Post date:** [April 6, 2013, 4:52am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-i-lease-an-office-space-and-live-there/572505/28 "2013-04-06T04:52:33Z")
It is a great solution when in a jam. ---
**Author:** ![Tim\_T-Bonham.net](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/46a35a/32.png) [@Tim\_T-Bonham.net](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tim_T-Bonham.net)\ **Post date:** [April 8, 2013, 3:37am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-i-lease-an-office-space-and-live-there/572505/29 "2013-04-08T03:37:16Z")
> [@Corcaigh](#): > > Not quite the same thing as the OP, but I knew a guy who rented a flat in town, and opened a shop elsewhere in the town. The shop had an upstairs that wasn’t being used for anything, so he thought he’d do himself a favour, and pay the rent for the shop, and live in the space above it. > > The shop landlord quickly found out what he was doing, and although they didn’t have a leg to stand on, as there was nothing in the lease forbidding him doing this, they waited till he’d gone out one day, came in, and dumped a load of furniture and other household stuff upstairs so that he couldn’t use the space to live in. Sounds like a way to foolishly chase away a good paying tenant. Wonder how long that landlord stayed in business? ---
**Author:** ![Peremensoe](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/ce7236/32.png) [@Peremensoe](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Peremensoe)\ **Post date:** [April 9, 2013, 9:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-i-lease-an-office-space-and-live-there/572505/30 "2013-04-09T21:06:54Z")
> [@Corcaigh](#): > > **is standing outside the cinema checking the start times** > Not quite the same thing as the OP, but I knew a guy who rented a flat in town, and opened a shop elsewhere in the town. The shop had an upstairs that wasn’t being used for anything, so he thought he’d do himself a favour, and pay the rent for the shop, and live in the space above it. > > The shop landlord quickly found out what he was doing, and although they didn’t have a leg to stand on, as there was nothing in the lease forbidding him doing this, they waited till he’d gone out one day, came in, and dumped a load of furniture and other household stuff upstairs so that he couldn’t use the space to live in. Was the upstairs space defined in the lease as part of the rented space or not? If so, how could the owners put things into it? If not, how did they not have a basis for a violation? ---
**Author:** ![Dewey\_Finn](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dewey_finn/32/4222_2.png) [@Dewey\_Finn](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dewey_Finn)\ **Post date:** [April 9, 2013, 9:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-i-lease-an-office-space-and-live-there/572505/31 "2013-04-09T21:14:01Z")
**Corcaigh** hasn’t posted since before Christmas, so I doubt you’ll get an answer. ---
**Author:** ![DocHaley](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/eada6e/32.png) [@DocHaley](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DocHaley)\ **Post date:** [August 23, 2016, 2:29am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-i-lease-an-office-space-and-live-there/572505/32 "2016-08-23T02:29:07Z")
> [@DCnDC](#): > > I’ve long wondered the opposite of [this question](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=598326) (can I use or rent my condo as an office?). Rather than hijack that thread: > > Rent on houses and apartments around here is ridiculous. However there’s plenty of office space to be had for well less than half the price of any decent residential place. Could I lease some of this cheap office space and just live there? Because really, if I leased a whole floor of a building, how would anyone ever know? > > I would imagine of course the legality of this is going to vary by the local zoning laws, if legal at all. Is it legal anywhere? Even if it isn’t legal, what’s the worst that could happen to me if I got caught? If your office space is part of your business you can claim there are documents/valuables that need protecting and hire yourself as the night watchman. Happens all over the place. What I’d suggest though is getting a small 19 foot motorhome and put your company name on it across the back and use it as much as possible. You can claim it is a mobile office. So yes you can, you just have to think it out and have the correct responses when needed. The amount you save on taxes, utilities, insurance on a home, etc will easily offset a small motorhome even a class B style that can be driven around like a custom van. CYa ---
**Author:** ![drachillix](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/48db29/32.png) [@drachillix](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/drachillix)\ **Post date:** [August 23, 2016, 2:56am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-i-lease-an-office-space-and-live-there/572505/33 "2016-08-23T02:56:40Z")
> [@TriPolar](#): > > I know someone who did this. The problem was that he couldn’t overtly say the office was his residence. He claimed he lived at his brother’s house, and that was his official residence. The landlord didn’t care as long as he had some other place that was his official residence. He put a free standing shower in the bathroom, put in a little kitchenette out in the big common area, and slept on the couch in his office. But he rarely cooked anything there, and washed his clothes at the coin-op. He did it for about 2 years, then moved in with his GF. His employees thought he was an oddball at first, but he was successful and they all did well in the end. I think it would be a good idea for a young, single entrepreneur during a start up operation. We have a bunch of development in downtown Fresno that is specifically built with a ground floor office/shop space and an upstairs apartment. For IRS purposes it makes a pretty clear line which space is which and your commute is measured in feet. In some ways I would love such an arrangement. ---
**Author:** ![Quercus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/q/7ab992/32.png) [@Quercus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Quercus)\ **Post date:** [August 23, 2016, 1:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-i-lease-an-office-space-and-live-there/572505/34 "2016-08-23T13:48:50Z")
> [@DocHaley](#): > > If your office space is part of your business you can claim there are documents/valuables that need protecting and hire yourself as the night watchman. > Happens all over the place. > CYa Well, you can claim whatever you want, but if things ended up in court, I know how I’d bet on the Judge ruling. ---
**Author:** ![drachillix](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/48db29/32.png) [@drachillix](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/drachillix)\ **Post date:** [August 23, 2016, 8:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-i-lease-an-office-space-and-live-there/572505/35 "2016-08-23T20:25:27Z")
> [@DocHaley](#): > > If your office space is part of your business you can claim there are documents/valuables that need protecting and hire yourself as the night watchman. For a sole prop, this would be irrelevant as the money you paid the “night watchmen” was your money anyways unless you tried to claim the night watchman is another person for schedule C purposes which will not fly under more than a cursory review by the IRS. I know of people who have invented half a dozen small businesses out of thin air trying to create deductions for services that are actually cash in pocket. Some get away with it for a while, invariably it implodes. For a corporation its still money being paid to you. it would make no fiscal difference if you cut 5 checks for $1,000 a month or 1 for $5,000 it is all income paid to an employee which is you resulting in the same end game tax situation. ---
**Author:** ![Dewey\_Finn](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dewey_finn/32/4222_2.png) [@Dewey\_Finn](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dewey_Finn)\ **Post date:** [August 23, 2016, 8:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-i-lease-an-office-space-and-live-there/572505/36 "2016-08-23T20:31:48Z")
> [@DocHaley](#): > > If your office space is part of your business you can claim there are documents/valuables that need protecting and hire yourself as the night watchman. So your scam involves claiming your business needs a night watchman. How do you explain needing a bed? Because a night watchman isn’t expected to sleep on the job. ---
**Author:** ![drachillix](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/48db29/32.png) [@drachillix](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/drachillix)\ **Post date:** [August 23, 2016, 8:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-i-lease-an-office-space-and-live-there/572505/37 "2016-08-23T20:33:43Z")
> [@Dewey\_Finn](#): > > So your scam involves claiming your business needs a night watchman. How do you explain needing a bed? Because a night watchman isn’t expected to sleep on the job. As long as he is not trying to deduct the cost of a bed in his home office the IRS probably will not care much about that detail. ---
**Author:** ![Clothahump](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/51bf81/32.png) [@Clothahump](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Clothahump)\ **Post date:** [June 6, 2017, 2:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-i-lease-an-office-space-and-live-there/572505/40 "2017-06-06T14:47:44Z")
Our lease for the Taekwondo school says we can’t live in it. But the reality is that we probably could live in it and the landlord would never know. Use the gym down the street to shower, use the coin-op laundry around the corner. ---
**Author:** ![Melbourne](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/b5e925/32.png) [@Melbourne](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Melbourne)\ **Post date:** [June 7, 2017, 6:29am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-i-lease-an-office-space-and-live-there/572505/41 "2017-06-07T06:29:04Z")
> [@DCnDC](#): > > Rent on houses and apartments around here is ridiculous. However there’s plenty of office space to be had for well less than half the price of any decent residential place. But the lease conditions are going to be different. I don’t know what the standard lease conditions are for you, but around here: A commercial lease does not include outgoings (mostly taxes). A residential lease does. A commercial lease can be broken on short notice. A residential lease they can’t just evict you without reason. Also, the fire safety regulations are different for residential properties. That means many commercial premises are not “fit for habitation”, which means that they can’t recover unpaid rent if they “permit” you to live there. ---
**Author:** ![coremelt](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/4491bb/32.png) [@coremelt](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/coremelt)\ **Post date:** [June 7, 2017, 12:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-i-lease-an-office-space-and-live-there/572505/42 "2017-06-07T12:34:21Z")
> [@Dewey\_Finn](#): > > So your scam involves claiming your business needs a night watchman. How do you explain needing a bed? Because a night watchman isn’t expected to sleep on the job. In Australia if you have a development of warehouse / office spaces which is normally non residential it is legal to designate one warehouse / space in the lot as being for a caretaker to live in. In some cases people have cheaply and legally built themselves very very nice and large homes inside warehouses through this provision. They still need to meet fire standards etc The caretaker position doesn’t need to be paid and theres not really any requirements for what counts as a caretaker. On the other hand many areas are designated dual usage. I’m currently living in a town house which is dual use and which is both office space and my home, however the pricing for it was the same as normal residential space really so it’s not a bargain. In this case the lease is in my company name and I pay my company a portion to rent my living space off my company (sub letting). All with the approval of the owner, wouldn’t be worth the risk otherwise. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-i-lease-an-office-space-and-live-there/572505.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-i-lease-an-office-space-and-live-there/572505.md?page=3)