# Can judges really order a defendant to be bound & gagged? **URL:** \ **Category:** Factual Questions\ **Created:** [November 12, 2011, 3:20am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-judges-really-order-a-defendant-to-be-bound-gagged/602666 "2011-11-12T03:20:36Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 7\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![alphaboi867](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/alphaboi867/32/3898_2.png) [@alphaboi867](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/alphaboi867)\ **Post date:** [November 12, 2011, 3:20am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-judges-really-order-a-defendant-to-be-bound-gagged/602666/1 "2011-11-12T03:20:36Z")
Can they? I know judges can order a defendant be shackled if he’s proven himself a security threat; even if a jury’s present. I also understand that in most courts it’s SOP for a defendant who repeadedly insists on disrupting court proceedings to simply removed from the courtroom and made to watch the proceedings on CCTV. But can a judge decide to keep him in the courtroom and have the security officers gag him? If so what would they gag him with? I know police & prison/jail guards have masks they can put on inmates to stop them from biting or spitting at staff; do they also have gags to keep them from speaking? Info for American courts would be most appreceated, but I also wonder about other 1st world countries? ---
**Author:** ![Koxinga](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/4af34b/32.png) [@Koxinga](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Koxinga)\ **Post date:** [November 12, 2011, 3:25am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-judges-really-order-a-defendant-to-be-bound-gagged/602666/2 "2011-11-12T03:25:05Z")
I think they generally send the defendant to another room to watch proceedings from another room, don’t they? If a court was going to gag anybody, [this fellow](http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Y9we2JSwa64) cussing the judge during a hearing accusing him of hawking his HIV+ saliva on a prison guard would qualify, I imagine. But they just take him out of the courtroom. ---
**Author:** ![RealityChuck](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/realitychuck/32/195_2.png) [@RealityChuck](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RealityChuck)\ **Post date:** [November 12, 2011, 3:27am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-judges-really-order-a-defendant-to-be-bound-gagged/602666/3 "2011-11-12T03:27:36Z")
Bobby Seale was ordered bound and gagged during the [Chicago Eight](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chicago_Seven#Trial)trial in 1969 (see second paragraph of the section). This was a drawing of [how he looked](http://www.richsamuels.com/nbcmm/chicago_conspiracy_trial/images/bobby_seale_bound.jpg) (no cameras in the courtrooms back then). ---
**Author:** ![Disgruntled\_Penguin](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/a8b319/32.png) [@Disgruntled\_Penguin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Disgruntled_Penguin)\ **Post date:** [November 12, 2011, 3:28am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-judges-really-order-a-defendant-to-be-bound-gagged/602666/4 "2011-11-12T03:28:51Z")
> [@alphaboi867](#): > > Can they? I know judges can order a defendant be shackled if he’s proven himself a security threat; even if a jury’s present. I also understand that in most courts it’s SOP for a defendant who repeadedly insists on disrupting court proceedings to simply removed from the courtroom and made to watch the proceedings on CCTV. But can a judge decide to keep him in the courtroom and have the security officers gag him? If so what would they gag him with? I know police & prison/jail guards have masks they can put on inmates to stop them from biting or spitting at staff; do they also have gags to keep them from speaking? Info for American courts would be most appreceated, but I also wonder about other 1st world countries? The judge in the Chicago Seven trial had Bobby Seale bound and gagged. > **[Bobby Seale](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bobby_Seale)** > > Robert George Seale (born October 22, 1936) is an African American revolutionary, political activist and author. Seale is widely known for co-founding the Marxist–Leninist and black power political organization the Black Panther Party (BPP) with fellow activist Huey P. Newton. Founded as the "Black Panther Party for Self-Defense", the Party's main practice was monitoring police activities and challenging police brutality in black communities, first in Oakland, California, and later in ci Seale ... ---
**Author:** ![MPB\_in\_Salt\_Lake](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/c0e974/32.png) [@MPB\_in\_Salt\_Lake](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MPB_in_Salt_Lake)\ **Post date:** [November 12, 2011, 3:29am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-judges-really-order-a-defendant-to-be-bound-gagged/602666/5 "2011-11-12T03:29:40Z")
The asshole who kidnapped Elizabeth Smart (Brian David Mitchell) insisted on singing/shouting Mormon hymns during his trial (he was clearly setting himself up for a “Not Guilty By Reason Of Insanity” acquittal years before the trial actually began) and he was gagged on several occasions, albeit with a little hood-like thing that they made him wear over his entire head. After a while, the judge apparently got sick of the “Crazy Religious Zealot” act and just started having him removed for the courtroom altogether, ordering him put in a holding cell with a closed circuit TV feed of the proceedings. ---
**Author:** ![Senegoid](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/senegoid/32/6606_2.png) [@Senegoid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Senegoid)\ **Post date:** [November 12, 2011, 6:55am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-judges-really-order-a-defendant-to-be-bound-gagged/602666/6 "2011-11-12T06:55:14Z")
> [@Disgruntled\_Penguin](#): > > The judge in the Chicago Seven trial had Bobby Seale bound and gagged. > > [Bobby Seale - Wikipedia](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bobby_Seale) (Of course, it was still the Chicago 8 when Seale was still part of the case.) Maybe they didn’t commonly have CCTV facilities back in the day, like the so commonly do now. (Anybody remember for sure?) One day, while the trial was still going on, my English Lit class at Berkeley got sidetracked into discussing it. The general consensus in the class was that the defendants and the judge alike were all being total assholes. ---
**Author:** ![Disgruntled\_Penguin](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/a8b319/32.png) [@Disgruntled\_Penguin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Disgruntled_Penguin)\ **Post date:** [November 12, 2011, 10:57am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-judges-really-order-a-defendant-to-be-bound-gagged/602666/7 "2011-11-12T10:57:21Z")
> [@Senegoid](#): > > (Of course, it was still the Chicago 8 when Seale was still part of the case.) > > Maybe they didn’t commonly have CCTV facilities back in the day, like the so commonly do now. (Anybody remember for sure?) > > One day, while the trial was still going on, my English Lit class at Berkeley got sidetracked into discussing it. The general consensus in the class was that the defendants and the judge alike were all being total assholes. True but I’ve always thought about it as the Chicago Seven since Bobby Seale was never in any way associated with the other seven and should not have been part of that trial. I agree that both sides were acting like assholes but the defendants had really every right to act that way considering the absurdity of the judges behavior. Judge Hoffman deserves nothing but scorn for his behavior. He was a very opinionated old man who had lost respect for the law and acted above the law and thought nothing of denying a defendant his constitutional rights. If the court cannot respect the law and act accordingly you can hardly expect the defense to especially since his behavior made the appeal a slam dunk. They literally had nothing to lose in making a travesty of that court and were handed a free pass to put the system on trial instead of themselves which is what they wanted in the first place. That is on the judge. With a reasonable judge that trial would have proceeded quite differently. Here is an excerpt from a good read about why Mr Seale was forced to be gagged and it answers the question about what they gagged him with. > [@](#): > > Seale’s demands, thereafter, increased in vehemence despite Judge Hoffman’s warnings that if they continued Seale would be bound and gagged. On the afternoon of October 29, Seale was taken forcibly by two marshals through the door to the lockup and returned, ten minutes later, chained hand and foot to a metal chair. A gag of muslin was in his mouth. > > The following morning, since the first gag had proved ineffective and the rattling of the chains against the metal chair had obviously disturbed the jury, Seale was brought to court strapped to a wooden chair. The gag that passed over his mouth and was tied in a knot at the nape of his neck was supplemented by another of the same muslin which passed under his chin and was tied in a sort of bow at the top of his head. Under the gag his mouth was taped. Seale sat quietly throughout most of the day, but as the afternoon session ended he managed to speak in a loud, if muffled, voice, once more insisting on his right to defend himself. > > The following morning the gag was further strengthened by an elastic bandage and Seale’s mouth was stuffed with some kind of cotton which the marshals had managed to insert by holding his nose. This forced him to open his mouth. The arrangement proved effective, but as Seale attempted to breathe the elastic bandage tightened around his head and he choked. Mr. Weinglass, at this point, petitioned the Court to loosen the gag and Judge Hoffman, having inquired whether the government agreed and upon the affirmative reply of the assistant prosecutor, Mr. Schultz, ordered the gag loosened. > **[A Special Supplement: The Trial of Bobby Seale | Jason Epstein](https://www.nybooks.com/articles/1969/12/04/a-special-supplement-the-trial-of-bobby-seale/)** > > I Introduction The United States District Court for the Northern District of Illinois (Eastern Division) occupies several floors of the new Federal