# Can lonesome polecats' charges be debunked? **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [November 21, 2010, 11:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-lonesome-polecats-charges-be-debunked/561486 "2010-11-21T23:36:39Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![zamboniracer](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/e9a140/32.png) [@zamboniracer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/zamboniracer)\ **Post date:** [November 21, 2010, 11:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-lonesome-polecats-charges-be-debunked/561486/1 "2010-11-21T23:36:39Z")
In this thread, [Why do teabaggers think liberals are fearful?](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=583797) lonesome polecat answered thusly: > [@](#): > > It’s a lot of things, big and little. It’s things like this post in the Pit, an excellent example of the left’s snarling hatred for everyone to the right of Nancy Pelosi. It’s Carrie Prejean in the Miss America pageant being punished for dissenting from the left’s position on same sex marriage. It’s Juan Williams being fired for a comment no reasonable person would have found the least bit controversial or offensive. It’s the mainstream media dragging Joe the Plumber through the mud for asking Obama an awkward question. It’s harassing Sara Palin with hundreds of frivolous ethics complaints. It’s the applause from a night club audience when Sandra Bernhard ranted about Sara Palin being gang raped by her “black brothers.” It’s the arson at Sara Palin’s church. It’s a President who pals around with the likes of William Ayers and Reverend Wright. It’s a President who removes references to God when quoting the Declaration of Independence. It’s the Democratic party embracing race hustlers like Al Sharpton and Jesse Jackson. It’s the Duke University rape hoax and the Jena Six circus, it’s American students in an American high school being forbidden to display the American flag on Cinco de Mayo, it’s a California school requiring students to dress like Muslims and pray to Allah in a class project on Islam. It’s forbidding a high school valedictorian to talk about her religion in her graduation speech. It’s progressive students shouting down conservative speakers on college campuses. It’s the way so many of you act like Soviet commissars intent on sniffing out “counter-revolutionaries” and sending them to the gulags. > > And you claim not to understand why so many people mistrust and fear you. > > Can you guys really be this blind? Let’s analyze these one by one. > [@](#): > > It’s Carrie Prejean in the Miss America pageant being punished for dissenting from the left’s position on same sex marriage. Nobody punished Prejean. She wasn’t even in the Miss America pageant - It was the Miss USA Pageant. She answered the question about same sex marriage and lost the vote of the judge who disagreed with her. Big deal. You’d think she’d take pride in standing up for her beliefs, except that her beliefs included the making of a sex tape. > [@](#): > > It’s Juan Williams being fired for a comment no reasonable person would have found the least bit controversial or offensive. Williams was fired by his employer for stating a position that they objected to. NPR thought it was a bigoted comment, and they fired him. He seems to have landed on his feet, having been taken in by an outfit - Fox News - more suited to his outlook. What’s the problem? > [@](#): > > It’s James Watson having his career destroyed for dissenting from the politically correct view of race. Prof. Watson said that people of African descent were not as intelligent as those of European descent. He later apologized, but what did he think was going to happen to him after he said such a stupid thing? > [@](#): > > It’s the mainstream media dragging Joe the Plumber through the mud for asking Obama an awkward question. I don’t know that that ever happened. Wurzelbacher had an unpaid Ohio tax lien that came to light after he became a quasi public figure. Is that being dragged through the mud? > [@](#): > > It’s harassing Sara Palin with hundreds of frivolous ethics complaints. In July 2009 the Anchorage Daily news itemized the ethics complaints against her. They totaled 18, not hundreds. Three of those even predated her nomination and so cannot be considered mere harrassment. [Link](http://www.adn.com/2009/06/21/838912/ethics-complaints-filed-against.html) > [@](#): > > It’s the applause from a night club audience when Sandra Bernhard ranted about Sara Palin being gang raped by her “black brothers.” Bernard’s rape remarks were reprehensible. There is no evidence that the crowd as a whole approved of her remarks, even if a few people there did approve of them. > [@](#): > > It’s the arson at Sara Palin’s church. The arson is too reprehensible. To my knowledge it remains an unsolved crime. Are you saying the Nancy Pelosi or other Democrats or liberals did it? > [@](#): > > It’s a President who pals around with the likes of William Ayers and Reverend Wright. As for Ayers, see this wikipedia article: [Link](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bill_Ayers_presidential_election_controversy). As for Wright, Obama addressed the issue to my satisfaction in this speech. [link.](http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/23690567/ns/politics-decision_08) > [@](#): > > It’s a President who removes references to God when quoting the Declaration of Independence. This is called taking things out of context. The speech makes clear that Obama says people are endowed with certain unalienable rights. If not so endowed by the Creator, then by whom? This complaint is really making a mountain out of a molehill. > [@](#): > > It’s the Democratic party embracing race hustlers like Al Sharpton and Jesse Jackson. No political party is perfect. Race hustlers or race baitors like Strom Thurmond or Trent Lott, take your pick. > [@](#): > > It’s the Duke University rape hoax and the Jena Six circus You lost me. Those things are the Democrats fault, how and why exactly? > [@](#): > > it’s American students in an American high school being forbidden to display the American flag on Cinco de Mayo Certainly this is an outrage. That happened once in California by some silly school administrators. It isn’t exactly a trend. > [@](#): > > it’s a California school requiring students to dress like Muslims and pray to Allah in a class project on Islam. According to my research, this did not occur in California. I find references to it happening once in the UK, but so what? > [@](#): > > It’s forbidding a high school valedictorian to talk about her religion in her graduation speech. The US Supreme Court, currently laden with Republicans, has trouble with this issue so I’m not going to solve it here. > [@](#): > > It’s progressive students shouting down conservative speakers on college campuses. Uncivil discourse is indeed a problem. I am most familiar with it when Republicans shouted down Congressional town meetings concerning the health bill. It is a tactic to be scorned certainly. > [@](#): > > It’s the way so many of you act like Soviet commissars intent on sniffing out “counter-revolutionaries” and sending them to the gulags. I assume you’re just exaggerating for emphasis. Hyperbole, I think they call it. ---
**Author:** ![Bricker](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/977dab/32.png) [@Bricker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bricker)\ **Post date:** [November 22, 2010, 12:02am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-lonesome-polecats-charges-be-debunked/561486/2 "2010-11-22T00:02:33Z")
I don’t believe your analysis is in good faith. > [@zamboniracer](#): > > Nobody punished Prejean. She wasn’t even in the Miss America pageant - It was the Miss USA Pageant. She answered the question about same sex marriage and lost the vote of the judge who disagreed with her. Big deal. You’d think she’d take pride in standing up for her beliefs, except that her beliefs included the making of a sex tape. How is her sex tape relevant? Moreover, both Perez Hilton and Prejean herself said at the time that her answer cost her the crown. While you may dispute the accuracy of that claim, you can hardly pretend it does not exist. > [@](#): > > In July 2009 the Anchorage Daily news itemized the ethics complaints against her. They totaled 18, not hundreds. Three of those even predated her nomination and so cannot be considered mere harrassment. [Link](http://www.adn.com/2009/06/21/838912/ethics-complaints-filed-against.html) If you believe the gravamen of **lonesome polecat** ’s complaint is that the number of complaints were in the triple digits, then you have refuted it. As I read it, though, the key element is that there were multiple – one might even say ‘many’ such complaints. Again, you may defend their merits, or not, but addressing the fact that they exist is the honest thing to do. ---
**Author:** ![Bosstone](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/22d042/32.png) [@Bosstone](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bosstone)\ **Post date:** [November 22, 2010, 12:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-lonesome-polecats-charges-be-debunked/561486/3 "2010-11-22T00:09:03Z")
I think what’s more important is many of these are isolated incidents of crazy and aren’t representative of ‘liberalism’ or ‘lefties’ at all; at the most, they’re liberalist philosophy taken to absurdist ends. ---
**Author:** ![VinylTurnip](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/v/b2d939/32.png) [@VinylTurnip](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/VinylTurnip)\ **Post date:** [November 22, 2010, 12:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-lonesome-polecats-charges-be-debunked/561486/4 "2010-11-22T00:09:49Z")
Nomally I’d get behind any pitting of **pwnsome lolcat** , but that post of his was made like, three weeks ago. How do you know he hasn’t come to his senses in the meantime? As to the content, there’s little to “debunk” because it’s just a list of essentially unrelated talking points with a meandering line drawn through them with fat crayon. Like something Glenn Beck might do, but thoughtfully condensed into a single, easily ignored post graciously stripped of the unwelcome sight of Beck’s leering fat face. ---
**Author:** ![zamboniracer](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/e9a140/32.png) [@zamboniracer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/zamboniracer)\ **Post date:** [November 22, 2010, 12:19am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-lonesome-polecats-charges-be-debunked/561486/5 "2010-11-22T00:19:22Z")
> [@Bricker](#): > > I don’t believe your analysis is in good faith. And you base that on what, exactly? > [@Bricker](#): > > How is her sex tape relevant? > > Moreover, both Perez Hilton and Prejean herself said at the time that her answer cost her the crown. While you may dispute the accuracy of that claim, you can hardly pretend it does not exist. Losing a beauty pageant doesn’t constitute being punished. Lonesome polecat claimed Prejean was punished for her views. She certainly was not. Not winning an award isn’t punishment in any sense of the word. As for her sex tape, while mentioning may be a cheap shot, this is the Pit, so what the heck. > [@Bricker](#): > > If you believe the gravamen of **lonesome polecat** ’s complaint is that the number of complaints were in the triple digits, then you have refuted it. > > As I read it, though, the key element is that there were multiple – one might even say ‘many’ such complaints. Again, you may defend their merits, or not, but addressing the fact that they exist is the honest thing to do. The key element as I read it was that polecat greatly exaggerated the number of ethical claims leveled against Palin which he certainly did. That is certainly an honest and fair criticism of polecat’s claims. ---
**Author:** ![Bosstone](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/22d042/32.png) [@Bosstone](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bosstone)\ **Post date:** [November 22, 2010, 12:23am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-lonesome-polecats-charges-be-debunked/561486/6 "2010-11-22T00:23:17Z")
> [@VinylTurnip](#): > > How do you know he hasn’t come to his senses in the meantime? Your posts always crack me up. ---
**Author:** ![Lamar\_Mundane](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/85f322/32.png) [@Lamar\_Mundane](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lamar_Mundane)\ **Post date:** [November 22, 2010, 12:29am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-lonesome-polecats-charges-be-debunked/561486/7 "2010-11-22T00:29:41Z")
> [@Bricker](#): > > If you believe the gravamen of **lonesome polecat** ’s complaint is that the number of complaints were in the triple digits, then you have refuted it. > > As I read it, though, the key element is that there were multiple – one might even say ‘many’ such complaints. Again, you may defend their merits, or not, but addressing the fact that they exist is the honest thing to do. A number of the ethics complaints were about “Troopergate” and were initiated by the fired trooper. These were legitimate complaints and had nothing to do with politics. The majority of the other complaints were intiated by a woman named Andree McLeod, a former Palin ally. McLeod is not a liberal, she is a Republican. ---
**Author:** ![BrotherCadfael](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/977dab/32.png) [@BrotherCadfael](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrotherCadfael)\ **Post date:** [November 22, 2010, 2:05am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-lonesome-polecats-charges-be-debunked/561486/8 "2010-11-22T02:05:56Z")
Perhaps his problem is that he hasn’t got any feminine polecat? ---
**Author:** ![fluiddruid](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/c2a13f/32.png) [@fluiddruid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/fluiddruid)\ **Post date:** [November 22, 2010, 2:39am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-lonesome-polecats-charges-be-debunked/561486/9 "2010-11-22T02:39:41Z")
> [@Bricker](#): > > If you believe the gravamen of **lonesome polecat** ’s complaint is that the number of complaints were in the triple digits, then you have refuted it. > > As I read it, though, the key element is that there were multiple – one might even say ‘many’ such complaints. Again, you may defend their merits, or not, but addressing the fact that they exist is the honest thing to do. Bricker, come on. You’re a reasonable sort of guy. If someone wants to complain about the Left, there are plenty of good reasons, but claiming that they are to blame for hundreds of complaints against Palin is just flat out incorrect. No honest person would use “hundreds” in lieu of the number 18. You could argue for “multiple” or “many”, but that’s not the word that was used. It was “hundreds”. As in more hundreds than just one hundred. ---
**Author:** ![Captain\_Amazing](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/6de8d8/32.png) [@Captain\_Amazing](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Captain_Amazing)\ **Post date:** [November 22, 2010, 2:51am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-lonesome-polecats-charges-be-debunked/561486/10 "2010-11-22T02:51:31Z")
> [@zamboniracer](#): > > Losing a beauty pageant doesn’t constitute being punished. Lonesome polecat claimed Prejean was punished for her views. She certainly was not. Not winning an award isn’t punishment in any sense of the word. As for her sex tape, while mentioning may be a cheap shot, this is the Pit, so what the heck. If she would have won but not for her views, then she is being punished for her views. ---
**Author:** ![Skywatcher](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/skywatcher/32/254_2.png) [@Skywatcher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Skywatcher)\ **Post date:** [November 22, 2010, 2:53am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-lonesome-polecats-charges-be-debunked/561486/11 "2010-11-22T02:53:47Z")
> [@Lamar\_Mundane](#): > > A number of the ethics complaints were about “Troopergate” and were initiated by the fired trooper. These were legitimate complaints and had nothing to do with politics. > > The majority of the other complaints were intiated by a woman named Andree McLeod, a former Palin ally. McLeod is not a liberal, she is a Republican. Let’s not forget the complaint that was filed by Palin herself. ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [November 22, 2010, 3:53am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-lonesome-polecats-charges-be-debunked/561486/12 "2010-11-22T03:53:46Z")
> [@Captain\_Amazing](#): > > If she would have won but not for her views, then she is being punished for her views. And all the other non-winning contestants were punished for their looks? ---
**Author:** ![Captain\_Amazing](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/6de8d8/32.png) [@Captain\_Amazing](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Captain_Amazing)\ **Post date:** [November 22, 2010, 4:20am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-lonesome-polecats-charges-be-debunked/561486/13 "2010-11-22T04:20:00Z")
> [@Czarcasm](#): > > And all the other non-winning contestants were punished for their looks? Except a beauty pageant is about judging who is the most beautiful. The purpose of the contest isn’t to judge who’s the least homophobic. ---
**Author:** ![Miller](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/miller/32/481_2.png) [@Miller](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Miller)\ **Post date:** [November 22, 2010, 4:26am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-lonesome-polecats-charges-be-debunked/561486/14 "2010-11-22T04:26:48Z")
> [@Captain\_Amazing](#): > > Except a beauty pageant is about judging who is the most beautiful. Then why do they ask the contestants any questions at all? ---
**Author:** ![Lobohan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lobohan/32/79_2.png) [@Lobohan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lobohan)\ **Post date:** [November 22, 2010, 4:30am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-lonesome-polecats-charges-be-debunked/561486/15 "2010-11-22T04:30:39Z")
> [@fluiddruid](#): > > Bricker, come on. You’re a reasonable sort of guy. Objection! Assumes facts not in evidence. ---
**Author:** ![CarnalK](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/carnalk/32/486_2.png) [@CarnalK](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CarnalK)\ **Post date:** [November 22, 2010, 4:45am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-lonesome-polecats-charges-be-debunked/561486/16 "2010-11-22T04:45:21Z")
> [@Miller](#): > > Then why do they ask the contestants any questions at all? I guess to prove they won’t completely embarrass themselves when they are out being beautiful while opening parades and cutting ribbons. Now why don’t you tell us why they call them “beauty” pageants? ---
**Author:** ![Fear\_Itself](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/fear_itself/32/19637_2.png) [@Fear\_Itself](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fear_Itself)\ **Post date:** [November 22, 2010, 4:47am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-lonesome-polecats-charges-be-debunked/561486/17 "2010-11-22T04:47:50Z")
> [@CarnalK](#): > > I guess to prove they won’t completely embarrass themselves when they are out being beautiful while opening parades and cutting ribbons. So the outcome of Prajean’s comments was totally justified. The system works! ---
**Author:** ![elucidator](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/8edcca/32.png) [@elucidator](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elucidator)\ **Post date:** [November 22, 2010, 5:58am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-lonesome-polecats-charges-be-debunked/561486/18 "2010-11-22T05:58:00Z")
Would she have been “punished” if she said something favorable about NAMBLA? How about if she referred to Hispanics as “beaners”? Or made some passing reference to how lazy black people are? Pretty likely, I’m thinking. So why should I be concerned if she is punished for slurring gay people? We have gotten to a place, praise the Goddess, where public racism is not acceptable, and we’ve had time to get used to that. The equality of gays is still aborning, but gaining ground every day. So, really, the only difference is how much time we’ve had to get used to it. So why should I care if she is punished for doing something she ought to have known better than to do? Is she offering a viewpoint I ought to respect, for some reason? Its not like she’s offering a conservative critque of tax policy, its not an intellectual abstraction, its an act of ignorant or willful cruelty, and I am not bound to offer it anything but contempt. If she is punished for it, good, maybe the light will penetrate down to her reptile blonde brain stem. Though if I had to choose which of the two, her or that Hilton guy, I would spend an hour with, probably be her, easier to look at. Either way, I’d need to find some hippies to get drunk with after. ---
**Author:** ![Guinastasia](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/guinastasia/32/5751_2.png) [@Guinastasia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Guinastasia)\ **Post date:** [November 22, 2010, 6:11am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-lonesome-polecats-charges-be-debunked/561486/19 "2010-11-22T06:11:11Z")
Well, that and Perez Hilton is a moronic tool. Hmmm…riddle me this? Who’s worse: Carrie Prejean, or that “They Don’t Have Maps” girl? (At least as a representative of beauty pageants) ---
**Author:** ![Little\_Nemo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/little_nemo/32/3120_2.png) [@Little\_Nemo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Little_Nemo)\ **Post date:** [November 22, 2010, 6:43am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-lonesome-polecats-charges-be-debunked/561486/20 "2010-11-22T06:43:20Z")
> [@elucidator](#): > > Would she have been “punished” if she said something favorable about NAMBLA? How about if she referred to Hispanics as “beaners”? Or made some passing reference to how lazy black people are? Or what if she had ranted about Sara Palin being gang raped by her “black brothers” or palled around with the likes of William Ayers and Reverend Wright? Apparently people aren’t supposed to do that. [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-lonesome-polecats-charges-be-debunked/561486.md?page=2)