# Can person IQ be improved? And why is science not looking into it? **URL:** \ **Category:** In My Humble Opinion\ **Created:** [January 9, 2021, 3:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-person-iq-be-improved-and-why-is-science-not-looking-into-it/930127 "2021-01-09T15:22:39Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 19\ **Page:** 5
**Author:** ![Kelby](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/a587f6/32.png) [@Kelby](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kelby)\ **Post date:** [January 31, 2021, 7:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-person-iq-be-improved-and-why-is-science-not-looking-into-it/930127/81 "2021-01-31T19:40:18Z")
> [@Jillwood77](#): > > Well some what I read on the Eugenics program. > > The Return Of Eugenics? Tennessee Judge Issues Sterilization Program For Inmates > > [https://austrian.economicblogs.org/zerohedge/2017/durden-eugenics-tennessee-issues-sterilization-inmates/](https://austrian.economicblogs.org/zerohedge/2017/durden-eugenics-tennessee-issues-sterilization-inmates/) > > In the old days. > > [https://familyinequality.files.wordpress.com/2011/06/sterlization-pam.jpg](https://familyinequality.files.wordpress.com/2011/06/sterlization-pam.jpg) > > Time line of CA > [https://www.pop.org/files/images/stories/CA%20eugenics%2012.JPG](https://www.pop.org/files/images/stories/CA%20eugenics%2012.JPG) > > North Carolina victims speak out on eugenics which targeted black women and young girls > > [North Carolina victims speak out on eugenics which targeted black women and young girls | The Millenium](https://themillenium9.wordpress.com/2014/10/25/north-carolina-victims-speak-out-on-eugenics-which-targeted-black-women-and-youg-girls/) > > The U.S. Is Still Forcibly Sterilizing Prisoners > > [The U.S. Is Still Forcibly Sterilizing Prisoners - Talk Poverty](https://talkpoverty.org/2017/08/23/u-s-still-forcibly-sterilizing-prisoners/) > > There were 1,049 victims of sterilizations in North Dakota. > > [https://www.uvm.edu/~lkaelber/eugenics/ND/ND1.jpg](https://www.uvm.edu/~lkaelber/eugenics/ND/ND1.jpg) > > The Dark History (and Reality) of Eugenics in America and the Forced Sterilization of Women > > [The Dark History (and Reality) of Eugenics in America and the Forced Sterilization of Women](https://ultraculture.org/blog/2013/10/24/eugenics-in-america/) > > And this. > > There is a very strong coorelation between low I.Q. and criminality. I worked in a prison as a graduate student. All the inmates had Institutional files with psych testing. Not one of the inmates I saw had a I.Q. of 100. Most were in the 80’s to low 90’s. Roughly the 15%-25% percentile. > > Some stuff I read on Wikipedia and Quora. And conservative message boards what the conservative are saying. > > They seem to think criminals have a low IQ on the conservative message boards. There is definitely a strong correlation between low IQ and people who are incarcerated, not necessarily between low IQ and criminality. God knows there are many white collar criminals who manage to avoid prison time. ---
**Author:** ![Kelby](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/a587f6/32.png) [@Kelby](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kelby)\ **Post date:** [January 31, 2021, 7:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-person-iq-be-improved-and-why-is-science-not-looking-into-it/930127/82 "2021-01-31T19:47:27Z")
> [@Jillwood77](#): > > And parents with low IQ will always lead to offsprings of low IQ. So the theory was crime was caused by low IQ. No, that is why the poster upthread mentioned “regression towards the mean”. Parents with low IQ’s actually tend to have children with IQ’s higher than theirs. Parents with IQ’s in the “gifted” range tend to have children with IQ’s lower than theirs. This can be a sobering realization for them (if they accept it) when their offspring do not find school as easy to navigate as they did and are not automatically placed into advanced academic programs. ---
**Author:** ![Kelby](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/a587f6/32.png) [@Kelby](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kelby)\ **Post date:** [January 31, 2021, 7:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-person-iq-be-improved-and-why-is-science-not-looking-into-it/930127/83 "2021-01-31T19:50:31Z")
> [@Jillwood77](#): > > Well I just did a search now. > > [​What is Donald Trump's IQ? His IQ test scores will shock you !](https://www.iq-test.net/Donald-Trumps-IQ-Score-pms19.html) > > _President-elect Donald Trump is currently the most polarizing figure on earth. Despite his masses of riches and possessions, he is not thought to be a smart man because of his outlandish statements. However, his IQ of 156 classifies him as a genius._ > > But that if you really believe it as he can say any thing or the US department of government could say any thing. > > So with out some pressure testing to see what his IQ is you cannot believe what he is saying or some government body say that I have some paper on his IQ. > > But that see what some other politician like Trump and businesses people and other people IQ have to show. The assertion Donald Trump has an IQ anywhere near 156 is laughable. He IS a savant in the art of conning people, but I don’t know if this is a measurable quantity. ---
**Author:** ![Velocity](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/velocity/32/18006_2.png) [@Velocity](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Velocity)\ **Post date:** [January 31, 2021, 10:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-person-iq-be-improved-and-why-is-science-not-looking-into-it/930127/84 "2021-01-31T22:31:01Z")
I have no problem believing Trump’s IQ is above average. But 156 is Triple Nine Society territory; no way. ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [January 31, 2021, 10:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-person-iq-be-improved-and-why-is-science-not-looking-into-it/930127/85 "2021-01-31T22:40:21Z")
Triple Nine Society? I would have difficulty believing he could multiply 3 X 9. ---
**Author:** ![Voyager](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/voyager/32/133_2.png) [@Voyager](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Voyager)\ **Post date:** [January 31, 2021, 11:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-person-iq-be-improved-and-why-is-science-not-looking-into-it/930127/86 "2021-01-31T23:03:09Z")
> [@Kelby](#): > > The assertion Donald Trump has an IQ anywhere near 156 is laughable. > > He IS a savant in the art of conning people, but I don’t know if this is a measurable quantity. I wonder who took the IQ test for him. ---
**Author:** ![Chingon](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chingon/32/17645_2.png) [@Chingon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chingon)\ **Post date:** [January 31, 2021, 11:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-person-iq-be-improved-and-why-is-science-not-looking-into-it/930127/87 "2021-01-31T23:30:31Z")
Meh, we had a previously prolific poster who constantly claimed to be in the 999 society, and they were about as intelligent as Trump as far as I could tell. ---
**Author:** ![Kelby](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/a587f6/32.png) [@Kelby](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kelby)\ **Post date:** [January 31, 2021, 11:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-person-iq-be-improved-and-why-is-science-not-looking-into-it/930127/88 "2021-01-31T23:31:34Z")
> [@Voyager](#): > > > [@Kelby](#): > > > > The assertion Donald Trump has an IQ anywhere near 156 is laughable. > > > > He IS a savant in the art of conning people, but I don’t know if this is a measurable quantity. > > I wonder who took the IQ test for him. Nobody. What you’ll find for most of these claims of celebrity IQ is poor, if any, legitimate sourcing. ---
**Author:** ![Wendell\_Wagner](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/8491ac/32.png) [@Wendell\_Wagner](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Wendell_Wagner)\ **Post date:** [January 31, 2021, 11:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-person-iq-be-improved-and-why-is-science-not-looking-into-it/930127/89 "2021-01-31T23:44:14Z")
Look through that article that JillWood77 links to about Trump’s I.Q. First, it claims that the fact that Trump wrote _The Art of the Deal_ shows how smart he is. Trump didn’t actually write that book. His co-author Tony Schwartz wrote every word of the book. Schwartz interviewed Trump who told him what to write about and who referred him to other sources for the book, but Trump did not write the book. Second, the person who wrote that article that JillWood77 links to says specifically that they aren’t taking the I.Q. of 156 from an actual I.Q. test. They say that they are estimating that Trump has an I.Q. of at least 156 because being admitted to Wharton requires an SAT score that’s equivalent to at least an I.Q. of 156. That’s blatantly wrong. If they had said that someone who is admitted to Wharton strictly based on their academic record must have an I.Q. of at least 125, I would be willing to admit that. 156 I.Q., though, is far above the average I.Q. of a Wharton student. And even saying that Trump must have at least an I.Q. of 125 assumes that he was actually admitted strictly based on his academic record. Perhaps he was admitted because his father promised Wharton a big donation that year, for instance. ---
**Author:** ![kenobi\_65](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kenobi_65/32/13178_2.png) [@kenobi\_65](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kenobi_65)\ **Post date:** [January 31, 2021, 11:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-person-iq-be-improved-and-why-is-science-not-looking-into-it/930127/90 "2021-01-31T23:47:00Z")
> [@Wendell\_Wagner](#): > > They say that they are estimating that Trump has an I.Q. of at least 156 because being admitted to Wharton requires an SAT score that’s equivalent to at least an I.Q. of 156. And, according to Mary Trump, as related to her by her aunt Maryanne (Donald’s sister), he paid someone else to take the SAT for his admission to Wharton. > **[Trump cheated on his SAT by paying someone to take it for him, according to...](https://www.businessinsider.com/donald-trump-cheated-on-his-sat-penn-wharton-mary-trump-2020-7)** > > President Donald Trump's niece's tell-all book, set to be published next week, says Trump paid someone to take his SAT for him. ---
**Author:** ![Voyager](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/voyager/32/133_2.png) [@Voyager](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Voyager)\ **Post date:** [February 1, 2021, 12:53am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-person-iq-be-improved-and-why-is-science-not-looking-into-it/930127/91 "2021-02-01T00:53:01Z")
> [@Kelby](#): > > Nobody. > > What you’ll find for most of these claims of celebrity IQ is poor, if any, legitimate sourcing. I was playing off the claim by his cousin that someone took the SATs for him, which I find quite plausible. I’m sure his IQ number is totally made up, whether by him or by someone else. ETA: Oops, ninjaed. ---
**Author:** ![Jillwood77](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/e47c2d/32.png) [@Jillwood77](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jillwood77)\ **Post date:** [February 2, 2021, 12:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-person-iq-be-improved-and-why-is-science-not-looking-into-it/930127/92 "2021-02-02T12:29:42Z")
I read a bit about it on the internet but no textbook it is very controversial. And I don’t know what to take on it. There was a video I seen on YouTube of a fringe professor saying stuff on it but a bit fringe. People who are really dumb and do stupid things, by into lot of conspiracies, think Covid is not real, vaccines could be little unsafe but very unsafe and plot by the elite, to give people microchip and think they have high IQ by just reading but never took test, know very little about subjects but preach topics and yell and scream about topic. There also thing as good conspiracies and really bad conspiracies where we at now like the flat earthers, vaccine microchip, Qnoners and Covid is not real. And the open carry nutcases. And there was some people talking about Trump and IQ that why the US is getting worse because of dumb people can run for government. There was a topic on IQ and clown Trump. ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [February 2, 2021, 2:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-person-iq-be-improved-and-why-is-science-not-looking-into-it/930127/93 "2021-02-02T14:56:00Z")
> [@Jillwood77](#): > > And there was some people talking about Trump and IQ that why the US is getting worse because of dumb people can run for government. There was a topic on IQ and clown Trump. Is English your primary language? ---
**Author:** ![Wendell\_Wagner](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/8491ac/32.png) [@Wendell\_Wagner](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Wendell_Wagner)\ **Post date:** [February 2, 2021, 3:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-person-iq-be-improved-and-why-is-science-not-looking-into-it/930127/94 "2021-02-02T15:07:36Z")
Jillwood77, do you know anyone who can write grammatical English and who can compose a comprehensible essay? It’s obvious that you can’t do either. Maybe you can find someone who’s good at English grammar and composition who you can ask to completely rewrite all your posts before you post them. I can’t even figure out what you claiming in your posts. I was able to write my last post showing what was obviously wrong with Trump writing _The Art of the Deal_ and having an I.Q. of 156 because I was replying to the article that you linked to, not you yourself. Otherwise it’s nearly impossible to reply to anything you write because I don’t understand what you’re talking about. ---
**Author:** ![Wendell\_Wagner](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/8491ac/32.png) [@Wendell\_Wagner](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Wendell_Wagner)\ **Post date:** [February 4, 2021, 9:01am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-person-iq-be-improved-and-why-is-science-not-looking-into-it/930127/95 "2021-02-04T09:01:09Z")
A quick read that will tell you about why I.Q. tests are flawed is [The dark history of the IQ test](https://www.starsinsider.com/lifestyle/440739/the-dark-history-of-the-iq-test). ---
**Author:** ![Siam\_Sam](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/d78d45/32.png) [@Siam\_Sam](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Siam_Sam)\ **Post date:** [February 7, 2021, 5:58am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-person-iq-be-improved-and-why-is-science-not-looking-into-it/930127/96 "2021-02-07T05:58:34Z")
I knew a scientist who found he could raise his IQ by masturbating. It was a stroke of genius. ---
**Author:** ![Jillwood77](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/e47c2d/32.png) [@Jillwood77](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jillwood77)\ **Post date:** [February 7, 2021, 12:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-person-iq-be-improved-and-why-is-science-not-looking-into-it/930127/97 "2021-02-07T12:45:05Z")
I think because my English is not that good some members are having trouble understanding what I’m trying to say and what my question is. And it probability does not help that my English is weak that wikipedia could probably explain most of my questions. I was trying to say that liberals and conservatives seem to have different meaning what IQ means. ---
**Author:** ![Telemark](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/telemark/32/372_2.png) [@Telemark](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Telemark)\ **Post date:** [February 7, 2021, 2:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-person-iq-be-improved-and-why-is-science-not-looking-into-it/930127/98 "2021-02-07T14:12:27Z")
> [@Jillwood77](#): > > I was trying to say that liberals and conservatives seem to have different meaning what IQ means. You are mistaken that this is political issue. Lots of people all across the political spectrum don’t understand this issue. ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [February 7, 2021, 3:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-person-iq-be-improved-and-why-is-science-not-looking-into-it/930127/99 "2021-02-07T15:48:03Z")
> [@Jillwood77](#): > > And it probability does not help that my English is weak that wikipedia could probably explain most of my questions. This does not make any sense. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-person-iq-be-improved-and-why-is-science-not-looking-into-it/930127.md?page=4)