# Can somebody explain Oprah Winfrey to non US-Americans? **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Tags:** talk-variety-show\ **Created:** [December 18, 2023, 3:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-somebody-explain-oprah-winfrey-to-non-us-americans/994778 "2023-12-18T15:36:12Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 7
**Author:** ![Spice\_Weasel](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/spice_weasel/32/5435_2.png) [@Spice\_Weasel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Spice_Weasel)\ **Post date:** [December 19, 2023, 7:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-somebody-explain-oprah-winfrey-to-non-us-americans/994778/121 "2023-12-19T19:20:57Z")
> [@griffin1977](#): > > Though unlike the anti-vax issue it’s hard to claim Oprah was on the wrong side of that one. The established view, that there was no chance of BSE spreading to humans through beef consumption was wrong. I think the main issue is that she misrepresented the facts on her show, which is explored more in depth in the podcast. It doesn’t exonerate the beef industry by any means. It also explains how Dr. Phil happened – The lawsuit was unlike anything she had to deal with before, and by her own admission, she was not coping effectively. Dr. Phil kind of swooped in and guided her through it. I believe she felt like she owed him a debt of gratitude. ---
**Author:** ![GargoyleWB](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gargoylewb/32/199_2.png) [@GargoyleWB](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GargoyleWB)\ **Post date:** [December 19, 2023, 7:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-somebody-explain-oprah-winfrey-to-non-us-americans/994778/122 "2023-12-19T19:41:38Z")
Looking back through the lens of causality, I think that Dr Phil and Dr Oz were small snowballs that got away from her before avalanching. She has always been enamored by and promoted “self helpers” of any kind, whether books or people, and Phil and Oz wore big flashy altruistic self-help empowerment hats at first. In the Phil and Oz case, I think they were narcissistic conmen that played Oprah for the rich, naive mark that she is. ---
**Author:** ![Atamasama](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/atamasama/32/12961_2.png) [@Atamasama](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Atamasama)\ **Post date:** [December 19, 2023, 8:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-somebody-explain-oprah-winfrey-to-non-us-americans/994778/123 "2023-12-19T20:37:57Z")
I had totally forgotten about the beef thing. Yeah, that was a big deal. It was amazing to me that something she could say would be so impactful as to affect an entire institution, in this case the beef industry. And in this case, she spread some misinformation that caused panic, while also talking about some legitimate concerns that were not being addressed. It was a case where you can see how much power she had, and how that power could simultaneously do good and bad things. ---
**Author:** ![Mahaloth](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mahaloth/32/1079_2.png) [@Mahaloth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mahaloth)\ **Post date:** [December 19, 2023, 11:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-somebody-explain-oprah-winfrey-to-non-us-americans/994778/124 "2023-12-19T23:16:38Z")
> [@pulykamell](#): > > Yeah, I definitely knew Zsa Zsa as some rich Hungarian woman who was married a lot, and Eva I remember from Green Acres. (I actually even have their mother’s cookbook for some reason, _Jolie Gabor’s Family Cookbook_.) Socialite is the first word I think of and it is how Wikipedia describes her. Pretty much famous for being famous and going to social events. For note, here is the article on “famous for being famous” and Zsa Zsa, Paris Hilton, and Kim Kardashian are all listed. > **[Famous for being famous](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Famous_for_being_famous)** > > Famous for being famous is a term, usually used pejoratively, for someone who attains celebrity status for no clearly identifiable reason (as opposed to fame based on achievement, skill, or talent) and appears to generate their own fame, or someone who achieves fame through a family or relationship association with an existing celebrity. > The term originates from an analysis of the media-dominated world called The Image: A Guide to Pseudo-events in America (1961), by historian and social theoris... ---
**Author:** ![pulykamell](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pulykamell/32/3166_2.png) [@pulykamell](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pulykamell)\ **Post date:** [December 20, 2023, 12:06am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-somebody-explain-oprah-winfrey-to-non-us-americans/994778/125 "2023-12-20T00:06:33Z")
Good article. And, yeah, _very_ different than the career/fame arc of someone like Oprah Winfrey. ---
**Author:** ![chela](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chela/32/21582_2.png) [@chela](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/chela)\ **Post date:** [December 20, 2023, 12:40am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-somebody-explain-oprah-winfrey-to-non-us-americans/994778/126 "2023-12-20T00:40:44Z")
Overall she was a good influence and deserving of her success. > **[What Oprah Knows About Letting Go of Material Possessions](https://www.oprah.com/inspiration/oprah-on-cleaning-out-harpo-studios_1)** > > Oprah says: "It was a monumental purging: letting go of all things Harpo, the studio I built in 1990, three and a half years after 'The Oprah Winfrey Show' went national." ---
**Author:** ![Spice\_Weasel](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/spice_weasel/32/5435_2.png) [@Spice\_Weasel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Spice_Weasel)\ **Post date:** [December 20, 2023, 12:58am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-somebody-explain-oprah-winfrey-to-non-us-americans/994778/127 "2023-12-20T00:58:29Z")
> [@Atamasama](#): > > I had totally forgotten about the beef thing. Yeah, that was a big deal. For the OP, I think it’s critical to understand that at one point in the US, Oprah was so influential that a single one of her shows led to a massive decline in revenue for the beef industry. The podcast definitely goes into how misogynistic and fatphobic the coverage of the lawsuit was, tabloids comparing her to cows, etc. It was not a happy time for her. ---
**Author:** ![madmonk28](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/madmonk28/32/20811_2.png) [@madmonk28](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/madmonk28)\ **Post date:** [December 20, 2023, 1:22am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-somebody-explain-oprah-winfrey-to-non-us-americans/994778/128 "2023-12-20T01:22:41Z")
> [@Spice\_Weasel](#): > > …Oprah was so influential that a single one of her shows led to a massive decline in revenue for the beef industry. Indeed, after her giving air time to anti-vaxers 2007, the percentage of parents refusing or delaying vaccinations for their children rose from 22% to 40%. > **[The Oprah-fication of medicine](https://sciencebasedmedicine.org/the-oprah-fication-of-medicine/)** > > When it comes to quackery, Oprah really is the Queen of All Media. The Secret, Dr. Phil, "America's Quack" Dr. Oz, and Jenny McCarthy all got their start thanks to Oprah, plus a whole lot of New Age n > **[I Regret to Inform You That Oprah Is at It Again](https://welltodo.substack.com/p/i-regret-to-inform-you-that-oprah)** > > Is another Oprah-fueled trend peddling pseudoscience? Plus: the latest wellness news & trends ---
**Author:** ![suranyi](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/e36b37/32.png) [@suranyi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/suranyi)\ **Post date:** [December 20, 2023, 1:43am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-somebody-explain-oprah-winfrey-to-non-us-americans/994778/129 "2023-12-20T01:43:45Z")
Something seems off about those numbers. The state of California [reported (pdf)](https://www.cdph.ca.gov/Programs/CID/DCDC/CDPH%20Document%20Library/Immunization/2021-22KindergartenSummaryReport.pdf) that in 2021 94% of incoming kindergartners had all required immunizations. ---
**Author:** ![madmonk28](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/madmonk28/32/20811_2.png) [@madmonk28](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/madmonk28)\ **Post date:** [December 20, 2023, 1:49am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-somebody-explain-oprah-winfrey-to-non-us-americans/994778/130 "2023-12-20T01:49:22Z")
The numbers are for 2008 after Jenny McCarthy appeared and include parents who delayed recommended vaccinations, but ultimately got them for their children. From another publication that year. Over the past decade, the reputation of childhood vaccines has been severely damaged. The latest blow came during a recent episode of the _Oprah Winfrey Show_ ,1 on which 2 celebrity mothers presented emotional stories about their autistic children and implicated the measles-mumps-rubella vaccine in the cause of their illness. Their stories were told despite ample research that has long since debunked the original article by Wakefield et al2 from 1998 (which linked the vaccine and autism) and the fact that their original article was retracted by the journal (_Lancet_ ) that published it. [https://publications.aap.org/pediatrics/article-abstract/121/3/621/72836/Fighting-for-the-Reputation-of-Vaccines-Lessons?redirectedFrom=fulltext](https://publications.aap.org/pediatrics/article-abstract/121/3/621/72836/Fighting-for-the-Reputation-of-Vaccines-Lessons?redirectedFrom=fulltext) ---
**Author:** ![2outta3](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/2outta3/32/15520_2.png) [@2outta3](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/2outta3)\ **Post date:** [December 20, 2023, 1:50am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-somebody-explain-oprah-winfrey-to-non-us-americans/994778/131 "2023-12-20T01:50:50Z")
Lessee, using your argument then Phil Donahue, Geraldo, Rosie O, Rush Limbaugh, Joe Rogan, et. al. could/can all be accused of promoting quackery, nonsense, fraud, etc. If this is your main criticism of Oprah, then I would guess it has to be a criticism of all day time talk show hosts since she didn’t do anything that the others haven’t done or aren’t doing. ---
**Author:** ![madmonk28](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/madmonk28/32/20811_2.png) [@madmonk28](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/madmonk28)\ **Post date:** [December 20, 2023, 1:56am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-somebody-explain-oprah-winfrey-to-non-us-americans/994778/132 "2023-12-20T01:56:11Z")
It’s not just my argument, it is the argument of a number of medical professionals. Just like Trump, Oprah Winfrey has created a carefully guarded persona that has no relation to reality. In Trump’s case, he pretends to be a successful business man, Oprah’s brand is being an open and nurturing person who actually cares about her fans. In both cases, their followers refuse to believe obvious facts that undermine those images. In fact, Oprah’s anti-vax programming fed directly into Trump’s mishandling of the COVID response. > **[The Anti-vaccination Movement: A Regression in Modern Medicine](https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC6122668/)** > > There have been recent trends of parents in Western countries refusing to vaccinate their children due to numerous reasons and perceived fears. While opposition to vaccines is as old as the vaccines themselves, there has been a recent surge in the... ---
**Author:** ![Eyebrows\_0f\_Doom](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/eyebrows_0f_doom/32/3119_2.png) [@Eyebrows\_0f\_Doom](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Eyebrows_0f_Doom)\ **Post date:** [December 20, 2023, 2:44am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-somebody-explain-oprah-winfrey-to-non-us-americans/994778/133 "2023-12-20T02:44:47Z")
> [@2outta3](#): > > Lessee, using your argument then Phil Donahue, Geraldo, Rosie O, Rush Limbaugh, Joe Rogan, et. al. could/can all be accused of promoting quackery, nonsense, fraud, etc. If this is your main criticism of Oprah, then I would guess it has to be a criticism of all day time talk show hosts since she didn’t do anything that the others haven’t done or aren’t doing. Well, Rush and Rogan _obviously_ promote fraud, nonsense and quackery. Is there a sane person who thinks otherwise? ---
**Author:** ![Duckster](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/duckster/32/1244_2.png) [@Duckster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Duckster)\ **Post date:** [December 20, 2023, 3:14am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-somebody-explain-oprah-winfrey-to-non-us-americans/994778/134 "2023-12-20T03:14:43Z")
> At the centre of Winfrey’s castle of secrecy is a legal requirement that she imposes on anyone who works for her: a confidentiality agreement never to reveal anything about her. Every member of the 500 or so Harpo staff has to sign one, as well as those on the fringes – according to Kelley, that includes caterers, florists, upholsterers, plumbers, and the vets who treat her dogs. The legal restraint lasts for life. > **[The secretive world of Oprah Winfrey](https://www.theguardian.com/tv-and-radio/2010/apr/17/secretive-world-oprah-winfrey)** > > She's the most famous businesswoman in the world, so why does the media clam up when it comes to revelations from her past? > **[10 Strict Rules Oprah Makes Her Staff Follow](https://www.yourtango.com/entertainment/rules-oprahs-staff-must-follow)** > > Lawsuits and controversy come often. > **[Oprah Confidentiality Clause - Not So Confidential](https://www.tmz.com/2010/02/28/oprah-winfrey-confidentiality-clause-lawsuit/)** > > Oprah Winfrey's company specifically told the physical trainers who are suing them to shut their traps about all things Oprah or there would be hell to pay -- it's all in good old fashioned black and white ... and we got a copy. Oprah even demands when you sever the relationship with her, or her company, you cannot keep your copy of the NDA you are required to sign to never, ever say anything about her. ---
**Author:** ![Chronos](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chronos/32/134_2.png) [@Chronos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chronos)\ **Post date:** [December 20, 2023, 3:29am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-somebody-explain-oprah-winfrey-to-non-us-americans/994778/135 "2023-12-20T03:29:11Z")
Lots of talk show hosts have promoted quackery. Oprah has done it much more successfully than most. Which is no surprise, given that she’s been much more successful, in general, than most. ---
**Author:** ![madmonk28](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/madmonk28/32/20811_2.png) [@madmonk28](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/madmonk28)\ **Post date:** [December 20, 2023, 3:39am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-somebody-explain-oprah-winfrey-to-non-us-americans/994778/136 "2023-12-20T03:39:15Z")
So, she shouldn’t be held accountable? ---
**Author:** ![Dr.Drake](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/ad7895/32.png) [@Dr.Drake](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dr.Drake)\ **Post date:** [December 20, 2023, 3:53am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-somebody-explain-oprah-winfrey-to-non-us-americans/994778/137 "2023-12-20T03:53:05Z")
Not like an actual journalist or scientist, no. She should, in and of herself, do better and BE accountable. She clearly is smart but not trained or practiced in seeing through woo. My guess is, like many humans, she is reluctant to admit the magnitude of her mistakes, and if she is aware of them at all hopes to balance it by doing good elsewhere. But it’s certainly not her fault that her viewers are as gullible as they are, and if we’re blaming the rich and powerful for exploiting the gullible, she’s among multitudes. Not that I think she wasn’t wrong: just context. ---
**Author:** ![Measure\_for\_Measure](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/measure_for_measure/32/557_2.png) [@Measure\_for\_Measure](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Measure_for_Measure)\ **Post date:** [December 20, 2023, 5:42am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-somebody-explain-oprah-winfrey-to-non-us-americans/994778/138 "2023-12-20T05:42:25Z")
I’ve never been a fan of Oprah, but I perceive a lot of positivity and little or no dysfunctionality on the home page of her website: [Oprah.com](https://www.oprah.com/index.html) As a control, I’ll compare it with these stories, cherry picked for dysfunction, from the CBS news website: **List of Jeffrey Epstein’s associates must be unsealed, judge rules** At this stage, it’s prurient interest all the way down. **Police believe Philadelphia slashings suspect is “Fairmount Park Rapist,” sources say** This week in mayhem I **French serial killer’s widow convicted for her part in murders** This week in mayhem II. **Celine Dion “has no control of her muscles,” sister says** Celebrity **New details emerge as YouTuber Ruby Franke pleads guilty to child abuse** Celebrity **5 kids home alone die in fire as father is out Christmas shopping, police say** This week in mayhem III. Yeah, I plead guilty: I turn my nose up at the TV news. I have little interest in following Oprah, but I perceive the good outweighing the harm. I opine that a lot of people have leveled up from watching her show, something which is damn rare on TV, outside of PBS. ---
**Author:** ![BigT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bigt/32/12044_2.png) [@BigT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BigT)\ **Post date:** [December 20, 2023, 9:22am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-somebody-explain-oprah-winfrey-to-non-us-americans/994778/139 "2023-12-20T09:22:15Z")
> [@2outta3](#): > > Lessee, using your argument then Phil Donahue, Geraldo, Rosie O, Rush Limbaugh, Joe Rogan, et. al. could/can all be accused of promoting quackery, nonsense, fraud, etc. If this is your main criticism of Oprah, then I would guess it has to be a criticism of all day time talk show hosts since she didn’t do anything that the others haven’t done or aren’t doing. ⁢ So all of these people gave quacks their own TV shows? Because that’s the claim you replied to. I will agree that it is very likely that any long-running talk show will eventually have some woo-promoting guests on them. It’s not great, but these aren’t science shows, and their vetting isn’t always the best. ---
**Author:** ![madmonk28](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/madmonk28/32/20811_2.png) [@madmonk28](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/madmonk28)\ **Post date:** [December 20, 2023, 11:08am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-somebody-explain-oprah-winfrey-to-non-us-americans/994778/140 "2023-12-20T11:08:53Z")
> [@Dr.Drake](#): > > But it’s certainly not her fault that her viewers are as gullible as they are, and if we’re blaming the rich and powerful for exploiting the gullible, she’s among multitudes. Exactly, she’s no better than Trump. I think that a person who helped create the modern anti-vax movement just to make a buck is a bad person. That’s a controversial position for some. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-somebody-explain-oprah-winfrey-to-non-us-americans/994778.md?page=6) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-somebody-explain-oprah-winfrey-to-non-us-americans/994778.md?page=8)