# Can the Democrats win the Alabama senate special election in December? **URL:** \ **Category:** Politics & Elections\ **Created:** [August 13, 2017, 12:49am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-the-democrats-win-the-alabama-senate-special-election-in-december/793504 "2017-08-13T00:49:00Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 53
**Author:** ![TroutMan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/troutman/32/6721_2.png) [@TroutMan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TroutMan)\ **Post date:** [December 12, 2017, 6:32am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-the-democrats-win-the-alabama-senate-special-election-in-december/793504/1041 "2017-12-12T06:32:21Z")
> [@Velocity](#): > > Polling is difficult in this election because it’s a very atypical race. But I think Jones is a slight-to-moderate favorite by this point. It would be a surprise upset if Moore wins. That’s not really true. If you trust Nate Silver, it will be a slight upset if Jones wins. If you trust poll averages, it’s wide open. If you trust Alabama voters to do what Alabama voters always do, it would be a massive upset if Jones wins. ---
**Author:** ![Gyrate](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gyrate/32/3588_2.png) [@Gyrate](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gyrate)\ **Post date:** [December 12, 2017, 9:41am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-the-democrats-win-the-alabama-senate-special-election-in-december/793504/1042 "2017-12-12T09:41:25Z")
> [@Rick\_Kitchen](#): > > [Trump Super PAC Gets 12-Year-Old Girl To Interview Roy Moore](https://www.huffingtonpost.com/entry/trump-super-pac-girl-roy-moore_us_5a2e9698e4b0a290f05255a9) > > See? He didn’t jump her right there in front of the camera, he’s a good guy. > /sarcasm Presumably they couldn’t find any girl older than 12 willing to be in the same room with him. I’m still of the view that Moore will win and the polls are off because lots of people don’t want to be seen to be supporting the unethical scumbag they nonetheless will vote for. ---
**Author:** ![Ludovic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/7ab992/32.png) [@Ludovic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ludovic)\ **Post date:** [December 12, 2017, 12:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-the-democrats-win-the-alabama-senate-special-election-in-december/793504/1043 "2017-12-12T12:01:55Z")
I wouldn’t be surprised either way. There is the shy voter factor but there is also the special election/midterm angry voter factor, especially since Democrats have been outperforming in other special elections. I’m not sure measures of likely voters are accounting for this, since if you ask people, they might not only be too shy to admit they’re a Moore supporter, they might be too shy to admit that they’re too disillusioned to come out and vote and tell the pollsters that the definitely will be coming out to vote for Moore when they won’t. ---
**Author:** ![asahi](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/asahi/32/8693_2.png) [@asahi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/asahi)\ **Post date:** [December 12, 2017, 12:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-the-democrats-win-the-alabama-senate-special-election-in-december/793504/1044 "2017-12-12T12:28:39Z")
> [@Ludovic](#): > > I wouldn’t be surprised either way. There is the shy voter factor but there is also the special election/midterm angry voter factor, especially since Democrats have been outperforming in other special elections. Voters may be angry, but it won’t matter because Alabama is already making sure that many of them will never, ever vote again – ever. I acknowledge that Mother Jones is a left-leaning source, but their facts are accurate and can be found in other publications. > **[Don't blame black voters if Roy Moore wins. Blame this guy.](https://www.motherjones.com/politics/2017/12/the-republican-overseeing-the-alabama-election-doesnt-think-voting-should-be-easy/)** > > "As long as I’m secretary of state of Alabama, you’re going to have to show some initiative to become a registered voter." > [@](#): > > In recent years, Alabama Republicans have taken steps to protect their grip on power by making it harder for African Americans and Latinos to vote. They passed a law requiring voters to show a government-issued photo ID, a measure that has been found to disproportionately disenfranchise African Americans and Latinos, who are more likely to lack such an ID and face impediments to getting one. The ID law also applied to absentee voting, which is used by many elderly black voters in rural counties, who now must mail in copies of their photo IDs with their ballots. (The NAACP Legal Defense Fund is challenging the law in federal court as intentionally discriminatory.) They reformed campaign finance laws to weaken the political organizations that mobilize African American voters. **They closed 31 DMV offices across the state, disproportionately affecting rural majority-black counties. In every county in which African Americans made up more than 75 percent of registered voters, the local DMV was slated for closure. (After a federal civil rights investigation, Alabama agreed to increase DMV service in rural African American counties, partially reversing the closures.) Since the US Supreme Court gutted the Voting Rights Act in 2013, allowing states like Alabama to change voting procedures without federal approval, Alabama has closed about 200 voting precincts, creating longer lines and sowing confusion among voters.** I remember people thought it was hyperbole when I said that we’re heading back to Jim Crow on election night. But I’ve lived in the South. I know its history. I know how people think there. Stripping black people of their rights and their power is a priority for those who vote for a guy like Roy Moore. Don’t think Alabamians or Mississippians would ever vote for watered-down **code noir**? Trust me, they will. And they know that this Justice Department’s Civil Rights division won’t do shit to stop them. ---
**Author:** ![BobLibDem](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/boblibdem/32/3149_2.png) [@BobLibDem](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BobLibDem)\ **Post date:** [December 12, 2017, 1:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-the-democrats-win-the-alabama-senate-special-election-in-december/793504/1045 "2017-12-12T13:17:55Z")
So nice that Mrs. Moore gave an ironclad defense against Roy being anti-Semitic, saying “one of our attorneys is a Jew”. Not to be outdone, the final Moore rally featured [Bill Staehle](https://www.huffingtonpost.com/entry/roy-moore-vietnam-brothel_us_5a2f5432e4b046175432cce3?ncid=inblnkushpmg00000009) relating the totally family-friendly story of how he and Moore wound up at a brothel with young hookers: > [@](#): > > Staehle said he and Moore went to what they were told would be a “private club” to join a fellow soldier who was celebrating the end of his tour of duty. > > The club, he said, turned out to be a brothel. > > “There were certainly pretty girls. And they were girls, and they were young. Some were probably very young, I don’t know,” Staehle said. If that doesn’t seal the deal, I don’t know what will. ---
**Author:** ![Lord\_Feldon](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lord_feldon/32/341_2.png) [@Lord\_Feldon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lord_Feldon)\ **Post date:** [December 12, 2017, 1:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-the-democrats-win-the-alabama-senate-special-election-in-december/793504/1046 "2017-12-12T13:31:15Z")
So the story is that, while responsible for stopping him from violating the law (he was an MP), he watched a fellow soldier go into a brothel filled with “very young” girls. And this shows how moral he is, because he didn’t rape them himself. Maybe he was known for his permissiveness, though. [Oh? He wasn’t:](http://www.montgomeryadvertiser.com/story/news/politics/southunionstreet/2017/09/21/life-wartime-roy-moore-fights-battles-and-often-goes-looking-them/678577001/) > [@](#): > > Moore writes in his autobiography that he was “shocked” at the lack of discipline in the company and began issuing Article 15 charges — common but controversial nonjudicial punishments during the conflict. The soldiers under his command recalled Moore focusing on regulation haircuts and constant salutes, and called him “Captain America,” not meaning it as a compliment. > > “His policies damn near got him killed in Vietnam,” Barrey Hall, who served under Moore, told The Associated Press in 2003. “He was a strutter.” ---
**Author:** ![asahi](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/asahi/32/8693_2.png) [@asahi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/asahi)\ **Post date:** [December 12, 2017, 1:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-the-democrats-win-the-alabama-senate-special-election-in-december/793504/1047 "2017-12-12T13:45:04Z")
I know it’s fun to attack Roy Moore’s past sexual misconduct - I for one never pass up a chance to point out Republican hypocrisy. But the unending chain of epithets and obsession with this issue is a potential trap for Democrats, maybe not in a state that’s most likely going to be won by the GOP no matter what they do, but it could matter in a state like Wisconsin, Pennsylvania, or even the odd House district in a blue state like New York. These are salacious stories, but Democrats need to stay focused on really crank up the “class warfare,” which is our strength. Talking about family values and culture is the GOP strength. ---
**Author:** ![k9bfriender](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/k9bfriender/32/3283_2.png) [@k9bfriender](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/k9bfriender)\ **Post date:** [December 12, 2017, 2:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-the-democrats-win-the-alabama-senate-special-election-in-december/793504/1048 "2017-12-12T14:12:42Z")
Originally Posted by Kim Wyatt Boothe, 37, stay-at-home mom … I’m a Christian. I raise my children as Christians and we study the Bible and its foundation. **I’m so thankful I have somebody that I can support that understands how important it is to put God back into our government.** Seems someone’s a fan of sharia law. ---
**Author:** ![Elendil\_s\_Heir](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/7cd45c/32.png) [@Elendil\_s\_Heir](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Elendil_s_Heir)\ **Post date:** [December 12, 2017, 2:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-the-democrats-win-the-alabama-senate-special-election-in-december/793504/1049 "2017-12-12T14:45:05Z")
> [@k9bfriender](#): > > Originally Posted by Kim Wyatt Boothe, 37, stay-at-home mom > … I’m a Christian. I raise my children as Christians and we study the Bible and its foundation. **I’m so thankful I have somebody that I can support that understands how important it is to put God back into our government.** > > Seems someone’s a fan of sharia law. Different God, silly. ---
**Author:** ![asahi](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/asahi/32/8693_2.png) [@asahi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/asahi)\ **Post date:** [December 12, 2017, 2:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-the-democrats-win-the-alabama-senate-special-election-in-december/793504/1050 "2017-12-12T14:53:39Z")
> [@k9bfriender](#): > > Originally Posted by Kim Wyatt Boothe, 37, stay-at-home mom > … I’m a Christian. I raise my children as Christians and we study the Bible and its foundation. **I’m so thankful I have somebody that I can support that understands how important it is to put God back into our government.** > > Seems someone’s a fan of sharia law. The Alaban. ---
**Author:** ![Monocracy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/monocracy/32/4493_2.png) [@Monocracy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Monocracy)\ **Post date:** [December 12, 2017, 3:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-the-democrats-win-the-alabama-senate-special-election-in-december/793504/1051 "2017-12-12T15:00:45Z")
If I were on the $25,000 Pyramid, and the clue was “Things a racist would say”, my first clue would be “Some of my best friends are black.” I cannot believe that Roy Moore’s wife said that with a straight face. It was kind of an underground joke in the 90s, but by the end of the 00s, I thought everyone was aware of it. In 2017, how can someone still trot that line out and not be aware of what it means? And the defense against antisemitism, “Our attorney is Jewish.” That had to be a joke. It was a pretty tasteless joke given the context, but there is no way she could have said that with serious intentions. It’s too off-the-wall. > **['Wow': Don Lemon speechless after Roy Moore's wife insists they're not...](https://www.rawstory.com/2017/12/wow-don-lemon-speechless-after-roy-moores-wife-insists-theyre-not-anti-semitic-because-they-have-a-jewish-lawyer/)** > > A bewildered Don Lemon on Monday reacted to Kayla Moore’s claim that she and her husband, GOP Senate candidate Roy Moore, are not anti-Semitic because their lawyer is Jewish, and the result was an instant classic.Lemon played a clip of Kayla and... ---
**Author:** ![Saint\_Cad](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/saint_cad/32/18907_2.png) [@Saint\_Cad](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Saint_Cad)\ **Post date:** [December 12, 2017, 3:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-the-democrats-win-the-alabama-senate-special-election-in-december/793504/1052 "2017-12-12T15:22:40Z")
I think that the fact that Moore may win this speaks to the Alabama Republicans and how they want to prove every Southern Alt-Right stereotype true. BUT what does it say about the Alabama Democrats if they could win this election yet Jones loses on low Dem turnout? ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [December 12, 2017, 3:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-the-democrats-win-the-alabama-senate-special-election-in-december/793504/1053 "2017-12-12T15:44:17Z")
Moore is going to win. The Republicans have shown us in the last couple of years that no matter how much of an ass their candidate is, no matter how much they publically decry that ass of a candidate, when push comes to shove they _will_ get on their knees and kiss that ass. ---
**Author:** ![BobLibDem](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/boblibdem/32/3149_2.png) [@BobLibDem](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BobLibDem)\ **Post date:** [December 12, 2017, 3:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-the-democrats-win-the-alabama-senate-special-election-in-december/793504/1054 "2017-12-12T15:58:51Z")
> [@Czarcasm](#): > > Moore is going to win. The Republicans have shown us in the last couple of years that no matter how much of an ass their candidate is, no matter how much they publically decry that ass of a candidate, when push comes to shove they _will_ get on their knees and kiss that ass. Too true. The term tribalism has gotten a lot of play but that’s where we’re at. ---
**Author:** ![The\_Stainless\_Steel\_Rat](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/the_stainless_steel_rat/32/5727_2.png) [@The\_Stainless\_Steel\_Rat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Stainless_Steel_Rat)\ **Post date:** [December 12, 2017, 4:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-the-democrats-win-the-alabama-senate-special-election-in-december/793504/1055 "2017-12-12T16:15:57Z")
Well, I voted (for Jones and to renew the School tax levies). Only one precinct, but it was busy (but not overcrowded, just a steady stream of people). Each precinct (AFAICT) has around 2,700 voters, and by 10:00am about 850 had voted there, which given another nine hours of voting, indicates that it’ll be heavier than normal for a special election, But who is coming out–voters disgusted with Moore, or voters against any Democrat? Time will tell. ---
**Author:** ![RTFirefly](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/c77e96/32.png) [@RTFirefly](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RTFirefly)\ **Post date:** [December 12, 2017, 4:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-the-democrats-win-the-alabama-senate-special-election-in-december/793504/1056 "2017-12-12T16:47:20Z")
> [@DSYoungEsq](#): > > Now you know the curse of being retired. I’m eager to be accursed in this manner. Just a few more years! ---
**Author:** ![ElvisL1ves](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/5daacb/32.png) [@ElvisL1ves](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ElvisL1ves)\ **Post date:** [December 12, 2017, 4:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-the-democrats-win-the-alabama-senate-special-election-in-december/793504/1057 "2017-12-12T16:49:29Z")
> [@DSYoungEsq](#): > > OMG. Now you know the curse of being retired. :embarrassed: Isn’t the curse that all retirees are required to go work the polls every Election Day? ---
**Author:** ![Velocity](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/velocity/32/18006_2.png) [@Velocity](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Velocity)\ **Post date:** [December 12, 2017, 4:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-the-democrats-win-the-alabama-senate-special-election-in-december/793504/1058 "2017-12-12T16:53:45Z")
> [@The\_Stainless\_Steel\_Rat](#): > > Well, I voted (for Jones and to renew the School tax levies). Only one precinct, but it was busy (but not overcrowded, just a steady stream of people). Each precinct (AFAICT) has around 2,700 voters, and by 10:00am about 850 had voted there, which given another nine hours of voting, indicates that it’ll be heavier than normal for a special election, But who is coming out–voters disgusted with Moore, or voters against any Democrat? > > Time will tell. Might break local records for voter turnout. ---
**Author:** ![Miller](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/miller/32/481_2.png) [@Miller](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Miller)\ **Post date:** [December 12, 2017, 4:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-the-democrats-win-the-alabama-senate-special-election-in-december/793504/1059 "2017-12-12T16:57:52Z")
> [@Monocracy](#): > > If I were on the $25,000 Pyramid, and the clue was “Things a racist would say”, my first clue would be “Some of my best friends are black.” I cannot believe that Roy Moore’s wife said that with a straight face. It was kind of an underground joke in the 90s, but by the end of the 00s, I thought everyone was aware of it. In 2017, how can someone still trot that line out and not be aware of what it means? > > And the defense against antisemitism, “Our attorney is Jewish.” That had to be a joke. It was a pretty tasteless joke given the context, but there is no way she could have said that with serious intentions. It’s too off-the-wall. > > ['Wow': Don Lemon speechless after Roy Moore's wife insists they're not anti-Semitic because they have a Jewish lawyer - Raw Story](https://www.rawstory.com/2017/12/wow-don-lemon-speechless-after-roy-moores-wife-insists-theyre-not-anti-semitic-because-they-have-a-jewish-lawyer/) Have there been stories about Moore being anti Semitic? His wife’s bragging on having a Jewish attorney is the first I’d heard of the subject. ---
**Author:** ![RTFirefly](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/c77e96/32.png) [@RTFirefly](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RTFirefly)\ **Post date:** [December 12, 2017, 5:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-the-democrats-win-the-alabama-senate-special-election-in-december/793504/1060 "2017-12-12T17:01:19Z")
> [@Monocracy](#): > > If I were on the $25,000 Pyramid, and the clue was “Things a racist would say”, my first clue would be “Some of my best friends are black.” I cannot believe that Roy Moore’s wife said that with a straight face. It was kind of an underground joke in the 90s, but by the end of the 00s, I thought everyone was aware of it. Hell, people were already being ridiculed for using that line back in the 1960s. And then there was Steve Bannon. For possibly the first time ever, I have to agree with something [Erick Erickson tweeted](https://twitter.com/EWErickson/status/940576081945522176) this morning: > [@](#): > > Y’all, there have been lots of warning signs that Steve Bannon isn’t the political genius he claims to be. But you need look no further than him going to Alabama to brag that he went to the Ivy League and @JoeNBC only went to the University of Alabama. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-the-democrats-win-the-alabama-senate-special-election-in-december/793504.md?page=52) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-the-democrats-win-the-alabama-senate-special-election-in-december/793504.md?page=54)