# Can the Democrats win the Alabama senate special election in December? **URL:** \ **Category:** Politics & Elections\ **Created:** [August 13, 2017, 12:49am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-the-democrats-win-the-alabama-senate-special-election-in-december/793504 "2017-08-13T00:49:00Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 70
**Author:** ![GreysonCarlisle](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/a87d85/32.png) [@GreysonCarlisle](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GreysonCarlisle)\ **Post date:** [December 13, 2017, 8:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-the-democrats-win-the-alabama-senate-special-election-in-december/793504/1381 "2017-12-13T20:15:38Z")
> [@Chronos](#): > > Some have debated whether it would have been better for Democrats, long-term, to win or lose this seat. I think it’s pretty clearly better that we won it. It makes it a whole lot more likely that we’ll take the Senate in 2018, which is a big deal. We almost certainly won’t still hold onto this seat in 2020, but that’s OK, because by then, we’ll have enough other opportunities to reinforce a lead. I think that it would have been a loss to the Republicans either way. But, like you, I think it’s better that Jones won this election. My reasoning is different, though. This election wasn’t just about red v. blue. It was about noxious beliefs versus decency. Decency won, though just barely, and those noxious beliefs that have so long been espoused by those in power are now under attack. Will that help bring a big blue wave in 2018? I hope so. But the fresh air and sunshine brought about by this election will persist well beyond 2018 or 2020. ---
**Author:** ![sweepkick](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/87869e/32.png) [@sweepkick](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/sweepkick)\ **Post date:** [December 13, 2017, 8:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-the-democrats-win-the-alabama-senate-special-election-in-december/793504/1382 "2017-12-13T20:36:54Z")
Really glad to see that Alabama did the right thing, the results have restored a bit of faith in humanity. I guess we can now get down to business with the compulsory abortions. ---
**Author:** ![HurricaneDitka](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/96bed5/32.png) [@HurricaneDitka](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/HurricaneDitka)\ **Post date:** [December 13, 2017, 8:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-the-democrats-win-the-alabama-senate-special-election-in-december/793504/1383 "2017-12-13T20:42:26Z")
> [@Euphonious\_Polemic](#): > > Oh sure, BUSINESS friendly. … That was my point. Manda JO said: > [@MandaJo](#): > > … if he’s seen as a business-friendly Democrat. … ---
**Author:** ![Rick\_Kitchen](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/rick_kitchen/32/522_2.png) [@Rick\_Kitchen](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rick_Kitchen)\ **Post date:** [December 13, 2017, 8:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-the-democrats-win-the-alabama-senate-special-election-in-december/793504/1384 "2017-12-13T20:42:31Z")
Next question is, will Moore run in 2020? Will he run for Governor or Senator? Is Ivey one of the not-Tea-party-enough Republicans the Moore-istas want to run against in the primary? ---
**Author:** ![Happy\_Lendervedder](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/happy_lendervedder/32/8488_2.png) [@Happy\_Lendervedder](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Happy_Lendervedder)\ **Post date:** [December 13, 2017, 9:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-the-democrats-win-the-alabama-senate-special-election-in-december/793504/1385 "2017-12-13T21:03:20Z")
> [@sweepkick](#): > > Really glad to see that Alabama did the right thing, the results have restored a bit of faith in humanity. > > I guess we can now get down to business with the compulsory abortions. Huzzah! ---
**Author:** ![Telemark](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/telemark/32/372_2.png) [@Telemark](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Telemark)\ **Post date:** [December 13, 2017, 9:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-the-democrats-win-the-alabama-senate-special-election-in-december/793504/1386 "2017-12-13T21:25:55Z")
> [@Rick\_Kitchen](#): > > Next question is, will Moore run in 2020? He’s still waiting on a call back from God. ---
**Author:** ![Sherrerd](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/sherrerd/32/8_2.png) [@Sherrerd](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sherrerd)\ **Post date:** [December 13, 2017, 9:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-the-democrats-win-the-alabama-senate-special-election-in-december/793504/1387 "2017-12-13T21:28:58Z")
> [@GreysonCarlisle](#): > > This election wasn’t just about red v. blue. It was about noxious beliefs versus decency. Decency won, though just barely, and those noxious beliefs that have so long been espoused by those in power are now under attack. … Yes. And more specifically, the nihilistic anti-democratic chaos merchant Steve Bannon has received a black eye, to add to his gin nose. He’ll make excuses for himself. But his major self-promotion point has been ‘I get people elected,’ and that claim has now been exploded. Bannon going back to being a fringe figure is a win for the USA. ---
**Author:** ![Blue\_Blistering\_Barnacle](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/blue_blistering_barnacle/32/3386_2.png) [@Blue\_Blistering\_Barnacle](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Blue_Blistering_Barnacle)\ **Post date:** [December 13, 2017, 9:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-the-democrats-win-the-alabama-senate-special-election-in-december/793504/1388 "2017-12-13T21:38:46Z")
> [@Sherrerd](#): > > Yes. And more specifically, the nihilistic anti-democratic chaos merchant Steve Bannon has received a black eye, to add to his gin nose. > > He’ll make excuses for himself. But his major self-promotion point has been ‘I get people elected,’ and that claim has now been exploded. > > Bannon going back to being a fringe figure is a win for the USA. +1 ---
**Author:** ![bobot](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bobot/32/21622_2.png) [@bobot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bobot)\ **Post date:** [December 13, 2017, 9:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-the-democrats-win-the-alabama-senate-special-election-in-december/793504/1389 "2017-12-13T21:44:22Z")
> [@EndlessEntropy](#): > > Looks like the Republican frontrunner, Roy Moore, has issues with a suspension, ethics codes violations, interference, and authority abuse. Doug Jones looks like a solid choice for the Democrats and if the turnout is favorable for Democrats and underwhelming for the Republicans, maybe the Democrats can win. > > What will it take for a W? Above is the OP. I applaud your optimism for even posing this question. I wouldn’t have thunk it possible, but your vision of there even being a possibility is worthy of applause. The actual outcome demands it! ---
**Author:** ![TroutMan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/troutman/32/6721_2.png) [@TroutMan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TroutMan)\ **Post date:** [December 13, 2017, 9:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-the-democrats-win-the-alabama-senate-special-election-in-december/793504/1390 "2017-12-13T21:52:56Z")
If Doug Jones is doomed to lose the seat in 2020, put him on the ballot for president. ---
**Author:** ![FlikTheBlue](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/fliktheblue/32/10972_2.png) [@FlikTheBlue](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/FlikTheBlue)\ **Post date:** [December 13, 2017, 10:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-the-democrats-win-the-alabama-senate-special-election-in-december/793504/1391 "2017-12-13T22:15:27Z")
> [@adaher](#): > > Then explain what you meant. What’s been wrong with Alabama since the 80s? Saying that something has been wrong with Alabama since the 80s implies things were better before that. I think there was a time in parts of the South where things used to be better than they are now. I might have said 90s instead of 80s, but back then people in the South would elect moderate left Democrats. People like Anne Richards, Lloyd Bentsen, and Bill Clinton all won back in those days. That all changed in the 90s. I suspect that if Doug Jones and Roy Moore ran with their same records back in say, 1986, Doug Jones would have likely won by 20 or 30 points, even in Alabama. ---
**Author:** ![sweepkick](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/87869e/32.png) [@sweepkick](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/sweepkick)\ **Post date:** [December 13, 2017, 10:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-the-democrats-win-the-alabama-senate-special-election-in-december/793504/1392 "2017-12-13T22:24:57Z")
> [@FlikTheBlue](#): > > I think there was a time in parts of the South where things used to be better than they are now. I might have said 90s instead of 80s, but back then people in the South would elect moderate left Democrats. People like Anne Richards, Lloyd Bentsen, and Bill Clinton all won back in those days. That all changed in the 90s. I suspect that if Doug Jones and Roy Moore ran with their same records back in say, 1986, Doug Jones would have likely won by 20 or 30 points, even in Alabama. Coincidentally or not, Fox News and the rise of right-wing hate media began around that same time period. ---
**Author:** ![nate](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/nate/32/13085_2.png) [@nate](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/nate)\ **Post date:** [December 13, 2017, 10:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-the-democrats-win-the-alabama-senate-special-election-in-december/793504/1393 "2017-12-13T22:33:53Z")
> [@Aspenglow](#): > > I’d really love to hear how **nate** is feeling tonight. He made a very poignant post somewhere in the forum recently, maybe even in this thread, about what it’s been like as a more progressive person living in Alabama. I hope tonight’s results lift his spirits some. Thanks for asking! Yes, I feel elated and last night was wonderful. I spent the evening lifting weights with the NYT real-time results pulled up on my phone and followed the roller coaster ride with everyone else I’m sure. I know any other half-sane republican would have won by 10+ pts, but I have a little more faith in humanity now that there is proof actual deal breakers exist. It helps also that today at work I found out a few of my conservative colleagues actually had write-in votes (at least two for Nick Saban, one for some marine that was running as a write-in candidate) so maybe my guilt-trip-filled talks with these guys had some sway. ---
**Author:** ![FlikTheBlue](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/fliktheblue/32/10972_2.png) [@FlikTheBlue](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/FlikTheBlue)\ **Post date:** [December 13, 2017, 10:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-the-democrats-win-the-alabama-senate-special-election-in-december/793504/1394 "2017-12-13T22:38:33Z")
> [@sweepkick](#): > > Coincidentally or not, Fox News and the rise of right-wing hate media began around that same time period. It seems like it fell apart in 1994 when Newt Gingrich made his contract with America. I’m not really sure what exactly changed on the ground that made the regular voters in the South give up on electing moderate Democrats, but if I had to pin down a date that’s the one I would give. ---
**Author:** ![adaher](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/dec6dc/32.png) [@adaher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/adaher)\ **Post date:** [December 13, 2017, 10:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-the-democrats-win-the-alabama-senate-special-election-in-december/793504/1395 "2017-12-13T22:48:51Z")
> [@FlikTheBlue](#): > > I think there was a time in parts of the South where things used to be better than they are now. I might have said 90s instead of 80s, but back then people in the South would elect moderate left Democrats. People like Anne Richards, Lloyd Bentsen, and Bill Clinton all won back in those days. That all changed in the 90s. I suspect that if Doug Jones and Roy Moore ran with their same records back in say, 1986, Doug Jones would have likely won by 20 or 30 points, even in Alabama. That’s not because the politics wasn’t less toxic, but because in the 80s and 90s Democrats were more willing to compromise with white grievance. Even in his national campaign, Clinton was pro death penalty, wanted to reform affirmative action and welfare, and tough on crime. When a REpublican favored those things, he was accused of dog whistling. When a Democrat did it, they were moderate. ---
**Author:** ![adaher](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/dec6dc/32.png) [@adaher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/adaher)\ **Post date:** [December 13, 2017, 10:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-the-democrats-win-the-alabama-senate-special-election-in-december/793504/1396 "2017-12-13T22:51:48Z")
> [@FlikTheBlue](#): > > It seems like it fell apart in 1994 when Newt Gingrich made his contract with America. I’m not really sure what exactly changed on the ground that made the regular voters in the South give up on electing moderate Democrats, but if I had to pin down a date that’s the one I would give. The South actually continued to elect moderate Democrats after that. It really didn’t end until Obama was elected President. Then they pretty much all got fired. I think that has more to do with a Democratic Party that doesn’t feel like compromising with the South’s culture anymore. In many ways that’s actually admirable. The baleful influence of the South on Republican politics is a good part of what made it harder and harder to be a Republican. ---
**Author:** ![ThelmaLou](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/thelmalou/32/390_2.png) [@ThelmaLou](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ThelmaLou)\ **Post date:** [December 13, 2017, 11:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-the-democrats-win-the-alabama-senate-special-election-in-december/793504/1397 "2017-12-13T23:59:23Z")
Will Mitch keep Jones from being seated until after the vote on the tax bill? ---
**Author:** ![wonky](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/wonky/32/393_2.png) [@wonky](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/wonky)\ **Post date:** [December 14, 2017, 12:03am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-the-democrats-win-the-alabama-senate-special-election-in-december/793504/1398 "2017-12-14T00:03:09Z")
> [@ThelmaLou](#): > > Will Mitch keep Jones from being seated until after the vote on the tax bill? No. Jones will not be able to join the Senate before the end of December because the result will not be certified yet. But McConnell would have the option of holding up the Senate vote to wait for Jones. Harry Reid did that in 2010 when Scott Brown was elected in a special election. McConnell is not likely to follow Reid’s lead. Lots of nice clips of McConnell, Collins, McCain, and others demanding that Reid wait because the Brown election was a referendum! Let the people be heard! Now Collins says there’s no reason to wait for Jones to be able to vote. ---
**Author:** ![HurricaneDitka](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/96bed5/32.png) [@HurricaneDitka](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/HurricaneDitka)\ **Post date:** [December 14, 2017, 12:12am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-the-democrats-win-the-alabama-senate-special-election-in-december/793504/1399 "2017-12-14T00:12:48Z")
> [@wonky](#): > > Harry Reid did that in 2010 when Scott Brown was elected in a special election. Ummm … not really. Because of Brown’s election, the House just passed the Senate version of the ACA (avoiding the need for another Senate vote on the bill, which the Republicans would then be in a position to filibuster) and then they amended it via reconciliation, again to avoid a filibuster made possible through Brown’s victory. ---
**Author:** ![tomndebb](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/b9e5f3/32.png) [@tomndebb](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tomndebb)\ **Post date:** [December 14, 2017, 1:48am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-the-democrats-win-the-alabama-senate-special-election-in-december/793504/1400 "2017-12-14T01:48:04Z")
> [@Euphonious\_Polemic](#): > > No, you made most of that up. He never said that. You’re not telling the truth here. Do you have some kind of “get out of sin free” card for that? Pointing out errors in a post is acceptable. Claiming that the errors were “made up” by the poster is an accusation of lying and is prohibited. This is a Warning to refrain from such language in the future. [/Moderating] [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-the-democrats-win-the-alabama-senate-special-election-in-december/793504.md?page=69) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-the-democrats-win-the-alabama-senate-special-election-in-december/793504.md?page=71)