# Can the government listen to cell phone conversations when the phone is turned off? **URL:** \ **Category:** Factual Questions\ **Created:** [May 20, 2010, 4:27am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-the-government-listen-to-cell-phone-conversations-when-the-phone-is-turned-off/540101 "2010-05-20T04:27:31Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![Drum\_God](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/drum_god/32/44_2.png) [@Drum\_God](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Drum_God)\ **Post date:** [May 20, 2010, 4:27am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-the-government-listen-to-cell-phone-conversations-when-the-phone-is-turned-off/540101/1 "2010-05-20T04:27:31Z")
… or on, for that matter? [YouTube clip](http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Y4TkTjSMuYE) of a Fox News report says that the FBI can eavesdrop on conversations even when your cell phone is turned off. The story claims that it has something to do with the GPS chip in the phone. This sounds like complete and utter crap to me. [ul] [li]Why would the government want to do this? Any info gleaned this way would not be admissible in court.[/li][li]Why would phone companies want to cooperate with this?[/li][li]Why would phone manufacturers want to cooperate with this?[/li][li]How would a GPS chip be used in this way? The GPS satellites don’t communicate with individual receivers, do they?[/li][li]Is there any shred of truth to this?[/li][/ul] I did hold my stomach and search the Fox News website for a few minutes, but I could not find a direct link there to this story. I could only stand to look at Fox News for a few minutes, so it may be there and I didn’t find it. ---
**Author:** ![Adroit](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/df788c/32.png) [@Adroit](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Adroit)\ **Post date:** [May 20, 2010, 4:43am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-the-government-listen-to-cell-phone-conversations-when-the-phone-is-turned-off/540101/2 "2010-05-20T04:43:46Z")
How can you have a conversation with your phone off? ---
**Author:** ![Chessic\_Sense](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/7c8e57/32.png) [@Chessic\_Sense](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chessic_Sense)\ **Post date:** [May 20, 2010, 4:46am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-the-government-listen-to-cell-phone-conversations-when-the-phone-is-turned-off/540101/3 "2010-05-20T04:46:57Z")
> [@Drum\_God](#): > > [ul] > [li]Why would the government want to do this? Any info gleaned this way would not be admissible in court.[/li][li]Why would phone companies want to cooperate with this?[/li][li]Why would phone manufacturers want to cooperate with this?[/li][li]How would a GPS chip be used in this way? The GPS satellites don’t communicate with individual receivers, do they?[/li][li]Is there any shred of truth to this?[/li][/ul] You seem to be under the impression that such tactics would only be useful in a law enforcement setting. There’s nothing to submit to a court when I just want to tell the Predator drone where to shoot. ---
**Author:** ![xash](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/x/c6cbf5/32.png) [@xash](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/xash)\ **Post date:** [May 20, 2010, 5:19am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-the-government-listen-to-cell-phone-conversations-when-the-phone-is-turned-off/540101/4 "2010-05-20T05:19:13Z")
Here’s an app that can do it on the iPhone: [http://www.ilocalis.com/](http://www.ilocalis.com/) So, technically it can be done. Note that your phone needs to be truly powered off (not just on standby mode with the screen off), to prevent any software from recording ambient sounds remotely. ETA: GPS has nothing to do with it. ETA2: Someone would need physical access to your device (or access through a security exploit) in order to install the spy software on your phone. There has been a recent alarm in India over China bugging telecom equipment sold to Indian companies, which was then used for espionage. So, if a chip or phone manufacturer wants to cooperate with law enforcement or espionage agencies, there is nothing to prevent them physically from doing it. ---
**Author:** ![Dervorin](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/eb8c5e/32.png) [@Dervorin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dervorin)\ **Post date:** [May 20, 2010, 6:11am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-the-government-listen-to-cell-phone-conversations-when-the-phone-is-turned-off/540101/5 "2010-05-20T06:11:06Z")
> [@Adroit](#): > > How can you have a conversation with your phone off? I had the same question when I read the title, but then I realised the OP meant ambient conversations rather than ones being had specifically using the phone. Random eavesdropping, if you like. ---
**Author:** ![Adroit](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/df788c/32.png) [@Adroit](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Adroit)\ **Post date:** [May 20, 2010, 6:16am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-the-government-listen-to-cell-phone-conversations-when-the-phone-is-turned-off/540101/6 "2010-05-20T06:16:47Z")
> [@Dervorin](#): > > I had the same question when I read the title, but then I realised the OP meant ambient conversations rather than ones being had specifically using the phone. Random eavesdropping, if you like. So the phone even when turned off, is able to record conversation near by… :dubious:I doubt it… ---
**Author:** ![ParentalAdvisory](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/53a042/32.png) [@ParentalAdvisory](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ParentalAdvisory)\ **Post date:** [May 20, 2010, 7:48am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-the-government-listen-to-cell-phone-conversations-when-the-phone-is-turned-off/540101/7 "2010-05-20T07:48:55Z")
> **[Covert listening device](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Covert_listening_device)** > > A covert listening device, more commonly known as a bug or a wire, is usually a combination of a miniature radio transmitter with a microphone. The use of bugs, called bugging, or wiretapping is a common technique in surveillance, espionage and police investigations. > Self-contained electronic covert listening devices came into common use with intelligence agencies in the 1950s, when technology allowed for a suitable transmitter to be built into a relatively small package. By 1956, the US Centra... ---
**Author:** ![Deflagration](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/3ab097/32.png) [@Deflagration](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Deflagration)\ **Post date:** [May 20, 2010, 9:31am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-the-government-listen-to-cell-phone-conversations-when-the-phone-is-turned-off/540101/8 "2010-05-20T09:31:46Z")
The answer is yes (and no). How we do it is to install software on the phone to make it appear off when turned off and appear on when turned on. It can then be tracked (like a gps) using the cell phone towers in the normal way. An incoming connection (used for listening) can also be made without the phone ringing or showing any visible signs of activity. So if it’s meant to be off it still appears off and if on, does not show the incoming call. The downside is that the phone still consumes battery when supposedly off. And all the fun and games stop if you just remove your battery. The only way around this is for us to gain physical access to your phone and install an additional hardware ‘bug’. ---
**Author:** ![Gary\_Robson](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gary_robson/32/3448_2.png) [@Gary\_Robson](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gary_Robson)\ **Post date:** [May 20, 2010, 2:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-the-government-listen-to-cell-phone-conversations-when-the-phone-is-turned-off/540101/9 "2010-05-20T14:43:07Z")
“We”? ---
**Author:** ![Baron\_Greenback](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/baron_greenback/32/48_2.png) [@Baron\_Greenback](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Baron_Greenback)\ **Post date:** [May 20, 2010, 2:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-the-government-listen-to-cell-phone-conversations-when-the-phone-is-turned-off/540101/10 "2010-05-20T14:45:47Z")
“us”? Edit lol great minds… ---
**Author:** ![Swallowed\_My\_Cellphone](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/9d8465/32.png) [@Swallowed\_My\_Cellphone](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Swallowed_My_Cellphone)\ **Post date:** [May 20, 2010, 2:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-the-government-listen-to-cell-phone-conversations-when-the-phone-is-turned-off/540101/11 "2010-05-20T14:46:45Z")
[quote=“Gary “Wombat” Robson, post:9, topic:540101”] “We”? [/QUOTE] He’s one of “them”. ---
**Author:** ![Sunspace](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/sunspace/32/1250_2.png) [@Sunspace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sunspace)\ **Post date:** [May 20, 2010, 4:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-the-government-listen-to-cell-phone-conversations-when-the-phone-is-turned-off/540101/12 "2010-05-20T16:15:12Z")
> [@Swallowed\_My\_Cellphone](#): > > He’s one of “them”. _He_’s the “they” in “they say…”?!! ---
**Author:** ![purplehorseshoe](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/purplehorseshoe/32/2996_2.png) [@purplehorseshoe](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/purplehorseshoe)\ **Post date:** [May 20, 2010, 4:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-the-government-listen-to-cell-phone-conversations-when-the-phone-is-turned-off/540101/13 "2010-05-20T16:21:46Z")
Anyone else read \*\*Deflagration’s \*\*post and hear it in [Michael Weston’s](http://www.usanetwork.com/series/burnnotice/)voiceover voice? ---
**Author:** ![Rhythmdvl](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/85f322/32.png) [@Rhythmdvl](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rhythmdvl)\ **Post date:** [May 20, 2010, 4:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-the-government-listen-to-cell-phone-conversations-when-the-phone-is-turned-off/540101/14 "2010-05-20T16:21:59Z")
He’s on first? ---
**Author:** ![mlees](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/ba8739/32.png) [@mlees](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/mlees)\ **Post date:** [May 20, 2010, 5:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-the-government-listen-to-cell-phone-conversations-when-the-phone-is-turned-off/540101/15 "2010-05-20T17:12:10Z")
You’re no longer part of the System. You’re above the System. Over it. Beyond it. We are “them.” "They " are us. ---
**Author:** ![blindboyard](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/blindboyard/32/2833_2.png) [@blindboyard](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/blindboyard)\ **Post date:** [May 20, 2010, 7:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-the-government-listen-to-cell-phone-conversations-when-the-phone-is-turned-off/540101/16 "2010-05-20T19:07:27Z")
Google “roving bug” should you be wanting information on this topics. ---
**Author:** ![Leaffan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/leaffan/32/299_2.png) [@Leaffan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Leaffan)\ **Post date:** [May 20, 2010, 7:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-the-government-listen-to-cell-phone-conversations-when-the-phone-is-turned-off/540101/17 "2010-05-20T19:14:06Z")
> [@mlees](#): > > You’re no longer part of the System. You’re above the System. Over it. Beyond it. We are “them.” "They " are us. And we are all together… ---
**Author:** ![Bricker](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/977dab/32.png) [@Bricker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bricker)\ **Post date:** [May 20, 2010, 7:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-the-government-listen-to-cell-phone-conversations-when-the-phone-is-turned-off/540101/18 "2010-05-20T19:17:50Z")
I am the Eggman. ---
**Author:** ![Autolycus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/22d042/32.png) [@Autolycus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Autolycus)\ **Post date:** [May 20, 2010, 10:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-the-government-listen-to-cell-phone-conversations-when-the-phone-is-turned-off/540101/19 "2010-05-20T22:12:35Z")
> [@Bricker](#): > > I am the Eggman. They are the Eggmen. ---
**Author:** ![hibernicus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/hibernicus/32/2802_2.png) [@hibernicus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/hibernicus)\ **Post date:** [May 20, 2010, 10:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-the-government-listen-to-cell-phone-conversations-when-the-phone-is-turned-off/540101/20 "2010-05-20T22:20:33Z")
> [@Deflagration](#): > > How we do it is to install software on the phone to make it appear off when turned off and appear on when turned on. That’s worrying - my phone behaves exactly like that. So does my TV and my electric toothbrush. How can I remove this software from all my household appliances? [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-the-government-listen-to-cell-phone-conversations-when-the-phone-is-turned-off/540101.md?page=2)