# Can things get any stranger? French fries are now "freedom fries" **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [March 12, 2003, 1:45am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-things-get-any-stranger-french-fries-are-now-freedom-fries/160711 "2003-03-12T01:45:00Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![leander](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/bcef8e/32.png) [@leander](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/leander)\ **Post date:** [March 12, 2003, 11:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-things-get-any-stranger-french-fries-are-now-freedom-fries/160711/41 "2003-03-12T23:38:45Z")
[slight hijack] > [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by sturmhauke \* > \*\*I think Cecil pretty convincingly addressed both your points in that article. Do you have a counter-cite? \*\* Actually, Cecil didn’t write the article; SD Staff Dex did. So you can’t blame The Perfect Master. Here’s the [thread](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?threadid=133520) arguing the origin of fries. And here’s an [article](http://csmweb2.emcweb.com/durable/2001/05/16/fp16s1-csm.shtml) (from said thread) claiming that the origin is Belgian not France. Frankly, I don’t see how anyone could think Dex “convincingly addressed” the points; seemed a rather lame “straight dope” with few sources and cites, and weak arguments. [/slight hijack] As to the OP, I find it ironic that we are now associating “French” fries with “freedom.” In other words, whenever I think of the “French” in fries, I’ll think of freedom… ---
**Author:** ![ultrafilter](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/3d9bf3/32.png) [@ultrafilter](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ultrafilter)\ **Post date:** [March 13, 2003, 1:17am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-things-get-any-stranger-french-fries-are-now-freedom-fries/160711/42 "2003-03-13T01:17:32Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by feath \* > \*\*A perfect example of how number lie…or can be ‘tweeked’. > > ‘43%’ want freedom fries. You added 14% of the 23% of ‘none’…makeing it 57%. - a CLEAR majority! > (apposed to ‘33%’ with the left over 9% of the 23% of the ‘none’ which makes ‘42%’) > > At least site the real numbers. 4 out of 10 people want freedom frys. This is NOT a clear majority. 3 out of 10 people want french. 2 out of 10 dont care. (1% is fractioned out over them all) \*\* That’s not how renormalization (a very standard process) works. To renormalize, you take the categories you’re interested in, sum up to get the total percentage recommended, and divide each value by that. I added 43% and 33% together to get 76%. 43%/76% is 56.5%, and 33%/76% is 43.5%. In other words, of the people who want some kind of fried potatoes, 56.5% would order them as freedom fries. ---
**Author:** ![Frostillicus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/e9bcb4/32.png) [@Frostillicus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Frostillicus)\ **Post date:** [March 13, 2003, 1:55am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-things-get-any-stranger-french-fries-are-now-freedom-fries/160711/43 "2003-03-13T01:55:08Z")
Classify this moronic action under “empty gestures” along with 48 year old Bruce Willis’s offer to enlist in the US army and help with the invasion of Iraq.:rolleyes: ---
**Author:** ![elelle](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/f0a364/32.png) [@elelle](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elelle)\ **Post date:** [March 13, 2003, 1:55am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-things-get-any-stranger-french-fries-are-now-freedom-fries/160711/44 "2003-03-13T01:55:51Z")
Damn. This is enough to make the Statue of Liberty cry. ---
**Author:** ![tracer](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/tracer/32/20578_2.png) [@tracer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tracer)\ **Post date:** [March 13, 2003, 2:28am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-things-get-any-stranger-french-fries-are-now-freedom-fries/160711/45 "2003-03-13T02:28:04Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by leander \* > **Frankly, I don’t see how anyone could think Dex “convincingly addressed” the points; seemed a rather lame “straight dope” with few sources and cites, and weak arguments.** Dex **did** cite the OED’s entry on “to french” (meaning to cut into strips), which claimed the term first appeared in 1895, several decades after the introduction of _pommes frites_. ---
**Author:** ![HPL](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/3da27b/32.png) [@HPL](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/HPL)\ **Post date:** [March 13, 2003, 3:13am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-things-get-any-stranger-french-fries-are-now-freedom-fries/160711/46 "2003-03-13T03:13:34Z")
As someone who belongs to no party, but votes Republican more often then not, I’ll say it’s pretty stupid. ---
**Author:** ![feath](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/4bbf92/32.png) [@feath](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/feath)\ **Post date:** [March 13, 2003, 3:31am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-things-get-any-stranger-french-fries-are-now-freedom-fries/160711/47 "2003-03-13T03:31:53Z")
> [@](#): > > That’s not how renormalization (a very standard process) works. To renormalize, you take …\ Thanks for the math lesson - now I know \*why \* I dont believe poll results when I see them! ---
**Author:** ![Kami\_Bum](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/838e76/32.png) [@Kami\_Bum](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kami_Bum)\ **Post date:** [March 13, 2003, 3:42am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-things-get-any-stranger-french-fries-are-now-freedom-fries/160711/48 "2003-03-13T03:42:29Z")
hmm, does this mean that teenagers accross the US will secretly engage in “freedom kissing”…mmm, teen romance and patriotism joined together. ---
**Author:** ![ultrafilter](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/3d9bf3/32.png) [@ultrafilter](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ultrafilter)\ **Post date:** [March 13, 2003, 4:47am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-things-get-any-stranger-french-fries-are-now-freedom-fries/160711/49 "2003-03-13T04:47:53Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by feath \* > \*\*Thanks for the math lesson - now I know \*why \* I dont believe poll results when I see them! \*\* Renormalization doesn’t make data any worse than it already is. It’s a way of figuring out what the odds of a certain response to question B given a certain response to question A. Nothing to be suspicious of just because of that. That doesn’t mean that renormalized data is automatically valid, though. Take my data–it’s a self-selected subset of a self-selected population. No way in hell is anyone going to believe that it has any scientific merit. But it’s the best I have, so I posted it. ---
**Author:** ![leander](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/bcef8e/32.png) [@leander](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/leander)\ **Post date:** [March 13, 2003, 4:59am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-things-get-any-stranger-french-fries-are-now-freedom-fries/160711/50 "2003-03-13T04:59:21Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by tracer \* > \*\*Dex **did** cite the OED’s entry on “to french” (meaning to cut into strips), which claimed the term first appeared in 1895, several decades after the introduction of _pommes frites_. \*\* So as not to hijack this thread further, I have posted my reply in the _Comments on Staff Reports_ forum [here](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?threadid=133520). ---
**Author:** ![Princhester](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/3e96dc/32.png) [@Princhester](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Princhester)\ **Post date:** [March 13, 2003, 11:12am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-things-get-any-stranger-french-fries-are-now-freedom-fries/160711/51 "2003-03-13T11:12:08Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by catsix \* > \*\*Not 100% sure on the accuracy of this, but WDVE radio reported about the ‘freedom fries’ thing this morning and also mentioned that what we in the U.S. call American cheese is known as Canadian cheese in Canada. > > Any Canadians know if that’s accurate and if so, why the different names? \*\* Because the only way to sell that crap is by naming it something patriotic. A more accurate name would be “vaguely cheese shaped solidified grease with yellow colouring, that tastes almost but not entirely unlike cheese” But somehow I don’t think that would sell. ---
**Author:** ![asterion](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/4da419/32.png) [@asterion](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/asterion)\ **Post date:** [March 13, 2003, 12:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-things-get-any-stranger-french-fries-are-now-freedom-fries/160711/52 "2003-03-13T12:41:36Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Princhester \* > \*\*Because the only way to sell that crap is by naming it something patriotic. A more accurate name would be “vaguely cheese shaped solidified grease with yellow colouring, that tastes almost but not entirely unlike cheese” > > But somehow I don’t think that would sell. \*\* Cheez Whiz and Velveeta sell, and they don’t have patriotic names. ---
**Author:** ![asterion](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/4da419/32.png) [@asterion](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/asterion)\ **Post date:** [March 13, 2003, 12:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-things-get-any-stranger-french-fries-are-now-freedom-fries/160711/53 "2003-03-13T12:42:38Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Kami\_Bum \* > \*\*hmm, does this mean that teenagers accross the US will secretly engage in “freedom kissing”…mmm, teen romance and patriotism joined together. \*\* All right! New pickup line for me to try. ---
**Author:** ![kingpengvin](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/9dc877/32.png) [@kingpengvin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kingpengvin)\ **Post date:** [March 13, 2003, 8:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-things-get-any-stranger-french-fries-are-now-freedom-fries/160711/54 "2003-03-13T20:42:12Z")
Ok it got weirder… As I understand there is a bill out to remove the bodies of American servicemen buried in France from WWII. Sure they fought for Liberty and Freedom but we can’t let them remain in a democratic country that disagrees with the US. ---
**Author:** ![greck](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/7ab992/32.png) [@greck](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/greck)\ **Post date:** [March 13, 2003, 9:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-things-get-any-stranger-french-fries-are-now-freedom-fries/160711/55 "2003-03-13T21:25:06Z")
We think in language. The word french and the concept of a nation that has turned it’s back on us in our time of need are inextricably linked now. Why should the fried potato stick industry suffer because of our inability to control the subliminable messages recieved at mcdonalds? And it will suffer you know. Just ask the “Smokin’ Saddam’s” chain of fast food places. Moreover, changing the name is a way of taking a national sore spot and turning it into a source of national pride. Just think, if you can wake up every morning, tell yourself “I love and accept myself for who I am right now” then surround yourself with good smells and other sensory input; get your day started the right way. Right about lunch time, you may be running low on inspiration, maybe a little cynical about the state of world affairs, but lo and behold, you go to burger king and eat some FREEDOM FRIES and you thank god your an american. propaganda you say, I say affirmations for patriots. ---
**Author:** ![Princhester](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/3e96dc/32.png) [@Princhester](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Princhester)\ **Post date:** [March 13, 2003, 10:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-things-get-any-stranger-french-fries-are-now-freedom-fries/160711/56 "2003-03-13T22:49:34Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by asterion \* > \*\*Cheez Whiz and Velveeta sell, and they don’t have patriotic names. \*\* Good point. ---
**Author:** ![gvargh](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/df705f/32.png) [@gvargh](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gvargh)\ **Post date:** [March 14, 2003, 4:03am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-things-get-any-stranger-french-fries-are-now-freedom-fries/160711/57 "2003-03-14T04:03:37Z")
So will the americans return the Statue of Liberty to the French? Must be quite jarring to see a French landmark every day in the greatest city in the world!!:rolleyes: ---
**Author:** ![kingpengvin](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/9dc877/32.png) [@kingpengvin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kingpengvin)\ **Post date:** [March 14, 2003, 1:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-things-get-any-stranger-french-fries-are-now-freedom-fries/160711/58 "2003-03-14T13:35:28Z")
Mon Deiu! ---
**Author:** ![Mandelstam](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/47e85d/32.png) [@Mandelstam](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mandelstam)\ **Post date:** [March 14, 2003, 2:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-things-get-any-stranger-french-fries-are-now-freedom-fries/160711/59 "2003-03-14T14:11:38Z")
Perhaps we should issue new history textbooks to all American children, in which the revolution of 1776 is fought against the French, and the European general who helps the defiant colonists to win is called…the Marquis de TonyBlair. ---
**Author:** ![moc.liamtoh\_rorrim](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/f17d59/32.png) [@moc.liamtoh\_rorrim](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/moc.liamtoh_rorrim)\ **Post date:** [March 14, 2003, 2:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-things-get-any-stranger-french-fries-are-now-freedom-fries/160711/60 "2003-03-14T14:46:12Z")
> [@](#): > > At the beginning of WWII people refused to buy Japanese made goods from stores even though the Japanese had long since been paid for them and the store owner was the only one hurt by the practice. think of it this way… If people thought “well, the germans already have the money, no harm in buying these products” and then the shopkeeper sells out of all his german stuff. What does he do? He buys more because people seem to be buying it! [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-things-get-any-stranger-french-fries-are-now-freedom-fries/160711.md?page=2) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-things-get-any-stranger-french-fries-are-now-freedom-fries/160711.md?page=4)