# Can "White Nationalists" use the immigration issue to reach the mainstream? **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [January 11, 2010, 8:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-white-nationalists-use-the-immigration-issue-to-reach-the-mainstream/524554 "2010-01-11T20:26:26Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 11\ **Page:** 6
**Author:** ![Bridget\_Burke](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/7cd45c/32.png) [@Bridget\_Burke](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bridget_Burke)\ **Post date:** [March 9, 2010, 11:26am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-white-nationalists-use-the-immigration-issue-to-reach-the-mainstream/524554/101 "2010-03-09T11:26:17Z")
Chen19’s latest “interesting” source: American Enterprise Institute. From [Sourcewatch](http://www.sourcewatch.org/index.php?title=American_Enterprise_Institute): > [@](#): > > The American Enterprise Institute for Public Policy Research (AEI) is an extremely influential, pro-business, conservative think tank founded in 1943 by Lewis H. Brown. It promotes the advancement of free enterprise capitalism[1], and succeeds in placing its people in influential governmental positions. It is the center base for many neo-conservatives. They’re agin’ AGW & for the Tobacco Industry. [Right Wing Watch](http://www.rightwingwatch.org/content/american-enterprise-institute) points out that Lynne Cheney & Newt Gingrich hung out with the AEI. And Kenny Boy Lay! At least, they’re one step up from John Tanton’s gang. ---
**Author:** ![BrainGlutton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/82dd89/32.png) [@BrainGlutton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrainGlutton)\ **Post date:** [March 9, 2010, 4:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-white-nationalists-use-the-immigration-issue-to-reach-the-mainstream/524554/102 "2010-03-09T16:47:04Z")
> [@Bridget\_Burke](#): > > Chen19’s latest “interesting” source: American Enterprise Institute. > > From [Sourcewatch](http://www.sourcewatch.org/index.php?title=American_Enterprise_Institute): > > They’re agin’ AGW & for the Tobacco Industry. > > [Right Wing Watch](http://www.rightwingwatch.org/content/american-enterprise-institute) points out that Lynne Cheney & Newt Gingrich hung out with the AEI. And Kenny Boy Lay! > > At least, they’re one step up from John Tanton’s gang. Going to the AEI website and searching on “immigration,” the [results](http://www.aei.org/googleSearch?query=immigration&start=0&sortBy=relevance) suggest no clear policy line. Of course, the GOP and the conservative movement are divided on the issue: One the one side are the paleocons who are anti-immigration for both economic and “cultural” reasons (environmental reasons, not so much), and on the other side are the bizcons who want that cheap immigrant labor. We saw that play out when W called for “immigration reform” and set off a firestorm of controversy within his party. ---
**Author:** ![Chen019](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/f19dbf/32.png) [@Chen019](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chen019)\ **Post date:** [March 9, 2010, 10:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-white-nationalists-use-the-immigration-issue-to-reach-the-mainstream/524554/103 "2010-03-09T22:12:23Z")
> [@](#): > > Of course, the GOP and the conservative movement are divided on the issue: One the one side are the paleocons who are anti-immigration for both economic and “cultural” reasons (environmental reasons, not so much), and on the other side are the bizcons who want that cheap immigrant labor. We saw that play out when W called for “immigration reform” and set off a firestorm of controversy within his party. This is a pretty good summary. The Neocons tend to be on the bizcon side. > [@](#): > > Neoconservatives, by contrast, have dissociated these two issues, leading the fight against multiculturalism while passionately clinging to the ideal of unrestricted immigration. Their pro-immigration stand, based on a conviction of both its economic necessity and its political morality, compels them to ignore, or ritually dismiss, the mounting evidence that the sea-change in America’s ethnic identity is fueling the cultural-diversity movement. To keep immigration from coming under attack, they are forced to hunt for alternative explanations for multiculturalism. > **[Emek - Özgür Denizli](https://ozgurdenizli.com/category/emek.html)** ---
**Author:** ![SteveG1](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/bb73d2/32.png) [@SteveG1](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SteveG1)\ **Post date:** [March 10, 2010, 2:11am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-white-nationalists-use-the-immigration-issue-to-reach-the-mainstream/524554/104 "2010-03-10T02:11:45Z")
> [@foolsguinea](#): > > I’m of German descent. My father’s ancestors, whether Pennsylvania Dutch from colonial days or later immigrants, took an enormous amount of crap from the Anglo-Scots, & eventually abandoned the German language. But you know what? The German strain improved the Yankean culture. For one thing, the English barely knew how to cook aught. 😃 Leaving the Anglo-Scots Calvinists as the dominant culture & unchanged would have left this country very bland, dark, & sad. No one would so much as whistle on Sundays, & non-WASP’s would probably be murdered _en masse,_ both within & without the borders. > > And the same goes for the Italians, the Jews, the Chinese, the Mexicans. I welcome the infusion of new cultural influences as it allows us to pick & choose the best of both. And the USA would really be better off a little more Latino in character. “My people” came from Sicily, at the turn of the century - around 1900, give or take. They also took crap for a while. We brought good food, good wine, etc. We’re staying. ---
**Author:** ![BrainGlutton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/82dd89/32.png) [@BrainGlutton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrainGlutton)\ **Post date:** [March 10, 2010, 3:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-white-nationalists-use-the-immigration-issue-to-reach-the-mainstream/524554/105 "2010-03-10T15:15:48Z")
> [@SteveG1](#): > > “My people” came from Sicily, at the turn of the century - around 1900, give or take. They also took crap for a while. We brought good food, good wine, etc. We’re staying. How much poorer American culture be without Mafia movies! 😉 ---
**Author:** ![BrainGlutton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/82dd89/32.png) [@BrainGlutton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrainGlutton)\ **Post date:** [March 11, 2010, 3:39am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-white-nationalists-use-the-immigration-issue-to-reach-the-mainstream/524554/106 "2010-03-11T03:39:38Z")
> [@Chen019](#): > > Why is there no equivalence? If it is legitimate for any of these countries, including Tibet, to maintain a particular ethnic/religious makeup then it seems strange the US can’t. I’ve started a [new thread](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=555430) to debate this. > [@Chen019](#): > > My position on immigration is that it should be skill based. And with color-blind application? At this point, it’s very hard to believe you. ---
**Author:** ![Chen019](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/f19dbf/32.png) [@Chen019](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chen019)\ **Post date:** [March 11, 2010, 4:34am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-white-nationalists-use-the-immigration-issue-to-reach-the-mainstream/524554/107 "2010-03-11T04:34:35Z")
> [@](#): > > Originally Posted by Chen019 > My position on immigration is that it should be skill based. > > BrainGlutton wrote: > > And with color-blind application? At this point, it’s very hard to believe you. Well, in the US context I note that China currently has an oversupply of engineers. That would be more beneficial than low skill immigration that appears to actually place an overall burden on the taxpayer. > [@](#): > > "Overall, households headed by persons without a high school diploma (or low-skill households) received an average of $32,138 per household in direct benefits, means-tested benefits, education, and population-based services in FY 2004. If expenditures for interest and other financial obligations relating to past government activities are added to the count, expenditures rise to $36,989 per household. If the cost of public goods is added, annual total expenditures on benefits and services come to $43,084 per low-skill household… > > The substantial net tax burden imposed by low-skill U.S. households also suggests lessons for immigration policy. Recently proposed immigration legislation would greatly increase the number of poorly educated immigrants entering and living in the United States.[12] Before this policy is adopted, Congress should examine carefully the potential negative fiscal effects of low-skill immigrant households receiving services." [http://www.heritage.org/Research/Welfare/sr12.cfm](http://www.heritage.org/Research/Welfare/sr12.cfm) ---
**Author:** ![BrainGlutton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/82dd89/32.png) [@BrainGlutton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrainGlutton)\ **Post date:** [March 18, 2010, 12:44am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-white-nationalists-use-the-immigration-issue-to-reach-the-mainstream/524554/108 "2010-03-18T00:44:40Z")
> [@Chen019](#): > > Well, in the US context I note that China currently has an oversupply of engineers. What, you mean, more engineers than China can employ? In a huge and underdeveloped and rapidly-industrializing country like that? Cite? ---
**Author:** ![SteveG1](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/bb73d2/32.png) [@SteveG1](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SteveG1)\ **Post date:** [March 18, 2010, 1:26am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-white-nationalists-use-the-immigration-issue-to-reach-the-mainstream/524554/109 "2010-03-18T01:26:55Z")
> [@BrainGlutton](#): > > How much poorer American culture be without Mafia movies! 😉 Heh heh Fond memories of watching the Untouchables and cheering for the bad guys? 😃 ---
**Author:** ![Chen019](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/f19dbf/32.png) [@Chen019](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chen019)\ **Post date:** [March 18, 2010, 4:48am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-white-nationalists-use-the-immigration-issue-to-reach-the-mainstream/524554/110 "2010-03-18T04:48:05Z")
> [@BrainGlutton](#): > > What, you mean, more engineers than China can employ? In a huge and underdeveloped and rapidly-industrializing country like that? Cite? From a recent newspaper article: > [@](#): > > Some estimate that 30 percent of Chinese engineering students will not find jobs after graduation and that the average pay of the college graduates is now approaching that of rural migrant workers. At the same time, factories in Guangdong province cannot find enough labor. [http://roomfordebate.blogs.nytimes.com/2010/03/07/educated-and-fearing-the-future-in-china/?pagemode=print](http://roomfordebate.blogs.nytimes.com/2010/03/07/educated-and-fearing-the-future-in-china/?pagemode=print) ---
**Author:** ![Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e8c25b/32.png) [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Really_Not_All_That_Bright)\ **Post date:** [March 18, 2010, 1:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-white-nationalists-use-the-immigration-issue-to-reach-the-mainstream/524554/111 "2010-03-18T13:33:32Z")
> [@BrainGlutton](#): > > What, you mean, more engineers than China can employ? In a huge and underdeveloped and rapidly-industrializing country like that? Cite? That one’s true. Bear in mind that while there’s lots of production in China, there’s not a lot of development - finished goods produced there are generally based on extant designs, either legally or via reverse engineering. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-white-nationalists-use-the-immigration-issue-to-reach-the-mainstream/524554.md?page=5)