# Can you conspire with someone you have never interacted with? **URL:** \ **Category:** Factual Questions\ **Created:** [February 9, 2012, 4:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-you-conspire-with-someone-you-have-never-interacted-with/612319 "2012-02-09T16:19:13Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 14\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![puddleglum](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/puddleglum/32/137_2.png) [@puddleglum](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/puddleglum)\ **Post date:** [February 9, 2012, 4:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-you-conspire-with-someone-you-have-never-interacted-with/612319/1 "2012-02-09T16:19:13Z")
(Do not need answer fast) If a person meets with someone else to plan a crime that is conspiracy, but what if they try to persuade someone they have never met to commit a crime ? If someone has an enemy and announces that they will pay money to whoever commits an assault on that person. If an assault is committed and the person pays the atttacker is that conspiracy despite the fact that the first time they meet is when receiving payment? I read a book that says there were rumors about something like this being the reason James Earl Ray shot Reverend King and wanted to know if it is was possible to do something like that and get off, or if there would be criminal charges. ---
**Author:** ![Gary\_Robson](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gary_robson/32/3448_2.png) [@Gary\_Robson](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gary_Robson)\ **Post date:** [February 9, 2012, 4:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-you-conspire-with-someone-you-have-never-interacted-with/612319/2 "2012-02-09T16:30:49Z")
A conspiracy can take place without a face-to-face meeting, if that’s what you’re asking. Planning a crime with someone via email, Facebook, notes left in library books, encrypted messages on Usenet, telephone conversations, or carrier pigeons is still a conspiracy. ---
**Author:** ![TriPolar](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/tripolar/32/3008_2.png) [@TriPolar](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TriPolar)\ **Post date:** [February 9, 2012, 4:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-you-conspire-with-someone-you-have-never-interacted-with/612319/3 "2012-02-09T16:36:22Z")
A conspiracy can’t take place between people who do not interact. Your description is simply talking about interaction that is not face-to-face, or indirect. I don’t know if the indirect interaction forms a conspiracy, but it’s still illegal to commit a crime that way. ---
**Author:** ![lawbuff](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/13edae/32.png) [@lawbuff](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/lawbuff)\ **Post date:** [February 9, 2012, 4:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-you-conspire-with-someone-you-have-never-interacted-with/612319/4 "2012-02-09T16:54:30Z")
glum, your example is more in line, not with Conspiracy, but “Accessory BEFORE the fact”. A person who induces or encourages criminal behavior and that behavior is done. > **[accessory before the fact](https://www.law.cornell.edu/wex/accessory_before_the_fact)** ---
**Author:** ![grude](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/e47774/32.png) [@grude](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/grude)\ **Post date:** [February 9, 2012, 5:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-you-conspire-with-someone-you-have-never-interacted-with/612319/5 "2012-02-09T17:44:38Z")
> [@lawbuff](#): > > glum, your example is more in line, not with Conspiracy, but “Accessory BEFORE the fact”. A person who induces or encourages criminal behavior and that behavior is done. > > [accessory before the fact | Wex | US Law | LII / Legal Information Institute](http://www.law.cornell.edu/wex/accessory_before_the_fact) Conspiracy laws have always scared me because they seem so open to abuse. > [@](#): > > A person who aids, abets, or encourages another to commit a crime but who is not present at the scene. An accessory before the fact, like an accomplice, may be held criminally liable to the same extent as the principal. Many jurisdictions refer to an accessory before the fact as an accomplice. So if someone on a poorly moderated message board posts they want to buy heroin in America City and I tell them to go to the corner of Faux and Fake Streets and look for the guy wearing the green jacket he is selling, I’ve just committed a crime?:smack: ---
**Author:** ![lawbuff](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/13edae/32.png) [@lawbuff](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/lawbuff)\ **Post date:** [February 9, 2012, 5:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-you-conspire-with-someone-you-have-never-interacted-with/612319/6 "2012-02-09T17:48:40Z")
> [@grude](#): > > So if someone on a poorly moderated message board posts they want to buy heroin in America City and I tell them to go to the corner of Faux and Fake Streets and look for the guy wearing the green jacket he is selling, I’ve just committed a crime?:smack: It’s a good bet you have. I’m not a lawyer, but I would not risk that conduct. ---
**Author:** ![isaiahrobinson](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/85e7bf/32.png) [@isaiahrobinson](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/isaiahrobinson)\ **Post date:** [February 9, 2012, 6:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-you-conspire-with-someone-you-have-never-interacted-with/612319/7 "2012-02-09T18:04:28Z")
Under English law, no, you probably can’t be found to have “conspired” with the random attacker if all you did was put a bounty on the victim’s head. The statutory crime of conspiracy requires “agreement” that a crime will be committed, and in the scenario you describe the two parties never agreed anything in advance. It would certainly be a crime, but you’d probably be charged with being an accessory, or something similar. ---
**Author:** ![Xema](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/x/9de053/32.png) [@Xema](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Xema)\ **Post date:** [February 9, 2012, 6:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-you-conspire-with-someone-you-have-never-interacted-with/612319/8 "2012-02-09T18:31:26Z")
> [@puddleglum](#): > > If an assault is committed and the person pays the atttacker is that conspiracy despite the fact that the first time they meet is when receiving payment? It would be rather strange if the law said, in effect, “It’s okay to hire someone to commit a crime, so long as you don’t meet in person.” ---
**Author:** ![postcards](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/8e8cbc/32.png) [@postcards](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/postcards)\ **Post date:** [February 9, 2012, 6:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-you-conspire-with-someone-you-have-never-interacted-with/612319/9 "2012-02-09T18:40:06Z")
[quote=“Gary “Wombat” Robson, post:2, topic:612319”] A conspiracy can take place without a face-to-face meeting, if that’s what you’re asking. Planning a crime with someone via email, Facebook, notes left in library books, encrypted messages on Usenet, telephone conversations, or carrier pigeons is still a conspiracy. [/QUOTE] The OP’s question is: Can you conspire with someone you have never interacted with? All of these examples can be defined as ‘interacting’ with someone. ---
**Author:** ![si\_blakely](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/d9b06d/32.png) [@si\_blakely](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/si_blakely)\ **Post date:** [February 9, 2012, 6:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-you-conspire-with-someone-you-have-never-interacted-with/612319/10 "2012-02-09T18:44:28Z")
[Incitement](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Incitement) is the criminal act of encouraging others to commit a crime (at least in the UK and similar jurisdictions) and requires no direct communication between parties as long as there is an inducement. Si ---
**Author:** ![coffeecat](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/coffeecat/32/3405_2.png) [@coffeecat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/coffeecat)\ **Post date:** [February 9, 2012, 6:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-you-conspire-with-someone-you-have-never-interacted-with/612319/11 "2012-02-09T18:46:43Z")
> [@grude](#): > > Conspiracy laws have always scared me because they seem so open to abuse. [No kidding.](http://clatl.com/atlanta/forgotten-man/Content?oid=1239461) ---
**Author:** ![isaiahrobinson](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/85e7bf/32.png) [@isaiahrobinson](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/isaiahrobinson)\ **Post date:** [February 9, 2012, 11:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-you-conspire-with-someone-you-have-never-interacted-with/612319/12 "2012-02-09T23:26:15Z")
> [@si\_blakely](#): > > [Incitement](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Incitement) is the criminal act of encouraging others to commit a crime (at least in the UK and similar jurisdictions) and requires no direct communication between parties as long as there is an inducement. > > Si Incitement was abolished a few years ago and replaced with “encouraging or assisting” an offence. You’re right though, the bottom line is that the offender in the OP’s example probably couldn’t be charged with conspiracy, but would definitely be charged with something else. ---
**Author:** ![KarlGauss](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/karlgauss/32/3713_2.png) [@KarlGauss](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/KarlGauss)\ **Post date:** [February 10, 2012, 3:27am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-you-conspire-with-someone-you-have-never-interacted-with/612319/13 "2012-02-10T03:27:30Z")
> [@coffeecat](#): > > [No kidding.](http://clatl.com/atlanta/forgotten-man/Content?oid=1239461) That is about the saddest thing I’ve read in a long, long time. I am speechless; nauseated, I want to scream. America was once a great country, truly ‘the city on the hill’. As my sig line here said after 9/11, although I was a ‘Canadian by birth’, I was an ‘American by heart’. Now, I am embarrassed. Embarrassed that I was, until recently, such a staunch and ardent supporter of the US against those who chose to be blind to its greatness. And, embarrassed that the country that was once a paragon of freedom and decency has allowed itself to be manipulated and usurped by anti-science, ‘sky wizard’ quoting, subjugating zealots. I want to cry for the lost city. ---
**Author:** ![Shmendrik](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ee7513/32.png) [@Shmendrik](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Shmendrik)\ **Post date:** [February 10, 2012, 4:20am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-you-conspire-with-someone-you-have-never-interacted-with/612319/14 "2012-02-10T04:20:20Z")
> [@KarlGauss](#): > > That is about the saddest thing I’ve read in a long, long time. I am speechless; nauseated, I want to scream. > > America was once a great country, truly ‘the city on the hill’. As my sig line here said after 9/11, although I was a ‘Canadian by birth’, I was an ‘American by heart’. Now, I am embarrassed. Embarrassed that I was, until recently, such a staunch and ardent supporter of the US against those who chose to be blind to its greatness. And, embarrassed that the country that was once a paragon of freedom and decency has allowed itself to be manipulated and usurped by anti-science, ‘sky wizard’ quoting, subjugating zealots. I want to cry for the lost city. Um, this story happened in 1994. And what does your off topic rant have to do with anything? You may be surprised to know that the sky wizard book has a lot to say about fighting injustice.