# Can you imagine if Pirates had tanks? Imagine no longer and no, it is not cool. **URL:** \ **Category:** Miscellaneous and Personal Stuff I Must Share\ **Created:** [September 27, 2008, 10:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-you-imagine-if-pirates-had-tanks-imagine-no-longer-and-no-it-is-not-cool/465503 "2008-09-27T22:54:41Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![GIGObuster](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gigobuster/32/421_2.png) [@GIGObuster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GIGObuster)\ **Post date:** [September 27, 2008, 10:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-you-imagine-if-pirates-had-tanks-imagine-no-longer-and-no-it-is-not-cool/465503/1 "2008-09-27T22:54:41Z")
> **[BBC NEWS | Africa | Somalia's pirates seize 33 tanks](http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/africa/7637257.stm)** > > Pirates off the coast of Somalia have seized a Ukrainian ship carrying 33 tanks, officials say. > [@](#): > > **Somalia’s pirates seize 33 tanks** > > A Ukrainian ship seized by pirates off the coast of Somalia was carrying 33 tanks and other weapons, the Ukrainian defence minister has confirmed. > > Earlier, the country’s foreign ministry said the ship had a crew of 21 and was sailing under a Belize flag to the Kenyan port of Mombasa. > > There has been a recent surge in piracy off the coast of Somalia. > > Russia announced on Friday it would start carrying out regular anti-piracy patrols in the waters off Somalia. > > A navy spokesman said a warship had been sent to the area earlier this week to protect Russian citizens and ships. > > Somalia has not had an effective national government for 17 years, leading to a collapse of law and order both on land and at sea. > > Somali pirates are currently holding more than a dozen hijacked ships in Eyl, a town in the semi-autonomous region of Puntland. Yikes! I thought that after several high profile attacks patrol ships from many nations, including the US, were monitoring the area, looks like modern day pirates are raising the stakes. ---
**Author:** ![WormTheRed](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/bbe5ce/32.png) [@WormTheRed](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/WormTheRed)\ **Post date:** [September 27, 2008, 11:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-you-imagine-if-pirates-had-tanks-imagine-no-longer-and-no-it-is-not-cool/465503/2 "2008-09-27T23:21:28Z")
So now we go from Ninja Pirates, to Tank Soldier Pirates! How are they gonna fit the tanks on their ships? And on a serious note. How can tanks be sent around the world without protection vessels? ---
**Author:** ![Harmonious\_Discord](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/74df32/32.png) [@Harmonious\_Discord](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Harmonious_Discord)\ **Post date:** [September 27, 2008, 11:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-you-imagine-if-pirates-had-tanks-imagine-no-longer-and-no-it-is-not-cool/465503/3 "2008-09-27T23:23:34Z")
I was thinking what a smart way to avoid them being used to kill you. Hijack them in the shipping boat. ---
**Author:** ![GIGObuster](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gigobuster/32/421_2.png) [@GIGObuster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GIGObuster)\ **Post date:** [September 28, 2008, 12:12am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-you-imagine-if-pirates-had-tanks-imagine-no-longer-and-no-it-is-not-cool/465503/4 "2008-09-28T00:12:22Z")
I was wondering how pirates would use them, but there is good news and bad news: The good news is that the pirates seem to not have equipment to unload the tanks. The bad news is that the ship also was full of weapons: [http://www.nytimes.com/2008/09/28/world/africa/28pirates.html?ref=africa](http://www.nytimes.com/2008/09/28/world/africa/28pirates.html?ref=africa) > [@](#): > > On Friday, Kenyan and Ukrainian officials disclosed that the ship was loaded with 2,320 tons of weapons. Many diplomats in Kenya are concerned that the arms could fall into the hands of insurgents fighting Somalia’s transitional government and pitch the country deeper into chaos. > > The pirates, however, are not expected to be able to do much with the T-72 tanks because each weighs more than 80,000 pounds. Western diplomats have said that the pirates do not have the special equipment or the skill to get the tanks ashore. > > But the tanks — and the jitters they have caused — may be used for leverage to increase the ransom. Andrew Mwangura, program coordinator for the Seafarers’ Assistance Program in Kenya, which tracks pirate attacks, said that the pirates had demanded $35 million through intermediaries and that they were trying to contact the ship’s owners. > > “They even have someone who speaks English,” he said. ---
**Author:** ![msmith537](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/d9b06d/32.png) [@msmith537](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/msmith537)\ **Post date:** [September 28, 2008, 12:16am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-you-imagine-if-pirates-had-tanks-imagine-no-longer-and-no-it-is-not-cool/465503/5 "2008-09-28T00:16:26Z")
33 T-72 tanks. That’s a lot of arrrrmor. ---
**Author:** ![Muffin](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/muffin/32/4341_2.png) [@Muffin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Muffin)\ **Post date:** [September 28, 2008, 1:17am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-you-imagine-if-pirates-had-tanks-imagine-no-longer-and-no-it-is-not-cool/465503/6 "2008-09-28T01:17:47Z")
Where’s Tank Girl when you need her? ---
**Author:** ![Spiny\_Norman](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/9de0a6/32.png) [@Spiny\_Norman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Spiny_Norman)\ **Post date:** [September 28, 2008, 1:51am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-you-imagine-if-pirates-had-tanks-imagine-no-longer-and-no-it-is-not-cool/465503/7 "2008-09-28T01:51:04Z")
Am I the only one thinking that the pirates may have bitten off a bit more than they can swallow? My first thought process on waylaying 33 T-72s would probably be along the lines of: [ol] [li]Arr! That be some fine booty! Shiver me timbers![/li][li]This is enough weapons for a battalion![/li][li]These guys must be RICH. They can buy T-72s. I’ll be rolling in dough.[/li][li]Wait - they’re rich and they command an army.[/li][li]And they’re probably mad as hell.[/li][li]At me. Also, they command an army.[/li][li]Perhaps this isn’t a great idea.[/li][li]They’re commanding a fucking ARMY![/li][li]And I made them mad.[/li][li]Ohshitohshitohshitohshit. Perhaps they’ll let me live if I give them their tanks.[/li][li]Like, really quick.[/li][li]A fucking army. Whose idea was this, anyway…[/li][li]Screw it, I’m dead.[/li][/ol] As Terry Pratchett says, when arguing with a general, you need to keep a few things in mind. Such as, not saying “You and which army?”. In other pirate news, Her Danish Majesty’s ship [HDMS Absalon](http://www.naval-technology.com/projects/absalon/) (Good-looking ship, even if I say so as a Dane) recently boarded a pirate ship off Somalia’s coast and detained 10 crewmen/suspected pirates. Regrettably, no one knew what to do with them. Hanging them from the yardarm was out of the question - no longer allowed and the ship has no yardarms, anyway. They couldn’t be handed over to local authorities, such as they are - Danish authorities can’t send prisoners to a foreign jurisdiction without a guarantee that no death penalty will be imposed. Someone suggested sending them to Copenhagen to stand trial. Someone else pointed put that Danish courts would be ill-equipped to get witnesses etc., plus the pirates would have a good asylum case if convicted. In the end, they were released. The Danish naval heroes of yore would spin in their graves, except they mostly were buried at sea. ETA: An extra “t” ---
**Author:** ![Count\_Blucher](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/c5a1d2/32.png) [@Count\_Blucher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Count_Blucher)\ **Post date:** [September 28, 2008, 2:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-you-imagine-if-pirates-had-tanks-imagine-no-longer-and-no-it-is-not-cool/465503/8 "2008-09-28T02:09:58Z")
> [@Muffin](#): > > Where’s Tank Girl when you need her? Ka-noodling with Tron…? 😃 ---
**Author:** ![Boyo\_Jim](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/87869e/32.png) [@Boyo\_Jim](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Boyo_Jim)\ **Post date:** [September 28, 2008, 3:15am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-you-imagine-if-pirates-had-tanks-imagine-no-longer-and-no-it-is-not-cool/465503/9 "2008-09-28T03:15:50Z")
I wonder what Kenya was planning to do with 33 tanks? ---
**Author:** ![Moirai](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/96bed5/32.png) [@Moirai](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Moirai)\ **Post date:** [September 28, 2008, 3:23am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-you-imagine-if-pirates-had-tanks-imagine-no-longer-and-no-it-is-not-cool/465503/10 "2008-09-28T03:23:14Z")
The current Google ads are for dating hot Somali women and buying Naval ships at Shopzilla dot com. ---
**Author:** ![Rand\_Rover](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/db5fbb/32.png) [@Rand\_Rover](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rand_Rover)\ **Post date:** [September 28, 2008, 4:06am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-you-imagine-if-pirates-had-tanks-imagine-no-longer-and-no-it-is-not-cool/465503/11 "2008-09-28T04:06:57Z")
If I priced insurance policies for cargo on ships that were planning to go anywhere near Somalia, I’d charge them 110% of the value of the cargo just for calling me and wasting my time. Also, if I were on a ship loaded with tanks and tons of weapons, there’s no damn way a pirate gets within boarding distance. Hmmm . . . inside job maybe? ---
**Author:** ![GIGObuster](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gigobuster/32/421_2.png) [@GIGObuster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GIGObuster)\ **Post date:** [September 28, 2008, 4:07am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-you-imagine-if-pirates-had-tanks-imagine-no-longer-and-no-it-is-not-cool/465503/12 "2008-09-28T04:07:27Z")
> [@EJsGirl](#): > > The current Google ads are for dating hot Somali women and buying Naval ships at Shopzilla dot com. Heh, I only get right now: ``` Anti-Piracy Solutions and Pirate Hats & Swords. ``` ---
**Author:** ![Der\_Trihs](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/der_trihs/32/233_2.png) [@Der\_Trihs](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Der_Trihs)\ **Post date:** [September 28, 2008, 9:17am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-you-imagine-if-pirates-had-tanks-imagine-no-longer-and-no-it-is-not-cool/465503/13 "2008-09-28T09:17:32Z")
According to the BBC, the pirates are [demanding a ransom](http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/africa/7639090.stm) for ship and crew. > [@](#): > > Pirates who seized a Ukrainian ship off the coast of Somalia have reportedly demanded a ransom of $35m (£19m) to release the vessel and its crew. > > The pirates also warned against any attempt to rescue the crew or cargo of the MV Faina, which is carrying 33 T-72 battle tanks destined for Kenya. > > But the Kenyan government later denied it had been issued with ransom demands. And in related news, an [article](http://en.rian.ru/russia/20080926/117144421.html) about the Russians sending the ship mentioned in the first article. Unlike the Danish, I suspect that the Russians won’t be releasing any pirates they catch. Except possibly as chum . . . ---
**Author:** ![Malacandra](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@Malacandra](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Malacandra)\ **Post date:** [September 28, 2008, 10:34am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-you-imagine-if-pirates-had-tanks-imagine-no-longer-and-no-it-is-not-cool/465503/14 "2008-09-28T10:34:35Z")
> [@Rand\_Rover](#): > > If I priced insurance policies for cargo on ships that were planning to go anywhere near Somalia, I’d charge them 110% of the value of the cargo just for calling me and wasting my time. > > Also, if I were on a ship loaded with tanks and tons of weapons, there’s no damn way a pirate gets within boarding distance. Hmmm . . . inside job maybe? Because you’d be using the cargo to fight them off? Hey, I like excitement as much as the next perpetual stay-at-home, but shipping like a thousand tons of things that go bang, all live and ready to rock and roll? Nu-_uh_! :eek: ---
**Author:** ![Princhester](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/3e96dc/32.png) [@Princhester](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Princhester)\ **Post date:** [September 28, 2008, 12:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-you-imagine-if-pirates-had-tanks-imagine-no-longer-and-no-it-is-not-cool/465503/15 "2008-09-28T12:18:57Z")
> [@Rand\_Rover](#): > > If I priced insurance policies for cargo on ships that were planning to go anywhere near Somalia, I’d charge them 110% of the value of the cargo just for calling me and wasting my time. Except that the actual risk is low (albeit that the headlines are splashy) and you will go out of business because your competitors will take the risk. > [@](#): > > Also, if I were on a ship loaded with tanks and tons of weapons, there’s no damn way a pirate gets within boarding distance. Hmmm . . . inside job maybe? Why, what would you do? Drive the tanks up onto deck? I hear they go great up vertical steel surfaces. Know much about ships, do you? Or would you be breaking out the small arms. Sure, they’re shipped ready for firing. Not. And the crew of Phillipino seafarers are all trained in the use of rocket launchers and so on. It’s in their basic. Same as yours and mine. Riiight. ---
**Author:** ![aruvqan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/aruvqan/32/2891_2.png) [@aruvqan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/aruvqan)\ **Post date:** [September 28, 2008, 12:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-you-imagine-if-pirates-had-tanks-imagine-no-longer-and-no-it-is-not-cool/465503/16 "2008-09-28T12:54:40Z")
> [@Spiny\_Norman](#): > > Hanging them from the yardarm was out of the question - no longer allowed and the ship has no yardarms, anyway. They couldn’t be handed over to local authorities, such as they are - Danish authorities can’t send prisoners to a foreign jurisdiction without a guarantee that no death penalty will be imposed. > > Someone suggested sending them to Copenhagen to stand trial. Someone else pointed put that Danish courts would be ill-equipped to get witnesses etc., plus the pirates would have a good asylum case if convicted. > > In the end, they were released. The Danish naval heroes of yore would spin in their graves, except they mostly were buried at sea. > > ETA: An extra “t” Well, he could shoot them, but Danish Naval law apaprently no longer has a death penalty. He could dump them off in the Hague, who might concievably have the same witness issue. if they were taken in an act of piracy, or there was enough evidence of piracy, the international court in England is still set up to deal with piracy. I do believe that under international maritime law was broken in this case and it should be addressed. I would probably have shot them in the back of the head and dumped them if there was enough compelling evidence of piracy. The pirates would have had no compunction to capture and release the average common seaman on any vessel they took. ---
**Author:** ![ladyfoxfyre](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/ad7895/32.png) [@ladyfoxfyre](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ladyfoxfyre)\ **Post date:** [September 28, 2008, 2:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-you-imagine-if-pirates-had-tanks-imagine-no-longer-and-no-it-is-not-cool/465503/17 "2008-09-28T14:52:11Z")
Interestingly enough, this subject is the topic of a debate case that I’ll be judging in November. Full case can be seen here: > **[Center for Study of Ethics in the Professions](https://www.iit.edu/center-ethics)** > > Mission Founded in 1976, the Center for the Study of Ethics in the Professions was the first interdisciplinary center of its kind to focus on ethics in the professions. During its forty year history, It’s case number 4. The issue surrounds what to do with the pirates. ---
**Author:** ![Polycarp](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/82dd89/32.png) [@Polycarp](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Polycarp)\ **Post date:** [September 28, 2008, 3:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-you-imagine-if-pirates-had-tanks-imagine-no-longer-and-no-it-is-not-cool/465503/18 "2008-09-28T15:05:09Z")
The solution here is inherent in one of **Spiny Norman** ’s posts: Send in Terry Pratchett to deal with them. Or at least that’s what Milt Caniff said when I was a kid! 🆒 ---
**Author:** ![LSLGuy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lslguy/32/5813_2.png) [@LSLGuy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/LSLGuy)\ **Post date:** [September 28, 2008, 3:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-you-imagine-if-pirates-had-tanks-imagine-no-longer-and-no-it-is-not-cool/465503/19 "2008-09-28T15:14:52Z")
Throw them over the side & sail away towing their vessel. Seems pretty easy to me. Going back to **Spiny Norman** ’s discussion, ISTR an incident back in the 1970s during the (previous) heyday of Middle East anarchy. Some terrorist / revolutionary group kidnapped a Soviet diplomat / KGB guy from an embassy staff. The Sovs solved that problem with their usual ruthlessness & nobody ever kidnapped another Soviet official. Europeans & Americans were seized at regular intervals, but no Soviets. Now today’s Ukraine is not the old Soviet Union, but today’s Russia certainly seems to be itching to reclaim the Soviet rep for worldwide champion snarling badass. So my advice to pirates is to do whatever it takes to not be stopped / boarded by the Russian Navy. ---
**Author:** ![Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e8c25b/32.png) [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Really_Not_All_That_Bright)\ **Post date:** [September 28, 2008, 3:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-you-imagine-if-pirates-had-tanks-imagine-no-longer-and-no-it-is-not-cool/465503/20 "2008-09-28T15:20:22Z")
> [@Rand\_Rover](#): > > Also, if I were on a ship loaded with tanks and tons of weapons, there’s no damn way a pirate gets within boarding distance. Hmmm . . . inside job maybe? If you’re on a ship loaded with tanks and tons of weapons, chances are the pirate ship chasing you is a lot faster. [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-you-imagine-if-pirates-had-tanks-imagine-no-longer-and-no-it-is-not-cool/465503.md?page=2)