# Can you sell somebody else's soul to the devil? **URL:** \ **Category:** Miscellaneous and Personal Stuff I Must Share\ **Created:** [December 10, 2010, 9:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-you-sell-somebody-elses-soul-to-the-devil/563709 "2010-12-10T21:56:53Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![Miller](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/miller/32/481_2.png) [@Miller](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Miller)\ **Post date:** [December 11, 2010, 10:16am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-you-sell-somebody-elses-soul-to-the-devil/563709/21 "2010-12-11T10:16:23Z")
I think you’re going to hell in that deal, regardless of the terms of your contract with the Devil, for one pretty simple fact: you’re willing to condemn people to _an eternity of constant suffering_ for your own personal gain. That’s just about as evil an act as I can imagine. ---
**Author:** ![TriPolar](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/tripolar/32/3008_2.png) [@TriPolar](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TriPolar)\ **Post date:** [December 11, 2010, 6:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-you-sell-somebody-elses-soul-to-the-devil/563709/22 "2010-12-11T18:35:48Z")
The law is clear on this matter. If you legally obtain someone else’s soul, you are free to do what you want with it. The trouble is that the devil is usually not interested in used souls. There are plenty of conservatives who have unused mint condition souls for sale. Zombies however love the fresh unused brains of liberals. ---
**Author:** ![RandMcnally](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/b782af/32.png) [@RandMcnally](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RandMcnally)\ **Post date:** [December 11, 2010, 6:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-you-sell-somebody-elses-soul-to-the-devil/563709/23 "2010-12-11T18:41:18Z")
But would Satan actually want to make the deal with you **Little Nemo**? I mean, assuming I genuinely sell you my soul I’m assuming that because I sold my soul to anyone, therefore not giving my soul to God, I’m automatically damned and my soul reverts to Satan. Why would he trade with you, he’s already getting it? ---
**Author:** ![dzero](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/5f9b8f/32.png) [@dzero](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/dzero)\ **Post date:** [December 11, 2010, 6:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-you-sell-somebody-elses-soul-to-the-devil/563709/24 "2010-12-11T18:53:18Z")
I’m sure you could do it with a power of attorney, although I have to say I’m still fuzzy on the attorney/Satan distinction. ---
**Author:** ![Little\_Nemo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/little_nemo/32/3120_2.png) [@Little\_Nemo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Little_Nemo)\ **Post date:** [December 11, 2010, 7:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-you-sell-somebody-elses-soul-to-the-devil/563709/25 "2010-12-11T19:42:11Z")
> [@RandMcnally](#): > > But would Satan actually want to make the deal with you **Little Nemo**? I mean, assuming I genuinely sell you my soul I’m assuming that because I sold my soul to anyone, therefore not giving my soul to God, I’m automatically damned and my soul reverts to Satan. > > Why would he trade with you, he’s already getting it? According to tradition, the devil seems to have a pretty endless appetite for souls. My guess is he likes to buy them because that seals the deal - he doesn’t have to worry about a last minute repentance saving a sinful soul that he had been counting on for decades. Not sure what the theological implications are of soul transferral. If somebody sells me their soul, do their actions still have an impact on it? Do their ongoing sins and virtues still effect their soul’s fate in the afterlife? Or is the soul locked into the state it was in at the point of sale? If the latter, then the devil will certainly be willing to deal with me - the souls I hold cannot be corrupted through normal means so I represent the only opportunity he has for obtaining them. ---
**Author:** ![Ann\_Onimous](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/ea5d25/32.png) [@Ann\_Onimous](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ann_Onimous)\ **Post date:** [December 11, 2010, 7:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-you-sell-somebody-elses-soul-to-the-devil/563709/26 "2010-12-11T19:57:42Z")
> [@Little\_Nemo](#): > > My guess is he likes to buy them because that seals the deal - he doesn’t have to worry about a last minute repentance saving a sinful soul that he had been counting on for decades. Not according to Christian beliefs. Luke 23:39-43: > [@](#): > > 39 One of the criminals who hung there hurled insults at him: “Aren’t you the Messiah? Save yourself and us!” > > 40 But the other criminal rebuked him. “Don’t you fear God,” he said, “since you are under the same sentence? 41 We are punished justly, for we are getting what our deeds deserve. But this man has done nothing wrong.” > > 42 Then he said, “Jesus, remember me when you come into your kingdom.” > > 43 Jesus answered him, “Truly I tell you, today you will be with me in paradise.” No matter what kind of life is led, no matter what “deal” is made with Satan, if the person truly converts at the last second, Satan has lost. ---
**Author:** ![Fear\_Itself](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/fear_itself/32/19637_2.png) [@Fear\_Itself](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fear_Itself)\ **Post date:** [December 11, 2010, 10:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-you-sell-somebody-elses-soul-to-the-devil/563709/27 "2010-12-11T22:11:57Z")
> [@Ann\_Onimous](#): > > No matter what kind of life is led, no matter what “deal” is made with Satan, if the person truly converts at the last second, Satan has lost. Almost. There is [one unforgivable sin](http://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=Mark%203:28-29&version=NIV): > [@](#): > > **Mark 3:28-29** > > "Truly I tell you, people can be forgiven all their sins and every slander they utter, but whoever blasphemes against the Holy Spirit will never be forgiven; they are guilty of an eternal sin.” ---
**Author:** ![Malleus\_Incus\_Stapes](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/malleus_incus_stapes/32/3293_2.png) [@Malleus\_Incus\_Stapes](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Malleus_Incus_Stapes)\ **Post date:** [December 12, 2010, 12:57am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-you-sell-somebody-elses-soul-to-the-devil/563709/28 "2010-12-12T00:57:31Z")
> [@RandMcnally](#): > > I’m not sure what would happen if you’re genuinely repentant later on, but if you go into the deal thinking, “Oh, I’ll just ask for forgiveness later” or later comes, “I wish I didn’t do that, but it sure was fun” that voids the forgiveness asking. If we can do a religion pastiche here… the Talmud explicitly says that saying “I will sin and repent” pretty much makes said repentance worthless. But we don’t have a devil figure like Christianity does, let alone soul-selling. For the triad we’ll have to work some Islamc theology in there somewhere. ---
**Author:** ![Little\_Nemo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/little_nemo/32/3120_2.png) [@Little\_Nemo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Little_Nemo)\ **Post date:** [December 12, 2010, 4:17am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-you-sell-somebody-elses-soul-to-the-devil/563709/29 "2010-12-12T04:17:34Z")
> [@Ann\_Onimous](#): > > No matter what kind of life is led, no matter what “deal” is made with Satan, if the person truly converts at the last second, Satan has lost. But no mention is made in Luke that the criminal had sold his soul to Satan. He presumedly was still in possession of his soul and repentence was therefore still an option open to him. ---
**Author:** ![Mr.Excellent](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/f19dbf/32.png) [@Mr.Excellent](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mr.Excellent)\ **Post date:** [December 12, 2010, 5:57am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-you-sell-somebody-elses-soul-to-the-devil/563709/30 "2010-12-12T05:57:25Z")
In principle, I think your plan _could_ work. But the devil, as always, is in the details. You’ve stipulated that selling the souls of others for a genuinely immoral end could damn your own soul. Selling the souls of others for your threesome raises the specter of rape - what if Satan fulfills the bargaining by so manipulating the minds of the ladies Dawson and Q that they cannot really consent. And rape is certainly a damnable offense. A smarter Faustian-bargain-by-proxy would be on exchange for the Devil gifting you with sufficient sex appeal to make a threesome very appealing to the ladies in question (though still resistable) and an opportunity to bring your charm to bear. Then there’s no impairment of free will, no rape issue, and you’re free and clear. ---
**Author:** ![Little\_Nemo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/little_nemo/32/3120_2.png) [@Little\_Nemo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Little_Nemo)\ **Post date:** [December 12, 2010, 6:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-you-sell-somebody-elses-soul-to-the-devil/563709/31 "2010-12-12T06:09:33Z")
I would definitely have my attornies look over the paperwork before signing. ---
**Author:** ![Miller](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/miller/32/481_2.png) [@Miller](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Miller)\ **Post date:** [December 12, 2010, 8:43am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-you-sell-somebody-elses-soul-to-the-devil/563709/32 "2010-12-12T08:43:10Z")
> [@Little\_Nemo](#): > > I would definitely have my attornies look over the paperwork before signing. Oh, that’ll work out well for you. Whose payroll do you think they’re on? ---
**Author:** ![BigT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bigt/32/12044_2.png) [@BigT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BigT)\ **Post date:** [December 12, 2010, 9:03am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-you-sell-somebody-elses-soul-to-the-devil/563709/33 "2010-12-12T09:03:35Z")
From what I understand, you only actually give up ownership of your soul when you die. You need it to live, so it’s not like it goes to the buyer right away. For Satan, this is no problem. He’s practically immortal, and so will outlive anyone. This is a problem for you, unless you intend to kill to actually get the soul. Of course, to do that, you have to actually have a method of collection, like some magick or something. Plus, I’m not certain that, when the devil gets ownership of your soul, he doesn’t automatically get ownership of all the other souls you have acquired. Your soul is literally you, so it’s what owns the other soul. So just like a slaveowner owns everything his slaves own, he owns those souls. And if you both committed murder and performed the required blasphemy of the Holy Spirit to get your soul-taking powers, he already is assured of you soul. But even if you assume that he does not, getting two souls instead of all the ones you currently have isn’t the best deal. He might be better off just making sure you don’t repent. ---
**Author:** ![Little\_Nemo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/little_nemo/32/3120_2.png) [@Little\_Nemo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Little_Nemo)\ **Post date:** [December 12, 2010, 6:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-you-sell-somebody-elses-soul-to-the-devil/563709/34 "2010-12-12T18:07:47Z")
> [@Miller](#): > > Oh, that’ll work out well for you. Whose payroll do you think they’re on? See that’s the great thing. They may be agents of evil but they’re on my payroll. And while agents of good might undermine me for the cause of the greater good, agents of evil have no problem in selling out the cause of evil for their own self-interest. ---
**Author:** ![Little\_Nemo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/little_nemo/32/3120_2.png) [@Little\_Nemo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Little_Nemo)\ **Post date:** [December 12, 2010, 6:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-you-sell-somebody-elses-soul-to-the-devil/563709/35 "2010-12-12T18:13:40Z")
> [@BigT](#): > > From what I understand, you only actually give up ownership of your soul when you die. You need it to live, so it’s not like it goes to the buyer right away. > > For Satan, this is no problem. He’s practically immortal, and so will outlive anyone. This is a problem for you, unless you intend to kill to actually get the soul. Of course, to do that, you have to actually have a method of collection, like some magick or something. > > Plus, I’m not certain that, when the devil gets ownership of your soul, he doesn’t automatically get ownership of all the other souls you have acquired. Your soul is literally you, so it’s what owns the other soul. So just like a slaveowner owns everything his slaves own, he owns those souls. And if you both committed murder and performed the required blasphemy of the Holy Spirit to get your soul-taking powers, he already is assured of you soul. > > But even if you assume that he does not, getting two souls instead of all the ones you currently have isn’t the best deal. He might be better off just making sure you don’t repent. I could make this work in my favor. From what you’re describing my ownership works like a lien. And it’s tied in to my lifetime and the lifetimes of the souls’ owners. So the devil needs to deal with me in an expeditious manner or the whole deal will start to fall apart as the participants die off. The worst case scenario for the devil is I die will holding all the liens and, having never made any deals with the devil myself, I bring my whole collection of souls with me to heaven. ---
**Author:** ![Eutychus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/a3d4f5/32.png) [@Eutychus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Eutychus)\ **Post date:** [December 13, 2010, 3:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-you-sell-somebody-elses-soul-to-the-devil/563709/36 "2010-12-13T15:47:40Z")
I believe there is precedent for this. In the case of Simpson vs. The Devil, it was alleged that Mr. Simpson had sold his soul to the devil. However, it was later shown that since he had given his soul away (to his wife, hereafter known as “Marge”) that he could not show proper ownership of said “soul” and therefore did not have the rights to sell it. ---
**Author:** ![Regallag\_The\_Axe](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/regallag_the_axe/32/445_2.png) [@Regallag\_The\_Axe](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Regallag_The_Axe)\ **Post date:** [December 13, 2010, 11:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-you-sell-somebody-elses-soul-to-the-devil/563709/37 "2010-12-13T23:46:01Z")
> [@Little\_Nemo](#): > > I could make this work in my favor. From what you’re describing my ownership works like a lien. And it’s tied in to my lifetime and the lifetimes of the souls’ owners. So the devil needs to deal with me in an expeditious manner or the whole deal will start to fall apart as the participants die off. The worst case scenario for the devil is I die will holding all the liens and, having never made any deals with the devil myself, I bring my whole collection of souls with me to heaven. Or you could simply consume the souls of others to prolong your own life. With a sufficient supply of souls, you could essentially live forever. With practical immortality, you would have the time to perfect the skills you’d need to get whatever you want! ---
**Author:** ![Little\_Nemo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/little_nemo/32/3120_2.png) [@Little\_Nemo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Little_Nemo)\ **Post date:** [December 14, 2010, 12:26am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-you-sell-somebody-elses-soul-to-the-devil/563709/38 "2010-12-14T00:26:54Z")
I don’t know about that. Where’s the evidence that souls equate to life? After all, we’ve established they can be transferred away without causing the original owner’s death. ---
**Author:** ![Boyo\_Jim](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/87869e/32.png) [@Boyo\_Jim](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Boyo_Jim)\ **Post date:** [December 14, 2010, 12:44am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-you-sell-somebody-elses-soul-to-the-devil/563709/39 "2010-12-14T00:44:55Z")
Define ‘soul’. Define ‘Devil’. Define ‘Can’. Define ‘you’. Define sell’. . . . ---
**Author:** ![Regallag\_The\_Axe](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/regallag_the_axe/32/445_2.png) [@Regallag\_The\_Axe](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Regallag_The_Axe)\ **Post date:** [December 14, 2010, 1:50am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-you-sell-somebody-elses-soul-to-the-devil/563709/40 "2010-12-14T01:50:22Z")
> [@Little\_Nemo](#): > > I don’t know about that. Where’s the evidence that souls equate to life? After all, we’ve established they can be transferred away without causing the original owner’s death. Well, you know how it is. You’ve got a bunch of souls, and you decide to see what they taste like, and it turns out they’re really, **really** delicious. A few millennia later the internet comes along and you start posting on message boards. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-you-sell-somebody-elses-soul-to-the-devil/563709.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/can-you-sell-somebody-elses-soul-to-the-devil/563709.md?page=3)