# \[Canada\] Trudeau gets to work **URL:** \ **Category:** In My Humble Opinion\ **Created:** [November 5, 2015, 2:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/canada-trudeau-gets-to-work/736709 "2015-11-05T14:28:50Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![wolfpup](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/wolfpup/32/10618_2.png) [@wolfpup](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/wolfpup)\ **Post date:** [November 6, 2015, 10:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/canada-trudeau-gets-to-work/736709/21 "2015-11-06T22:14:14Z")
> [@Northern\_Piper](#): > > And the long-form census is back! > > [Mandatory long-form census restored by new Liberal government](http://www.cbc.ca/news/politics/canada-liberal-census-data-1.3305271) > > I acknowledge that it seems very geeky that this should give me pleasure, but when the Conservatives abolished it in 2010, that was actually one of the clearest signs of their rejection of science in favour of ideology. **Governments of all levels and stripes need good, reliable information about the people, in order to provide services to the people.** Emphasis mine. Damn right. Thank you, I had not seen this news. 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![BrainGlutton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/82dd89/32.png) [@BrainGlutton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrainGlutton)\ **Post date:** [November 6, 2015, 10:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/canada-trudeau-gets-to-work/736709/22 "2015-11-06T22:36:56Z")
I have never seen anyone get so excited about a census form . . . ---
**Author:** ![Euphonious\_Polemic](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/euphonious_polemic/32/3002_2.png) [@Euphonious\_Polemic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Euphonious_Polemic)\ **Post date:** [November 6, 2015, 10:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/canada-trudeau-gets-to-work/736709/23 "2015-11-06T22:40:11Z")
> [@Northern\_Piper](#): > > I remember at the time being intrigued and bemused by how such an apparently dull topic caught on. I could imagine the backroom discussion in Tony “Guppy” Clement’s office: “a census form - surely only stats folks would worry about that?” Clement has now admitted that he did [not like the idea of cancelling the census in the first place](http://www.theglobeandmail.com/news/politics/liberals-to-reinstate-mandatory-longform-census/article27116084/). > [@](#): > > Mr. Clement told reporters on Thursday that the decision to bring in a voluntary census had been made “collectively” in 2010 by the Conservative government. In hindsight, he said, “I think I would have done it differently.” “Collectively”. Ha! The cancellation of the census had Harper’s fingerprints all over it. Eliminate actual data, and then you can say whatever you want. Especially after you shut those darn scientists and statisticians up! ---
**Author:** ![wolfpup](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/wolfpup/32/10618_2.png) [@wolfpup](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/wolfpup)\ **Post date:** [November 6, 2015, 10:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/canada-trudeau-gets-to-work/736709/24 "2015-11-06T22:44:42Z")
It’s not a “census form” issue, it’s a _ **census information** _ issue. It was a big political issue at the time, and for the same very good reason that the census itself is a big deal: it’s fundamental to all social and community planning at all levels of government. ---
**Author:** ![Northern\_Piper](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/northern_piper/32/5304_2.png) [@Northern\_Piper](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Northern_Piper)\ **Post date:** [November 6, 2015, 10:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/canada-trudeau-gets-to-work/736709/25 "2015-11-06T22:53:42Z")
> [@BrainGlutton](#): > > I have never seen anyone get so excited about a census form . . . We’re Canadian. ---
**Author:** ![tingbudong](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/tingbudong/32/520_2.png) [@tingbudong](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tingbudong)\ **Post date:** [November 6, 2015, 11:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/canada-trudeau-gets-to-work/736709/26 "2015-11-06T23:02:13Z")
Looks like our federal scientists are [getting their voices back!](http://www.nationalobserver.com/2015/11/06/news/breaking-trudeau-government-unmuzzles-scientists) ---
**Author:** ![Northern\_Piper](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/northern_piper/32/5304_2.png) [@Northern\_Piper](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Northern_Piper)\ **Post date:** [November 6, 2015, 11:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/canada-trudeau-gets-to-work/736709/27 "2015-11-06T23:11:00Z")
It’s sort of like when the ice starts to melt at the end of “Frozen”! ---
**Author:** ![Peremensoe](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/ce7236/32.png) [@Peremensoe](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Peremensoe)\ **Post date:** [November 6, 2015, 11:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/canada-trudeau-gets-to-work/736709/28 "2015-11-06T23:21:34Z")
Now they’re allowed to talk about how the ice is melting. ---
**Author:** ![wolfpup](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/wolfpup/32/10618_2.png) [@wolfpup](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/wolfpup)\ **Post date:** [November 6, 2015, 11:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/canada-trudeau-gets-to-work/736709/29 "2015-11-06T23:39:29Z")
> [@Peremensoe](#): > > Now they’re allowed to talk about how the ice is melting. When Catherine McKenna, the new Minister of Environment and Climate Change, was asked about the significance of adding “climate change” to the title, those were almost her exact words. In one momentous election, climate change has gone from “no such thing” to being an explicit and integral part of environmental policymaking. ---
**Author:** ![Euphonious\_Polemic](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/euphonious_polemic/32/3002_2.png) [@Euphonious\_Polemic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Euphonious_Polemic)\ **Post date:** [November 6, 2015, 11:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/canada-trudeau-gets-to-work/736709/30 "2015-11-06T23:43:16Z")
> [@tingbudong](#): > > Looks like our federal scientists are [getting their voices back!](http://www.nationalobserver.com/2015/11/06/news/breaking-trudeau-government-unmuzzles-scientists) I think a great Harper-era story was when there was a minor earthquake near Ottawa, and the press could get nobody from the Geological Survey of Canada who was allowed to say one single word on camera or to a reporter. They were all under the uniform gag order that the Harper Government had put on them. The press had to to to the **US** Geological Survey, where they were able to find AMERICAN scientists who were allowed to speak to the press about the Ottawa quake. ---
**Author:** ![CarnalK](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/carnalk/32/486_2.png) [@CarnalK](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CarnalK)\ **Post date:** [November 7, 2015, 12:25am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/canada-trudeau-gets-to-work/736709/31 "2015-11-07T00:25:17Z")
Personally, I find the Ministry name change quite annoying. I know climate change is an important issue but this seems like unseemly pandering. ---
**Author:** ![wolfpup](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/wolfpup/32/10618_2.png) [@wolfpup](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/wolfpup)\ **Post date:** [November 7, 2015, 1:12am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/canada-trudeau-gets-to-work/736709/32 "2015-11-07T01:12:01Z")
> [@CarnalK](#): > > Personally, I find the Ministry name change quite annoying. I know climate change is an important issue but this seems like unseemly pandering. I can understand that perspective. There’s something to be said for tradition. At MIT, computer science came under the umbrella of the department of electrical engineering for decades, until they finally deigned to rename it to “Electrical Engineering and Computer Science”. Meanwhile almost all other universities had established distinct computer science departments. But here’s the counter argument. There comes a point where a particular aspect of some field or policy matter outgrows its original boundaries. In politics image is important. You can hardly put that kind of label on a ministerial role and then fail to make climate commitments, nor can a future government rescind the label without having to explain why. And if at some point in the future it becomes common to have separate departments for the environment and for climate change because of the growing importance of the latter, this move will be seen as prescient. ---
**Author:** ![BrainGlutton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/82dd89/32.png) [@BrainGlutton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrainGlutton)\ **Post date:** [November 7, 2015, 2:01am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/canada-trudeau-gets-to-work/736709/33 "2015-11-07T02:01:14Z")
> [@wolfpup](#): > > I can understand that perspective. There’s something to be said for tradition. At MIT, computer science came under the umbrella of the department of electrical engineering for decades, until they finally deigned to rename it to “Electrical Engineering and Computer Science”. Meanwhile almost all other universities had established distinct computer science departments. That example does not sound like any argument **for** tradition. ---
**Author:** ![BrainGlutton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/82dd89/32.png) [@BrainGlutton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrainGlutton)\ **Post date:** [November 7, 2015, 2:07am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/canada-trudeau-gets-to-work/736709/34 "2015-11-07T02:07:57Z")
> [@CarnalK](#): > > Personally, I find the Ministry name change quite annoying. I know climate change is an important issue but this seems like unseemly pandering. It is not unseemly pandering unless they give it the name and then don’t actually do anything about climate change. You know, like happened with “Homeland Security.” But do you really expect that, from this government? ---
**Author:** ![BrainGlutton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/82dd89/32.png) [@BrainGlutton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrainGlutton)\ **Post date:** [November 7, 2015, 2:10am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/canada-trudeau-gets-to-work/736709/35 "2015-11-07T02:10:58Z")
> [@Euphonious\_Polemic](#): > > I think a great Harper-era story was when there was a minor earthquake near Ottawa, and the press could get nobody from the Geological Survey of Canada who was allowed to say one single word on camera or to a reporter. They were all under the uniform gag order that the Harper Government had put on them. > > The press had to to to the **US** Geological Survey, where they were able to find AMERICAN scientists who were allowed to speak to the press about the Ottawa quake. 😕 Why was the Geological Survey under a gag order? Earthquakes have nothing to do with climate change . . . nor with anything else that is politically controversial, AFAIK. (Of course, I have heard of a theory that fracking causes/facilitates earthquakes, or something like that, which **would** be politically controversial.) ---
**Author:** ![BrainGlutton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/82dd89/32.png) [@BrainGlutton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrainGlutton)\ **Post date:** [November 7, 2015, 2:17am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/canada-trudeau-gets-to-work/736709/36 "2015-11-07T02:17:21Z")
> [@Northern\_Piper](#): > > We’re Canadian. Yeah, I get it, changing the paper-towel roll is more excitement than you can bear . . . you get all worked up in anticipation and then you have post-paper-towel-roll-change-letdown afterwards . . . 😉 ---
**Author:** ![The\_Tooth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/c67d28/32.png) [@The\_Tooth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Tooth)\ **Post date:** [November 7, 2015, 2:18am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/canada-trudeau-gets-to-work/736709/37 "2015-11-07T02:18:25Z")
> [@BrainGlutton](#): > > Well . . . that is . . . grumblemumblemutter . . . you guys **still** put cheese curds on your fries, so there! I don’t. Speaking of which, do you know how hard it is to get the good people of Montana to understand the concept, never mind serve, fries and gravy? I do. ---
**Author:** ![Raygun99](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/6f9a4e/32.png) [@Raygun99](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Raygun99)\ **Post date:** [November 7, 2015, 2:20am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/canada-trudeau-gets-to-work/736709/38 "2015-11-07T02:20:54Z")
> [@BrainGlutton](#): > > 😕 Why was the Geological Survey under a gag order? Earthquakes have nothing to do with climate change . . . nor with anything else that is politically controversial, AFAIK. (Of course, I have heard of a theory that fracking causes/facilitates earthquakes, or something like that, which **would** be politically controversial.) It wasn’t that they, specifically, were under gag order, it was that all government-employed scientists were. ---
**Author:** ![BrainGlutton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/82dd89/32.png) [@BrainGlutton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrainGlutton)\ **Post date:** [November 7, 2015, 2:23am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/canada-trudeau-gets-to-work/736709/39 "2015-11-07T02:23:25Z")
> [@The\_Tooth](#): > > I don’t. Speaking of which, do you know how hard it is to get the good people of Montana to understand the concept, never mind serve, fries and gravy? > > I do. It is probably hard to get the good people of Montana to understand **most** concepts that do not involve mining or microbrewing or snow-skiing, but that’s another discussion . . . Even in such relatively sophisticated places as Baltimore, Maryland, it can be a problem. I once ordered fries with gravy there and got **chicken** gravy! :mad: ---
**Author:** ![BrainGlutton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/82dd89/32.png) [@BrainGlutton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrainGlutton)\ **Post date:** [November 7, 2015, 2:24am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/canada-trudeau-gets-to-work/736709/40 "2015-11-07T02:24:40Z")
> [@Raygun99](#): > > It wasn’t that they, specifically, were under gag order, it was that all government-employed scientists were. You mean, government-employed scientists under Harper could not talk to the press **at all, about anything?!** Seriously?! [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/canada-trudeau-gets-to-work/736709.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/canada-trudeau-gets-to-work/736709.md?page=3)