# Canadian 'dopers, Freedom Convoy? **URL:** \ **Category:** Politics & Elections\ **Created:** [February 10, 2022, 12:07am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/canadian-dopers-freedom-convoy/959186 "2022-02-10T00:07:49Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 13
**Author:** ![Skywatcher](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/skywatcher/32/254_2.png) [@Skywatcher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Skywatcher)\ **Post date:** [February 15, 2022, 12:59am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/canadian-dopers-freedom-convoy/959186/241 "2022-02-15T00:59:35Z")
> [@Guest-starring\_Id](#): > > Brad Howland called the protest “a beautiful, legal, peaceful protest” that he visited on the weekend. Studied business at Trump U, I’m guessing. ---
**Author:** ![RickJay](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/bb73d2/32.png) [@RickJay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RickJay)\ **Post date:** [February 15, 2022, 1:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/canadian-dopers-freedom-convoy/959186/242 "2022-02-15T01:09:15Z")
> [@k9bfriender](#): > > Why? One, it’s accurate. Really? EVERYONE there is a fascist? Even most? Come on, get serious. Anyway, for an interesting story, my sister works in an Ontario MPP’s office, running it. Obviously I’m not saying which one. They are being BESEIGED with communications, as you might imagine, both supporting and opposing the blockade. She reports: 1. Most of the pro-blockade emails and calls are from outside Ontario. (They essentially ignore them; they must given priority to Ontario residents, obviously.) 2. Those are, in her words, “dumb.” Dumber than football bats: most of the pro-blockade emails don’t get the concept of the provincial/federal division of powers; they’re writing to an MPP complaining about Justin Trudeau or about border rules. Apparently they also use a lot of capital letters, colors, and cite God a lot. ---
**Author:** ![RickJay](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/bb73d2/32.png) [@RickJay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RickJay)\ **Post date:** [February 15, 2022, 1:10am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/canadian-dopers-freedom-convoy/959186/243 "2022-02-15T01:10:45Z")
Incidentally, the invocation of the Emergency Powers Act does not seem to be consistent with the letter and purpose of the Act. ---
**Author:** ![ShadowFacts](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/shadowfacts/32/2934_2.png) [@ShadowFacts](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ShadowFacts)\ **Post date:** [February 15, 2022, 2:34am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/canadian-dopers-freedom-convoy/959186/244 "2022-02-15T02:34:09Z")
> [@octopus](#): > > Talking about enforcing the law selectively is a big deal. If you can ignore law when it’s convenient why can’t others? This whole ‘rooting out liberal hypocrisy’ schtick is tired and boring. It’s a classic Straight Dope example of Bricker Underlining Liberal Lies Showing Hypocrisy In Tenets. ---
**Author:** ![Dr\_Paprika](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dr_paprika/32/3042_2.png) [@Dr\_Paprika](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dr_Paprika)\ **Post date:** [February 15, 2022, 2:35am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/canadian-dopers-freedom-convoy/959186/245 "2022-02-15T02:35:58Z")
There is legitimate debate to be had on what is needed for people returning to Canada. For people without symptoms, an expensive test seems heavy handed at this stage of the pandemic where most travellers are vaccinated. As this is also a requirement to fly, I’d be okay with that standard myself. However, I do not have the responsibilities of government should there be further variants, and this might mean more changes down the road. Since no one can see the future, and since policies have changed several times - I would favour easing things for the time being. As per earlier threads, I get why truckers are asking “why now?”. But the protest no longer seems to be about the fine details of vaccine policies, about which reasonable people may differ. ---
**Author:** ![elbows](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/b3f665/32.png) [@elbows](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elbows)\ **Post date:** [February 15, 2022, 3:26am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/canadian-dopers-freedom-convoy/959186/246 "2022-02-15T03:26:47Z")
These mandates will/would have always been, lifted, within a couple of weeks anyway. It’s not about the mandate or the vaccine. They want to play ‘hard done by’ victims. ---
**Author:** ![Euphonious\_Polemic](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/euphonious_polemic/32/3002_2.png) [@Euphonious\_Polemic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Euphonious_Polemic)\ **Post date:** [February 15, 2022, 4:07am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/canadian-dopers-freedom-convoy/959186/247 "2022-02-15T04:07:07Z")
Their clearly stated goal is to remove the prime minister, who recently won an election. That’s really it. The mandate bullshit is just a fig leaf. As has been pointed out, many of the health mandates are provincial, and the federal government has no jurisdiction. Others are from private companies. (See above). And finally, mandates are starting to go away anyway, as cases drop. It’s like going into a bar 10 minutes before closing time, and demanding they stop serving alcohol. ---
**Author:** ![JohnT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/johnt/32/15048_2.png) [@JohnT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JohnT)\ **Post date:** [February 15, 2022, 4:30am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/canadian-dopers-freedom-convoy/959186/248 "2022-02-15T04:30:29Z")
> [@Euphonious\_Polemic](#): > > I think he may be taking a break. Last posted Jan 26. He PM’d me on the 31st to say he was taking a break from the dope, sounding uncertain as to his return. (Usually I don’t reveal PM info, but figured explaining that his absence is purposeful is OK.) ---
**Author:** ![velomont](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/v/8491ac/32.png) [@velomont](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/velomont)\ **Post date:** [February 15, 2022, 4:48am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/canadian-dopers-freedom-convoy/959186/249 "2022-02-15T04:48:39Z")
I suspect that you are probably correct in that. And they are so bloody oblivious as a result. ---
**Author:** ![octopus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/octopus/32/3716_2.png) [@octopus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/octopus)\ **Post date:** [February 15, 2022, 5:10am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/canadian-dopers-freedom-convoy/959186/250 "2022-02-15T05:10:45Z")
An almost clever acronym! Gaslighting protests aside the simple solution would to stop being an ideology of hypocrits. And as tired as the truthful observation may be it’s not quite as tired as the actual hypocrisy coming from the group who chants “All cops are bastards” and tosses Molotov cocktails at the police than wishing to have the same police enforce their will against protesters blocking a street. Why not send in social workers? Ottawa doesn’t want a winter of love? Or as hypocritical as a Prime Minister who supports said protests when it doesn’t effect him personally. When one is actually impacted by the ideology one promotes and doesn’t like the impact the proper response is to modify one’s belief system instead of whining about accurate observations or worse trying to shut down an accurate critique. ---
**Author:** ![Atamasama](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/atamasama/32/12961_2.png) [@Atamasama](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Atamasama)\ **Post date:** [February 15, 2022, 5:16am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/canadian-dopers-freedom-convoy/959186/251 "2022-02-15T05:16:42Z")
> [@octopus](#): > > And as tired as the truthful observation may be it’s not quite as tired as the actual hypocrisy coming from the group who chants “All cops are bastards” and tosses Molotov cocktails at the police than wishing to have the same police enforce their will against protesters blocking a street. Why not send in social workers? Ottawa doesn’t want a winter of love? Name a Democrat that supports throwing Molotov cocktails. And don’t try to pull the “all BLM protestors did it” garbage. ---
**Author:** ![DesertDog](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/desertdog/32/11503_2.png) [@DesertDog](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DesertDog)\ **Post date:** [February 15, 2022, 6:36am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/canadian-dopers-freedom-convoy/959186/252 "2022-02-15T06:36:54Z")
> [@Euphonious\_Polemic](#): > > You bet your ass the enforcement is selective. It’s the ol’ _bound but not protected_ vs. the _protected but not bound_ meme. ---
**Author:** ![RickJay](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/bb73d2/32.png) [@RickJay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RickJay)\ **Post date:** [February 15, 2022, 1:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/canadian-dopers-freedom-convoy/959186/253 "2022-02-15T13:38:14Z")
> [@Euphonious\_Polemic](#): > > As has been pointed out, many of the health mandates are provincial, and the federal government has no jurisdiction. Others are from private companies. (See above). As I noted a few messages ago, these folks don’t necessarily have a super clear understanding of what level of government is what. ---
**Author:** ![RitterSport](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/rittersport/32/6326_2.png) [@RitterSport](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RitterSport)\ **Post date:** [February 15, 2022, 1:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/canadian-dopers-freedom-convoy/959186/254 "2022-02-15T13:42:34Z")
Well, there’s probably a bunch of Americans, so you would expect nothing less. ---
**Author:** ![k9bfriender](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/k9bfriender/32/3283_2.png) [@k9bfriender](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/k9bfriender)\ **Post date:** [February 15, 2022, 1:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/canadian-dopers-freedom-convoy/959186/255 "2022-02-15T13:54:40Z")
> [@RickJay](#): > > Really? EVERYONE there is a fascist? Who has said that? You keep tilting at these strawmen, I’m gonna stop thinking that you are taking this seriously. What has been said is that the organizers of this are fascist and white supremacist groups. Many of the participants are as well. But no one has said that EVERYONE is. If you want to disagree that the organizers are fascist and/or white supremacism, make that case, but stop claiming that anyone said that EVERYONE there is. > [@RickJay](#): > > Come on, get serious. Please do. ---
**Author:** ![Horatius](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/horatius/32/3572_2.png) [@Horatius](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Horatius)\ **Post date:** [February 15, 2022, 1:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/canadian-dopers-freedom-convoy/959186/256 "2022-02-15T13:54:49Z")
> [@RitterSport](#): > > Well, there’s probably a bunch of Americans, so you would expect nothing less. Well, that might explain why they don’t know which _particular_ issues are federal government or provincial government, but with the US having a very similar federal/state structure, you’d think they’d at least be aware of the concept of State vs. Federal jurisdiction. But these guys don’t even understand that much. I’ve heard things online where someone was trying to explain it to them, and it was like watching a dog try to figure out why its bowl is empty. ---
**Author:** ![BeepKillBeep](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/9e8a1a/32.png) [@BeepKillBeep](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BeepKillBeep)\ **Post date:** [February 15, 2022, 2:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/canadian-dopers-freedom-convoy/959186/257 "2022-02-15T14:18:01Z")
> [@RickJay](#): > > We need to cut back on accusations of “fascism” and the like too I agree it has been overused in the past. In fact, I used to caution my friends about calling people like Harper a fascist, because if real fascists show up then nobody will pay attention. And guess what? Real fascists are here now, and people are not paying attention. The Republican party is now a fascist party. Anybody voting Republican is inherently voting for fascism whether they are fascist or not. And I do not think that anybody can reasonably claim to not see it. They’re being rather blatant about it now. And the same holds true for the Fascist Convoy. Created by fascists, for the purposes of grifting money for their causes, and gaining supporters by using the vaccine mandate as a wedge issue. Is every person that showed up to the protest a fascist? No. But once you’re there and started to see that you’re surrounded by fascists, and holocaust deniers are making speeches, etc, then you leave. So anybody who is left is ok with standing with fascists. There’s very little room for saying “Oh, I didn’t realize it” at this point. It is pretty blatant. It reminds me of the whole “Islamic terrorism” when the right was like “Why is the left afraid to call it what it is?” Well, here we are. A protest started by fascists for fascist purposes. Call it what it is … fascism. ---
**Author:** ![hogarth](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/hogarth/32/1773_2.png) [@hogarth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/hogarth)\ **Post date:** [February 15, 2022, 2:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/canadian-dopers-freedom-convoy/959186/258 "2022-02-15T14:22:29Z")
> [@Dr\_Paprika](#): > > Obviously the protestors include a hodgepodge of disaffected groups - including people unhappy with Trudeau, Trumpistas, contrarians, hippie types, anarchists, those whose identity is tied up with refusing vaccines, the frustrated, some truckers, American and foreign agitators, attention seekers, as well as those outside of mainstream politics. Reminds me a bit of Occupy Wall Street in terms of having a bunch of different groups with a bunch of different messages. ---
**Author:** ![RickJay](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/bb73d2/32.png) [@RickJay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RickJay)\ **Post date:** [February 15, 2022, 3:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/canadian-dopers-freedom-convoy/959186/259 "2022-02-15T15:29:21Z")
> [@BeepKillBeep](#): > > And guess what? Real fascists are here now, and people are not paying attention. The Republican party is now a fascist party. I agree but that’s an American thing. > [@BeepKillBeep](#): > > No. But once you’re there and started to see that you’re surrounded by fascists, But is that the case? Rather a great many actual eyewitness accounts say it is not. I cannot help but notice that the accounts of the occupiers teeming with white supremacists are not, in fact, eyewitness accounts. Here’s a counter account: [https://maybury.ca/the-reformed-physicist/2022/02/03/a-night-with-the-untouchables/](https://maybury.ca/the-reformed-physicist/2022/02/03/a-night-with-the-untouchables/) ---
**Author:** ![BeepKillBeep](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/9e8a1a/32.png) [@BeepKillBeep](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BeepKillBeep)\ **Post date:** [February 15, 2022, 3:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/canadian-dopers-freedom-convoy/959186/260 "2022-02-15T15:47:06Z")
That person seems like they were pretty sympathetic to the supposed cause of the protest, so I’m not sure I can trust their blog but I appreciate you providing it as a counter-point. I work with researchers at the University of Ottawa, and they paint a different picture for me. I also know for a fact that the organizers are far-right white supremacists. I also know with certainty that white supremacists groups are there, at a minimum the “Sons of Odin.” We also know that there’s a lot of far-right sympathies and QAnon nuttery, and Q is linked heavily to white nationalist (just go on the Facebook page or reddit). So can I be certain without being in Ottawa? No, but there’s a lot of evidence to suggest that it is true. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/canadian-dopers-freedom-convoy/959186.md?page=12) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/canadian-dopers-freedom-convoy/959186.md?page=14)