# Canadian 'dopers, how serious is all this about Justin Trudeau? **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [July 20, 2020, 8:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/canadian-dopers-how-serious-is-all-this-about-justin-trudeau/915868 "2020-07-20T20:17:03Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 5
**Author:** ![Uzi](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/91b2a8/32.png) [@Uzi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Uzi)\ **Post date:** [August 10, 2020, 2:06am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/canadian-dopers-how-serious-is-all-this-about-justin-trudeau/915868/81 "2020-08-10T02:06:48Z")
> [@Euphonious\_Polemic](#): > > Do you think Trudeau should have waded into Alberta when they were fucking up the response at meat packing plants and told them what to do? No, because Trudeau is an idiot. BUT, whatever federal department is responsible for this area, should be working with the equivalent provincial body to ensure that response is coordinated and successful across the country. And if that isn’t happening then the PM should get involved to resolve it. ---
**Author:** ![orcenio](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/orcenio/32/1036_2.png) [@orcenio](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/orcenio)\ **Post date:** [August 10, 2020, 2:24am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/canadian-dopers-how-serious-is-all-this-about-justin-trudeau/915868/82 "2020-08-10T02:24:06Z")
My opinion of Justin Trudeau hasn’t changed far from 3 years ago: > [@How's Trudeau doing, Canada?](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hows-trudeau-doing-canada/746019/98): > > Trudeau isn’t a leader, but an entitled name/smile. Nonetheless most Canadians are (and will continue to be) satisfied with his tepid governance. This will change when/if the Tories get a well respected leader and the Libs get bogged down in scandal. > [@How's Trudeau doing, Canada?](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hows-trudeau-doing-canada/746019/101): > > Trudeau, in particular, is an PM that is bred and image sculpted into an acceptable left-wing devil-may-care Pierre jr, saviour of Canada. He’s not half the free-spirited, intellectual, and political batsman as his father. He’s a smile in a coat. And, frankly, most Canadians are satisfied with that (for now). Harsh, but while his current experience makes him more-than-qualified to be PM, Trudeau just isn’t particularly intellectually ambitious. This is an armchair amateur psychoanalysis of the guy but I feel his intellectual indolence exhibits itself especially through lackluster political goals, no over-arcing policy direction (outside of “have me as PM”), and JT’s willingness to just shut-up and follow the important health/economic/political directions of his educated staff during this global pandemic. Thank God for that last point too. Can you imagine if we had an unaware, conceited, blind, arrogant, over-privileged Jared Kushner as PM? Justin Trudeau, at least, shows some amount of self-awareness when he’s in-over his head. ---
**Author:** ![BippityBoppityBoo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bippityboppityboo/32/5745_2.png) [@BippityBoppityBoo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BippityBoppityBoo)\ **Post date:** [August 10, 2020, 2:43am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/canadian-dopers-how-serious-is-all-this-about-justin-trudeau/915868/83 "2020-08-10T02:43:32Z")
> [@orcenio](#): > > JT’s willingness to just shut-up and follow the important health/economic/political directions of his educated staff during this global pandemic. I would accept this in a New York minute if we Americans could have this. Both a leader who had educated staff and the same one following their advice. ---
**Author:** ![Cat\_Whisperer](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cat_whisperer/32/4839_2.png) [@Cat\_Whisperer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cat_Whisperer)\ **Post date:** [August 10, 2020, 2:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/canadian-dopers-how-serious-is-all-this-about-justin-trudeau/915868/84 "2020-08-10T14:51:11Z")
> [@Grey](#): > > @Uzi, I’m just trying to point out while LIberal and SNC are two words everyone should raise an eyebrow at, in this case any linkage does not appear to be valid. We need to remember as well SNC-Lavalin is the largest construction company in Canada, followed by PLC Construction and EllisDon. I’m not sure how a company picks their construction contractor but a Quebec based one being picked to build a factory in Montreal with little lead time does not seem crazy to me. > > As for Medicom, they came into play back in [March 2020 as part of a group of 3 suppliers of PPE](https://pm.gc.ca/en/news/news-releases/2020/03/31/prime-minister-announces-new-partnerships-canadian-industries-fight) > > > The Government of Canada has signed new procurement agreements with Canadian companies Thornhill Medical, Medicom, and Spartan Bioscience to purchase and boost capacity to manufacture equipment and supplies including portable ventilators, surgical masks, and rapid testing kits. The government has ordered millions of supplies to ease the pressure on health care facilities. It has also signed letters of intent with five companies – Precision Biomonitoring, Fluid Energy Group Ltd., Irving Oil, Calko Group, and Stanfield’s – to produce additional test kits, hand sanitizer, and protective apparel including masks and gowns. Interesting you should mention PCL - PCL will not do business in Quebec because of their culture of corruption. ---
**Author:** ![Euphonious\_Polemic](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/euphonious_polemic/32/3002_2.png) [@Euphonious\_Polemic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Euphonious_Polemic)\ **Post date:** [August 10, 2020, 3:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/canadian-dopers-how-serious-is-all-this-about-justin-trudeau/915868/85 "2020-08-10T15:18:04Z")
> [@Uzi](#): > > No, because Trudeau is an idiot. BUT, whatever federal department is responsible for this area, should be working with the equivalent provincial body to ensure that response is coordinated and successful across the country. And if that isn’t happening then the PM should get involved to resolve it. Yes, we understand that “argle bargle, I hate Trudeau” is policy in some areas. However, to your point about the feds working with the provinces… it seems you’ve made this complaint without reviewing what actually happened and is happening in this area. As you say, “IF this isn’t happening”. I am amused that you simply assume that it is not, without even looking into it. > In January 2020, the co-chairs of the PHN Council established a FPT Special Advisory Committee on COVID-19 to advise the Conference of FPT Deputy Ministers of Health on the coordination, public health policy, and technical content related to the COVID-19 outbreak. > **[Pan-Canadian Public Health Network | Réseau pancanadien de santé publique](https://www.phn-rsp.ca/index.html)** > > The Pan-Canadian Public Health Network (PHN) is a network of individuals across Canada from many sectors and levels of government, who effectively work together to strengthen public health in Canada. The PHN includes academics, researchers, public... The Public Health Agency of Canada is also working collaboratively on this. Canada’s National Microbiology Laboratory (NML) is doing important research into Covid The feds have developed ethical and technical guidance for managing COVID-19 for health professionals and a broad range of sectors in collaboration with: - health authorities - public health experts - provincial and territorial governments But of course, you already knew that none of this was done, because “Trudeau is an idiot” ---
**Author:** ![BeepKillBeep](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/9e8a1a/32.png) [@BeepKillBeep](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BeepKillBeep)\ **Post date:** [August 10, 2020, 5:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/canadian-dopers-how-serious-is-all-this-about-justin-trudeau/915868/86 "2020-08-10T17:56:18Z")
When I was in the military, one of the things we were taught is that as an officer our job is to provide leadership and vision. It is not to be an expert in all things. You will never have as much as expertise as the troops. You need to listen to them, absorb what they have to say, and then make a decision. Trudeau, for the most part, does that. He is face and voice of the government but rarely presents himself as the one with all of the answers. That’s good leadership. That isn’t to say of course that’s he hasn’t done some incredibly stupid things, both before and as PM. And that matters to me, because I want to be able to vote on policy, not personality. I care predominantly about the platform and policies presented by each of the major parties. My hope is that Peter McKay gets CPC leadership. And I hope that McKay will help normalize the party a bit. The CPC is just feeling a bit too Republican for my tastes as of late. I sincerely hope that social conservativism is a losing prospect in Canada because it 100% not the way I want the country to go. As long as the CPC continues with a wink wink nudge nudge (or more) to social conservativism, they will have a hard time getting my vote. ---
**Author:** ![Hypnagogic\_Jerk](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/hypnagogic_jerk/32/4252_2.png) [@Hypnagogic\_Jerk](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hypnagogic_Jerk)\ **Post date:** [August 10, 2020, 11:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/canadian-dopers-how-serious-is-all-this-about-justin-trudeau/915868/87 "2020-08-10T23:58:12Z")
@Cat_Whisperer says: > Interesting you should mention PCL - PCL will not do business in Quebec because of their culture of corruption. Don’t know much about PCL Construction, but according to [their website](https://www.pcl.com/Meet-the-PCL-Family/Locations/Canada/Ottawa/Pages/Ottawa-Office.aspx): > Welcome to PCL Ottawa! We’ve been building landmarks in Eastern Ontario, Quebec, and beyond for more than a quarter of a century. ---
**Author:** ![Dr\_Paprika](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dr_paprika/32/3042_2.png) [@Dr\_Paprika](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dr_Paprika)\ **Post date:** [August 11, 2020, 1:08am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/canadian-dopers-how-serious-is-all-this-about-justin-trudeau/915868/88 "2020-08-11T01:08:58Z")
It’s less scandalous but it looks like the Liberals may have run a similar play with a “no one else can do it” choice of a company to administer loans. Time will tell. ---
**Author:** ![Uzi](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/91b2a8/32.png) [@Uzi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Uzi)\ **Post date:** [August 11, 2020, 2:54am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/canadian-dopers-how-serious-is-all-this-about-justin-trudeau/915868/89 "2020-08-11T02:54:43Z")
> [@Euphonious\_Polemic](#): > > However, to your point about the feds working with the provinces… it seems you’ve made this complaint without reviewing what actually happened and is happening in this area. As you say, “IF this isn’t happening”. I am amused that you simply assume that it is not, without even looking into it. Is this some sort of gotchya? But, I took you at your word. I guess I’m stupid as well. > [@Euphonious\_Polemic](#): > > Do you think Trudeau should have waded into Alberta when they were fucking up the response at meat packing plants and told them what to do? > [@Euphonious\_Polemic](#): > > But of course, you already knew that none of this was done, because “Trudeau is an idiot” So, you say Trudeau isn’t an idiot? I have proof [Link](https://www.quora.com/Was-Justin-Trudeau-racist-for-wearing-blackface-several-times). What do you have? ---
**Author:** ![Cat\_Whisperer](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cat_whisperer/32/4839_2.png) [@Cat\_Whisperer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cat_Whisperer)\ **Post date:** [August 11, 2020, 4:11am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/canadian-dopers-how-serious-is-all-this-about-justin-trudeau/915868/90 "2020-08-11T04:11:48Z")
> [@Hypnagogic\_Jerk](#): > > @Cat_Whisperer says: > > > Interesting you should mention PCL - PCL will not do business in Quebec because of their culture of corruption. > > Don’t know much about PCL Construction, but according to [their website](https://www.pcl.com/Meet-the-PCL-Family/Locations/Canada/Ottawa/Pages/Ottawa-Office.aspx): > > > Welcome to PCL Ottawa! We’ve been building landmarks in Eastern Ontario, Quebec, and beyond for more than a quarter of a century. I asked my husband about this (he’s the one who told me PCL doesn’t work in Quebec - something he found out working at PCL for 10 years), and he said that they did a test run in Gatineau about six years ago, and I guess it must have gone okay if they’re still working there. So, to update, it sounds like PCL is cautiously attempting to work in Quebec now. ---
**Author:** ![Dread\_Pirate\_Jimbo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dread_pirate_jimbo/32/3897_2.png) [@Dread\_Pirate\_Jimbo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dread_Pirate_Jimbo)\ **Post date:** [August 11, 2020, 4:35am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/canadian-dopers-how-serious-is-all-this-about-justin-trudeau/915868/91 "2020-08-11T04:35:42Z")
Can confirm. I worked for PCL from 2004-2013. PCL has maintained an office in Ottawa for quite a number of years (they built the Canadian Tire Centre for the Senators), but it was common knowledge in the company that they were very reluctant to cross the border into Quebec due to the well-known, shady business practices in the construction industry out there. In 2013 they decided to take on a major project in Gatineau (IIRC, a hospital) to test the waters, with the expectation that they would continue to perform work in Quebec if they could finish the job without having to grease palms or put up with shoddy workmanship. So it appears that after a century in business, they’ve begun to operate in Quebec. But generally speaking, that’s a company that stays out of sketchy locations. They do billions of work in the United States as well, with offices in Los Angeles Denver, Seattle, Minnesota, etc., but by my recollection stayed the hell away from Chicago and New York City. ---
**Author:** ![Grey](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/b782af/32.png) [@Grey](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Grey)\ **Post date:** [August 11, 2020, 1:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/canadian-dopers-how-serious-is-all-this-about-justin-trudeau/915868/92 "2020-08-11T13:52:58Z")
2013 would have been mid way through the Charbonneau Commission into graft and corruption between local governments in Montreal (though some provincial ministers were investigated as well) and the engineering and construction industries. Especially around the McGill Hospital which brings SNC into the picture. ---
**Author:** ![Cat\_Whisperer](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cat_whisperer/32/4839_2.png) [@Cat\_Whisperer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cat_Whisperer)\ **Post date:** [August 12, 2020, 4:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/canadian-dopers-how-serious-is-all-this-about-justin-trudeau/915868/93 "2020-08-12T16:33:30Z")
PM Trudeau not answering questions from PC MP Pierre Poilievre - that was uncomfortable to watch. PM Trudeau doesn’t seem to like being asked tough questions, and doesn’t seem to like answering them. Maybe he should stop doing highly questionable things, then. [![](https://img.youtube.com/vi/8bGVNPw9R8o/maxresdefault.jpg "'Nobody believes you': Poilievre grills Trudeau as he testifies over WE Charity controversy") ](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8bGVNPw9R8o) ---
**Author:** ![Euphonious\_Polemic](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/euphonious_polemic/32/3002_2.png) [@Euphonious\_Polemic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Euphonious_Polemic)\ **Post date:** [August 12, 2020, 6:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/canadian-dopers-how-serious-is-all-this-about-justin-trudeau/915868/94 "2020-08-12T18:37:26Z")
> [@Cat\_Whisperer](#): > > Pierre Poilievre I wouldn’t answer questions from this member of the opposition either. Poilievre is the worst example from his party I can think of. He has tried to make voting harder for poor people (pulling a page out of the Republican playbook), thinks using the term “tar baby” is appropriate, (Ohhh, he had no idea this was a racist term… bullshit), is famous for crapping on indigenous peoples of Canada… Anything he says is simply partisan blather, and can be discounted as a fact-free rant. ---
**Author:** ![Sam\_Stone](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ecccb3/32.png) [@Sam\_Stone](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sam_Stone)\ **Post date:** [August 12, 2020, 8:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/canadian-dopers-how-serious-is-all-this-about-justin-trudeau/915868/95 "2020-08-12T20:35:47Z")
> [@Euphonious\_Polemic](#): > > I wouldn’t answer questions from this member of the opposition either. > Poilievre is the worst example from his party I can think of. He has tried to make voting harder for poor people (pulling a page out of the Republican playbook), thinks using the term “tar baby” is appropriate, (Ohhh, he had no idea this was a racist term… bullshit), is famous for crapping on indigenous peoples of Canada… > > Anything he says is simply partisan blather, and can be discounted as a fact-free rant. Is there something about a person’s background that makes a question invalid? This is pure ad-hominem nonsense. Either the question is reasonable or it isn’t. It doesn’t matter if it was delivered by a politician, a clown (but I repeat myself), a racist, a saint, or a flying monkey. But it is a great way to deflect from a difficult question: “I don’t answer the questions of bad people! You are bad! Therefore, I’m innocent.” ---
**Author:** ![Euphonious\_Polemic](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/euphonious_polemic/32/3002_2.png) [@Euphonious\_Polemic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Euphonious_Polemic)\ **Post date:** [August 12, 2020, 8:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/canadian-dopers-how-serious-is-all-this-about-justin-trudeau/915868/96 "2020-08-12T20:55:09Z")
> [@Sam\_Stone](#): > > Is there something about a person’s background that makes a question invalid? His background is a partisan, ethics-free blatherer from the opposition party. His questions are not “invalid”, but they are tainted. His background certainly comes into play, and needs to be considered when looking at the context of “Trudeau didn’t answer him nicely”. The original post seemed to give the impression that Pollievere was a nice, independent journalist. He is not. ---
**Author:** ![Sam\_Stone](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ecccb3/32.png) [@Sam\_Stone](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sam_Stone)\ **Post date:** [August 12, 2020, 9:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/canadian-dopers-how-serious-is-all-this-about-justin-trudeau/915868/97 "2020-08-12T21:25:56Z")
The question is a question. It’s not ‘tainted’ by the background of the questioner. If the questioner was anonymous, would you say that you can’t understand the question without knowing the identity of the questioner? If not, then the identity of the questioner is irrelevant to the question. Please explain how a clear question about a factual matter becomes ‘tainted’ because of the person who asked it. The question could be tendentious, or misleading, or a statement shrouded in a question, or an accusation shrouded in a question. But those can be parsed by looking at the question itself. ---
**Author:** ![Cat\_Whisperer](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cat_whisperer/32/4839_2.png) [@Cat\_Whisperer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cat_Whisperer)\ **Post date:** [August 12, 2020, 9:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/canadian-dopers-how-serious-is-all-this-about-justin-trudeau/915868/98 "2020-08-12T21:36:47Z")
> [@Euphonious\_Polemic](#): > > > [@Sam\_Stone](#): > > > > Is there something about a person’s background that makes a question invalid? > > His background is a partisan, ethics-free blatherer from the opposition party. His questions are not “invalid”, but they are tainted. His background certainly comes into play, and needs to be considered when looking at the context of “Trudeau didn’t answer him nicely”. The original post seemed to give the impression that Pollievere was a nice, independent journalist. He is not. I called him PC MP Pierre Poilievre - I’m not sure where you’re getting “nice, independent journalist” from. Mr. Poilievre looks like an annoying asshole to me, but he was asking these questions as a duly elected Canadian Member of Parliament during a virtual House of Commons Standing Committee on Finance (FINA). ---
**Author:** ![RickJay](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/bb73d2/32.png) [@RickJay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RickJay)\ **Post date:** [August 12, 2020, 9:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/canadian-dopers-how-serious-is-all-this-about-justin-trudeau/915868/99 "2020-08-12T21:45:01Z")
> [@Euphonious\_Polemic](#): > > I wouldn’t answer questions from this member of the opposition either. That isn’t how Parliament is supposed to work, and any reasonable adult just interprets this as a bullshit excuse not to answer a difficult question. ---
**Author:** ![Dr\_Paprika](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dr_paprika/32/3042_2.png) [@Dr\_Paprika](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dr_Paprika)\ **Post date:** [August 12, 2020, 10:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/canadian-dopers-how-serious-is-all-this-about-justin-trudeau/915868/100 "2020-08-12T22:36:14Z")
I’m not the biggest fan of Pierre Poilievre but the questions he asked Trudeau were tough and fairly reasonable. I agree his background is sometimes shady. Trudeau did not answer some of his questions, but he didn’t have to answer to anyone and chose to do it. Canadian politics being what it is, one half expects the totally unloaded question “when will you and your gang of thugs resign?”. This wasn’t that. [![](https://img.youtube.com/vi/Xm6GiHomqG4/hqdefault.jpg "The Springfield Mayoral Debate (The Simpsons)") ](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Xm6GiHomqG4) [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/canadian-dopers-how-serious-is-all-this-about-justin-trudeau/915868.md?page=4) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/canadian-dopers-how-serious-is-all-this-about-justin-trudeau/915868.md?page=6)