# Canadian English vs. American English along the border **URL:** \ **Category:** In My Humble Opinion\ **Created:** [November 1, 2015, 3:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/canadian-english-vs-american-english-along-the-border/736337 "2015-11-01T15:32:05Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![RickJay](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/bb73d2/32.png) [@RickJay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RickJay)\ **Post date:** [November 2, 2015, 9:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/canadian-english-vs-american-english-along-the-border/736337/41 "2015-11-02T21:07:55Z")
> [@CalMeacham](#): > > I’ve lived in three places in New York State, and never heard anyone speak that way, either. Born, raised and live in Ontario. New Yorkers certainly don’t sound like we do, but it’s not exactly “hat” or hot, either. Of course, it’s hard to spell these things out, but there is an extremely noticeable change in accent when I cross into Buffalo or, for that matter, drive down and cross over to Detroit. It works both ways, too; people in Detroit instantly identify me as Canadian. I’ll have to make a point of trying to figure out the major differences the next time I go there. I wholeheartedly agree with Hari Seldon that Canadians as a whole have fewer accents; there is very, very little difference between me and someone from Lethbridge, whereas if I cross the border and begin driving south I can tell the difference between someone from Lansing and someone from Troy, OH, a distance of maybe four hours’ drive. You can hear different accents if you go down East but past Quebec everyone starts to sound the same. The major difference, I find, is rural versus urban; people in small towns tend to have more classically, strongly Canadian accents than people in large cities, who will tend to demonstrate a less pronounced, but still noticeable, Canadian. ---
**Author:** ![Muffin](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/muffin/32/4341_2.png) [@Muffin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Muffin)\ **Post date:** [November 2, 2015, 9:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/canadian-english-vs-american-english-along-the-border/736337/42 "2015-11-02T21:30:45Z")
I cannot receive broadcast TV where I live. When I am staying at motels in Northern Ontario, American shows outnumber Canadian ones on cable service. As it happens, when I want to watch something, either at home or on the road, I plug my laptop into a TV and watch Netflix, where again American shows and movies outnumber Canadian ones. Hearing American accents is pervasive in Canada. ---
**Author:** ![hogarth](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/hogarth/32/1773_2.png) [@hogarth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/hogarth)\ **Post date:** [November 3, 2015, 1:17am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/canadian-english-vs-american-english-along-the-border/736337/43 "2015-11-03T01:17:18Z")
> [@RickJay](#): > > Born, raised and live in Ontario. > > New Yorkers certainly don’t sound like we do, but it’s not exactly “hat” or hot, either. Of course, it’s hard to spell these things out, but there is an extremely noticeable change in accent when I cross into Buffalo or, for that matter, drive down and cross over to Detroit. There’s definitely a Buffalo accent that’s kind of like that. In this episode of “Saul of the Mole Men”, you can hear Saul (who is supposed to be from Buffalo) talking about “nastrils” and being “self-canscious” (around 6:15 in the video). > **[Watch Saul of the Mole Men from Adult Swim](https://www.adultswim.com/videos/saul-of-the-mole-men/moustache-ride/)** > > Watch Saul of the Mole Men Episodes and Clips for Free from Adult Swim. Watch free episodes, clips and videos of the live action Adult Swim series Saul of the Mole Men on AdultSwim.com. ---
**Author:** ![Spoons](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/spoons/32/3141_2.png) [@Spoons](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Spoons)\ **Post date:** [November 3, 2015, 6:40am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/canadian-english-vs-american-english-along-the-border/736337/44 "2015-11-03T06:40:24Z")
> [@Northern\_Piper](#): > > Even limited to that area, I know that cable subscribers in southern Saskatchewan get the US networks as part of their basic package, as mentioned above, and would be extremely surprised if it was not the same for southern Alberta ( **Spoons**?) It is the same for southern Alberta: basic cable includes the five major US networks (ABC, CBS, NBC, PBS, Fox), plus CNN. In addition, TSN and Sportsnet (included in basic cable, these are Canada’s equivalents of ESPN) often carry feeds of US sports from ESPN and other US sports broadcasters, so I’m not missing important sports events. Heck, Sportsnet broadcast the recent baseball World Series–except it didn’t really. It just showed the feed from Fox Sports, complete with American commentary. ---
**Author:** ![Spoons](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/spoons/32/3141_2.png) [@Spoons](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Spoons)\ **Post date:** [November 3, 2015, 6:54am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/canadian-english-vs-american-english-along-the-border/736337/45 "2015-11-03T06:54:59Z")
> [@hogarth](#): > > There’s definitely a Buffalo accent that’s kind of like that. Older Southern Ontarians would remember the days before Canadian cable companies could substitute Canadian ads over American ones when viewers were watching American channels. So we got the US ads, including local Buffalo ones. Dan Creed Chev-Olds, “Starts Friday in Depew, Saturday in North Tonawanda, Sunday in Lackawanna, Monday in Olean and Dunkirk,” and Super-Duper Supermarkets. All these locally-produced ads, featuring local talent, had accents that were _wayyyy_ off what we heard every day at home in Toronto. Joey, Super-Duper’s spokesperson, was speaking English, but when she said, “Not forty-nine cents, not thirty-nine cents, but just twenty-nine cents,” in her Buffalo accent, it was hard to believe that we in Toronto were just 60 miles away as the crow flies. Buffalo newscasters–Irv Weinstein, Tom Jolls, and Barry Lillis (the weatherman from the NBC affiliate), and others, did not sound foreign at all. But Joey and Dan Creed and the “Starts Friday” guy? Wow! ---
**Author:** ![Muffin](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/muffin/32/4341_2.png) [@Muffin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Muffin)\ **Post date:** [November 3, 2015, 1:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/canadian-english-vs-american-english-along-the-border/736337/46 "2015-11-03T13:49:24Z")
> [@Spoons](#): > > In the days of Toronto the Good, Buffalo was depressingly repetitive with it’s local news: “Fire in Cheektowaga. Fire in North Tonawanda. Fire in Lackawanna.” I grew up wondering if anything else ever happened in Buffalo. Then one year they had a big snowstorm, so the news was slightly different for a couple of days. ---
**Author:** ![Leaffan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/leaffan/32/299_2.png) [@Leaffan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Leaffan)\ **Post date:** [November 3, 2015, 7:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/canadian-english-vs-american-english-along-the-border/736337/47 "2015-11-03T19:49:24Z")
> [@hogarth](#): > > There’s definitely a Buffalo accent that’s kind of like that. > > In this episode of “Saul of the Mole Men”, you can hear Saul (who is supposed to be from Buffalo) talking about “nastrils” and being “self-canscious” (around 6:15 in the video). > [Moustache Ride - S1 EP6 - Saul of the Mole Men](http://www.adultswim.com/videos/saul-of-the-mole-men/moustache-ride/) That’s exactly what I was referring to. A friend of mine went shopping in Buffalo a few years back. He bought some shoes and the clerk asked him if he wanted the “backs.” “The backs?” “Yes. The backs. Do you want the backs?” Much confusion continued until he figured out she was talking about the box. Michiganders have the same accent, whether you want to believe it or not. When I listen to main-stream media, CNN, The tonight Show, etc. I detect no difference between my accent (in Ontario) and the main-stream accent. To my ears I sound just like Anderson Cooper or Jimmy Fallon. Although I do in fact say “eh” once in a while. I also get a kick out of your mangling of French words and names. ---
**Author:** ![RickJay](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/bb73d2/32.png) [@RickJay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RickJay)\ **Post date:** [November 3, 2015, 9:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/canadian-english-vs-american-english-along-the-border/736337/48 "2015-11-03T21:31:01Z")
> [@Leaffan](#): > > Michiganders have the same accent, whether you want to believe it or not. They don’t sound the same to me, and believe me, I’m in both places a lot. Buffalo (and northwestern NY; it’s true of Rochester, too) is kind of like Michigan but with a flavour of New York City and Boston. > [@](#): > > When I listen to main-stream media, CNN, The tonight Show, etc. I detect no difference between my accent (in Ontario) and the main-stream accent. Someone else would, though. The “media” accent is meant to be relatable, something everyone kind of thinks they sound like. You do not sound the same. You’re closer than, say, someone from the deepest hills of Georgia, but the Canadian accent is distinct and there’s a few words that are dead giveaways. After I’ve spent awhile in the States, I can hear it myself. Matthew Perry once told a story about how when he was cast in “Friends,” the producers told him his job was pretty much to act like himself; that’s why they hired him. But for the first few seasons they’d have to cut a scene because, while he had to act like himself, himself was Canadian, and he’d occasionally say a line in a way that was unmistakably Canadian (which his character wasn’t) and everyone would burst out laughing at his accent. ---
**Author:** ![glowacks](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/glowacks/32/5548_2.png) [@glowacks](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/glowacks)\ **Post date:** [November 4, 2015, 12:05am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/canadian-english-vs-american-english-along-the-border/736337/49 "2015-11-04T00:05:38Z")
> [@Leaffan](#): > > That’s exactly what I was referring to. > > A friend of mine went shopping in Buffalo a few years back. He bought some shoes and the clerk asked him if he wanted the “backs.” “The backs?” “Yes. The backs. Do you want the backs?” Much confusion continued until he figured out she was talking about the box. > > Michiganders have the same accent, whether you want to believe it or not. > > When I listen to main-stream media, CNN, The tonight Show, etc. I detect no difference between my accent (in Ontario) and the main-stream accent. To my ears I sound just like Anderson Cooper or Jimmy Fallon. Although I do in fact say “eh” once in a while. > > I also get a kick out of your mangling of French words and names. I’m guessing this is the [Northern Cities Vowel Shift](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Northern_Cities_Vowel_Shift). ---
**Author:** ![Muffin](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/muffin/32/4341_2.png) [@Muffin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Muffin)\ **Post date:** [November 4, 2015, 12:12am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/canadian-english-vs-american-english-along-the-border/736337/50 "2015-11-04T00:12:32Z")
_**Spoons, I sincerely apologize for attributing my statement at [post 46](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=18827855&postcount=46) as being a quote from you. I totally botched my coding.**_ I hope that pissed off Buffalos to not gore you over this. ---
**Author:** ![Leaffan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/leaffan/32/299_2.png) [@Leaffan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Leaffan)\ **Post date:** [November 4, 2015, 12:32am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/canadian-english-vs-american-english-along-the-border/736337/51 "2015-11-04T00:32:33Z")
> [@glowacks](#): > > I’m guessing this is the [Northern Cities Vowel Shift](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Northern_Cities_Vowel_Shift). I believe that’s exactly what it is, and we don’t share that a mere one kilometer from the border, which is strange. ---
**Author:** ![Spoons](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/spoons/32/3141_2.png) [@Spoons](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Spoons)\ **Post date:** [November 4, 2015, 1:56am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/canadian-english-vs-american-english-along-the-border/736337/52 "2015-11-04T01:56:05Z")
No harm done, **Muffin** ; I was sure it was an error in coding. In fact, I got a little chuckle out of it, as I remembered Irv Weinstein so often saying, “Topping tonight’s Eyewitness News–Fire in North Tonawanda!” ---
**Author:** ![wolfpup](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/wolfpup/32/10618_2.png) [@wolfpup](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/wolfpup)\ **Post date:** [November 4, 2015, 2:43am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/canadian-english-vs-american-english-along-the-border/736337/53 "2015-11-04T02:43:29Z")
> [@Muffin](#): > > … “Fire in Cheektowaga. Fire in North Tonawanda. Fire in Lackawanna.” > > I grew up wondering if anything else ever happened in Buffalo. Then one year they had a big snowstorm, so the news was slightly different for a couple of days. Yes, it was “firefighters unable to reach North Tonawanda or Lackawanna due to big snowstorm.” ---
**Author:** ![Derleth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/b9e5f3/32.png) [@Derleth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Derleth)\ **Post date:** [November 4, 2015, 2:55am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/canadian-english-vs-american-english-along-the-border/736337/54 "2015-11-04T02:55:38Z")
> [@Northern\_Piper](#): > > Even limited to that area, I know that cable subscribers in southern Saskatchewan get the US networks as part of their basic package, as mentioned above, and would be extremely surprised if it was not the same for southern Alberta ( **Spoons**?) OK, this surprises me, unless you’re talking about Big National Networks like CNN, Fox News (not local Fox affiliates, but national Fox News), TNT, USA, SyFy, and so on. That’s also not what I meant. [Great Falls, MT ranks 191 according to Nielsen.](http://www.tvnewscheck.com/tv-station-directory/dma) That’s out of the top 100, which I can use as a very generous cutoff for big-market/small-market for my purposes. (100 is Ft. Smith-Fayetteville-Springdale-Rogers, AR. Where? Exactly. I said it was generous.) And that’s it. Look at a map: Every other city in the state is a heck of a long way from Great Falls. If you want American TV influence in the part of Canada near Havre, Great Falls is pretty much it unless you think one of the other cities in Montana sends TV north. Which would be surprising, given that no city in Montana cracks the top 100. And if you get far enough west to find a big market, guess what? It’s Seattle-Vancouver. Of course TV crosses the border there. Of course I knew that Canadians get _The Simpsons_, for example. Of course I knew Canadians get enough American _shows_ they need CanCon laws, or think they do. I was talking about American _local TV networks_. I’m very surprised to hear those travel in Canadian cable and satellite packages. ---
**Author:** ![Lord\_Feldon](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lord_feldon/32/341_2.png) [@Lord\_Feldon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lord_Feldon)\ **Post date:** [November 4, 2015, 4:36am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/canadian-english-vs-american-english-along-the-border/736337/55 "2015-11-04T04:36:55Z")
> [@Derleth](#): > > I was talking about American _local TV networks_. I’m very surprised to hear those travel in Canadian cable and satellite packages. They aren’t necessarily the _nearby_ local stations, though. When I was in Saskatchewan ten years ago, the hotel cable had at least one channel from Detroit, PBS from Seattle, and a couple from Minneapolis IIRC. ---
**Author:** ![Spoons](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/spoons/32/3141_2.png) [@Spoons](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Spoons)\ **Post date:** [November 4, 2015, 4:38am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/canadian-english-vs-american-english-along-the-border/736337/56 "2015-11-04T04:38:51Z")
_sigh_ As the Canadian who is most likely closest to Great Falls, Montana (that city is only three hours by road south of me), I guess it falls to me. Canadians have chimed in repeatedly in this thread about how they get American networks and channels. I’ve spoken how my US networks come via cable from Spokane, WA; others have spoken about how they get theirs from Buffalo, NY, and even Minot ND. So what is it about Great Falls that makes it somehow special? Is it that we don’t get Great Falls news here in Lethbridge, ads for Great Falls businesses, weather for the Great Falls area, results from Great Falls high school sports? On the other hand, I do get local news and ads on my US channels from Spokane: ads for Northern Quest casino, the resorts at Coeur d’Alene (as an aside, I’d love to play golf there someday after seeing ads for CdA’s course), local Spokane news, Gonzagas NCAA basketball games, and so on. All available as part of my basic cable package. So, TV crosses the border, even here in sparsely-populated southern Alberta. It is not restricted to Seattle-Vancouver, Buffalo-Toronto, or Rochester-Montreal. Let’s return to your original premise: you said something like, “We don’t get their [i.e. Canadians’] TV, they don’t get ours.” I cannot comment on the former point, but I think we’ve all proven your latter point to be wrong. ---
**Author:** ![Jim\_s\_Son](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/e19adc/32.png) [@Jim\_s\_Son](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jim_s_Son)\ **Post date:** [November 4, 2015, 5:43am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/canadian-english-vs-american-english-along-the-border/736337/57 "2015-11-04T05:43:32Z")
I went to college in Buffalo in the 1970s and had a portable black and white tv that could pick up 3 Toronto and 1 Hamilton station. Canadians would pronounce “Schedule” without the c and you’d see occasional different spellings like “centre”. But the Canadian “eh” you hear from Don Cherry now or “Great White North” wasn’t used much. Back then you’d want a few years to see movies on network tv. They would appear several days earlier on Canadian tv and have more of the original violence (machine gunning of deGaulle’s car in “Day of the Jackal”) and nudity (breasts of Michael’s Italian wife in “Godfather”). ---
**Author:** ![Muffin](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/muffin/32/4341_2.png) [@Muffin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Muffin)\ **Post date:** [November 4, 2015, 8:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/canadian-english-vs-american-english-along-the-border/736337/58 "2015-11-04T08:09:13Z")
> [@Spoons](#): > > the resorts at Coeur d’Alene (as an aside, I’d love to play golf there someday after seeing ads for CdA’s course) Idaho’s white water paddling is exceptionally good. I’ve said it before, and I’ll say it again. I want to trade Idaho for PEI. > [@Jim\_s\_Son](#): > > I went to college in Buffalo in the 1970s and had a portable black and white tv that could pick up 3 Toronto and 1 Hamilton station. Canadians would pronounce “Schedule” without the c Damn, my accent has been Americanized. I lived between Toronto and Oakville in the 60s and 70s, but I pronounce schedule with a hard c and I have no idea when it changed. Sniff – now I feel like a linguistic traitor. ---
**Author:** ![Kamino\_Neko](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kamino_neko/32/34_2.png) [@Kamino\_Neko](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kamino_Neko)\ **Post date:** [November 4, 2015, 9:25am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/canadian-english-vs-american-english-along-the-border/736337/59 "2015-11-04T09:25:01Z")
> [@Lord\_Feldon](#): > > They aren’t necessarily the _nearby_ local stations, though. Yeah…when I was living in Newfoundland, we got our American TV networks from Detroit. (I think they’re out of Buffalo, now, but I only visit for a month every couple of years, so it doesn’t stick as well. But I’m pretty sure they have at least the same Fox affiliate we get around here, which is WUTV, Fox 29 out of Buffalo.) ---
**Author:** ![Jragon](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/e19b73/32.png) [@Jragon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jragon)\ **Post date:** [November 4, 2015, 9:48am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/canadian-english-vs-american-english-along-the-border/736337/60 "2015-11-04T09:48:28Z")
As far as I can tell, people from British Columbia, and especially Vancouver, are more or less indistinguishable in accent from the rest of the “Cascadian” region (roughly the northernmost tip of NorCal, California, Oregon, Washington, and BC). The only way you’d figure it out is from shibboleths like “zed” instead of “zee”. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/canadian-english-vs-american-english-along-the-border/736337.md?page=2) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/canadian-english-vs-american-english-along-the-border/736337.md?page=4)