# Canadian English vs. American English along the border **URL:** \ **Category:** In My Humble Opinion\ **Created:** [November 1, 2015, 3:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/canadian-english-vs-american-english-along-the-border/736337 "2015-11-01T15:32:05Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 16\ **Page:** 4
**Author:** ![Cyros](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/a698b9/32.png) [@Cyros](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cyros)\ **Post date:** [November 4, 2015, 1:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/canadian-english-vs-american-english-along-the-border/736337/61 "2015-11-04T13:48:06Z")
> [@Muffin](#): > > Idaho’s white water paddling is exceptionally good. I’ve said it before, and I’ll say it again. I want to trade Idaho for PEI. Over my dead body! PEI has some nice sea kayaking, great warm water beaches, good hiking, and Michael Smith! I’m not trading that away. ---
**Author:** ![Boyo\_Jim](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/87869e/32.png) [@Boyo\_Jim](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Boyo_Jim)\ **Post date:** [November 4, 2015, 6:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/canadian-english-vs-american-english-along-the-border/736337/62 "2015-11-04T18:01:41Z")
Just a couple of months ago I circumnavigated Lake Superior, entering Canada in Sault St. Marie and leaving through Duluth. I’d say you don’t notice it _immediately_, but it you exchange more than a couple of sentences, some words will end up being spoken that give it away. ---
**Author:** ![wolfpup](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/wolfpup/32/10618_2.png) [@wolfpup](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/wolfpup)\ **Post date:** [November 4, 2015, 6:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/canadian-english-vs-american-english-along-the-border/736337/63 "2015-11-04T18:37:11Z")
> [@Muffin](#): > > Damn, my accent has been Americanized. I lived between Toronto and Oakville in the 60s and 70s, but I pronounce schedule with a hard c and I have no idea when it changed. Sniff – now I feel like a linguistic traitor. It didn’t. I hear it both ways, but everyone I know says it with a hard “c”. I think the other way is a British-ism. Canadian pronunciation and spelling is often a hybrid between British and American. We spell “colour” and “favour” correctly because we never went out of our way to change our spelling to show how much we hate the British, yet we write “aluminum” and not “aluminium” and spell “civilization” with a “z” and not an “s”. And speaking of which, you’re not a linguistic traitor as long as you remember that the last letter of the alphabet is “zed”, not “zee”. 😉 ---
**Author:** ![Muffin](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/muffin/32/4341_2.png) [@Muffin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Muffin)\ **Post date:** [November 4, 2015, 6:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/canadian-english-vs-american-english-along-the-border/736337/64 "2015-11-04T18:57:20Z")
I was sent from grade one back to kindergarten because the teacher did not like the spelling of my name. I guess it scarred me for life. ---
**Author:** ![TBG](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/c89c15/32.png) [@TBG](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TBG)\ **Post date:** [November 4, 2015, 11:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/canadian-english-vs-american-english-along-the-border/736337/65 "2015-11-04T23:18:59Z")
> [@Leaffan](#): > > That’s exactly what I was referring to. > > A friend of mine went shopping in Buffalo a few years back. He bought some shoes and the clerk asked him if he wanted the “backs.” “The backs?” “Yes. The backs. Do you want the backs?” Much confusion continued until he figured out she was talking about the box. > > Michiganders have the same accent, whether you want to believe it or not. No, we don’t, whether YOU mistakenly believe it or not. No one in MI pronounces box as backs. ---
**Author:** ![Leaffan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/leaffan/32/299_2.png) [@Leaffan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Leaffan)\ **Post date:** [November 4, 2015, 11:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/canadian-english-vs-american-english-along-the-border/736337/66 "2015-11-04T23:57:55Z")
> [@TBG](#): > > No, we don’t, whether YOU mistakenly believe it or not. No one in MI pronounces box as backs. They sure do in Port Huron. ---
**Author:** ![Muffin](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/muffin/32/4341_2.png) [@Muffin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Muffin)\ **Post date:** [November 5, 2015, 12:24am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/canadian-english-vs-american-english-along-the-border/736337/67 "2015-11-05T00:24:53Z")
The first Europeans in the Lake Superior region were French (e.g. Étienne Brûlé, or any number of later coureur des bois and voyageurs). Brûlé is French for burnt, so its no surprise that some rivers are named in the French equivalent of Burnt River of Burntwood River. There is a Brule River (Burnt River) in Minnesota, a Bois Brule River (Burntwood River) in Wisconsin, and a Brule River (Burnt River) in Michigan. I, a Canadian, am used to pronouncing Brule as Brew-lay and pronouncing Bois Brule as Bwa Brew-lay, but Americans on the other side of the lake pronounce Brule as Brool and Bois Brule as Boys Brool. Sometimes I wonder if the pronunciation might have something to do with literacy. The earlier French pronunciation grew out of how people spoke, whereas the present American pronunciation seems to me to have arisen out of a quickly growing population reading unaccented texts and maps. Whatever the reason for the differences may be, when I cross the border to paddle the lower [Brule](https://www.americanwhitewater.org/content/River/detail/id/948/) in Minnesota, I get some funny looks when I forget to make it rhyme with drool. ---
**Author:** ![Balthisar](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/balthisar/32/2825_2.png) [@Balthisar](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Balthisar)\ **Post date:** [November 5, 2015, 12:40am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/canadian-english-vs-american-english-along-the-border/736337/68 "2015-11-05T00:40:51Z")
> [@Leaffan](#): > > They sure do in Port Huron. I’m _from_ Port Huron. Some of us (not me) do stupid shit like “pin” instead of “pen,” but unless the pronunciation of “backs” is like “box,” then I’ve never heard a local pronounce “box” anything like “backs.” “Box,” like “boxing day,” that’s how we speak. ---
**Author:** ![Muffin](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/muffin/32/4341_2.png) [@Muffin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Muffin)\ **Post date:** [November 5, 2015, 12:48am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/canadian-english-vs-american-english-along-the-border/736337/69 "2015-11-05T00:48:34Z")
I was thrown by an Appalachian English accent when I called for technical support. I had to repeatedly ask the fellow to please speak very slowly and loudly during our long call. While waiting for a download to complete, the fellow expressed concern about how much time and money he had spent taking courses to perfect his English accent in India. I congratulated him on his fine accent, thinking to myself that my not understanding a hillbilly accent was at least a change from my not understanding an Indian accent. I’ve learned to accept that I’m not very good at following accents different than those I heard as a child. ---
**Author:** ![jz78817](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jz78817/32/1028_2.png) [@jz78817](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jz78817)\ **Post date:** [November 5, 2015, 2:16am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/canadian-english-vs-american-english-along-the-border/736337/70 "2015-11-05T02:16:04Z")
> [@Leaffan](#): > > They sure do in Port Huron. nope. I spend enough time there. ---
**Author:** ![Leaffan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/leaffan/32/299_2.png) [@Leaffan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Leaffan)\ **Post date:** [November 5, 2015, 2:26am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/canadian-english-vs-american-english-along-the-border/736337/71 "2015-11-05T02:26:10Z")
> [@Balthisar](#): > > I’m _from_ Port Huron. Some of us (not me) do stupid shit like “pin” instead of “pen,” but unless the pronunciation of “backs” is like “box,” then I’ve never heard a local pronounce “box” anything like “backs.” “Box,” like “boxing day,” that’s how we speak. > [@jz78817](#): > > nope. I spend enough time there. Well, I guess I stand corrected. I have no issues with that, but swear box was pronounced as “backs” in Port Huron. I grew up in Sarnia. ---
**Author:** ![Muffin](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/muffin/32/4341_2.png) [@Muffin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Muffin)\ **Post date:** [November 5, 2015, 2:44am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/canadian-english-vs-american-english-along-the-border/736337/72 "2015-11-05T02:44:43Z")
> [@Leaffan](#): > > I grew up in Sarnia. Nice town. Used to teach kayaking there in the late 90s. ---
**Author:** ![jz78817](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jz78817/32/1028_2.png) [@jz78817](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jz78817)\ **Post date:** [November 5, 2015, 3:38am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/canadian-english-vs-american-english-along-the-border/736337/73 "2015-11-05T03:38:51Z")
> [@Leaffan](#): > > Well, I guess I stand corrected. I have no issues with that, but swear box was pronounced as “backs” in Port Huron. > > I grew up in Sarnia. I don’t know IPA, but I think the disconnect is between whether “box” is pronounced closer to “bawks” or “bahks.” hell, even in the states we have regions where “Mary,” “Marry,” and “Merry” are pronounced differently, and regions where they’re pronounced the same. ---
**Author:** ![wolfpup](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/wolfpup/32/10618_2.png) [@wolfpup](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/wolfpup)\ **Post date:** [November 5, 2015, 3:55am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/canadian-english-vs-american-english-along-the-border/736337/74 "2015-11-05T03:55:01Z")
> [@Muffin](#): > > The first Europeans in the Lake Superior region were French (e.g. Étienne Brûlé … Not to be confused with that foppish dandy Crème Brûlée, who could taunt you with a cream custard like no one else in the west. And on a related note, Bill Bryson’s [_Made in America_](http://www.amazon.com/made-america-Informal-History-Language-ebook/dp/B00T3DR544) is an entertaining account of the evolution of the English language in America, including the origins of many place names, either borrowed from the Old World, or Spanish, French, or Indian names and often undergoing remarkable transformations and alterations in pronunciation. The very term “America” might never have come to pass had the USA been named the USC – United States of Columbia – or worse, Freedonia – eventualities which would have caused much confusion with the University of Southern California and the fictional locale of a future Marx brothers film, respectively. ---
**Author:** ![RickJay](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/bb73d2/32.png) [@RickJay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RickJay)\ **Post date:** [November 5, 2015, 6:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/canadian-english-vs-american-english-along-the-border/736337/75 "2015-11-05T18:52:34Z")
I noted an interesting distinction just last night; the fiancee and I were watching Jimmy Kimmel’s famous “We Ate Your Hallowe’en Candy” prank videos. Kimmel, who is American, and as near as I can tell every single parent in the videos, all presumably American, pronoucne Hallowe’en as “Holl-uh-ween,” the first vowel sounding like “hall,” “awl” or “caw.” Neither I nor any other Canadian I’ve ever heard says “Hallowe’en” that way; we say it with a much sharper A sound, the way you’d say “Hal” in “HAL 9000,” or the name Cal, or for that matter the A sound in Kimmel’s rival, Jimmy Fallon. We then watched a video where actor Mark Ruffalo, an American (Wisconsin) purportedly (it was a joke within a joke) played the prank on his kids. He too pronounced it in the American fashion, so it’s not just Kimmel (who is from Brooklyn but spent half his childhood in Las Vegas.) ---
**Author:** ![Leaffan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/leaffan/32/299_2.png) [@Leaffan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Leaffan)\ **Post date:** [November 5, 2015, 7:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/canadian-english-vs-american-english-along-the-border/736337/76 "2015-11-05T19:18:56Z")
> [@RickJay](#): > > I noted an interesting distinction just last night; the fiancee and I were watching Jimmy Kimmel’s famous “We Ate Your Hallowe’en Candy” prank videos. > > Kimmel, who is American, and as near as I can tell every single parent in the videos, all presumably American, pronoucne Hallowe’en as “Holl-uh-ween,” the first vowel sounding like “hall,” “awl” or “caw.” > > Neither I nor any other Canadian I’ve ever heard says “Hallowe’en” that way; we say it with a much sharper A sound, the way you’d say “Hal” in “HAL 9000,” or the name Cal, or for that matter the A sound in Kimmel’s rival, Jimmy Fallon. > > We then watched a video where actor Mark Ruffalo, an American (Wisconsin) purportedly (it was a joke within a joke) played the prank on his kids. He too pronounced it in the American fashion, so it’s not just Kimmel (who is from Brooklyn but spent half his childhood in Las Vegas.) I have noticed that in the pronunciation of words like pasta. In Canada we use the HAL “A” sound for both vowels, similar to Santa; in the US it is pronounced as “pawstaw.” Michael J Fox pronounced it as “pawstaw” in one of the Spin City episodes and it grated on my ears. I’ll bet that was take II and he was coached on how to pronounce it like an American. Similarly we have a bedroom community in Ottawa called Kanata (pronounced kanAta). US visitors will pronounce it as “KanAWta” and I have no clue why since they don’t say “CanAWda.” [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/canadian-english-vs-american-english-along-the-border/736337.md?page=3)