# Canadians and doughnuts
**URL:** https://boards.straightdope.com/t/canadians-and-doughnuts/546165
**Category:** Cafe Society
**Created:** [July 9, 2010, 11:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/canadians-and-doughnuts/546165 "2010-07-09T23:13:04Z")
**Posts on this page:** 13
**Page:** 7
### Author:  [@md2000](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/md2000)
#### Post date: [October 2, 2010, 1:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/canadians-and-doughnuts/546165/121 "2010-10-02T13:17:22Z")
I was reading an artcle (Globe and Mail, IIRC) about the switch at Tim Hortons/Horton’s. About 10 years ago one of the principals of the company quit over the quality of doughnuts. They used to be mixed and baked at the store during the night shift. Now they are plopped out and frozen at a central factory, and reheated and decorated at the store as needed.
This may have affected quality, but since Tim’s has forced out most of the competition, and is the equivalent of “Starbucks on every corner” outside the urban downtowns, where will people go if they don’t like reheated cardboard? A side effect of this is that the variety of donuts is about one quarter what it used to be, and fanciful creamed varieties (Remember bowties?) non-existent. Of course, the franchisees are of two minds. On one hand, they replace expensive real bakers with minimum drudges who transfer trays to ovens. OTOH, can you be proud about raking in cash if it is for selling crap?
The problem IIRC with Krispy Kreme is that they were good (if any doughnut could be “good”) but they misread the enthusiasm and grossly overexpanded. Once the novelty wore off - “I can get them around the corner, they are not the big treat when I go to New York” the payback disappeared and they sank under the debt. Is there even one still open in the Toronto area?
As for the sign discussion - well, someone wondered about the apostrophe. Canada has its interesting politics, even if we are all intelligent about health care. We argue language, signs and doughnuts. I keep looking for the Tim Horton’s exit on the St Catherines skyway. Is it, like, fifty feet in the air?
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### Author:  [@Beware\_of\_Doug](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Beware_of_Doug)
#### Post date: [October 2, 2010, 1:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/canadians-and-doughnuts/546165/122 "2010-10-02T13:49:43Z")
Donuts have blue-collar and fat-slob connotations in the US. Much donut hate has been sublimated to cop hate, by associating the toroidal sugared viand with supposedly wide-assed civil servants.
Canada has less drastic class distinction than the US, so donuts have less of a negative image.
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### Author:  [@md2000](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/md2000)
#### Post date: [October 2, 2010, 1:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/canadians-and-doughnuts/546165/123 "2010-10-02T13:59:01Z")
> [@Beware\_of\_Doug](#):
>
> Donuts have blue-collar and fat-slob connotations in the US. Much donut hate has been sublimated to cop hate, by associating the toroidal sugared viand with supposedly wide-assed civil servants.
>
> Canada has less drastic class distinction than the US, so donuts have less of a negative image.
I recall a situation a few years ago, where a group of kids gunned their car leaving a gravel parking lot and left some cars with a few dings and glass chips. Nothing really serious, but it probably didn’t help when I see the police talking to the kid who is wearing a T-shirt with big letters saying “BAD COP! NO DONUT!”
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### Author:  [@Hypnagogic\_Jerk](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hypnagogic_Jerk)
#### Post date: [October 2, 2010, 5:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/canadians-and-doughnuts/546165/124 "2010-10-02T17:06:35Z")
> [@md2000](#):
>
> As for the sign discussion - well, someone wondered about the apostrophe. Canada has its interesting politics, even if we are all intelligent about health care. We argue language, signs and doughnuts.
Well, to begin with, [thread=580460]follow me here[/thread], **md2000**.
> [@mnemosyne](#):
>
> Yes, but this is GQ, and politics aren’t nearly as fun as doughnuts.
Wrong. Doughnuts are _tasty_. Politics is _fun_. Have you ever had fun with a doughnut?
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### Author:  [@Colibri](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Colibri)
#### Post date: [October 2, 2010, 7:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/canadians-and-doughnuts/546165/125 "2010-10-02T19:18:55Z")
> [@md2000](#):
>
> (True fact that Americans may not know - it is illegal to post in English in QUebec. A few years ago I went across from Ottawa to Hull; the big sign in the shop window said “Bienvenue” and the matching “Welcome” had been sliced out of the paper, leaving an obvious hole - probably on the orders of the language police. So there is no welcome for you maudit anglais in Quebec. Nor for ethniques nor monnaie.)
**[Moderator Note]**
**md2000** , political jabs like this are not allowed in GQ. No warning issued, but don’t do this again.
> [@mnemosyne](#):
>
> I won’t comment on your last two sentences, other than to say that they are offensive.
> [@Hypnagogic\_Jerk](#):
>
> Oh, **mnemosyne** , you know **md2000** isn’t going to start a thread in GD or the Pit where we could actually debate this whole issue. That’s just not how the man operates. So we have to do it here.
If you see a problem with another poster’s post, please report it. And of course you don’t have to debate it here; you can start a thread in another more appropriate forum.
Let’s desist from the debate about language in this thread, especially since a Pit thread on the subject has now been started. Since this thread is about the cultural significance of donuts, it’s more appropriate for Cafe Society in any case.
Colibri
General Questions Moderator
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### Author:  [@gregorio](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gregorio)
#### Post date: [October 14, 2010, 5:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/canadians-and-doughnuts/546165/126 "2010-10-14T17:32:47Z")
I’ve walked by this print very often here at work. It caught my eye 15 years ago and I still enjoy it today. Maybe you’ll want to track down the artist, **Fried Dough Ho**?
“[How Fragile We Are](http://i27.photobucket.com/albums/c176/hummu/howfragileweare.jpg)”, Glenn Semple, 1989.
Very Canadian. Very Albertan. Rocky landscape, brilliant blue sky, warm gloves, teacups, a babushka or a silky scarf, and of course featured prominantly a glazed doughnut. I smile a little every time I walk by it.
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### Author:  [@Siam\_Sam](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Siam_Sam)
#### Post date: [October 15, 2010, 2:33am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/canadians-and-doughnuts/546165/127 "2010-10-15T02:33:24Z")
Still long lines at Krispy Kreme in Bangkok, two weeks plus after opening. Maybe some day I can make it in and try one.
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### Author:  [@Siam\_Sam](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Siam_Sam)
#### Post date: [October 24, 2010, 3:54am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/canadians-and-doughnuts/546165/128 "2010-10-24T03:54:59Z")
> [@Siam\_Sam](#):
>
> Something similar happened with Singapore’s Rotiboy, which I mentioned back in post #39. Hard to describe; Rotiboy is not doughnuts, but rather this sort of baked bun. Not even any fillings. But very good. A branch opened in Bangkok’s Siam Square, and long lines formed. The number you were allowed to buy was capped, to make sure they didn’t run out and could accommodate everyone. **It got to where some enterprising individuals started buying up as many as they were permiited, then resold them at a slight mark-up to others waiting in line!**
Yep, it’s happened. We’ve now seen people standing on the sidewalks near the shopping center where Krispy Kreme is located, selling at a slight mark-up the Krispy Kreme doughnuts that they or someone else (these might just be employees of some entrepreneur) stood in line to buy.
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### Author:  [@straight\_man](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/straight_man)
#### Post date: [October 24, 2010, 4:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/canadians-and-doughnuts/546165/129 "2010-10-24T16:49:00Z")
Does this count as a zombie thread? Hope not, I actually have an answer or two…
> [@Flutterby](#):
>
> They were much _much_ better when they made them on site instead of freezing them and trucking them to every store like they do now to be reheated in some odd oven that glazes them also (I think, that was brought in after I worked there).
As of when I worked there, the glazes were still applied by hand. It’s been a couple years, but I would assume it’s still the same.
> [@jasonh300](#):
>
> I wasn’t impressed with their donuts, but every time I go to Canada, my first stop is Tim Hortons for a cup of coffee. It’s the best coffee I’ve ever had. I had some Canadian friends mail me a can of Tim Hortons coffee a few years ago and I could not duplicate it in my home coffee maker. It’s not only the coffee, but the way they brew it. There’s some proprietary trick to it.
There is no trick that I know of (other than cocaine, of course), except the packets the store gets its coffee in are single-sized, and you don’t open them until right when you make the coffee, so it may be fresher. Perhaps the machines run at a different temperature or speed?
> [@Northern\_Piper](#):
>
> Another thing that Tim’s has done very well is that “location, location, location” thing - they’re masters at finding good places for their stores, whether the drive-through kind or the mall kind…
IIRC, most Tims are franchised, not run by the company (though some are!) so I doubt that there’s a massive corporate strategy at play. One of the places I worked at was actually kind of tucked away, and it still got really good traffic.
> [@Hypnagogic\_Jerk](#):
>
> In my experience, Canadians _believe_ they have a reflexive distrust of patriotism, but in reality they’re just as patriotic as any other people. It’s just that to them “patriotism” means “American”, so convincing themselves that it is something they don’t have is a way of positioning themselves at odds with the US. Paradoxically, it’s actually nation-building.
I like this explanation —with just the caveat that my generation is more Americanized, hence somewhat more openly “patriotic”.
> [@Beware\_of\_Doug](#):
>
> Canada has less drastic class distinction than the US, so donuts have less of a negative image.
And I _really_ like this explanation! I can’t think of particularly Canadian class stereotypes, other than ones attached to the United States, and the range of customers you get in a Tim Horton’s is really pretty vast.
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### Author:  [@Flutterby](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Flutterby)
#### Post date: [October 24, 2010, 5:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/canadians-and-doughnuts/546165/130 "2010-10-24T17:43:32Z")
> [@straight\_man](#):
>
> As of when I worked there, the glazes were still applied by hand. It’s been a couple years, but I would assume it’s still the same.
That’s quite likely, I was just guessing since when I worked there they were still done by hand and made in store and that was nearly ten years ago when we were just hearing about them making the change over.
Went into the one I used to work at a few weeks ago (was in town and heading home, I needed my highway coffee :p) and it had been renovated to look exactly like any other Tim’s now. Was almost weird, since in my head it was the same as it had been!
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### Author:  [@RickJay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RickJay)
#### Post date: [October 25, 2010, 12:58am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/canadians-and-doughnuts/546165/131 "2010-10-25T00:58:59Z")
> [@jasonh300](#):
>
> I wasn’t impressed with their donuts, but every time I go to Canada, my first stop is Tim Hortons for a cup of coffee. It’s the best coffee I’ve ever had. I had some Canadian friends mail me a can of Tim Hortons coffee a few years ago and I could not duplicate it in my home coffee maker. It’s not only the coffee, but the way they brew it. There’s some proprietary trick to it.
It’s also necessary, if you take your coffee with cream, to use 18% cream, which is a common product here but curiously hard to find in many parts of the USA. My best friend, who lives in California, can’t find 18% to save his life.
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### Author:  [@Siam\_Sam](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Siam_Sam)
#### Post date: [October 31, 2010, 5:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/canadians-and-doughnuts/546165/132 "2010-10-31T17:02:24Z")
Saw the line at Krispy Kreme today. Jesus, but it’s STILL out the door of the shopping center and down the block, more than a month after opening. The wife knows someone who waited an hour in line recently. Madness! Madness, I say!
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### Author:  [@Sunspace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sunspace)
#### Post date: [November 8, 2010, 5:42am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/canadians-and-doughnuts/546165/133 "2010-11-08T05:42:25Z")
> [@mnemosyne](#):
>
> )Directions to a cousin’s house in Whitby Ontario went something like this: “Take X avenue until you hit the Tims at the Esso, then turn right. Turn left at the light after the Country Style, and then right at the Coffee Time. You’ll see a real Tim’s, and then two side streets down, turn right again. We’re three houses down from the Tim’s on that road.”
Hey, I think I know where that is. (I grew up in Whitby. 🙂 )
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