# Can't find a job? You aren't looking hard enough! **URL:** \ **Category:** Miscellaneous and Personal Stuff I Must Share\ **Created:** [September 21, 2017, 1:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cant-find-a-job-you-arent-looking-hard-enough/796887 "2017-09-21T13:20:34Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 13\ **Page:** 8
**Author:** ![Johnny\_Bravo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/johnny_bravo/32/493_2.png) [@Johnny\_Bravo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Johnny_Bravo)\ **Post date:** [September 25, 2017, 9:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cant-find-a-job-you-arent-looking-hard-enough/796887/141 "2017-09-25T21:38:51Z")
> [@kenobi\_65](#): > > Personal experience suggests that, if pizza delivery drivers had to pass drug screens, we would have a dire shortage of pizza delivery drivers. 😉 Likewise for pizza store managers. ---
**Author:** ![Kent\_Clark](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kent_clark/32/105_2.png) [@Kent\_Clark](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kent_Clark)\ **Post date:** [September 25, 2017, 9:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cant-find-a-job-you-arent-looking-hard-enough/796887/142 "2017-09-25T21:53:33Z")
Congratulations on finding something to bring in some extra money. Not to be a jerk, but do you mind if we look back at some of the things you originally said against how the reality is playing out? > [@Post #1](#): > > It’s menial labor stuff, probably around 10.00 to 14.00 per hour. But the job you actually were offered pays “5 and change for driving, and 7 and change for in store activities.” Did the manager assure you if you don’t get the tips he said you should, he’d at least adjust your hourly up to minimum wage? > [@Post #5](#): > > Fourth is grocery store meat counter that pays between 10 to 12 depending on how well I can negotiate with the store manager! They haven’t called you back, have they? > [@Post #88](#): > > It’s just a matter of time. Should have one or two offers by tonight. You were a little overconfident there. > [@Post #14](#): > > Insurance is a good point. Didn’t even think about that. But my car is a little older and paid for so I would think there would be a modest increase, but not enough to kill the idea of being a delivery driver. Oops. Your insurance company refuses to cover you for delivering pizza. While you’re waiting for a quote from a different company, reflect on what they might tell someone who’d had a couple of accidents and/or speeding tickets, not to mention a DUI. In my state that would put you in the “assigned risk” pool, which doesn’t cover using your car for work, period. > [@Post #125](#): > > The second job will allow me to throw an additional 1K per month at the debt and pay it off faster. Assume you end up grossing $15/hr. after tips and mileage. Now, subtract 15% withholding for Federal income tax, 7.65% for FICA and 2.35% for state income tax (it might be anywhere from 2% up, unless you’re in one of the seven states that don’t have an income tax.) That’s 25%, bringing your hourly take down to $11.25. Don’t forget, your mileage allowance is going to be eaten up by higher insurance costs as well as gas. The IRS allows 54 cents/mi when you use your car for business. If you do a couple of trips per hour, and each roundtrip averages three miles, that will cost you (optimistically) $3.24, which brings your hourly net to $8.01. To get to your goal of $1K/mo. you’ll need to work 124.8 hours per month, more than 30 per week. (Granted, you’ll get some of that back after you file your taxes, but that’s a long way away when you want to pay your debt.) How many shifts are you willing to work? How many shifts is your manager guaranteeing? > [@Post #11](#): > > I’m on the other side as well looking for a position similar to what I’m doing now in a different state that I’d like to move to. I’ve submitted about 10 resumes and haven’t gotten anything back. But most places aren’t looking to pay what I want or aren’t in the field I want. So, the REAL job search – the one for a job that would pay a living wage, in a field you’re qualified for – isn’t going smoothly? ---
**Author:** ![InsomniaMama](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/ad7895/32.png) [@InsomniaMama](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/InsomniaMama)\ **Post date:** [September 25, 2017, 11:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cant-find-a-job-you-arent-looking-hard-enough/796887/143 "2017-09-25T23:52:01Z")
Really it’s his wife I feel bad for. New baby and even more time without help at home? I would have lost my mind. And I only took my 12 weeks of maternity leave and went back to my part-time corporate job. Which paid a lot more than delivering pizzas. ---
**Author:** ![Zetetic\_Skeptic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/f9ae1b/32.png) [@Zetetic\_Skeptic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Zetetic_Skeptic)\ **Post date:** [September 26, 2017, 1:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cant-find-a-job-you-arent-looking-hard-enough/796887/144 "2017-09-26T13:59:17Z")
> [@kunilou](#): > > Congratulations on finding something to bring in some extra money. Not to be a jerk, but do you mind if we look back at some of the things you originally said against how the reality is playing out? Thanks and I don’t mind if you’re a jerk! 😃 I am always glad to own up to what I’ve said and if I’m wrong, I’ll always take responsibility for it. Might take me a while to get there sometimes. > [@kunilou](#): > > But the job you actually were offered pays “5 and change for driving, and 7 and change for in store activities.” Did the manager assure you if you don’t get the tips he said you should, he’d at least adjust your hourly up to minimum wage? No assurances like that are given. Do servers at restaurants get guarantees that if every table stiffs them, they’ll be compensated up to a certain level? It’s part of the risk of doing these types of jobs. Either you accept it and live with it, or you find something else that doesn’t involve that particular risk. Great part about it, I get to decide if it’s a risk I’m willing to take. > [@kunilou](#): > > They haven’t called you back, have they? Sadly, not yet. But it was one of three. The other two did request interviews. One wound up with a job offer. So I’m not crying about it. > [@kunilou](#): > > You were a little overconfident there. Yes I was. But I’m a confident person. Confidence is an attractive trait to most employers. Not too many potential employers would be impressed by a mousy and unsure potential employee. I certainly wouldn’t. Plus it is much better to go through life with confidence than without. So yeah, I was wrong on that one. But it’s okay. I had a backup plan. > [@kunilou](#): > > Oops. Your insurance company refuses to cover you for delivering pizza. While you’re waiting for a quote from a different company, reflect on what they might tell someone who’d had a couple of accidents and/or speeding tickets, not to mention a DUI. In my state that would put you in the “assigned risk” pool, which doesn’t cover using your car for work, period. Well, my answer to that would be the same thing I would tell anyone who is in trouble and suffering the consequences of their own actions. Don’t break the law. It’s really pretty simple. I can feel sorry for them, but they put themselves in that position. Just like me with my student loans. I don’t get to blame the system, society or anything else for my issues. For insurance, I have another quote already and the cost difference is minimal, essentially a wash. > [@kunilou](#): > > Assume you end up grossing $15/hr. after tips and mileage. Now, subtract 15% withholding for Federal income tax, 7.65% for FICA and 2.35% for state income tax (it might be anywhere from 2% up, unless you’re in one of the seven states that don’t have an income tax.) That’s 25%, bringing your hourly take down to $11.25. Based on the 11.25 figure, if I work an average of 25 hours per week, that would put me at 281.25 per week, or 1,125 per month (average). > [@kunilou](#): > > Don’t forget, your mileage allowance is going to be eaten up by higher insurance costs as well as gas. The IRS allows 54 cents/mi when you use your car for business. If you do a couple of trips per hour, and each roundtrip averages three miles, that will cost you (optimistically) $3.24, which brings your hourly net to $8.01. > > To get to your goal of $1K/mo. you’ll need to work 124.8 hours per month, more than 30 per week. (Granted, you’ll get some of that back after you file your taxes, but that’s a long way away when you want to pay your debt.) How many shifts are you willing to work? How many shifts is your manager guaranteeing? I think the fuel cost/consumption at 3.24 per hour is a little aggressive. For a 5 hour shift, that comes to 116 miles per night. Furthest point from the store is 4 miles, so 8 miles round trip. If I made 10 deliveries a night, averaging 5 mile round trip (they all won’t be to the furthest spot), then based on my fuel economy, I’m looking at about 7.00 per night in gas (or one hour of in store work). That’s 50 miles, 18 miles per gallon, 2.50 per gallon. 2.8 gallons of fuel at 2.50 per gallon. But obviously will fluctuate depending on number of deliveries. > [@kunilou](#): > > So, the REAL job search – the one for a job that would pay a living wage, in a field you’re qualified for – isn’t going smoothly? The REAL job search is something that won’t happen overnight. Again, I don’t have to settle. If I wanted to, I could apply for about 30-45 different positions per month, but those aren’t what I’m looking for right now. If I did that, the probabilities go way up that I would receive responses. I’ve got plenty of work experience and qualifications, so I’m holding out until I find something that would fit me, both in job description that I’m looking for and salary. I’ve found several that would work and no, I haven’t received any call backs. I think a lot of that has to do with the fact that I’m 1,400 miles away. It’s hard to interview from half way across the country. I think if I want to move, I’m just going to have to do it, then start the job search. ---
**Author:** ![Zetetic\_Skeptic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/f9ae1b/32.png) [@Zetetic\_Skeptic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Zetetic_Skeptic)\ **Post date:** [September 26, 2017, 2:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cant-find-a-job-you-arent-looking-hard-enough/796887/145 "2017-09-26T14:08:47Z")
> [@InsomniaMama](#): > > Really it’s his wife I feel bad for. New baby and even more time without help at home? I would have lost my mind. And I only took my 12 weeks of maternity leave and went back to my part-time corporate job. Which paid a lot more than delivering pizzas. Some might think that looking from the outside looking in but I assure you, she’s well taken care of and has the help of an older son who is wonderfully helpful. Take into account also that I am the one who has gotten up at night with the baby for the last five months save a handful of days when I just needed a full night in bed. I do wash bottles, I load/unload the dishwasher, I fix dinners, I help keep the house straight, I help fold laundry and anything else she needs help with. Granted, some of these duties will have to move to her more frequently, but it won’t mean she’ll have to do everything all of the time. We both decided this was a route we wanted to take to get us out of debt sooner which will free us up for more later. Live like nobody else today so you can live like nobody else tomorrow (paraphrasing Dave Ramsey). ---
**Author:** ![Broomstick](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/broomstick/32/246_2.png) [@Broomstick](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Broomstick)\ **Post date:** [September 26, 2017, 2:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cant-find-a-job-you-arent-looking-hard-enough/796887/146 "2017-09-26T14:14:31Z")
> [@Zetetic\_Skeptic](#): > > No assurances like that are given. Do servers at restaurants get guarantees that if every table stiffs them, they’ll be compensated up to a certain level? Actually… yes. At least in theory. If a server doesn’t get sufficient tips to bring them up the equivalent of normal minimum wage then their employer is supposed to make up the difference. Does that always happen in real life? No. Even in jobs that are supposed to have a flat hourly wage the employer doesn’t always live up to responsibilities, that’s why I once sued a former boss (and won). ---
**Author:** ![Pantastic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/3bc359/32.png) [@Pantastic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Pantastic)\ **Post date:** [September 26, 2017, 2:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cant-find-a-job-you-arent-looking-hard-enough/796887/147 "2017-09-26T14:20:35Z")
> [@Zetetic\_Skeptic](#): > > No assurances like that are given. Do servers at restaurants get guarantees that if every table stiffs them, they’ll be compensated up to a certain level? It’s part of the risk of doing these types of jobs. Either you accept it and live with it, or you find something else that doesn’t involve that particular risk. Great part about it, I get to decide if it’s a risk I’m willing to take. It’s illegal for them not to do so, as paying someone less than minimum wage in the US is against the law. They get away from it, and have scofflaws like you on their side who support their lawbreaking, but any actually legal business will make such assurances. > [@](#): > > Well, my answer to that would be the same thing I would tell anyone who is in trouble and suffering the consequences of their own actions. Don’t break the law. Unless it’s labor laws like the minimum wage laws? It always amazes me how someone will sneer at pesky laws they don’t like in one paragraph, then give ‘don’t break the law’ as advice later on in the same post. ---
**Author:** ![Zetetic\_Skeptic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/f9ae1b/32.png) [@Zetetic\_Skeptic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Zetetic_Skeptic)\ **Post date:** [September 26, 2017, 2:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cant-find-a-job-you-arent-looking-hard-enough/796887/148 "2017-09-26T14:34:11Z")
> [@Broomstick](#): > > Actually… yes. At least in theory. If a server doesn’t get sufficient tips to bring them up the equivalent of normal minimum wage then their employer is supposed to make up the difference. > > Does that always happen in real life? No. Even in jobs that are supposed to have a flat hourly wage the employer doesn’t always live up to responsibilities, that’s why I once sued a former boss (and won). See, I learned something just now. I certainly knew about minimum wage, but wasn’t aware that employers had to make up the difference. I thought maybe there was a carve out in the law for jobs that made their money on tips. Regardless, the employer didn’t say anything like that to me at all. I’ve also had employers try to take advantage of me. We handled it the old fashioned way though. Small town, small rumors can turn ugly in a hurry. Pay what’s owed or we’ll take care of the problem another way. Glad you were able to get what you were owed as well. ---
**Author:** ![Zetetic\_Skeptic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/f9ae1b/32.png) [@Zetetic\_Skeptic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Zetetic_Skeptic)\ **Post date:** [September 26, 2017, 2:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cant-find-a-job-you-arent-looking-hard-enough/796887/149 "2017-09-26T14:43:07Z")
> [@Pantastic](#): > > It’s illegal for them not to do so, as paying someone less than minimum wage in the US is against the law. They get away from it, and have scofflaws like you on their side who support their lawbreaking, but any actually legal business will make such assurances. I’m offended!!! (Not really, just teasing!) I’ve never been called a scofflaw before. Actually, if it’s the law for them to do so, then I am not on their side and think they should adhere to the laws on the books. If they do not, they should be called to task and be made to adhere to the laws. Does that still make me a scofflaw? See how quickly a misunderstanding can turn to insults? > [@Pantastic](#): > > Unless it’s labor laws like the minimum wage laws? It always amazes me how someone will sneer at pesky laws they don’t like in one paragraph, then give ‘don’t break the law’ as advice later on in the same post. I don’t think any laws are pesky. I still stand behind not breaking the law. If you don’t like a law, work through the system to change it. But while it’s in effect, if you break it, you are a criminal of one kind or another and there are consequences for those actions. Have I broken laws before? Sure. I’ve had a speeding ticket. Then I got hit with higher insurance premiums. Wow, guess I shouldn’t do that again, huh? Why is it so hard for people to understand the concept of consequences for breaking the law? Is it so tough to not get a DUI? Who’s fault is it that insurance then becomes unattainable or that the premiums are too expensive to afford? Must be the police officer. If he would have minded his own business and just let me continue swerving all over the place, I wouldn’t have these problems. I don’t think so. ---
**Author:** ![running\_coach](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/running_coach/32/15836_2.png) [@running\_coach](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/running_coach)\ **Post date:** [September 26, 2017, 2:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cant-find-a-job-you-arent-looking-hard-enough/796887/150 "2017-09-26T14:45:30Z")
> [@Zetetic\_Skeptic](#): > > I’ve also had employers try to take advantage of me. We handled it the old fashioned way though. Small town, small rumors can turn ugly in a hurry. **Pay what’s owed or we’ll take care of the problem another way.** Glad you were able to get what you were owed as well. Extortion, blackmail or arson? ---
**Author:** ![Zetetic\_Skeptic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/f9ae1b/32.png) [@Zetetic\_Skeptic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Zetetic_Skeptic)\ **Post date:** [September 26, 2017, 2:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cant-find-a-job-you-arent-looking-hard-enough/796887/151 "2017-09-26T14:56:20Z")
> [@running\_coach](#): > > Extortion, blackmail or arson? None of the above. Basically told him if he didn’t pay what he owed me, we’d make it impossible for him to do business in town. He was being a big penis head. I didn’t want more than what I had worked for and he was trying to cheat me out of it. ---
**Author:** ![Kent\_Clark](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kent_clark/32/105_2.png) [@Kent\_Clark](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kent_Clark)\ **Post date:** [September 26, 2017, 5:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cant-find-a-job-you-arent-looking-hard-enough/796887/152 "2017-09-26T17:21:43Z")
> [@Zetetic\_Skeptic](#): > > No assurances like that are given. Do servers at restaurants get guarantees that if every table stiffs them, they’ll be compensated up to a certain level? It’s part of the risk of doing these types of jobs. Either you accept it and live with it, or you find something else that doesn’t involve that particular risk. Great part about it, I get to decide if it’s a risk I’m willing to take. According to the [Department of Labor, yes.](https://www.dol.gov/whd/regs/compliance/hrg.htm) > [@](#): > > Tipped employees are individuals engaged in occupations in which they customarily and regularly receive more than $30 a month in tips. The employer may consider tips as part of wages, but the employer must pay at least $2.13 an hour in direct wages. > The employer who elects to use the tip credit provision must inform the employee in advance and must be able to show that the employee receives at least the applicable minimum wage (see above) when direct wages and the tip credit allowance are combined. If an employee’s tips combined with the employer’s direct wages of at least $2.13 an hour do not equal the minimum hourly wage, the employer must make up the difference. Also, employees must retain all of their tips, except to the extent that they participate in a valid tip pooling or sharing arrangement. [In some states](https://www.dol.gov/whd/state/tipped.htm) employees must receive at least minimum wage _before_ tips. ---
**Author:** ![Zetetic\_Skeptic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/f9ae1b/32.png) [@Zetetic\_Skeptic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Zetetic_Skeptic)\ **Post date:** [September 26, 2017, 5:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cant-find-a-job-you-arent-looking-hard-enough/796887/153 "2017-09-26T17:32:25Z")
> [@kunilou](#): > > According to the [Department of Labor, yes.](https://www.dol.gov/whd/regs/compliance/hrg.htm) > > [In some states](https://www.dol.gov/whd/state/tipped.htm) employees must receive at least minimum wage _before_ tips. Right…I got that. Already conceded I didn’t know the details of tipping job wages, and agree that they should follow the law as written and implemented. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cant-find-a-job-you-arent-looking-hard-enough/796887.md?page=7)