# Captain of USN Aircraft carrier begs for help as COVID19 ravages ships company. **URL:** \ **Category:** The Quarantine Zone\ **Tags:** covid-quarantine\ **Created:** [March 31, 2020, 1:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/captain-of-usn-aircraft-carrier-begs-for-help-as-covid19-ravages-ships-company/850738 "2020-03-31T13:47:42Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 10
**Author:** ![Snowboarder\_Bo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/snowboarder_bo/32/229_2.png) [@Snowboarder\_Bo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Snowboarder_Bo)\ **Post date:** [April 24, 2020, 8:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/captain-of-usn-aircraft-carrier-begs-for-help-as-covid19-ravages-ships-company/850738/181 "2020-04-24T20:12:07Z")
[Navy recommends reinstatement of fired carrier captain](https://apnews.com/5f5774662e9f355665e947b55a37385f) > [@](#): > > The top Navy officer has recommended the reinstatement of the aircraft carrier captain fired for sending a fraught email to commanders pleading for faster action to protect his crew from a coronavirus outbreak, officials familiar with the investigation said Friday. > > Adm. Mike Gilday recommended that Navy Capt. Brett Crozier be returned to his ship, said the officials, who spoke on condition of anonymity to discuss the results of an investigation that have not yet been made public. > > If approved, his recommendation would end a drama that has rocked the Navy leadership, sent thousands of USS Theodore Roosevelt crew members ashore in Guam for quarantine and impacted the fleet across the Pacific, a region critical to America’s national security interests. > [@](#): > > Gilday met with Gen. Mark Milley, chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff, on Tuesday and with Defense Secretary Mark Esper on Friday morning to lay out his recommendations. An official says Esper has asked for a delay in any public announcement while he considers the recommendation. > > Earlier in the day, Esper’s chief spokesman Jonathan Hoffman had suggested that Esper was going into the matter with an open mind, and said “ he is generally inclined to support Navy leadership in their decision.” I hope he does follow the recommendations. ---
**Author:** ![Velocity](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/velocity/32/18006_2.png) [@Velocity](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Velocity)\ **Post date:** [April 24, 2020, 8:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/captain-of-usn-aircraft-carrier-begs-for-help-as-covid19-ravages-ships-company/850738/182 "2020-04-24T20:15:19Z")
If Biden is elected, he needs to give Crozier the Presidential Medal of Freedom. ---
**Author:** ![Monty](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/monty/32/47_2.png) [@Monty](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Monty)\ **Post date:** [April 24, 2020, 11:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/captain-of-usn-aircraft-carrier-begs-for-help-as-covid19-ravages-ships-company/850738/183 "2020-04-24T23:04:32Z")
Not that I have any say in Crozier’s assignments in any way whatsoever, but I do hope he is reinstated. What worries me is that if he does get reinstated, will the individual who removed him from command still be in his chain of command? ---
**Author:** ![running\_coach](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/running_coach/32/15836_2.png) [@running\_coach](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/running_coach)\ **Post date:** [April 24, 2020, 11:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/captain-of-usn-aircraft-carrier-begs-for-help-as-covid19-ravages-ships-company/850738/184 "2020-04-24T23:12:20Z")
> [@Monty](#): > > Not that I have any say in Crozier’s assignments in any way whatsoever, but I do hope he is reinstated. What worries me is that if he does get reinstated, will the individual who removed him from command still be in his chain of command? Modly resigned. ---
**Author:** ![aceplace57](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/aceplace57/32/3500_2.png) [@aceplace57](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/aceplace57)\ **Post date:** [April 25, 2020, 12:38am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/captain-of-usn-aircraft-carrier-begs-for-help-as-covid19-ravages-ships-company/850738/185 "2020-04-25T00:38:03Z")
Crozier would be better off getting a new assignment. Otherwise he’s going to catch serious shit from the Rear Adm Baker. Baker would be looking for any new excuse to write up Crozier. Since the Roosevelt is the Adm. Flagship. That means Baker’s quarters are there? That’s where his HQ is for the carrier strike group? > **[Reinstate? Reassign? Navy to decide fate of fired aircraft carrier captain](https://www.navytimes.com/news/your-navy/2020/04/19/reinstate-reassign-navy-to-decide-fate-of-fired-aircraft-carrier-captain/)** > > The Navy’s top admiral will soon decide the fate of the ship captain who was fired after pleading for commanders to move faster to safeguard his coronavirus-infected crew on the USS Theodore Roosevelt. > [@](#): > > But reinstating Crozier has its problems. > > It would put him back on a ship with Rear Adm. Stuart Baker, commander of the carrier strike group of which the Roosevelt is the lead ship. Officials say they did not have a good relationship and that was among the problems that triggered Crozier’s memo. Gilday may worry that putting them back together would exacerbate the ship’s toxic command climate. > > FORGIVE AND MOVE ON: > > Rather than return Crozier to the Roosevelt, Gilday could absolve him of wrongdoing and recommend he move on to another job. Crozier could retain his rank and standing and perhaps command another ship, leaving open the possibility that he could gain promotion and continue his Navy career. ---
**Author:** ![Monty](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/monty/32/47_2.png) [@Monty](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Monty)\ **Post date:** [April 25, 2020, 12:55am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/captain-of-usn-aircraft-carrier-begs-for-help-as-covid19-ravages-ships-company/850738/186 "2020-04-25T00:55:37Z")
> [@running\_coach](#): > > Modly resigned. Modly could order the captain removed from command, but it takes the ISIC (Immediate Superior in Command) to actually effect that removal. _aceplace57_’s post is on point also. ---
**Author:** ![Broomstick](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/broomstick/32/246_2.png) [@Broomstick](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Broomstick)\ **Post date:** [April 25, 2020, 9:07am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/captain-of-usn-aircraft-carrier-begs-for-help-as-covid19-ravages-ships-company/850738/187 "2020-04-25T09:07:53Z")
> [@running\_coach](#): > > Modly resigned. Modly was a firing disguised as a resignation. ---
**Author:** ![Elendil\_s\_Heir](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/7cd45c/32.png) [@Elendil\_s\_Heir](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Elendil_s_Heir)\ **Post date:** [April 25, 2020, 4:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/captain-of-usn-aircraft-carrier-begs-for-help-as-covid19-ravages-ships-company/850738/188 "2020-04-25T16:46:42Z")
How the coronavirus pandemic has shaken the U.S. military (including the news that there’s an outbreak aboard the destroyer USS _Kidd_, too): [How the coronavirus pandemic has shaken the US military | CNN Politics](https://www.cnn.com/2020/04/25/politics/coronavirus-impact-us-military/index.html) ---
**Author:** ![China\_Guy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/779978/32.png) [@China\_Guy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/China_Guy)\ **Post date:** [April 25, 2020, 9:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/captain-of-usn-aircraft-carrier-begs-for-help-as-covid19-ravages-ships-company/850738/189 "2020-04-25T21:26:57Z")
> [@Monty](#): > > Not that I have any say in Crozier’s assignments in any way whatsoever, but I do hope he is reinstated. What worries me is that if he does get reinstated, will the individual who removed him from command still be in his chain of command? Remember Modly took a chartered flight to deliver a profanity laden rant to the crew disguised as “damage control”, with very audible comments back like Bullshit. He was forced to resign within about 24 hours of the performance he thought trumpy would get behind. ---
**Author:** ![aceplace57](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/aceplace57/32/3500_2.png) [@aceplace57](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/aceplace57)\ **Post date:** [April 25, 2020, 10:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/captain-of-usn-aircraft-carrier-begs-for-help-as-covid19-ravages-ships-company/850738/190 "2020-04-25T22:21:48Z")
Crozier is part of the Naval Academy class of 1992. He’s had quite a successful & distinguished career. He’s already got his 20 and can retire. I’d like to see him get his command reinstated and finish his duty assignment. Then afterwards he can decide what’s next. I suspect the airline industry would love to have him afterwards. > **[Captain Brett Crozier was my Naval Academy classmate. He’s one of the finest...](https://www.dallasnews.com/opinion/commentary/2020/04/09/captain-brett-crozier-was-my-naval-academy-classmate-hes-one-of-the-finest-leaders-i-know/)** > > The events surrounding the dismissal of Capt. Brett Crozier, the former commanding officer of the USS Theodore Roosevelt, strikes close to home. Crozier and... > [@](#): > > After graduating, Crozier went to flight school in Pensacola, Fla. He started his aviation career in helicopters, excelled in his squadron, and was later selected for the rare transition from helicopters to jets. He flew F/A-18 Hornets and was later selected for command of a squadron. > > In April 2014, Crozier completed the Naval Nuclear Power training program and served as the Executive Officer of USS Ronald Reagan (CVN 76) until July 2016. Most recently, before taking command of the Roosevelt, he had command of the USS Blue Ridge, which is the flagship of the 7th Fleet with a home port in Japan. ---
**Author:** ![Snowboarder\_Bo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/snowboarder_bo/32/229_2.png) [@Snowboarder\_Bo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Snowboarder_Bo)\ **Post date:** [April 29, 2020, 4:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/captain-of-usn-aircraft-carrier-begs-for-help-as-covid19-ravages-ships-company/850738/191 "2020-04-29T16:23:13Z")
[Navy to widen carrier probe, delaying decision on commander](https://apnews.com/2607e2c91ab8464bb3bee820e111215f) > [@](#): > > The Navy will conduct a wider investigation of circumstances surrounding the spread of the coronavirus aboard the aircraft carrier USS Theodore Roosevelt, a move that effectively delays a decision on whether to reinstate the ship’s captain, who was fired after pleading for more urgent protection of his crew. > > The investigation was announced Wednesday by James E. McPherson, the acting Navy secretary, who said in a brief written statement that an initial inquiry was insufficient. “I have unanswered questions that the preliminary inquiry has identified and that can only be answered by a deeper review,” he said. > > The broader probe is to examine communication and leadership actions in the Navy chain of command in the Pacific, to include events before the initial virus outbreak in late March, officials said. > > The decision comes several days after McPherson and Adm. Mike Gilday, the chief of naval operations, met with Defense Secretary Mark Esper and Gen. Mark Milley, chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff, to discuss the Navy’s recommendation that Capt. Brett Crozier be restored to command of the ship. > > “I am directing Adm. Gilday to conduct a follow-on command investigation,” McPherson said. “This investigation will build on the good work of the initial inquiry to provide a more fulsome understanding of the sequence of events, actions, and decisions of the chain of command surrounding the COVID-19 outbreak aboard USS Theodore Roosevelt.” ---
**Author:** ![casdave](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/c6cbf5/32.png) [@casdave](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/casdave)\ **Post date:** [April 29, 2020, 4:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/captain-of-usn-aircraft-carrier-begs-for-help-as-covid19-ravages-ships-company/850738/192 "2020-04-29T16:41:45Z")
Having seen and dealt with staff investigations before, this looks very much like they are fishing for something else to hang him with - they know their stance to dismiss is not sustainable so now its time for post event justification - so now they are looking at previous history in an attempt to try tie them in - things such as incompatibility of command structure etc. ---
**Author:** ![Elendil\_s\_Heir](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/7cd45c/32.png) [@Elendil\_s\_Heir](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Elendil_s_Heir)\ **Post date:** [April 29, 2020, 6:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/captain-of-usn-aircraft-carrier-begs-for-help-as-covid19-ravages-ships-company/850738/193 "2020-04-29T18:25:28Z")
Here’s CNN on the latest developments, too: [USS Roosevelt: Navy launches broader investigation into virus-stricken aircraft carrier | CNN Politics](https://www.cnn.com/2020/04/29/politics/navy-investigation-uss-roosevelt/index.html) ---
**Author:** ![RioRico](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/f04885/32.png) [@RioRico](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RioRico)\ **Post date:** [April 29, 2020, 11:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/captain-of-usn-aircraft-carrier-begs-for-help-as-covid19-ravages-ships-company/850738/194 "2020-04-29T23:58:54Z")
> [@casdave](#): > > Having seen and dealt with staff investigations before, this looks very much like they are fishing for something else to hang him with - they know their stance to dismiss is not sustainable so now its time for post event justification - so now they are looking at previous history in an attempt to try tie them in - things such as incompatibility of command structure etc. You are probably correct, unfortunately. I recall a truism: Shit flows downhill. Whenever an underling can be blamed, they will be. Expect to see animal cruelty charges dating from when Capt. Crozier forgot to feed his goldfish when in middle school. ---
**Author:** ![What\_Exit](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/what_exit/32/10652_2.png) [@What\_Exit](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/What_Exit)\ **Post date:** [June 5, 2020, 5:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/captain-of-usn-aircraft-carrier-begs-for-help-as-covid19-ravages-ships-company/850738/195 "2020-06-05T17:18:17Z")
Just a minor update, the ship is at basically full ship’s complement and at sea. Its deployment was interrupted for 55 day in all. Captain Crozier has been reassigned to San Diego to serve in a temporary capacity as the special assistant to the Naval Air Forces chief of staff. I can’t find anything newer on him. ---
**Author:** ![Fretful\_Porpentine](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/fretful_porpentine/32/2873_2.png) [@Fretful\_Porpentine](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fretful_Porpentine)\ **Post date:** [June 9, 2020, 6:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/captain-of-usn-aircraft-carrier-begs-for-help-as-covid19-ravages-ships-company/850738/196 "2020-06-09T18:32:30Z")
[Update](https://www.cdc.gov/mmwr/volumes/69/wr/mm6923e4.htm?s_cid=mm6923e4_e&deliveryName=USCDC_921-DM30202) with some serology testing results, as well as information about the individual precautions people had and had not taken. One interesting takeaway is that face coverings seem to do quite a bit to protect the wearer, not just other people: about 56% of those who had worn one were infected, versus _81%_ of those who had not. ---
**Author:** ![needscoffee](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/needscoffee/32/1076_2.png) [@needscoffee](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/needscoffee)\ **Post date:** [June 10, 2020, 1:17am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/captain-of-usn-aircraft-carrier-begs-for-help-as-covid19-ravages-ships-company/850738/197 "2020-06-10T01:17:29Z")
> [@Fretful\_Porpentine](#): > > [Update](https://www.cdc.gov/mmwr/volumes/69/wr/mm6923e4.htm?s_cid=mm6923e4_e&deliveryName=USCDC_921-DM30202) with some serology testing results, as well as information about the individual precautions people had and had not taken. One interesting takeaway is that face coverings seem to do quite a bit to protect the wearer, not just other people: about 56% of those who had worn one were infected, versus _81%_ of those who had not. Not necessarily. > [@](#): > > Service members who reported taking preventive measures had a lower infection rate than did those who did not report taking these measures (e.g., wearing a face covering, 55.8% versus 80.8%; avoiding common areas, 53.8% versus 67.5%; and observing social distancing, 54.7% versus 70.0%, respectively). I did not see anywhere that the people wearing masks were not also the same people avoiding common areas and/or observing social distancing. So it could have been any or all of those factors causing the lower rate of transmission. I didn’t read the entire pdf, though, just the front page you linked to, so maybe it’s broken down better in the actual report. ---
**Author:** ![Fretful\_Porpentine](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/fretful_porpentine/32/2873_2.png) [@Fretful\_Porpentine](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fretful_Porpentine)\ **Post date:** [June 10, 2020, 1:42am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/captain-of-usn-aircraft-carrier-begs-for-help-as-covid19-ravages-ships-company/850738/198 "2020-06-10T01:42:47Z")
> [@needscoffee](#): > > Not necessarily. > I did not see anywhere that the people wearing masks were not also the same people avoiding common areas and/or observing social distancing. So it could have been any or all of those factors causing the lower rate of transmission. I didn’t read the entire pdf, though, just the front page you linked to, so maybe it’s broken down better in the actual report. Well, if they were _exactly_ the same people, wouldn’t the numbers have been the same? Instead, we’re seeing a really big gap in infection rates with / without mask-wearing, and more modest ones with the other behaviors. ---
**Author:** ![Chronos](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chronos/32/134_2.png) [@Chronos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chronos)\ **Post date:** [June 10, 2020, 1:53am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/captain-of-usn-aircraft-carrier-begs-for-help-as-covid19-ravages-ships-company/850738/199 "2020-06-10T01:53:07Z")
You could still have had some people social distancing (but not doing other things), some people avoiding common areas (but not doing other things), and some people doing everything they could think of (including social distancing, avoiding common areas, and wearing masks). In that case, the mask-wearers would still fare better than those doing other things, even if the masks themselves didn’t help. You could also have, for instance, all of the sailors who work in one particular area all wearing masks, because their lieutenant ordered or suggested they do it. So the people wearing masks were also the ones who were around others wearing masks. This is why controlling variables is important in experiments. ---
**Author:** ![Fretful\_Porpentine](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/fretful_porpentine/32/2873_2.png) [@Fretful\_Porpentine](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fretful_Porpentine)\ **Post date:** [June 10, 2020, 2:01am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/captain-of-usn-aircraft-carrier-begs-for-help-as-covid19-ravages-ships-company/850738/200 "2020-06-10T02:01:59Z")
Fair enough, but I’m pretty sure there’s no ethical way to do a controlled experiment on this, so I think “one more helpful though not absolutely conclusive bit of evidence” is the best we’re gonna get. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/captain-of-usn-aircraft-carrier-begs-for-help-as-covid19-ravages-ships-company/850738.md?page=9) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/captain-of-usn-aircraft-carrier-begs-for-help-as-covid19-ravages-ships-company/850738.md?page=11)