# Cars and suicide doors **URL:** \ **Category:** In My Humble Opinion\ **Created:** [October 10, 2017, 10:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cars-and-suicide-doors/798522 "2017-10-10T22:39:53Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![Flyer](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/flyer/32/7298_2.png) [@Flyer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Flyer)\ **Post date:** [October 10, 2017, 10:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cars-and-suicide-doors/798522/1 "2017-10-10T22:39:53Z")
Sometimes as a society changes, certain changes occur that seemingly nobody foresees. I’ve been considering some of the ramifications of an aging society. Suicide doors make it much easier to get in and out of a car. And obviously, older people as a group are much more in need of such help than young people. So I submit this question to the Dope’s collective foresight. As society continues to age, and as elderly people continue to be at least somewhat more active than in previous decades, will we see a return of suicide doors? ---
**Author:** ![snfaulkner](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/snfaulkner/32/433_2.png) [@snfaulkner](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/snfaulkner)\ **Post date:** [October 10, 2017, 10:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cars-and-suicide-doors/798522/2 "2017-10-10T22:52:36Z")
> [@Flyer](#): > > Sometimes as a society changes, certain changes occur that seemingly nobody foresees. I’ve been considering some of the ramifications of an aging society. > \*\* > Suicide doors make it much easier to get in and out of a car.\*\* And obviously, older people as a group are much more in need of such help than young people. So I submit this question to the Dope’s collective foresight. > > As society continues to age, and as elderly people continue to be at least somewhat more active than in previous decades, will we see a return of suicide doors? I 'm not so sure I agree with the bolded. I don’t think it is necessarily the fact the doors are suicide that make them easier to get through, but the design of the car as a whole. I would think sliding doors, like on a van or a helicopter, would make for the easiest entry/exit. But having said that, I’m always up for cool and different designs. If some company makes suicide doors that look cool to enough people, the fad could take off again. ---
**Author:** ![jz78817](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jz78817/32/1028_2.png) [@jz78817](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jz78817)\ **Post date:** [October 11, 2017, 12:23am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cars-and-suicide-doors/798522/3 "2017-10-11T00:23:21Z")
> [@Flyer](#): > > Sometimes as a society changes, certain changes occur that seemingly nobody foresees. I’ve been considering some of the ramifications of an aging society. > > Suicide doors make it much easier to get in and out of a car. cite? yes, I know this isn’t GQ, but you are making a declarative statement. and I’m kind of having trouble understanding the reasoning behind it. the seat back is often close to (within a few inches) of the rear of the door aperture. a conventional door doesn’t even have to open fully for you to be able to get in and sit down. a “suicide door” would have to open much farther before you could easily get in. apart from that, how the doors are anchored has significant structural implications. with a conventional door (hinges up front) the door is anchored to the A-pillar. The A-pillar is an enormously important part of the passenger cage and plays a huge role in crash safety, especially in the common offset frontal collisions. ---
**Author:** ![PastTense](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pasttense/32/14550_2.png) [@PastTense](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/PastTense)\ **Post date:** [October 11, 2017, 1:08am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cars-and-suicide-doors/798522/4 "2017-10-11T01:08:00Z")
It seems that some pickups have doors with hinges at the rear for the back seat. But these are not really “suicide” as you can’t open them when the front door is closed. ---
**Author:** ![jz78817](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jz78817/32/1028_2.png) [@jz78817](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jz78817)\ **Post date:** [October 11, 2017, 1:18am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cars-and-suicide-doors/798522/5 "2017-10-11T01:18:34Z")
> [@PastTense](#): > > It seems that some pickups have doors with hinges at the rear for the back seat. But these are not really “suicide” as you can’t open them when the front door is closed. yep. those are “extended cab” or “super cab” pickups. the rear doors are minimal. ---
**Author:** ![Thudlow\_Boink](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/thudlow_boink/32/320_2.png) [@Thudlow\_Boink](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Thudlow_Boink)\ **Post date:** [October 11, 2017, 1:24am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cars-and-suicide-doors/798522/6 "2017-10-11T01:24:29Z")
WTF are “suicide doors”? I’ve never heard of them. Never mind, I can google it… I see from Wikipedia that > [@](#): > > Suicide doors were especially popular with mobsters in the gangster era of the 1930s, supposedly owing to the ease of pushing passengers out of moving vehicles Perhaps this is what the OP meant by “easier to get … out of a car”? ---
**Author:** ![snfaulkner](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/snfaulkner/32/433_2.png) [@snfaulkner](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/snfaulkner)\ **Post date:** [October 11, 2017, 1:29am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cars-and-suicide-doors/798522/7 "2017-10-11T01:29:57Z")
I always thought they were called suicide because if you fell out of moving car, you would be dragged by the door instead of being able to tuck and roll to safety. ---
**Author:** ![Aspidistra](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/aspidistra/32/3894_2.png) [@Aspidistra](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Aspidistra)\ **Post date:** [October 11, 2017, 1:52am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cars-and-suicide-doors/798522/8 "2017-10-11T01:52:01Z")
My favorite bit of the wikipedia article “Popularized in the custom car trade, the term is avoided by major automobile manufacturers…” Gosh, really? You don’t say! ---
**Author:** ![BobBitchin](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/7ea924/32.png) [@BobBitchin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BobBitchin)\ **Post date:** [October 11, 2017, 2:25am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cars-and-suicide-doors/798522/9 "2017-10-11T02:25:36Z")
I’d like to think that we will move past swinging doors and onto something futuristic like invisible forcefield doors:D. But until then, I’ve seen a few YouTube videos where they have sliding doors or doors that retract into the body, forward/backward and the coolest, down. ---
**Author:** ![kanicbird](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/5f8ce5/32.png) [@kanicbird](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kanicbird)\ **Post date:** [October 11, 2017, 2:37am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cars-and-suicide-doors/798522/10 "2017-10-11T02:37:30Z")
> [@snfaulkner](#): > > I always thought they were called suicide because if you fell out of moving car, you would be dragged by the door instead of being able to tuck and roll to safety. My take on it is that if you opened the door at speed the wind would catch it and if you ‘held on’ you would be going out also. Also that you could open the door at speed and the wind would allow it to be open and allow a jump out. ---
**Author:** ![PastTense](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pasttense/32/14550_2.png) [@PastTense](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/PastTense)\ **Post date:** [October 11, 2017, 3:27am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cars-and-suicide-doors/798522/11 "2017-10-11T03:27:44Z")
Unfortunately lots of valuable innovations have been removed from cars. For example running boards: [![](https://images.carid.com/articles/running-boards-choosing-right-fit-style-function/1st-running-boards-design.jpg) ](https://images.carid.com/articles/running-boards-choosing-right-fit-style-function/1st-running-boards-design.jpg) If you had running boards on a car when you were a teenager your buddies would be able to stand on the running boards while you were flying down the road! ---
**Author:** ![Flyer](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/flyer/32/7298_2.png) [@Flyer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Flyer)\ **Post date:** [October 11, 2017, 4:05am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cars-and-suicide-doors/798522/12 "2017-10-11T04:05:43Z")
> [@snfaulkner](#): > > I 'm not so sure I agree with the bolded. I don’t think it is necessarily the fact the doors are suicide that make them easier to get through, but the design of the car as a whole. I would think sliding doors, like on a van or a helicopter, would make for the easiest entry/exit. > [@jz78817](#): > > cite? > > yes, I know this isn’t GQ, but you are making a declarative statement. and I’m kind of having trouble understanding the reasoning behind it. the seat back is often close to (within a few inches) of the rear of the door aperture. a conventional door doesn’t even have to open fully for you to be able to get in and sit down. a “suicide door” would have to open much farther before you could easily get in. Seriously?? I thought that the fact that suicide doors make getting in and out (especially out) easier was so self-evident that I wouldn’t need to elaborate. When you open a regular door, the greatest width of opening is 90 degrees from the front of your body, or perhaps even slightly behind you, depending on the car. This means that when you try to put your feet out of the car, THE DOOR IS **IN THE WAY**! You have to turn or twist your body significantly in order to move your feet back far enough to where the opening is actually wide enough to get out. This situation is severely aggravated whenever space is tight, and your car winds up being parked quite close to another vehicle. With suicide doors, the greatest width of opening is at the front of your body, where your feet already are. One very short, easy swivel, and you’re up and out without a struggle. Perhaps the picture at the top of this article will make things clearer. Notice how the lady’s feet and legs are unobstructed? [http://automotivemileposts.com/autobrevity/suicidedoors.html](http://automotivemileposts.com/autobrevity/suicidedoors.html) Here is another. [![](http://1.bp.blogspot.com/-yx6W1aBDpaY/VIyseg4RDvI/AAAAAAAAO54/jRLoisRUiiM/s1600/1948%2BRenault%2B4CV%2B-%2B1.jpg) ](http://1.bp.blogspot.com/-yx6W1aBDpaY/VIyseg4RDvI/AAAAAAAAO54/jRLoisRUiiM/s1600/1948%2BRenault%2B4CV%2B-%2B1.jpg) Now will somebody please tell me, just what in the name of common sense is so blasted hard to understand about that concept??? ---
**Author:** ![Aspidistra](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/aspidistra/32/3894_2.png) [@Aspidistra](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Aspidistra)\ **Post date:** [October 11, 2017, 4:08am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cars-and-suicide-doors/798522/13 "2017-10-11T04:08:10Z")
> [@PastTense](#): > > Unfortunately lots of valuable innovations have been removed from cars. For example running boards: > [https://www.carid.com/images/articles/running-boards-choosing-right-fit-style-function/1st-running-boards-design.jpg](https://www.carid.com/images/articles/running-boards-choosing-right-fit-style-function/1st-running-boards-design.jpg) > > If you had running boards on a car when you were a teenager your buddies would be able to stand on the running boards while you were flying down the road! I wouldn’t like to try it at freeway speeds. On the other hand, you could still ride on the running boards on [trams](https://www.google.com.au/search?q=w-class+trams&client=firefox-b-ab&dcr=0&tbm=isch&tbo=u&source=univ&sa=X&ved=0ahUKEwid7JOr2OfWAhWCyrwKHRueAlEQsAQIOw&biw=1203&bih=840) in my city as late as the 80’s - maybe even the 90’s for all I know, before they fitted auto-closing doors on them all. 20k’s an hour - still not exactly _safe_, but a lot more reasonable! ---
**Author:** ![snfaulkner](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/snfaulkner/32/433_2.png) [@snfaulkner](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/snfaulkner)\ **Post date:** [October 11, 2017, 4:24am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cars-and-suicide-doors/798522/14 "2017-10-11T04:24:51Z")
> [@Flyer](#): > > Seriously?? > > I thought that the fact that suicide doors make getting in and out (especially out) easier was so self-evident that I wouldn’t need to elaborate. > > When you open a regular door, the greatest width of opening is 90 degrees from the front of your body, or perhaps even slightly behind you, depending on the car. This means that when you try to put your feet out of the car, THE DOOR IS **IN THE WAY**! You have to turn or twist your body significantly in order to move your feet back far enough to where the opening is actually wide enough to get out. > > This situation is severely aggravated whenever space is tight, and your car winds up being parked quite close to another vehicle. > > With suicide doors, the greatest width of opening is at the front of your body, where your feet already are. One very short, easy swivel, and you’re up and out without a struggle. > > Perhaps the picture at the top of this article will make things clearer. Notice how the lady’s feet and legs are unobstructed? > [http://automotivemileposts.com/autobrevity/suicidedoors.html](http://automotivemileposts.com/autobrevity/suicidedoors.html) > > Here is another. > [http://1.bp.blogspot.com/-yx6W1aBDpaY/VIyseg4RDvI/AAAAAAAAO54/jRLoisRUiiM/s1600/1948%2BRenault%2B4CV%2B-%2B1.jpg](http://1.bp.blogspot.com/-yx6W1aBDpaY/VIyseg4RDvI/AAAAAAAAO54/jRLoisRUiiM/s1600/1948%2BRenault%2B4CV%2B-%2B1.jpg) > > Now will somebody please tell me, just what in the name of common sense is so blasted hard to understand about that concept??? Have you considered that many things in life you consider to be “self-evident” are more complicated than they seem? What’s easy for you might not be as easy for someone else with a different dis/ability? That maybe more factors might be involved? Or that your specific experience with a door on a specific car might not be the same on a different car? You came to the dope to discuss your question. Then you get upset when we point out the possibly flawed premise. Sorry for rocking your world view, but maybe you might learn something if you aren’t so tightly wound. ---
**Author:** ![jtur88](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/e9c0ed/32.png) [@jtur88](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jtur88)\ **Post date:** [October 11, 2017, 6:41am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cars-and-suicide-doors/798522/15 "2017-10-11T06:41:36Z")
You’ve got to admit, there is nothing cooler than a WWII officer in long trench coat, stepping out of the suicide doors of a staff car. The image is even included in historical model collections. [![](https://i.pinimg.com/originals/69/70/09/697009ce031f865ae31ecd89adea5c08.jpg) ](https://i.pinimg.com/originals/69/70/09/697009ce031f865ae31ecd89adea5c08.jpg) ---
**Author:** ![snfaulkner](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/snfaulkner/32/433_2.png) [@snfaulkner](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/snfaulkner)\ **Post date:** [October 11, 2017, 6:52am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cars-and-suicide-doors/798522/16 "2017-10-11T06:52:08Z")
Oh, I think they can look cool as hell! I’m not convinced they are intrinsically easier to get in/out of, let alone for all older people. Which leads me to say that if suicide doors make a comeback, it will be for aesthetic reasons moreso than any other reason. ---
**Author:** ![JacobSwan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/a6a055/32.png) [@JacobSwan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JacobSwan)\ **Post date:** [October 11, 2017, 9:17am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cars-and-suicide-doors/798522/17 "2017-10-11T09:17:08Z")
> [@Aspidistra](#): > > My favorite bit of the wikipedia article > > “Popularized in the custom car trade, the term is avoided by major automobile manufacturers…” > > Gosh, really? You don’t say! Rolls Royce prefer the term ‘Coach Door’ and have been building them for a few years now. > **[Rolls-Royce turns suicide doors' dark past into an elegant tradition](https://www.theverge.com/2017/5/21/15600764/rolls-royce-suicide-doors-dark-past-elegant-tradition)** > > A spectacular coach door by another name ---
**Author:** ![jz78817](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jz78817/32/1028_2.png) [@jz78817](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jz78817)\ **Post date:** [October 11, 2017, 11:04am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cars-and-suicide-doors/798522/18 "2017-10-11T11:04:16Z")
> [@Flyer](#): > > Seriously?? > > I thought that the fact that suicide doors make getting in and out (especially out) easier was so self-evident that I wouldn’t need to elaborate. > > … > > Now will somebody please tell me, just what in the name of common sense is so blasted hard to understand about that concept??? Then why is practically nobody in the industry doing them? ---
**Author:** ![Duckster](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/duckster/32/1244_2.png) [@Duckster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Duckster)\ **Post date:** [October 11, 2017, 7:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cars-and-suicide-doors/798522/19 "2017-10-11T19:53:01Z")
The defunct Saturn had two vehicles with suicide doors: [ul] [li][Saturn Ion Quad Coupe](https://i.ytimg.com/vi/17vZ8_E7dko/maxresdefault.jpg)[/li][li][Saturn SC2 (Driver’s side only)](https://img.autobytel.com/1999/saturn/sc1/2-800-oemexteriorview-54804.jpg)[/li][/ul] In both cases the front door had to be opened first. ---
**Author:** ![Folacin](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/folacin/32/3195_2.png) [@Folacin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Folacin)\ **Post date:** [October 11, 2017, 8:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cars-and-suicide-doors/798522/20 "2017-10-11T20:10:36Z")
> [@snfaulkner](#): > > Have you considered that many things in life you consider to be “self-evident” are more complicated than they seem? What’s easy for you might not be as easy for someone else with a different dis/ability? That maybe more factors might be involved? Or that your specific experience with a door on a specific car might not be the same on a different car? Going to have to agree with \*\*Flyer \*\*here. My grandmother had terrible arthritis, such that she had no flexibility in her feet and very little in her knees. When she came to visit, it was extremely difficult to get her into the car. Even with the front passenger seat pushed all the way back, it took a lot of pressure (and therefore causing her pain) to get her feet swung into the car, since they would hang up on the door. A suicide door would have eased that a lot. On the other hand - I can see where it might be easier for a wheelchair user to transfer themselves from the chair to the car on a standard door (and certainly easier to stow their chair). Of course, I’ve never seen a suicide door on the front of a car, so my example may be a bit moot (although we probably could have put grandma into the back seat in that case). [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cars-and-suicide-doors/798522.md?page=2)