# Carson was famous for giving Comics their big break. Why hasn't new talkshow hosts done the same? **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [May 16, 2013, 8:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/carson-was-famous-for-giving-comics-their-big-break-why-hasnt-new-talkshow-hosts-done-the-same/658554 "2013-05-16T20:49:22Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![astro](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/9dc877/32.png) [@astro](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/astro)\ **Post date:** [May 17, 2013, 1:13am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/carson-was-famous-for-giving-comics-their-big-break-why-hasnt-new-talkshow-hosts-done-the-same/658554/21 "2013-05-17T01:13:20Z")
Most of the comedians I’ve noticed over the past 10 years like Patton Oswalt, Dave Attell etc) have been via web recommends and their work on sitcoms or stand up specials. Late night talk shows aren’t even on my radar anymore. ---
**Author:** ![jasg](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/f0a364/32.png) [@jasg](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jasg)\ **Post date:** [May 17, 2013, 1:16am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/carson-was-famous-for-giving-comics-their-big-break-why-hasnt-new-talkshow-hosts-done-the-same/658554/22 "2013-05-17T01:16:58Z")
The Internet - YouTube and Funny or Die? New ways for comedians to reach an audience. ---
**Author:** ![dropzone](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dropzone/32/7515_2.png) [@dropzone](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/dropzone)\ **Post date:** [May 17, 2013, 1:36am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/carson-was-famous-for-giving-comics-their-big-break-why-hasnt-new-talkshow-hosts-done-the-same/658554/23 "2013-05-17T01:36:27Z")
> [@ftg](#): > > I remember the first time seeing Kinison or **Roseanne** where you knew right away this person was different. Well, the first time I saw Roseanne was on some talent show that doesn’t even make it into her IMDB profile and my reaction was to yell to my wife, “This woman’s stealing your material!” But as Wife never did standup, though she did hang out with the Second City crowd before we got married, she and Roseanne probably tuned into the zeitgeist and made up the same jokes. ---
**Author:** ![Becky2844](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/91b2a8/32.png) [@Becky2844](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Becky2844)\ **Post date:** [May 17, 2013, 2:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/carson-was-famous-for-giving-comics-their-big-break-why-hasnt-new-talkshow-hosts-done-the-same/658554/24 "2013-05-17T02:09:26Z")
> [@dropzone](#): > > Well, the first time I saw Roseanne was on some talent show that doesn’t even make it into her IMDB profile and my reaction was to yell to my wife, “This woman’s stealing your material!” But as Wife never did standup, though she did hang out with the Second City crowd before we got married, she and Roseanne probably tuned into the zeitgeist and made up the same jokes. I think I saw that same talent show: What’s for dinner? “Like he can’t lift the couch cushions and find his _own_ Cheetos.” Letterman has comics on occasionally. I’ve recognized a couple of them from that short-lived _Last Comic Standing._ I usually go to Comedy Central for my stand-up fix but I think the more pc our culture has become the harder it’s gotten for comics. Maybe comedy is in a transitional phase and eventually we’ll all be poking fun at robots. ---
**Author:** ![Exapno\_Mapcase](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/exapno_mapcase/32/1051_2.png) [@Exapno\_Mapcase](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Exapno_Mapcase)\ **Post date:** [May 17, 2013, 2:27am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/carson-was-famous-for-giving-comics-their-big-break-why-hasnt-new-talkshow-hosts-done-the-same/658554/25 "2013-05-17T02:27:19Z")
> [@bienville](#): > > Honestly, I can’t say whether any of the late night hosts are doing this because I don’t watch any of their shows enough. Maybe some of them do this. So why write a long post out of total ignorance? “Why don’t they make movies about superheroes? You’d think they’d have a built-in audience. Of course I never go to the movies, but I’m still going to complain about and condemn the whole business for their lack of basic common sense.” :rolleyes: In fact, all the late night shows do this. As several people in the thread actually said before you posted. ---
**Author:** ![The\_Universe\_Lashes\_Out](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/8797f3/32.png) [@The\_Universe\_Lashes\_Out](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Universe_Lashes_Out)\ **Post date:** [May 17, 2013, 3:11am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/carson-was-famous-for-giving-comics-their-big-break-why-hasnt-new-talkshow-hosts-done-the-same/658554/26 "2013-05-17T03:11:05Z")
> [@Smapti](#): > > It wasn’t that long ago that the late Mitch Hedberg broke into the public consciousness basically by appearing on Letterman every two weeks or so. From an early Mitch routine: I’ve been on the David Letterman show twice. Anyone see me? (sparse clapping) Hey, I’ll be damned! Like… four million people watched that show and I don’t know where the hell they are. I believe more people have seen me at the store and that would be a better introduction, “You might have seen this next comedian at the store.” And people would say, “Hell, yes, I have!” ---
**Author:** ![Thudlow\_Boink](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/thudlow_boink/32/320_2.png) [@Thudlow\_Boink](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Thudlow_Boink)\ **Post date:** [May 17, 2013, 3:33am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/carson-was-famous-for-giving-comics-their-big-break-why-hasnt-new-talkshow-hosts-done-the-same/658554/27 "2013-05-17T03:33:37Z")
I could have sworn I read an article or column a couple of years ago disparaging Leno for not giving aspiring stand-up comics a shot on the Tonight Show the way Carson used to do, but I’ve been unable to find it. ---
**Author:** ![Evil\_Captor](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/f17d59/32.png) [@Evil\_Captor](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Evil_Captor)\ **Post date:** [May 17, 2013, 4:57am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/carson-was-famous-for-giving-comics-their-big-break-why-hasnt-new-talkshow-hosts-done-the-same/658554/28 "2013-05-17T04:57:25Z")
John Stewart’s “The Daily Show” has been a great incubator for comic talent: Steve Carrell, Stephen Colbert, John Hodgman and Lewis Black, to name a few, have gone on to do some fairly cool things, and still come back, because apparently John’s a good guy to work with. ---
**Author:** ![bienville](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/4bbf92/32.png) [@bienville](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bienville)\ **Post date:** [May 17, 2013, 8:12am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/carson-was-famous-for-giving-comics-their-big-break-why-hasnt-new-talkshow-hosts-done-the-same/658554/29 "2013-05-17T08:12:18Z")
> [@Exapno\_Mapcase](#): > > So why write a long post out of total ignorance? 'Cause I don’t hear from you enough and get to missing you. The OP asked why current hosts aren’t giving any comics their first break. A major _focus_ of the responses prior to mine was that these days the impact of being launched by the chat show host just does not compare to the phenomenon of being launched by Carson back in the day. My point was that “nothing compares to Carson”, while broadly true, does not address the OP’s question. Even though it wouldn’t have the same impact from today’s hosts, today’s hosts can still do it. The point that they _can_ do it stands true _whether or not_ they actually are doing it. I admitted to having no data as to what _is_ being done only to point out that I’m _not_ posting to “complain about and condemn the whole business.” Of course none of what I wrote amounts to the value of your contribution to the Thread, but hey we can’t all aspire to such grandeur. ---
**Author:** ![Exapno\_Mapcase](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/exapno_mapcase/32/1051_2.png) [@Exapno\_Mapcase](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Exapno_Mapcase)\ **Post date:** [May 17, 2013, 1:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/carson-was-famous-for-giving-comics-their-big-break-why-hasnt-new-talkshow-hosts-done-the-same/658554/30 "2013-05-17T13:31:15Z")
> [@bienville](#): > > 'Cause I don’t hear from you enough and get to missing you. I can fix that. I’ll start searching for your posts and giving them the responses they deserve. ---
**Author:** ![Don\_t\_Call\_Me\_Shirley](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/f4b2a3/32.png) [@Don\_t\_Call\_Me\_Shirley](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Don_t_Call_Me_Shirley)\ **Post date:** [May 17, 2013, 1:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/carson-was-famous-for-giving-comics-their-big-break-why-hasnt-new-talkshow-hosts-done-the-same/658554/31 "2013-05-17T13:57:50Z")
Because talk shows are now nothing more than commercials. Carson had people on because he liked them, had good chemistry with them, and people liked watching them. Think how many times he had Charles Grodin or Bob Newhart on just to shoot the shit. Can’t do that anymore. Now you don’t get on unless you are selling a new movie or a new TV show or a book. Since movie studios and TV networks are mostly owned by the same companies, the talk shows are treated as merely another advertising outlet. Comedians who need a break aren’t selling anything. They don’t bring in any money to the parent companies. So, they aren’t getting on. ---
**Author:** ![Acsenray](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/acsenray/32/4519_2.png) [@Acsenray](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Acsenray)\ **Post date:** [May 17, 2013, 1:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/carson-was-famous-for-giving-comics-their-big-break-why-hasnt-new-talkshow-hosts-done-the-same/658554/32 "2013-05-17T13:58:24Z")
I believe I answered it. Not only is it not possible for shows to “launch” comedians like Carson did, they are also not able to take risks the way Carson could. Every moment for them is a moment when they could lose the audience’s attention to something else. They don’t have as much flexibility to hand over a segment just to give someone a chance. ---
**Author:** ![GrandWino](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/grandwino/32/67_2.png) [@GrandWino](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GrandWino)\ **Post date:** [May 17, 2013, 1:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/carson-was-famous-for-giving-comics-their-big-break-why-hasnt-new-talkshow-hosts-done-the-same/658554/33 "2013-05-17T13:59:23Z")
Though Craig Ferguson does have a lot of comics on his show, he’s notorious for not being there while the comics record their set. I’ve heard it from many comics on many different podcasts that Ferguson is never there to see them perform. ---
**Author:** ![Exapno\_Mapcase](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/exapno_mapcase/32/1051_2.png) [@Exapno\_Mapcase](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Exapno_Mapcase)\ **Post date:** [May 17, 2013, 2:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/carson-was-famous-for-giving-comics-their-big-break-why-hasnt-new-talkshow-hosts-done-the-same/658554/34 "2013-05-17T14:29:11Z")
On the flip side, Ferguson is the one carrying on the tradition of having people on just to talk to, without them having a big product to plug. He brings on low-level actors, writers, and eccentrics. Letterman used to do that in his NBC days but he can’t in the 11:35 spot. Leno still uses a few people like Terry Bradshaw that way. But please stop crediting Carson. It was Jack Paar’s Tonight Show that was noted for having on unfamous people who were good talkers and making stars of them. They’re mostly forgotten today - Genevieve, Dody Goodman, Alexander King, Jack Douglas and his wife Reiko - but they became huge celebrities for a few years. Carson never had regulars like that. He brought back professional comedians for many appearances, and he did have some people on for talk, but his Tonight Show was vastly more commercial than Paar’s. ---
**Author:** ![PlainJain](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/5daacb/32.png) [@PlainJain](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/PlainJain)\ **Post date:** [May 17, 2013, 2:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/carson-was-famous-for-giving-comics-their-big-break-why-hasnt-new-talkshow-hosts-done-the-same/658554/35 "2013-05-17T14:31:35Z")
> [@Acsenray](#): > > None of the current talk show hosts are as culturally important as Johnny Carson was. They don’t have the social clout to bestow some kind of gift of “now you’ve arrived” by getting someone on the show. It’s this I think. ---
**Author:** ![Justin\_Bailey](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/justin_bailey/32/8792_2.png) [@Justin\_Bailey](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Justin_Bailey)\ **Post date:** [May 17, 2013, 2:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/carson-was-famous-for-giving-comics-their-big-break-why-hasnt-new-talkshow-hosts-done-the-same/658554/36 "2013-05-17T14:49:48Z")
> [@Don\_t\_Call\_Me\_Shirley](#): > > Because talk shows are now nothing more than commercials. Carson had people on because he liked them, had good chemistry with them, and people liked watching them. Think how many times he had Charles Grodin or Bob Newhart on just to shoot the shit. Can’t do that anymore. Now you don’t get on unless you are selling a new movie or a new TV show or a book. Since movie studios and TV networks are mostly owned by the same companies, the talk shows are treated as merely another advertising outlet. Letterman and Ferguson both do this. Letterman calls in Regis Philbin all the time and Ferguson does the same with Kristen Bell. ---
**Author:** ![Mahaloth](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mahaloth/32/1079_2.png) [@Mahaloth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mahaloth)\ **Post date:** [May 17, 2013, 3:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/carson-was-famous-for-giving-comics-their-big-break-why-hasnt-new-talkshow-hosts-done-the-same/658554/37 "2013-05-17T15:06:26Z")
> [@Bob Ducca](#): > > Though Craig Ferguson does have a lot of comics on his show, he’s notorious for not being there while the comics record their set. I’ve heard it from many comics on many different podcasts that Ferguson is never there to see them perform. Can you give us an example of one of those podcasts? Or a citation from an online interview somewhere? ---
**Author:** ![GrandWino](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/grandwino/32/67_2.png) [@GrandWino](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GrandWino)\ **Post date:** [May 17, 2013, 3:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/carson-was-famous-for-giving-comics-their-big-break-why-hasnt-new-talkshow-hosts-done-the-same/658554/38 "2013-05-17T15:11:58Z")
> [@Mahaloth](#): > > Can you give us an example of one of those podcasts? Or a citation from an online interview somewhere? I can’t recall who all has said it but I’ve definitely heard it from multiple people, usually on either WTF w/ Marc Maron or You Made it Weird with Pete Holmes. I’ll do some digging and get back to you with specifics. I’ll ask some of my geekier comedy friends that would know. ---
**Author:** ![GrandWino](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/grandwino/32/67_2.png) [@GrandWino](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GrandWino)\ **Post date:** [May 17, 2013, 3:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/carson-was-famous-for-giving-comics-their-big-break-why-hasnt-new-talkshow-hosts-done-the-same/658554/39 "2013-05-17T15:50:17Z")
> [@Mahaloth](#): > > Can you give us an example of one of those podcasts? Or a citation from an online interview somewhere? Ok, checked with some people and so far I’m told that Chad Daniels and Hannibal Burress both talk about it on their episodes of WTF, and Maron talks about experiencing it himself during his set on Ferguson. If that’s not enough cites for you, Craig Ferguson himself was a guest on WTF and he and Maron talk about it. He basically said that it’s the end of his day and it’s time for him to go home. Part of the reason is that they tape the comic segments separately from the regular show so that they can drop them into a show whenever they want. ---
**Author:** ![Marley23](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@Marley23](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Marley23)\ **Post date:** [May 17, 2013, 4:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/carson-was-famous-for-giving-comics-their-big-break-why-hasnt-new-talkshow-hosts-done-the-same/658554/40 "2013-05-17T16:19:12Z")
“Notorious?” Because of the way the show is filmed and (in the old days, I think) because of the way the stage is set up, he’s not there when those bits are filmed. The comedians still get on his show and get the exposure. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/carson-was-famous-for-giving-comics-their-big-break-why-hasnt-new-talkshow-hosts-done-the-same/658554.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/carson-was-famous-for-giving-comics-their-big-break-why-hasnt-new-talkshow-hosts-done-the-same/658554.md?page=3)