# Cases Where the Movie Version Has Taken Over **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Tags:** movies\ **Created:** [May 17, 2024, 6:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cases-where-the-movie-version-has-taken-over/1001711 "2024-05-17T18:16:27Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 12
**Author:** ![CalMeacham](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/calmeacham/32/35_2.png) [@CalMeacham](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CalMeacham)\ **Post date:** [May 30, 2024, 5:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cases-where-the-movie-version-has-taken-over/1001711/221 "2024-05-30T17:51:25Z")
> [@Push\_You\_Down](#): > > The acquaintance who set it up explained that Harlan’s issue is with “professional courtesy.” Cameron was flippant about the subject apparently even jokingly saying he “ripped off” Outer Limits so… Harlan went after him. Here’s the take on it from a website called "CAmeron online: [https://www.jamescamerononline.com/Ellison.htm](https://www.jamescamerononline.com/Ellison.htm) Here’s the line from the interview as they give it, as reported by Ellison: > [@](#): > > Ellison also was told by a friend of his,Tracy Torme, that, while visiting the set for The Terminator, he had asked Cameron where he got the story idea. According to Ellison’s account of Torme’s statement, Cameron replied, “Oh, I ripped off a couple of Harlan Ellison stories.” But elsewhere he reports: > [@](#): > > _“About a week after my attorney contacted Hemdale, I got a call from the editor of Starlog magazine. …It turned out Cameron had given an interview to Starlog and, after I began inquiring at Hemdale, [The Terminator producer Gale Anne] Hurd sent Starlog a legal demand to see the interview.”_ According to Ellison, Gale Anne Hurd then modified Starlog’s article on The Terminator. She omitted a quote from Cameron in the article that read, _“‘Oh, I took a couple of Outer Limits segments.’”_ The reason that the Starlog editor had contacted Ellison was to provide him with the original version of the article, the one without Gale Anne Hurd’s editing. I note that these are both from Ellison. Cameron hasn’t explicitly commented, apparently because of a gag order (Cameron isn’t Donald Trump) ---
**Author:** ![CalMeacham](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/calmeacham/32/35_2.png) [@CalMeacham](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CalMeacham)\ **Post date:** [May 30, 2024, 5:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cases-where-the-movie-version-has-taken-over/1001711/222 "2024-05-30T17:54:10Z")
> [@Push\_You\_Down](#): > > I recently read an account of another filmmaker…someone who made “In Time” (I don’t know if it was the director or screenwriter) and was afraid of Ellison suing because minor conceptual similarities with “Repent, Harlequin.” They reached out to him through an acquaintance and met with him, showed him the movie and Harlan shrugged and said it was “fine”(\*) and everybody moved on. This account disputes your benign one regarding _About Time_: > [@](#): > > Later, Ellison would file a lawsuit against New Regency and **Andrew Niccol** , claiming that Niccol’s _**[In Time](https://collider.com/in-time-cillian-murphy-justin-timberlake/)**_ lifted concepts wholesale from his short story “Repent, Harlequin! Said The Ticktockman,” both of which feature a futuristic society where inhabitants are allotted only a certain amount of time to live. Some of these lawsuits were immensely ludicrous, particularly the _In Time_ one. Any similarities to “Repent, Harlequin! Said The Ticktockman” come off as pure coincidence, especially if audiences saw the film. [Ellison wound up settling out of court](https://www.hollywoodreporter.com/business/business-news/in-time-harlan-ellison-lawsuit-dropped-267567/), though he’d undergo a similar process with the _Terminator_ lawsuit. [https://collider.com/the-terminator-lawsuit/](https://collider.com/the-terminator-lawsuit/) ---
**Author:** ![Lumpy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lumpy/32/446_2.png) [@Lumpy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lumpy)\ **Post date:** [May 30, 2024, 6:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cases-where-the-movie-version-has-taken-over/1001711/223 "2024-05-30T18:10:05Z")
I’m not sure Ellison liked anything that didn’t have as it’s main theme how horrible and evil the world is. ---
**Author:** ![Push\_You\_Down](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/push_you_down/32/9095_2.png) [@Push\_You\_Down](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Push_You_Down)\ **Post date:** [May 30, 2024, 6:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cases-where-the-movie-version-has-taken-over/1001711/224 "2024-05-30T18:20:20Z")
Well, damn I’ll have to track down where I got that from–literally just read it a few days ago. ETA- The story was attributed to sci-fi writer Adam-Troy Castro (on a social media post) but I can’t find HIM positing it just him tagged in someone else relating it as Castro’s story–and the way its written I thought that Castro worked on In Time but now looking at it again. He just showed Harlan the movie and at the time expecting a reaction and Harlan just shrugged. But apparently decided to shrug and then call his lawyer. ---
**Author:** ![Just\_Asking\_Questions](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/ba9def/32.png) [@Just\_Asking\_Questions](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Just_Asking_Questions)\ **Post date:** [May 30, 2024, 7:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cases-where-the-movie-version-has-taken-over/1001711/225 "2024-05-30T19:16:03Z")
> [@Lumpy](#): > > I’m not sure Ellison liked anything I’d just stop there. ---
**Author:** ![DesertDog](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/desertdog/32/11503_2.png) [@DesertDog](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DesertDog)\ **Post date:** [June 4, 2024, 4:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cases-where-the-movie-version-has-taken-over/1001711/226 "2024-06-04T16:05:36Z")
> [@Lumpy](#): > > So in addition to all his other admirable traits, Tarzan has a 210 IQ. When one of the Tarzan movies came out – forget which one – _Mad Magazine_ had a Jack Davis satire of it. One exchange with the White Hunter: “Why, you speak English as good as _me_.” “That’s ‘as well as I’ and I happen to speak better than you do.” ---
**Author:** ![CalMeacham](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/calmeacham/32/35_2.png) [@CalMeacham](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CalMeacham)\ **Post date:** [June 4, 2024, 6:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cases-where-the-movie-version-has-taken-over/1001711/227 "2024-06-04T18:01:17Z")
> [@DesertDog](#): > > When one of the Tarzan movies came out – forget which one – _Mad Magazine_ had a Jack Davis satire of it. One exchange with the White Hunter: > “Why, you speak English as good as _me_.” > > “That’s ‘as well as I’ and I happen to speak better than you do.” Actual Tarzan quote from the first _Tarzan of the Apes_ novel: > [@](#): > > I love you, and because I love you I believe in you. But if I did not believe, still should I love. Had you come back for me, and had there been no other way, I would have gone into the jungle with you - forever. “Me Tarzan, you Jane” (which isn’t exactly what Johnny Weissmuller said) was a creation of the movies. ---
**Author:** ![EinsteinsHund](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/einsteinshund/32/8400_2.png) [@EinsteinsHund](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/EinsteinsHund)\ **Post date:** [June 4, 2024, 6:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cases-where-the-movie-version-has-taken-over/1001711/228 "2024-06-04T18:33:12Z")
> [@CalMeacham](#): > > Actual Tarzan quote from the first _Tarzan of the Apes_ novel: > > > [@](#): > > > > I love you, and because I love you I believe in you. But if I did not believe, still should I love. Had you come back for me, and had there been no other way, I would have gone into the jungle with you - forever. Ok, that’s a tad better than “Me Tarzan, you Jane”, but no Shakespeare either… 😉 ---
**Author:** ![CalMeacham](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/calmeacham/32/35_2.png) [@CalMeacham](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CalMeacham)\ **Post date:** [June 4, 2024, 6:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cases-where-the-movie-version-has-taken-over/1001711/229 "2024-06-04T18:50:41Z")
> [@EinsteinsHund](#): > > Ok, that’s a tad better than “Me Tarzan, you Jane”, but no Shakespeare either… 😉 What can you say? Nkima (Tarzan’s real monkey companion in the books. Cheetah was only in the movies. And he was a chimp) wasn’t a very good editor or speech coach. ---
**Author:** ![DPRK](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/4491bb/32.png) [@DPRK](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DPRK)\ **Post date:** [June 4, 2024, 9:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cases-where-the-movie-version-has-taken-over/1001711/230 "2024-06-04T21:22:27Z")
“In Time” was a double rippety rip-off, anyway: > **[The Price of Life (1987 film)](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Price_of_Life_(1987_film))** > > The Price of Life is a 1987 38-minute long American drama and science fiction film made by Chanticleer Films, directed by Stephen Tolkin and produced by Jana Sue Memel (story by Stephen Tolkin and Michel Monteaux). The film has music composed by Ken Fix. The film stars Dana Andersen, Diana Bellamy, Roy Brocksmith and Ron Campbell in the lead roles. > The basic premise of the film is that a time account is physically linked to every infant at birth, with death automatic when the balance drops to ze... ---
**Author:** ![DrDeth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/b487fb/32.png) [@DrDeth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DrDeth)\ **Post date:** [June 4, 2024, 9:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cases-where-the-movie-version-has-taken-over/1001711/231 "2024-06-04T21:30:49Z")
> [@DPRK](#): > > “In Time” was a double rippety rip-off, anyway: Doubtful. Were there successful lawsuits? Ideas can be original even if someone had the idea before, as in a film few ever saw. It is possible that _In Time_ bought the rights for a few bucks, just in case. Just like PotC On Stranger Tides where- > **[On Stranger Tides](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/On_Stranger_Tides)** > > On Stranger Tides is a 1987 historical fantasy supernatural novel by American writer Tim Powers. It was nominated for the World Fantasy Award for Best Novel, and placed second in the annual Locus poll for best fantasy novel. > Set in the early 18th century, On Stranger Tides takes place during the Golden Age of Piracy, when puppeteer John Chandagnac sets out to reclaim an inheritance in Haiti and is waylaid by various buccaneers and pirates, only to become one himself. Now known as "Jack Shandy",... _It was later revealed that the idea to adapt On Stranger Tides came close to the end of filming the Pirates trilogy, in which screenwriters [Ted Elliott](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ted_Elliott_(screenwriter)) and [Terry Rossio](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Terry_Rossio) found the novel and brought it up to producer [Jerry Bruckheimer](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jerry_Bruckheimer) as an idea to option the book for the new chapter.[[15]](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/On_Stranger_Tides#cite_note-15) In a 2011 interview, Tim Powers stated that Disney wanted the film rights as early as before the release of the second Pirates film, [Dead Man’s Chest](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pirates_of_the_Caribbean:_Dead_Man%27s_Chest) , though he thought they already used elements beforehand. Disney would not buy the rights to Powers’ novel until they started filming their fourth movie.[[4]](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/On_Stranger_Tides#cite_note-Youtube-4)[[5]](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/On_Stranger_Tides#cite_note-JDR_full_interview-5) Rossio mentioned how Disney was hit with at least six plagiarism lawsuits for the first Pirates of the Caribbean movie for supposedly stealing elements of the Monkey Island video game and stuff from the On Stranger Tides novel, despite there being a ride at Disneyland and also a first draft screenplay by other writers.[[16]](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/On_Stranger_Tides#cite_note-16)_ In other words, the basic concept of the Film had been developed before Disney knew of the novel, but in order to protect themselves and yes- use a few ideas- they bought the rights. ---
**Author:** ![Miller](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/miller/32/481_2.png) [@Miller](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Miller)\ **Post date:** [June 4, 2024, 9:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cases-where-the-movie-version-has-taken-over/1001711/232 "2024-06-04T21:42:08Z")
I was really disappointed that On Stanger Tides was optioned as a legal ass covering, and not as an adaptation in its own right. Great book, deserved more than being used to flog a few more pieces of eight from Jack Sparrows corpse. ---
**Author:** ![CalMeacham](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/calmeacham/32/35_2.png) [@CalMeacham](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CalMeacham)\ **Post date:** [June 5, 2024, 12:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cases-where-the-movie-version-has-taken-over/1001711/233 "2024-06-05T12:29:41Z")
This sort of thing happens a lot. Studios often buy up the rights to a similar story published earlier to avoid lawsuits. And sometimes, having paid the money, they say the film or TV is an adaptaion, when it pretty clearly isn’t. Examples: 1. Star Trek (TOS) episode “Arena”. Apparently Gene L. Coon wrote the episode unaware of Fredric Brown’s classic SF story of the same name (It’s in the Science Fiction Hall of Fame, and countless other anthologies). So they bought the rights and claimed it was an adaptation. Even though the endings of the story and the episode are diametrically opposed. And the stories are very different. One of these days I’d like to see somebody do the story straight, using CGI. 2. I, Robot. Screenwriter Jeff Vintar wrote a screenplay that was set in Asimov’s “Robots” universe, but wasn’t intended to be an adaptation of any existing story, let alone the fix-up by Asimov called “I, Robot” (or “Eando Binder’s” “I, Robot”, either). But the studio, noting the similarities, bought the rights to the Asimov book. Since they had the rights, why not put Asimov’s named on it and claim it as an adaptation? Even though the characters didn’t at all resemble the ones in the book, and the plot isn’t at all the same. And the conclusions drawn are again diametrically opposed (A “robot revolt” as depicted in the film _could not happen_ in Asimov’s universe). One of these days I’d love to see them fil m the screenplay Harlan Ellison had written adapting Asimov’s story (with Asimov’s blessing). 3. Starship Troopers – Ed Neumeier started writing a treatment for a movie tentatively entitled _Bug Hunt at Outpost 7_, which was planned to be a jingoistic xenophobic action movie. Neumeier wasn’t consciously adapting Heinlein’s book, but I can’t believe he was unaware of it – Neumeier’s output reveals him to be a big science fiction fan. Apparently they believed that the rights to the Heinlein book had already been bought. Later, when Neumeier and producer Jon Davidson tried to sell the idea they met with resistance until they found that the rights to the book were available, bought them, and repackaged the film as an adaptation. They also rewrote the script a little. An adaptation it definitely is not – I’ve never see n a case where the mismatch b etween philosophy, plot, and respect for scientific accuracy were so much at odds. Heinlein would’ve _hated_ this movie with a passion. Honey I Blew up the Kid – When I first saw the idea for this film I thought they’d bought the rights to Kit Reed’s _Attack of the Giant Baby_. So did a lot of other people, including Kit Reed, who sued. In this case I can honestly believe it was simply a similarity of ideas – HIBUTK is sort of obvious after you’ve made Honey I Shrunk the Kids. But their legal department was definitely at fault in not picking up on this sooner. Reed ended up getting a “special recognition” in the credits. Don’t get me started on all the times Robert Sheckley should’ve gotten recognition for stuff stolen from him; or how badly they mangled his work in “adaptation” ---
**Author:** ![Mahaloth](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mahaloth/32/1079_2.png) [@Mahaloth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mahaloth)\ **Post date:** [June 5, 2024, 12:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cases-where-the-movie-version-has-taken-over/1001711/234 "2024-06-05T12:32:39Z")
> [@Miller](#): > > I was really disappointed that On Stanger Tides was optioned as a legal ass covering, and not as an adaptation in its own right. Great book, deserved more than being used to flog a few more pieces of eight from Jack Sparrows corpse. I hadn’t even realized that until later. Funny enough, they probably also own Monkey Island now? I mean it was under the LucasArts production. Then again, Monkey Island 6 came out last year and Disney wasn’t involved so maybe those rights are elsewhere. Despite huge differences, I did notice that Curse of the Black Pearl had a few similar elements to Monkey Island. Just a coincidence, though. ---
**Author:** ![eburacum45](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/eburacum45/32/8690_2.png) [@eburacum45](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/eburacum45)\ **Post date:** [June 5, 2024, 5:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cases-where-the-movie-version-has-taken-over/1001711/235 "2024-06-05T17:21:11Z")
> [@dorvann](#): > > If i remember correctly the bipedal “wolfman” form is entirely a Hollywood creation. Can someone correct me if I am wrong? Well, there are a few examples of pre-Hollywood ‘wolfmen’ that appear to be bipedal. Here’s a woodcut of Peter Stummp attacking a victim; he was a famous ‘werewolf’ who was executed in a disturbing way in 1589. [![](https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/e/e0/Loup_garou.jpg/440px-Loup_garou.jpg) ](https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/e/e0/Loup_garou.jpg/440px-Loup_garou.jpg) ---
**Author:** ![DrDeth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/b487fb/32.png) [@DrDeth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DrDeth)\ **Post date:** [June 5, 2024, 7:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cases-where-the-movie-version-has-taken-over/1001711/236 "2024-06-05T19:06:30Z")
> [@Miller](#): > > I was really disappointed that On Stanger Tides was optioned as a legal ass covering, and not as an adaptation in its own right. Great book, It is a great book, but none of Tim Powers books have been made into a film, nor even optioned- AFAIK. RAH was likely the greatest SF author of all time, but other than the little known _Destination Moon_ none were any good- altho the Japanese version of _Door into Summer_ might be okay. And overall not many film versions were made- and RAHs TA books would be great as films. ---
**Author:** ![Lumpy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lumpy/32/446_2.png) [@Lumpy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lumpy)\ **Post date:** [June 5, 2024, 7:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cases-where-the-movie-version-has-taken-over/1001711/237 "2024-06-05T19:58:16Z")
And of course many movies have been _inspired by_ Philip K. Dick novels, but afaik none have actually been adapted. ---
**Author:** ![YamatoTwinkie](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/y/cc9497/32.png) [@YamatoTwinkie](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/YamatoTwinkie)\ **Post date:** [June 5, 2024, 8:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cases-where-the-movie-version-has-taken-over/1001711/238 "2024-06-05T20:11:48Z")
[A Scanner Darkly (2006)](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/A_Scanner_Darkly_(film)) ? ---
**Author:** ![carrps](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/carrps/32/2957_2.png) [@carrps](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/carrps)\ **Post date:** [June 5, 2024, 9:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cases-where-the-movie-version-has-taken-over/1001711/239 "2024-06-05T21:31:01Z")
> [@CalMeacham](#): > > “Demon with a Glass Hand” (my all-time favorite piece of SF television, which also involves warring sides being translated backwards in time to the present). Oh, me, too. Plus, being filmed in the oh-so-atmospheric Bradbury Building. ---
**Author:** ![carrps](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/carrps/32/2957_2.png) [@carrps](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/carrps)\ **Post date:** [June 5, 2024, 9:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cases-where-the-movie-version-has-taken-over/1001711/240 "2024-06-05T21:44:16Z")
> [@YamatoTwinkie](#): > > [A Scanner Darkly (2006)](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/A_Scanner_Darkly_(film)) ? Man in the High Castle? [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cases-where-the-movie-version-has-taken-over/1001711.md?page=11) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cases-where-the-movie-version-has-taken-over/1001711.md?page=13)