Again, depends on location. Mine almost always get to over 16, and die of diseases of old age. I got one into his 20’s, and another to 19 years 6 months.
And I live on an 80-acre farm on a dead-end road (though the 19+ cat lived with me on a side street in a village, first.)
We do have coyote. I shut the cats in at night. Most of them seem well aware of coyote and if I hear coyote singing while a cat’s still out that cat will almost always be right at the door (I’ve never, in this location, seen coyote come right up to the house.)
But, you know, I’m pretty sure we’ve had multiple threads on this subject; and that the OP of this thread now has assorted opinions from which to make up their mind. So I think I’m going to quit arguing this one here.
My garage cats were outdoor cats when they came to me. They have a cat flap they can come indoors. A rare event. I wasn’t about to try and force them indoors forever. My indoor cats never go outside. They would be the murderous ones.
I’m not at all worried about the mouse population around the yard. Jojo and Hari couldn’t catch a bird if their lives depended on it.
I live in a city. Coyotes do not exist in this country, the biggest predaror would be either Eagle Owls (Spotted Eagle owls - the smallest of the Eagle Owls) or Caracals, both usually take much smaller prey. Caracals are really rare.
Perhaps snakes? We have Puff Adders and Rinkhals and Cape Cobras, but they are rarely, if ever, seen in the suburbs.
In any case I will submit a photo of these two adolescents: Spot-Dot (foreground) and Moonlight (reclined)
(The random mess across the carpet is entirely their doing, they are an energetic pair and play with anything. Plastic forks. Lego pieces. An orange robot toy. A starfish filled with catnip. A 5mm nylon rope. Each other.)
ETA, there are a pair of Black Eagles within hunting distance from my current house (up to 20km), and they would take a cat, but the chances are very, very low. They are well fed by the ubundance of rock hyrax. (A small rabbit sized animal that resembles a rodent, but is not one)
I’ve lived here 23 years, and often walk in an area where there is a known breeding pair of caracals (they live in isolation, only meeting to breed) and have never seen one. One of my friends has had two sightings while walking his dogs. Fortunately the dogs are Scottish Terriers, not large game hunting dogs.
Never seen a leopard either, aside from in a zoo, and the area I grew up in had at least 2 or three. Cape Leopards are in the surrounding mountains, but I don’t think there are any close by, probably the closest would be in one of the bigger reserves about 50km away.
Cat one, the male “Moonshine” is at the point where he is comfortable on the bed. Cat two, “Spot-Dot” is ok with close proximity but she’s not ready to be touched.
And some animals are lethal to cats, one of them being Homo sapiens sapiens.
Keep them indoors, and as for litterbox odor, keep one box PER CAT and keep it scooped. There should be little odor if it’s kept scooped, and cleaned regularly.
Cat 1 (Moonlight) is now my friend. He happily cuddles and interracts with me. His sister, cat 2 (Spot-Dot) is still very wary of humans.
Cat 1 is not helping because he has realised that his sister is scared of me. This greatly improves his chances of winning his sibling rivalry battles, because he has a safe haven when he is near me. She won’t approach me, unless I am immobile and she sniffs my toes.
Bribery with cat treats has not worked out because Cat 1 steals the treats I put out for Cat 2, she is not fast enough, because she is nervous of me. I am considering separating them but… when they are being friendly they are really friendly. Sleeping cuddled up together. Playing together.
Time on its own might help. Could take weeks or months or years, though.
While I agree that you shouldn’t separate them in general since they sleep together and play together, you could try separating them for treat time. Give Cat 1 treats and cuddles in one room, first. Then go out and leave him there, get cat 2 in another room with cat 1 shut out, and hang out in there for a while with her; sitting somewhere comfortable that has room for a cat, and offering treats. Start by tossing the treats gently to a spot a bit out of your reach; then offer them closer. Take something to read or work on, and pretend to ignore Cat 2. If you look at her directly for a moment, immediately close your eyes in a long slow blink and turn your head a bit away from her. (This is Cat for ‘my intentions are friendly’ and seems to combine ‘I’m not intending to pounce on you either as prey or to drive you away’ with ‘I’m not afraid to take my eyes off you, and so won’t fear-bite.’) No sudden moves.
Ja, I have realised that the direct stare is not a good idea. I fake it somewhat on occasion with half closed eyes but cats being cats, she probably knows.
She is gradually becoming accustomed to me - just a short while ago I touched her and she did not hiss, and her fighting paw did not have claws out, so I guess its just time.
@GESancMan I have never heard of that. And it is probably not available in my country. I’ve already introduced both cats to soft drugs (catnip) so I am willing to find out. Thanks for the suggestion.
I realise it is not a drug, that reference was somewhat tongue in cheek. But yes, it is expensive. If bribery with food is going to win her over I am totally going to try that.
The next step in this process will be introducing children… I forsee difficulties.
– do your best to get her fully comfortable with you before introducing children, if possible. And do your best to get the children to not come right at her, but to follow the same slow procedure of letting her eventually come to them. And make entirely sure that she can get away from them into a safe hiding place of her choosing.
Yes, this seems to be a long term project, not least of all is that cat 1 (the much more dominant male) is bullying cat 2 by chasing her away when she comes near me. I guess he is territorial, or he wants to be the boss
The children have accepted that the cats both need time, but they are children, noisy and unpredictable to a cat, whereas I am this very predictable human who provides food and quietly plays with expensive electronics (how do cats know how to sit on a laptop?). I need them to get used to me before the kids get involved.
It might, or might not, help for you to step in if this shows no signs of abating over time.
When he does this – and only when he does this, or if he does something else unacceptable – pick him up and shut him in a room on his own for a bit (not a really long time.) Don’t pick him up by the scruff of his neck; but, when you pick him up, while supporting cat 1 with one arm take a firm grip on the scruff of his neck with the other hand. What you’re trying to tell him is ‘You’re not the boss, I am.’
He won’t fully agree with that, of course; cats aren’t that particular type of hierarchical. But he may back down some, because cats do recognize when they can’t win.
Lots of very noisy kids here.
My Siamese cats avoid at all costs. I’ve tried to teach the kids to do they same. They aren’t very family oriented cats. Aloof. Haughty, mean and complainers.
It works for us.
The inside/outside cats are more happy to interact with kids. To a degree.
I found out cats know easily how to get away from a kid. Don’t worry about the cats maintaining that distance from them. They will.
Teach the kids to leave them be til the cat decides to interact.
Forgive me if I’ve missed this, but do you have a Feliway diffuser for calming pheromones? A pheromone spray for the areas where they hang out? Perhaps, if he’ll tolerate it, a calming collar too? Since the female is so shy of you I wouldn’t try to put one on her.
I recently adopted a 10-year-old male from a rescue, a stray, not a feral, calm and and neutered, but he thinks it’s fun to chase my 18-year-old little girl cat. She was upset about it till I put in the Feliway and put calming collars on both of them. It cut way back on the chasing, and Sally is a lot more relaxed about him being around her.
