# Catholics thinking of ordaining women? \[i.e. Roman Catholic Church's priorities fucked up. E **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [July 17, 2010, 3:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/catholics-thinking-of-ordaining-women-i-e-roman-catholic-churchs-priorities-fucked-up-e/547036 "2010-07-17T15:04:09Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![Hari\_Seldon](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/hari_seldon/32/5173_2.png) [@Hari\_Seldon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hari_Seldon)\ **Post date:** [July 17, 2010, 3:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/catholics-thinking-of-ordaining-women-i-e-roman-catholic-churchs-priorities-fucked-up-e/547036/1 "2010-07-17T15:04:09Z")
My first reaction to the news that ordination of female priests is just as bad as pedophilia was that since they seem okay with the latter, maybe they are considering the former. ---
**Author:** ![twickster](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/ec9cab/32.png) [@twickster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/twickster)\ **Post date:** [July 17, 2010, 3:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/catholics-thinking-of-ordaining-women-i-e-roman-catholic-churchs-priorities-fucked-up-e/547036/2 "2010-07-17T15:14:07Z")
Could you provide a cite so I know whether to move this to the Pit or Great Debates? Thanks, **twickster** , MPSIMS moderator ---
**Author:** ![rekkah](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/ee59a6/32.png) [@rekkah](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/rekkah)\ **Post date:** [July 17, 2010, 3:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/catholics-thinking-of-ordaining-women-i-e-roman-catholic-churchs-priorities-fucked-up-e/547036/3 "2010-07-17T15:23:21Z")
[http://www.catholicnews.com/data/stories/cns/1002827.htm](http://www.catholicnews.com/data/stories/cns/1002827.htm) ---
**Author:** ![twickster](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/ec9cab/32.png) [@twickster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/twickster)\ **Post date:** [July 17, 2010, 3:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/catholics-thinking-of-ordaining-women-i-e-roman-catholic-churchs-priorities-fucked-up-e/547036/4 "2010-07-17T15:24:58Z")
Thanks. Let’s make it GD. ---
**Author:** ![BigT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bigt/32/12044_2.png) [@BigT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BigT)\ **Post date:** [July 17, 2010, 3:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/catholics-thinking-of-ordaining-women-i-e-roman-catholic-churchs-priorities-fucked-up-e/547036/5 "2010-07-17T15:47:16Z")
So what is the actual procedure for _delicta graviora_? And could be amended to include contacting the secular authorities if a crime was committed? ---
**Author:** ![Captain\_Amazing](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/6de8d8/32.png) [@Captain\_Amazing](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Captain_Amazing)\ **Post date:** [July 17, 2010, 4:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/catholics-thinking-of-ordaining-women-i-e-roman-catholic-churchs-priorities-fucked-up-e/547036/6 "2010-07-17T16:06:27Z")
> [@BigT](#): > > So what is the actual procedure for _delicta graviora_? And could be amended to include contacting the secular authorities if a crime was committed? With the exception now the sexual abuse of minors thing, I don’t think any of the _delicta graviora_ offenses are crimes in any secular jurisdiction. The other offenses that fit under that category are sacrilegious use or improper disposal of the consecrated host or wine, attempted celebration of the Mass by someone not allowed to celebrate a Mass, participating in religious rites with non-Catholic clergy, and consecration of the bread without the wine or the wine without the bread. ---
**Author:** ![John\_Mace](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_mace/32/185_2.png) [@John\_Mace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Mace)\ **Post date:** [July 17, 2010, 4:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/catholics-thinking-of-ordaining-women-i-e-roman-catholic-churchs-priorities-fucked-up-e/547036/7 "2010-07-17T16:17:32Z")
> [@twickster](#): > > Thanks. Let’s make it GD. Really? What’s the debate? The OP is clearly a deliberate strawman, since the Catholic Church is not “OK” with pedophilia. ---
**Author:** ![Captain\_Amazing](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/6de8d8/32.png) [@Captain\_Amazing](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Captain_Amazing)\ **Post date:** [July 17, 2010, 4:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/catholics-thinking-of-ordaining-women-i-e-roman-catholic-churchs-priorities-fucked-up-e/547036/8 "2010-07-17T16:31:50Z")
They’re so not OK with pedophilia, as a matter of fact, that they made it as serious an offense as abusing the host and a woman acting as a priest. ---
**Author:** ![Skald\_the\_Rhymer](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ecccb3/32.png) [@Skald\_the\_Rhymer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Skald_the_Rhymer)\ **Post date:** [July 17, 2010, 4:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/catholics-thinking-of-ordaining-women-i-e-roman-catholic-churchs-priorities-fucked-up-e/547036/9 "2010-07-17T16:43:00Z")
> [@John\_Mace](#): > > Really? What’s the debate? The OP is clearly a deliberate strawman, since the Catholic Church is not “OK” with pedophilia. I don’t see a debate either, but the OP’s position seems to be that the Roman Catholic Church’s priorities are fucked up. ---
**Author:** ![Lobohan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lobohan/32/79_2.png) [@Lobohan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lobohan)\ **Post date:** [July 17, 2010, 4:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/catholics-thinking-of-ordaining-women-i-e-roman-catholic-churchs-priorities-fucked-up-e/547036/10 "2010-07-17T16:48:53Z")
> [@John\_Mace](#): > > Really? What’s the debate? The OP is clearly a deliberate strawman, since the Catholic Church is not “OK” with pedophilia. I imagine the debate will happen when a _Resident Catholic Apologist™_ comes in and says that it is perfectly reasonable to equate raping small boys with allowing women to pass out biscuits and grape juice at the Sunday meetings. ---
**Author:** ![Hari\_Seldon](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/hari_seldon/32/5173_2.png) [@Hari\_Seldon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hari_Seldon)\ **Post date:** [July 17, 2010, 4:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/catholics-thinking-of-ordaining-women-i-e-roman-catholic-churchs-priorities-fucked-up-e/547036/11 "2010-07-17T16:52:54Z")
Here is a cite. It was also on the front page of yesterday’s Times but my search didn’t turn it up: [http://www.nytimes.com/2010/07/17/opinion/17sat4.html?\_r=1&scp=1&sq=ordination%20of%20females&st=cse](http://www.nytimes.com/2010/07/17/opinion/17sat4.html?_r=1&scp=1&sq=ordination%20of%20females&st=cse) ---
**Author:** ![BigT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bigt/32/12044_2.png) [@BigT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BigT)\ **Post date:** [July 17, 2010, 5:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/catholics-thinking-of-ordaining-women-i-e-roman-catholic-churchs-priorities-fucked-up-e/547036/12 "2010-07-17T17:07:48Z")
> [@Captain\_Amazing](#): > > With the exception now the sexual abuse of minors thing, I don’t think any of the _delicta graviora_ offenses are crimes in any secular jurisdiction. The other offenses that fit under that category are sacrilegious use or improper disposal of the consecrated host or wine, attempted celebration of the Mass by someone not allowed to celebrate a Mass, participating in religious rites with non-Catholic clergy, and consecration of the bread without the wine or the wine without the bread. So it’s more like they need another class for offenses that are serious, even in the secular world. For example, if a priest murders someone, surely that should be some sort of sin. Make pedophilia match with that. (I’m trying to get at least some debate out of this. Even if I tend to bow out once smarter people start making better arguments.) ---
**Author:** ![John\_Mace](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_mace/32/185_2.png) [@John\_Mace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Mace)\ **Post date:** [July 17, 2010, 5:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/catholics-thinking-of-ordaining-women-i-e-roman-catholic-churchs-priorities-fucked-up-e/547036/13 "2010-07-17T17:27:29Z")
> [@Lobohan](#): > > I imagine the debate will happen when a _Resident Catholic Apologist™_ comes in and says that it is perfectly reasonable to equate raping small boys with allowing women to pass out biscuits and grape juice at the Sunday meetings. Eh. It’s a club, and clubs get to make their own rules. Don’t like it? Don’t join. ---
**Author:** ![Lobohan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lobohan/32/79_2.png) [@Lobohan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lobohan)\ **Post date:** [July 17, 2010, 5:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/catholics-thinking-of-ordaining-women-i-e-roman-catholic-churchs-priorities-fucked-up-e/547036/14 "2010-07-17T17:33:15Z")
> [@John\_Mace](#): > > Eh. It’s a club, and clubs get to make their own rules. Don’t like it? Don’t join. No one is saying that they don’t have the right to make their rules. I think what people are saying is the Catholic Church is morally repugnant and vile. Catholics can be good people, the Catholic Church is pretty fairly characterized as evil. Not Stalin evil, but still pretty shitty. ---
**Author:** ![John\_Mace](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_mace/32/185_2.png) [@John\_Mace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Mace)\ **Post date:** [July 17, 2010, 5:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/catholics-thinking-of-ordaining-women-i-e-roman-catholic-churchs-priorities-fucked-up-e/547036/15 "2010-07-17T17:40:31Z")
> [@Lobohan](#): > > No one is saying that they don’t have the right to make their rules. I think what people are saying is the Catholic Church is morally repugnant and vile. If “people” are saying that, they should back it up with evidence. The OP is offering us the fact that Catholics say it’s against the rules to ordain women-- not much of an argument proving that the Church is “morally repugnant and vile”. ---
**Author:** ![Der\_Trihs](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/der_trihs/32/233_2.png) [@Der\_Trihs](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Der_Trihs)\ **Post date:** [July 17, 2010, 5:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/catholics-thinking-of-ordaining-women-i-e-roman-catholic-churchs-priorities-fucked-up-e/547036/16 "2010-07-17T17:43:47Z")
> [@John\_Mace](#): > > The OP is offering us the fact that Catholics say it’s against the rules to ordain women-- not much of an argument proving that the Church is “morally repugnant and vile”. Sexism is certainly “morally repugnant and vile”. ---
**Author:** ![John\_Mace](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_mace/32/185_2.png) [@John\_Mace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Mace)\ **Post date:** [July 17, 2010, 5:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/catholics-thinking-of-ordaining-women-i-e-roman-catholic-churchs-priorities-fucked-up-e/547036/17 "2010-07-17T17:48:07Z")
> [@Der\_Trihs](#): > > Sexism is certainly “morally repugnant and vile”. Not it a private club, where anyone who wishes to can leave. ---
**Author:** ![Squink](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/b5e925/32.png) [@Squink](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Squink)\ **Post date:** [July 17, 2010, 6:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/catholics-thinking-of-ordaining-women-i-e-roman-catholic-churchs-priorities-fucked-up-e/547036/18 "2010-07-17T18:04:24Z")
> [@John\_Mace](#): > > Really? What’s the debate? The OP is clearly a deliberate strawman, since the Catholic Church is not “OK” with pedophilia. What I see interesting here, is that the church lumps priestly pedophillia and ordination of women together as equally serious crimes against the church. Just off the top of my head, I’d’ve treated one as, at most, a civil infraction, and the other as felony. But that’s just me. I guess the Vatican _is_ uniquely situated to discern the true nature of these twin threats to the system. 😉 ---
**Author:** ![Ludovic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/7ab992/32.png) [@Ludovic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ludovic)\ **Post date:** [July 17, 2010, 6:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/catholics-thinking-of-ordaining-women-i-e-roman-catholic-churchs-priorities-fucked-up-e/547036/19 "2010-07-17T18:05:17Z")
Come now, can’t they be both against pedophilia, AND repugnant and vile (like the late Earl Warren)? While I don’t think their stance and actions against the sex abuse scandal have been sufficient, just because they equate sex abuse with female clergy and abuse of the host does not mean they are okay with sex abuse. To be fair, it could mean they just really hate the idea of female priests 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![casdave](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/c6cbf5/32.png) [@casdave](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/casdave)\ **Post date:** [July 17, 2010, 6:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/catholics-thinking-of-ordaining-women-i-e-roman-catholic-churchs-priorities-fucked-up-e/547036/20 "2010-07-17T18:08:22Z")
This is not a private club in any meaningful sense of the word. It has influence far and wide, into governements, into the most personal part of peoples lives, and as such it has a moral responsibility to consider the consequencies of its actions and policies both direct and also indirect. Sexism is a pretty dismal policy for any intstitution, we condemn other religions that discrimintate against women, and many countries have laws that make such discrimination illegal. Why should the Catholic church be allowed to exempt itself from the laws of those nations, why should any religion be allowed to do so? The Catholic church by its actions has ignored the laws on child abuse not for any moral purpose, quite the opposite, and now it finds that women are simply not good enough - well its not good enough, why should we hold any creedence with an organisation that is incapable of adapting to the enlightenement of society, we are not the same people of 2000 years ago, we grew up somewhat, its time Catholicism did too. [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/catholics-thinking-of-ordaining-women-i-e-roman-catholic-churchs-priorities-fucked-up-e/547036.md?page=2)