# Cats! My god, right? **URL:** \ **Category:** Factual Questions\ **Created:** [May 15, 2018, 6:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cats-my-god-right/814232 "2018-05-15T18:07:57Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 15\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![Jonathan\_Chance](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jonathan_chance/32/701_2.png) [@Jonathan\_Chance](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jonathan_Chance)\ **Post date:** [May 16, 2018, 1:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cats-my-god-right/814232/21 "2018-05-16T13:44:19Z")
> [@CalMeacham](#): > > As I’ve remarked on this Board before, I’m not convinced that our cats would wait until we’re completely dead before starting on us. Well, of course, Cal. Can’t let all that meat turn, can you? We’d go bad in a hurry lying out on the couch like that. ---
**Author:** ![GreysonCarlisle](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/a87d85/32.png) [@GreysonCarlisle](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GreysonCarlisle)\ **Post date:** [May 16, 2018, 1:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cats-my-god-right/814232/22 "2018-05-16T13:55:25Z")
> [@am77494](#): > > About 1 in 10 Americans are infected with Toxoplasma > > Cite : [https://www.cdc.gov/parasites/toxoplasmosis/epi.html](https://www.cdc.gov/parasites/toxoplasmosis/epi.html) Well, that is just perfectly terrifying. Luckily, most people who have it [don’t need treatment](https://www.cdc.gov/parasites/toxoplasmosis/gen_info/faqs.html). > [@](#): > > Once a diagnosis of toxoplasmosis is confirmed, you and your health care provider can discuss whether treatment is necessary. In an otherwise healthy person who is not pregnant, treatment usually is not needed. If symptoms occur, they typically go away within a few weeks to months. For pregnant women or persons who have weakened immune systems, medications are available to treat toxoplasmosis. ---
**Author:** ![md2000](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/73ab20/32.png) [@md2000](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/md2000)\ **Post date:** [May 16, 2018, 3:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cats-my-god-right/814232/23 "2018-05-16T15:13:00Z")
Domesticity has something to do with it, but the base animal they started from was very different. Dogs / wolves / canines of a sort are pack animals. they follow the leader, and have a hierarchical instinct; basically, most humans replace the alpha male pack leader in the instincts of dogs, so they follow, do what we say, etc. We have co-opted some of their instincts; herding sheep etc. is an offshoot of the chase-prey instinct. Territorial defense and defense of the master are instinctive. Cats are typically solitary animals. (The major exception I can think of being lions - they come in family packs). As a result they are not followers, they do not look up to us as “leader of the pack” and follow us around waiting to be told their role. When they were selected, the selection was for chasing mice, which did not require much deviation from their wild role. As for breeds - I recall some discussion that the genetics of dogs and how they develop allowed for some interesting variations - daschunds for example the legs did not get the same “grow” signal as the rest of the body. OTOH cats don’t seem have this excessive variability in their genetic makeup; funny fur or pug face seems to be the limit of our ability to mold their appearance. ---
**Author:** ![markn\_1](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/f9ae1b/32.png) [@markn\_1](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/markn_1)\ **Post date:** [May 16, 2018, 5:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cats-my-god-right/814232/24 "2018-05-16T17:21:43Z")
> [@jjakucyk](#): > > I just finished reading the book “The Character of Cats” by Stephen Budiansky and one of the major takeaways about why cats are the way they are is that they’re the only domesticated animal whose wild counterparts are completely asocial (rodents probably fall more in the tamed category than domesticated). Your parenthetical remark seems to be implying that rodents are not social animals. This is not true for all rodents; definitely false for rats. They do best when living with other rats and become very lonely if others are not available (having a lone pet rat is a very bad idea). I have the most personal experience with rats, but I understand that hamsters have a completely different social structure, and indeed are not social at all. If I died, my rats would unfortunately be trapped in their cage and wouldn’t be able to eat me. ☹ ---
**Author:** ![DrDeth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/b487fb/32.png) [@DrDeth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DrDeth)\ **Post date:** [May 16, 2018, 5:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cats-my-god-right/814232/25 "2018-05-16T17:55:30Z")
We have two cats raised from day old kittens by us. They truly love us, follow us around, want to be near us. However, they are the exception. I have had a pet rat and a pet ferret, and yes, they can be affectionate also, but not like a good dog. So, to actually answer the OP, dogs- _in general_- are indeed more loving, loyal and affectionate than most other pets. Cats are in there with other common pet mammals, but there are exceptions. ---
**Author:** ![DPRK](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/4491bb/32.png) [@DPRK](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DPRK)\ **Post date:** [May 16, 2018, 5:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cats-my-god-right/814232/26 "2018-05-16T17:56:07Z")
> [@Jonathan\_Chance](#): > > Well, of course, Cal. Can’t let all that meat turn, can you? We’d go bad in a hurry lying out on the couch like that. [This link](https://www.quora.com/Do-large-predators-usually-kill-their-prey-before-they-start-to-eat-them) says that cats don’t like surprises, and will make sure prey is dead before starting to eat it. It’s canines you have to worry about. ---
**Author:** ![jjakucyk](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/3d9bf3/32.png) [@jjakucyk](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jjakucyk)\ **Post date:** [May 16, 2018, 7:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cats-my-god-right/814232/27 "2018-05-16T19:16:09Z")
> [@markn\_1](#): > > Your parenthetical remark seems to be implying that rodents are not social animals. No I was saying that while rats may be social, their status as domesticated is a bit blurry as opposed to just tamed. It might be that the comparison with cats and sociability is limited to species of a similar or greater taxonomic rank. ---
**Author:** ![Malthus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/85f322/32.png) [@Malthus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Malthus)\ **Post date:** [May 16, 2018, 7:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cats-my-god-right/814232/28 "2018-05-16T19:45:18Z")
> [@jjakucyk](#): > > I just finished reading the book “The Character of Cats” by Stephen Budiansky and one of the major takeaways about why cats are the way they are is that they’re the only domesticated animal whose wild counterparts are completely asocial (rodents probably fall more in the tamed category than domesticated). They only became social when living with humans, and even in feral conditions tend only to co-habitate reluctantly. I don’t think it is actually true that cats in the wild were “completely asocial”. Cats are not pack animals like dogs, and they do not cooperate in hunting, but feral and wild cats definitely congregate together in loose “colonies” based mainly on the mother-kitten bond, often over several generations. [https://www.merckvetmanual.com/behavior/normal-social-behavior-and-behavioral-problems-of-domestic-animals/social-behavior-of-cats](https://www.merckvetmanual.com/behavior/normal-social-behavior-and-behavioral-problems-of-domestic-animals/social-behavior-of-cats) > [@](#): > > Cats are social animals that, in feral conditions, live in groups consisting mainly of queens and their litters. The density of the group depends partly on food resources. Because cats have been exposed to less selective breeding than dogs, there is far less breed diversity and a much narrower range of differences in both physical and behavioral traits. Most cats are solitary hunters that prey on rodents and other small animals, which is likely why their coexistence with people is so successful. Kittens usually learn to prefer to hunt prey that their mother hunted. Kittens may also develop limited food preferences based on texture and taste if not given a variety of foods when young. > > In free-range conditions, multiple generations of related females can live together, which also allows for communal rearing of kittens. Kittens may stay with the social group until 12–18 mo old. Sexual maturity is reached by ~6 mo of age. Queens are induced ovulators and generally cycle seasonally (most often from winter to summer) about every 3 wk if not bred. Weaning occurs at 5–8 wk of age. Although some kittens may suckle much later, this is more likely to be social than nutritional. Early weaning of kittens leads to earlier onset of play and predation. Just as humans have hijacked the pack behavior of dogs for their own uses, they have also made use of the partly-social nature of cats: in the wild, cats prefer to hang out with other cats over being solitary (and so your pet cat may prefer hanging out with you). It also explains why cats have such a wide variety of communication strategies with people: in their social groups, these wee necessary _as between cats_. Many of the behaviors cats display (purring, “kneading” their owners) are exactly those behaviors kittens display with their mothers (or other ‘queens’). ---
**Author:** ![jjakucyk](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/3d9bf3/32.png) [@jjakucyk](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jjakucyk)\ **Post date:** [May 16, 2018, 8:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cats-my-god-right/814232/29 "2018-05-16T20:03:33Z")
Feral cats are not wildcats, and feral cats seem to only congregate in packs when they’re in large numbers with abundant food (such as you see in urban areas). Wildcats and feral cats in rural locations disperse and establish individual territories that may overlap some but are fiercely defended the closer to the center one gets. Yes kittens hang around for several months, but they tend to disperse after reaching sexual maturity. I think the co-habitating and communal rearing of kittens is limited mainly to feral cats. > **[Wildcat](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wildcat#Social_and_territorial_behaviours)** > > The wildcat is a species complex comprising two small wild cat species: the European wildcat (Felis silvestris) and the African wildcat (F. lybica). The European wildcat inhabits forests in Europe, Anatolia and the Caucasus, while the African wildcat inhabits semi-arid landscapes and steppes in Africa, the Arabian Peninsula, Central Asia, into western India and western China. > The wildcat species differ in fur pattern, tail, and size: the European wildcat has long fur and a bushy tail with a ro Th... ---
**Author:** ![Omar\_Little](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/omar_little/32/269_2.png) [@Omar\_Little](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Omar_Little)\ **Post date:** [May 16, 2018, 8:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cats-my-god-right/814232/30 "2018-05-16T20:21:37Z")
So why are cats so afraid of cucumbers, then? ---
**Author:** ![Hilarity\_N.Suze](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/hilarity_n.suze/32/6223_2.png) [@Hilarity\_N.Suze](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hilarity_N.Suze)\ **Post date:** [May 16, 2018, 8:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cats-my-god-right/814232/31 "2018-05-16T20:43:49Z")
My last two cats were very different. One of them exhibited typical cat behavior. She was standoffish and didn’t want attention, except sometimes and then she would DEMAND it, by slashing ankles if necessary. (“Pet me, pet me, pet me, okay that’s enough now I’m gonna bite you.”) She was rarely to be found in the daytime and prone to crazy cat behavior at night. Climbing the curtains, massacring\* socks. The other one was mellow and almost doglike. He would go on walks me with and the dog. (Dog on leash, cat not on leash.) He preferred to be around people, and he liked to curl up in bed with the rest of us at night so yeah, I was sleeping with a man, a dog, and a cat. I had to give up some of my pillows. These two cats would interact with each other, and they would gang up together against the dog, but I wouldn’t say they were friends. They both liked to walk across the computer keyboard. One just did it during the daytime and the other one did it at night. What I’m saying is, they were very different, but all in the range of catlike behavior because, as they were cats, everything they did was catlike behavior. When the first one, the little she-devil, died, the remaining cat got much, much clingier, and now that he’s gone to his final rest I think the dog misses both of them. \*This word…looks wrong. ---
**Author:** ![jjakucyk](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/3d9bf3/32.png) [@jjakucyk](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jjakucyk)\ **Post date:** [May 16, 2018, 9:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cats-my-god-right/814232/32 "2018-05-16T21:00:51Z")
> [@Omar\_Little](#): > > So why are cats so afraid of cucumbers, then? I tried that with my cat once and she wasn’t the least bit interested. It probably looks like a snake at first I guess? ---
**Author:** ![Beckdawrek](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/beckdawrek/32/3647_2.png) [@Beckdawrek](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Beckdawrek)\ **Post date:** [May 16, 2018, 9:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cats-my-god-right/814232/33 "2018-05-16T21:18:07Z")
Well, here goes, both my cats at this very moment are clung to me like another skin. We turned the air conditioning on last week. They are decidedly unhappy about it. And this has brought out some weird clingy behaviours. They usually camp out on cat trees, cat beds or on the top of the dryer. I don’t recall this happening last year. I am almost ready to call a cat psychiatrist. My daughter has decided the aircondition unit maybe emitting a sound we can’t hear but they can. IDK, it doesn’t stay on all the time. I hope they are just cold, I can fix that. These cats are very aloof, and oh so snooty Siameses. It’s really unnatural for them to be clingy. And that’s what worries me the most. They don’t like me this much, they tolerate me because I am the food committee. ---
**Author:** ![Malthus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/85f322/32.png) [@Malthus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Malthus)\ **Post date:** [May 16, 2018, 9:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cats-my-god-right/814232/34 "2018-05-16T21:53:13Z")
> [@jjakucyk](#): > > Feral cats are not wildcats, and feral cats seem to only congregate in packs when they’re in large numbers with abundant food (such as you see in urban areas). Wildcats and feral cats in rural locations disperse and establish individual territories that may overlap some but are fiercely defended the closer to the center one gets. Yes kittens hang around for several months, but they tend to disperse after reaching sexual maturity. I think the co-habitating and communal rearing of kittens is limited mainly to feral cats. > > [Wildcat - Wikipedia](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wildcat#Social_and_territorial_behaviours) Heh, this is the problem with relying on secondary sources - nuance is lost. In fact, the actual social behavior of the African Wild Cat (the likely closest relation of the domestic cat) is simply not well known, because they are small, shy hunters. Evidence suggests, however, that they _can_ behave exactly like their feral cousins: the females are more likely to cluster together. Radio-collar studies show that female ranges overlap, while male ranges do not. The paper below concludes that they are, perhaps, ‘weakly social’ - like feral cats, though there are no “colonies” unlike feral cats - but the evidence is very thin either way: “These observations could be interpreted as a weak form of sociality in wild cats that could manifest itself more strongly under different ecological conditions”. Problem is, of course, that it is really, really tough to observe the fleeting social behavior of shy, wild mostly-nocturnal carnivores, even by dedicated scientists! In short, there is (as one may expect) social tendencies in wild cats, that can (and do) manifest themselves “under different ecological conditions”, of which feral-ness is one example, and domestication another and more extreme example. > [@](#): > > With most solitary felids, adults of the same sex exhibit a spatially and temporally dispersed social organisation (Beckoff, Daniels & Gittleman, 1984). However, all felids still posses a rich repertoire of communication signals (Leyhausen, 1965; Seidensticker, Hornocker, Wiles & Messick, 1973). Although information on communication is limited in small cats due to their mostly nocturnal activity patterns, the densely vegetated habitat that many of them inhabit, their wide ranging movement patterns and their extreme wariness to observers (Mellen, 1993; Nowell & Jackson, 1996), it seems that all felids possess very similar behavioural mechanisms and communication patterns (Mellen, 1993). Transmission of information by > individuals can be visual, through sound and odour (Gorman & Trowbridge, 1989). Odours are deposited in the environment as scent marks and therefore provide a spatial and historical record of the animal’s movement and behaviour patterns (Gorman & Trowbridge, 1989). > > … > > Few interactions between African wild cats were observed and were mostly between females with kittens or receptive females with males. Extensive female-female home range overlap indicates that food availability is variable in time and space (Sandell, 1989) and related females clustering together have been described in many carnivores (Smith, McDougal & Sunquist, 1987; Logan & Sweanor, 2001; Janečka, Blankenship, Hirth, Tewes, Kilpatrick & Grassman, 2004; Kitchen, Gese, Waits, Karki & Schauster, 2005). Home range overlap in females is common in solitary carnivores e.g. bobcat, L. rufus (Zezulak & Schwab, 1979); ocelot, L. pardalis (Ludlow & Sunquist, 1987) and kodkod, Oncifelis guigna (Dunstone, Durbin, Wyllie, Freer, Jamett, Mazolli & Rose, 2002). > > … > > The African wild cat seems to be solitary and no evidence of sociality as reported in feral colonies of domestic cats was observed (Laundré, 1977; Macdonald & Apps, 1978; Dards, 1978; Corbett, 1979; Macdonald, 1983; Fitzgerald & Karl, 1986). However it is interesting to note that older siblings did occasionally visit the mother and younger kittens at den sites, although no provisioning of food by older siblings was observed. Furthermore, on three occasions male cats visited females with kittens without any suggestion of infanticide. These observations could be interpreted as a weak form of sociality in wild cats that could manifest itself more strongly under different ecological conditions. > **[Complete.pdf](https://repository.up.ac.za/bitstream/handle/2263/28963/Complete.pdf?sequence=6)** ---
**Author:** ![md2000](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/73ab20/32.png) [@md2000](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/md2000)\ **Post date:** [May 17, 2018, 6:24am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cats-my-god-right/814232/35 "2018-05-17T06:24:14Z")
Despite questions whether cats form some sort of “hives”, they definitely don’t typically hunt in large packs like wolves or other canines; and even when you gather them in a group, they are apparently notoriously difficult to herd. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cats-my-god-right/814232.md?page=1)