# Catsix, STFU! **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [April 16, 2007, 6:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/catsix-stfu/400366 "2007-04-16T18:08:59Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 5
**Author:** ![Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e99b99/32.png) [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Diogenes_the_Cynic)\ **Post date:** [April 16, 2007, 9:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/catsix-stfu/400366/81 "2007-04-16T21:53:35Z")
Catsix is a she. ---
**Author:** ![Cat\_Whisperer](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cat_whisperer/32/4839_2.png) [@Cat\_Whisperer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cat_Whisperer)\ **Post date:** [April 16, 2007, 9:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/catsix-stfu/400366/82 "2007-04-16T21:54:16Z")
Are you permitted to have guns, concealed or otherwise, at work in the U.S.? It’s not completely out of line to compare a campus to a workplace. And of course for the instructors and administrators it IS their workplace. **Airman Doors** , you made one of the most compelling arguments I have ever heard FOR carrying a weapon (most are spurious at best) - I assume that you are fully trained to use a gun, and I can see your point that you feel a responsibility to carry your weapon. You, however, are not everybody. Most of the people I see out in public every day, I wouldn’t want to see them with a hot curling iron, much less a loaded weapon. I don’t think that all students over 21 carrying concealed weapons would have made things better; I have this picture in my head of a bunch of students whipping out their guns and firing into the back of their fellow students’ heads in their panic, but all of this discussion is just wanking anyway, since there is no way of knowing what would have been better. ---
**Author:** ![Gangster\_Octopus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/a8b319/32.png) [@Gangster\_Octopus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gangster_Octopus)\ **Post date:** [April 16, 2007, 9:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/catsix-stfu/400366/83 "2007-04-16T21:56:29Z")
[QUOTE=treis] Yeah, a political spin that was inappropriate for the thread. [/QUOTE] Why? If someone started a thread about a bomb going off in a marketplace in Baghdad, killing 33 people and someone chimed in something like, 'How’s tha for Mission Accomplished?", would that be inappropriate? I just don’t buy that is was inappropriate at all, and I don’t agree with **catsix’s** position at all. ---
**Author:** ![Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e99b99/32.png) [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Diogenes_the_Cynic)\ **Post date:** [April 16, 2007, 9:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/catsix-stfu/400366/84 "2007-04-16T21:56:47Z")
[QUOTE=Una Persson] Indeed? When have you ever argued an unambiguously pro-gun position on this message board? Just curious, because I’ve never seen it. Then again, what I’ve never seen could fill the Grand Canyon… [/QUOTE] You’ve never seen me argue for gun control either. If you were to do a search (which would be tricky since “gun” is a three letter word), you’d find that I’ve been consistent in saying that gun rights should be protected, but I also have a strong distaste for pro-gun zealots. I don’t dislike gun nuts because I think they’re wrong but because I think they’re creepy and fetishistic and they take the issue too seriously. ---
**Author:** ![Arnold\_Winkelried](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/3d9bf3/32.png) [@Arnold\_Winkelried](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Arnold_Winkelried)\ **Post date:** [April 16, 2007, 9:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/catsix-stfu/400366/85 "2007-04-16T21:57:27Z")
P.S. Thank you, engim4tic and Jodi, I did not know that. I’ve never bothered to enquire. I imagine then that this (the banning of concealed firearms, or handguns in general) is standard for most college campuses? ---
**Author:** ![treis](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/bc79bd/32.png) [@treis](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/treis)\ **Post date:** [April 16, 2007, 9:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/catsix-stfu/400366/86 "2007-04-16T21:59:30Z")
[QUOTE=Gangster Octopus] Why? If someone started a thread about a bomb going off in a marketplace in Baghdad, killing 33 people and someone chimed in something like, 'How’s tha for Mission Accomplished?", would that be inappropriate? I just don’t buy that is was inappropriate at all, and I don’t agree with **catsix’s** position at all. [/QUOTE] Yeah, in a thread about the tragedy of a marketplace bombing a political shot would be pretty inappropriate. ---
**Author:** ![Cat\_Whisperer](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cat_whisperer/32/4839_2.png) [@Cat\_Whisperer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cat_Whisperer)\ **Post date:** [April 16, 2007, 10:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/catsix-stfu/400366/87 "2007-04-16T22:08:02Z")
Forgot to address the OP - I don’t think **catsix’s** remark was appropriate in that thread, at any time. That thread was a discussion of what happened with shock, commiseration, grief, trying to get details, etc. Her remark would be appropriate in a forensic thread about why it happened, which I’m sure we’ll have plenty of. It was like her coming into a funeral thread about your dad who just died of lung cancer, and dropping a load about the evils of tobacco. Just not appropriate. (It would have been equally inappropriate for anti-gun supporters to get on their soapbox, too.) ---
**Author:** ![enigm4tic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/7ba0ec/32.png) [@enigm4tic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/enigm4tic)\ **Post date:** [April 16, 2007, 10:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/catsix-stfu/400366/88 "2007-04-16T22:09:33Z")
> [@DtC](#): > > What the fuck do you need to carry a gun for anyway? Are you really that much of a spineless chickenshit that you think you have to be armed all the time? I’m not anti-gun but I wish you fetishists would be honest enough to admit that you carry guns mostly to make yourself feel powerful, not for protection. There are actually more healthy ways to combat those intense feelings of inadequacy if you’re willing to seek them out. and > [@DtC](#): > > You’ve never seen me argue for gun control either. If you were to do a search (which would be tricky since “gun” is a three letter word), you’d find that I’ve been consistent in saying that gun rights should be protected, but I also have a strong distaste for pro-gun zealots. I don’t dislike gun nuts because I think they’re wrong but because I think they’re creepy and fetishistic and they take the issue too seriously. just don’t line up. I can’t see how somebody, especially like **Airman** presenting a legitimate reason to carry (trained military, used to gun handling and use, pre-existing duty to protect and serve) as nearly a responsibility due to his training, and converting that as a basis for a broad-brush attack on “fetishist” gun owners, and then SUBSEQUENTLY claiming you “don’t have a problem with gun rights” is a bit disingenuous. Akin to saying, perhaps, you have no problem with gay rights but any guy who has sex with another man is an abhorrent fetishist who has disgusting sexual practices, and that there are better ways to satisfy your sexual urges. The cognitive dissonance that holding a position with those extremes is incredible. ---
**Author:** ![Zebra](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/c0e974/32.png) [@Zebra](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Zebra)\ **Post date:** [April 16, 2007, 10:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/catsix-stfu/400366/89 "2007-04-16T22:14:31Z")
[QUOTE=Weirddave] Only difference is that yours is a fantasy,as are so many of your posts. Mine is well within the realm of possibility, even probability. I happen to know that Virginia is a state that respects the First Amendment and will freely issue CCPs to qualified citizens-except you can’t carry on school grounds, which deprives law abiding gun owners of the ability to defend themselves at school. [/QUOTE] Two things, Do you think the shooter chose the school because of the law? Do you think the shooter thought, “Hey, at the school, they can’t shoot back, I’ll go there.” I’m willing there is a connection between the shooter and the location and that the probablitly of some victim carrying didn’t enter in to the killers mind. There are places on the planet where people carry any weapon they can afford all the time. These places suck. Iraq, Afghanistan, large parts of Africa. Heck, why don’t you take your guns and move there. Aren’t those places the gun owners paradise? ---
**Author:** ![Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e99b99/32.png) [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Diogenes_the_Cynic)\ **Post date:** [April 16, 2007, 10:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/catsix-stfu/400366/90 "2007-04-16T22:15:21Z")
[QUOTE=enigm4tic] and just don’t line up. I can’t see how somebody, especially like **Airman** presenting a legitimate reason to carry (trained military, used to gun handling and use, pre-existing duty to protect and serve) as nearly a responsibility due to his training, and converting that as a basis for a broad-brush attack on “fetishist” gun owners, and then SUBSEQUENTLY claiming you “don’t have a problem with gun rights” is a bit disingenuous. Akin to saying, perhaps, you have no problem with gay rights but any guy who has sex with another man is an abhorrent fetishist who has disgusting sexual practices, and that there are better ways to satisfy your sexual urges. The cognitive dissonance that holding a position with those extremes is incredible. [/QUOTE] There is no contradiction. I believe that smoking should be legal and don’t really care for anti-smoking laws. That doesn’t mean I can’t think smoking is _stupid_. I support people’s legal rights to own firearms, but I have little respect for people who feel the need to pack heat wherever they go or who obsess about the issue all the time. I never saw **Airman** provide any reason he needs to carry a gun, by the way. “Responsibility to his training” my ass. Why would it be irresponsible to leave the thing at home? ---
**Author:** ![Arnold\_Winkelried](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/3d9bf3/32.png) [@Arnold\_Winkelried](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Arnold_Winkelried)\ **Post date:** [April 16, 2007, 10:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/catsix-stfu/400366/91 "2007-04-16T22:20:37Z")
[QUOTE=anamnesis] Was catsix’s comment too soon? Maybe. Was it insensitive? Definitely not. He has just as much a right to tell you to “shut the fuck up” about your stance on gun control because he believes that the increased acceptance of concealed carry law has led to a decline in aggravated assault and other armed crime … [/QUOTE] I don’t think the comment was too soon. It was just in the wrong thread. I’m sure no one would start a Pit thread blasting a poster for the act of initiating another gun control debate in the GD forum using the shootings in Virginia as an example. ---
**Author:** ![enigm4tic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/7ba0ec/32.png) [@enigm4tic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/enigm4tic)\ **Post date:** [April 16, 2007, 10:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/catsix-stfu/400366/92 "2007-04-16T22:29:26Z")
> [@Diogenes the Cynic](#): > > I support people’s legal rights to own firearms, but I have little respect for people who feel the need to pack heat wherever they go or who obsess about the issue all the time. No, because you’re assuming that all gun-owners have their guns to fire them at people and brandish them as much as possible, most gun owners have them to fire at ranges, or to protect themselves in the _unfortunate_ (as differentiated from _hoped for_) case that they must defend themselves with deadly force > [@dtc](#): > > I support people’s legal rights to own firearms, but I have little respect for people who feel the need to pack heat wherever they go or who obsess about the issue all the time. ok, sure, I can accept that, I think I had more issue with the rather vicious-sounding tone you adopted to **Airman** who at least posited that he had a better reason than “gun-toting fetishism” to be armed. It seemed like a bizarre attack against somebody who didn’t seem to be doing what you were so upset about, and he made legitimate (debatable, yes, but legitimate) points about the oddity of university campus rules, to wit > [@Airman Doors](#): > > I don’t understand why I can go pretty much anywhere with a weapon, but among that small subset of adults I would be a criminal were I to do so. which sounds less like fetishism and more like a reasonable discussion point, unlike your response, which _sounded_ like a rapid anti-gun position, even if that isn’t the position you actually take ---
**Author:** ![Tuckerfan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/eada6e/32.png) [@Tuckerfan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tuckerfan)\ **Post date:** [April 16, 2007, 10:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/catsix-stfu/400366/93 "2007-04-16T22:30:05Z")
[QUOTE=featherlou] Are you permitted to have guns, concealed or otherwise, at work in the U.S.? [/QUOTE] That depends upon the workplace and local laws. Some places of employment won’t allow you to have a firearm at all on premises, even though it’s perfectly legal for you to do so. Other times, the law prohibits people from carrying weapons in a place of employment. For example, in TN, it’s illegal for anyone to carry a firearm into a bar, unless they’re an on-duty police officer. You know, if _both_ sides on the gun issue were able to engage in a rational discussion of the matter, we might just come up with a workable solution which keeps more people safe than we have now. (Mind you, I’m _not_ saying that _all_ people who weigh in on gun matters are irrational, but certainly the biggest organizations representing both sides of the matter tend to extremes at times.) ---
**Author:** ![Skywatcher](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/skywatcher/32/254_2.png) [@Skywatcher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Skywatcher)\ **Post date:** [April 16, 2007, 10:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/catsix-stfu/400366/94 "2007-04-16T22:34:01Z")
[QUOTE=Gangster Octopus] Why? If someone started a thread about a bomb going off in a marketplace in Baghdad, killing 33 people and someone chimed in something like, 'How’s tha for Mission Accomplished?", would that be inappropriate? I just don’t buy that is was inappropriate at all [/QUOTE] Perhaps you missed **Aldebaran** essentially doing that very thing? ---
**Author:** ![Green\_Cymbeline](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/green_cymbeline/32/9244_2.png) [@Green\_Cymbeline](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Green_Cymbeline)\ **Post date:** [April 16, 2007, 10:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/catsix-stfu/400366/95 "2007-04-16T22:36:00Z")
[QUOTE=Airman Doors, USAF] I do have a CCW permit, I am a student, and I would carry my weapon were I allowed to. Remarkably enough, it’s not out of any sense of paranoia, but out of a sense of responsibility. I don’t think that anybody would argue that leaving a weapon in a car unattended is a responsible action, yet that’s what I am forced to do due to the ban on weapons at the university. Or I could leave it home, which totally negates the point of having a permit. For those hours when I am at school I am either a potentially helpless victim or hopelessly irresponsible. neither case fills me with much confidence. [/QUOTE] Do you live in a high crime area where the danger is so high that it trumps the danger of having a gun in the same home in which a child is present? Which do you think is more likely to happen: (1) you using the gun in self-defense or to save the life of someone in danger; or (2) Your kid gaining access to the gun and shooting himself or someone else? If you think the chances of (1) happening are greater than (2) happening, do you still think the chances of (1) are great enough overall to accept the risk of (2)? And there are a couple of other scenarios… (3) the risk of someone breaking into your home and stealing your gun to use for criminal acts; or (4) you shooting someone who you think is breaking into your house and it actually being your wife or your teenager sneaking in after curfew?; or (5) you confronting an intruder with a gun and him either wrestling it away from you and shooting you, or if he is armed, be more inclined to shoot you as fast as he can, lest he be shot by you (whereas if you were unarmed he would not be as inclined to harm you). ---
**Author:** ![Miller](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/miller/32/481_2.png) [@Miller](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Miller)\ **Post date:** [April 16, 2007, 10:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/catsix-stfu/400366/96 "2007-04-16T22:39:55Z")
[QUOTE=Lute Skywatcher] Perhaps you missed **Aldebaran** essentially doing that very thing? [/QUOTE] And didn’t he get pitted about twice daily for doing it? ---
**Author:** ![Orbifold](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/779978/32.png) [@Orbifold](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Orbifold)\ **Post date:** [April 16, 2007, 10:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/catsix-stfu/400366/97 "2007-04-16T22:43:44Z")
Arm the students! Because university students aren’t known for experimenting with drugs, or for being under large amounts of stress and pressure. And they all have training in responding to armed attackers in chaotic and crowded situations. Brilliant! ---
**Author:** ![Gangster\_Octopus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/a8b319/32.png) [@Gangster\_Octopus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gangster_Octopus)\ **Post date:** [April 16, 2007, 10:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/catsix-stfu/400366/98 "2007-04-16T22:45:34Z")
[QUOTE=Lute Skywatcher] Perhaps you missed **Aldebaran** essentially doing that very thing? [/QUOTE] I don’t know, I don’t read every thread, but if he had written it like **catsix** I would’ve had no problem. ---
**Author:** ![enigm4tic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/7ba0ec/32.png) [@enigm4tic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/enigm4tic)\ **Post date:** [April 16, 2007, 10:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/catsix-stfu/400366/99 "2007-04-16T22:57:35Z")
[QUOTE=Orbifold] Arm the students! Because university students aren’t known for experimenting with drugs, or for being under large amounts of stress and pressure. And they all have training in responding to armed attackers in chaotic and crowded situations. Brilliant! [/QUOTE] > [@Airman Doors](#): > > So much for rational discussion. thus goeth the pit. ---
**Author:** ![Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e99b99/32.png) [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Diogenes_the_Cynic)\ **Post date:** [April 16, 2007, 11:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/catsix-stfu/400366/100 "2007-04-16T23:04:47Z")
For those who would like to see a bunch of drunk and stoned college kids toting guns around with them all day, I wonder how you think they’re going to be able to tell who the maniac is and who’s just another “good guy” with a gun. Should they all just shoot to to kill anybody else with a gun? Is this really a recipe for peace and order? [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/catsix-stfu/400366.md?page=4) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/catsix-stfu/400366.md?page=6)